Welsford Pathfinder

[Meerkat]

Welsford Pathfinder

[boatlover]

And the "chase boat" was a Welsford Navigator.

I'm sure there was an "adrenalin rush" at the end of the ride ...

Regards,

Ed R

[batory]

Anyone on the forum building/thinking of building a Pathfinder?

[Meerkat]

I'd love a Pathfinder's smaller sister Navigator!

The view from the chase boat that took the above shot (a Navigator named "Jaunty"):


That's the Pathfinder under the boom in the 2nd picture.

And "Jaunty's" glamour shot:


Ever wonder what 20kts of wind looked like from an open boat?:


[ 07-03-2004, 09:04 PM: Message edited by: Meerkat ]

[John B]

Jaunty's 'glamour shot' is taken at mahurangi harbour.

[Meerkat]

Where is this one John?:



Here are a couple more pretty pics of Dave Perillo and his "Jaunty":





More at http://www.openboat.co.nz/

[ 07-04-2004, 02:15 AM: Message edited by: Meerkat ]

[john welsford]

If I have it right thats McKenzies Bay on Rangitoto. For the non Kiwis there is a dirty great volcanic cone right in the mouth of the main harbour that Auckland city uses ( there are three, one bigger than the Chesapeake! Small boat paradise)

John W

Originally posted by Meerkat:
Where is this one John?:



Here are a couple more pretty pics of Dave Perillo and his "Jaunty":





More at http://www.openboat.co.nz/

[John B]

snap
from the eastern side tho.

[Meerkat]

More eye candy!

Navigator on left, Pathfinder on right.

[keyhavenpotterer]

Great video of the Welsford Pathfinder 'Varuna' taken in some weather from a Welsford Navigator 'Jaunty' running alongside, showing what great cruisers these designs are.

A great piece of video showing this exceptional boat's control in a sea...


The stability of a high performance cruiser...John in nearground...three men standing on Varuna's gunwale...

[John B]

Nice to see Meer's name come up.

Paul G driving his pathfinder.

[StevenBauer]

And John has a piece in the latest Watercraft Magazine's Grand Designs section about Dave's new boat. Is there an online version of that piece?



Steven

[Yeadon]

In the video, is he sheeting that main back to a quarter bit? Tough to see, but the angle looks unusual ... like it would get in the way of helming that boat.

Cool video.

[John B]

I actually went for a short sail with Paul going back a few years. But I can't remember the details of the systems owing to oldfrtitis.

[paladin]

Oh, Darn! The memory is the second thing to go and he dunno reckomember what was the first.......

[JimD]

Thanks for that vid.

[keyhavenpotterer]

Full link to You Tube to get it big screen.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-awaoZHxcYQ

[RodSBT]

I've heard of a cabin version. Anyone have pics of this?

I would think with the full hull shape of a Pathfinder a cabin would work well considering the boat is under 18'.

[keyhavenpotterer]

A cabin version.



http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...inder-Launched

The standard one has a small cuddy for sleeping bags etc and affords a rain shelter sleeping in a sleeping bag with a bivi covering. There's enough room for two blokes forward from the cockpit for two to sleep on a flat floor (this gives Pathfinders huge under floor buoyancy and storage). Steve Earleys...Spartina



This still leaves the aft cockpit free and uncluttered for hospitality and fine dining...


They look very dry boats...water all flung away.


Great Pathfinder cruising website...

http://logofspartina.blogspot.com/

[skaraborgcraft]

that was a good video......but whos playing the guitar????

[epoxyboy]

That cabin pathfinder is 'Kaiarahi'. The "on the water pic" from launch day is on Akaroa harbour in NZ. The interior shot gives an indication of how tight my build space was - a 5 and a bit metre boat in a 6 metre garage :-)
AFAIK 'Kaiarahi' was the first cabin version ever launched anywhere. The cabin isnt strictly to the plans - as designed by JW the front of the cabin trunk is rounded which requires two laminations of thin plywood to achieve. I maintained the same roof line, and just extended the side on a fair curve foward to meet the deck beam that the front of the cabin trunk is attached to. I am happy with the result, YMMV.
My son and I spent a week on her in the Marlbourough Sounds (the northern end of the South Island of NZ) last Easter, and I was really happy with the way she coped with some pretty challenging conditions - the wind gets funnelled down valleys and fights the tidal stream, resulting in big swells and wind that goes from five knots to twenty in a matter of seconds. The jib and mizzen combination was just fantastic when things got a bit unpleasant, and sleeping in a cabin when the rain was bucketing down outside was a definite plus.

Pete

[RodSBT]

Thanks KP.

Great looking boat Pete, you should be proud!

[WI-Tom]

I agree--great Pathfinder video. But how do I find that music? Who is the guitarist, what album is that? Any info would be greatly appreciated!

Tom

[Clarkey]

The song is 'Find the cost of Freedom', written by Stephen Stills and originally performed by Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young but I am not sure which version this is yet.

[keyhavenpotterer]

Perry Burton has added a cabin to his Pathfinder for cruising Newfoundland. He's made a lovely job of it.





http://buildingpathfinder.blogspot.com/

[skaraborgcraft]

the more i see of these capable dinghy type cruisers,the more i realise im missing out by being "overboated". Golly,i even had thoughts of trading my Nordic Folkboat,which gets much less use these days than my sail and oar boat,which,although capable, is not built for the kind of use a pathfinder was designed for. Still unsure about the cabin version of pathfinder.....think i would prefer a canvas sprayhood and screens. Tempting....

[keyhavenpotterer]

A good open boat cruising book I've just read is 'Lugworm on the Loose, Exploring Greece in an open dinghy' by Ken Duxbury. He takes his plywood Drascombe down to Greece and goes cruising with his wife. He was owner of Drascombe at the time. Apart from the usual travel stuff, he talks about how the boat performed and what was successful. Among the nuggets, he says he wished he had a small cabin on occasion: it seems the boat was attractive to Greek wasps at night, great big things, I think he would have prefered to shut out. Same with mozzies in some areas. I think the cabin version would be good in this context: for avoiding parasites (and fly born diseases). He also says that the boats needed some form stability. While narrow waterlines and limited form stability can be useful in green waves, in the back eddies around the back of islands, promotaries and sea cliffs, the water and wind could create an awful chop and severe acute windshifts that left the boat suddenly hard pressed, without any time to reef. In such circumstances, the boat needed innate resistence to heel to cope. Pathfinder and Pilgrim have this in spades. He also was glad of his engine. Caught in a severe acute onshore breeze his only option on one occasion was to motor at maximum out over the waves, saving his boat. He also makes the point, that loaded down with cruising gear and food etc, the boats are too heavy to lift up the beach. He always anchored off in shallow water and waded ashore. Occasionally a passing ship wake reared up in the shelving beach and affected the boat more, so he left her just off the beach in a bit of water. I guess there's no tide to make use of in the med, so beaching between tides doesn't work. He anchored off a Taverna every night and walked ashore. He kept it simple: morning was for sailing (before the meltemi set in) afternoon for napping, evening for eating and drinking....after the Greeks default, it will be a cheap and very chearful holiday.

[David Geiss]

Interesting post just above..... those Weslford boats have a certain pugnacious and purposeful look, without looking too much like caricatures of something straining for a past era. My interest is in a day boat; something that might plane, or something akin to planing, without being too race-bred, like a Thistle for example (as in, you sail the boat or it sails you). Oughtred's Gannet strikes me. So does Vivier's Minahouet and any number of JW's designs. Uh oh, am I hijacking this sucker??????

[skaraborgcraft]

Granted a small cabin,if only used as a form of storage or positive bouyancy (scamp) is a handy thing if it doesnt spoil the look... thats down to the individual taste.I rowed 4nm last week into a headwind and small chop,so,for me,a small outboard would be a must,i enjoy rowing in smooth water,but with a heavily loaded camping boat,headwind and chop, even a 2hp would be better than the ash breeze.......and before MrMcMullen comments,im no spring chicken,and have my wife has better things to do than watch me sweat for hours when a small outboard would have had us safely back in harbour in well under an hour. The advantage of a sprit rig and getting the mast down does make a difference in a strong wind,more so than i realised. Cheers

[ILikeRust]

the more i see of these capable dinghy type cruisers,the more i realise im missing out by being "overboated".

I've had the same thought on many occasions. Seems my wife and kids are not half as interested in sailing as I am, and since buying my boat last August, I've spent far more time working on the boat (engine overhaul, interior woodwork) than actually sailing it. And I've paid for a slip that the boat has not been in since January - along with all the costs of a new sail, lots of new engine parts, epoxy, other boat bits, and yard storage fees... I really can see the advantage of a roomy and capable trailer-sailer.

I've been reading Steve's "Blog of Spartina" for a year or two now - I check in pretty much every day. Love his travels and his photography. He's made it pretty clear that you don't need much boat to have some excellent adventures. I do think, though, that I would like something with just slightly more amenities than the Pathfinder, for multi-day trips, even though it is a lovely boat. At least the ability to sleep out of the weather if it starts to get wet.

But yeah, I'm thinking that rather than the standard progression of moving from a 30-footer to a 36, my next boat might be a move down to something like a 20 or 24-footer that I can trailer and not have to pay marina fees. In a few years, maybe. I need to get some more time with this one first.

[ILikeRust]

My interest is in a day boat; something that might plane, or something akin to planing, without being too race-bred, like a Thistle for example

Did you see this?

[keyhavenpotterer]

David Geiss,

The Pathfinder planes off the wind in a stiff breeze. For more a more planing orientated experience, John Welsford's AWOL design incorporates many of Pathfinder's features - flat floor sleeping, sub floor buoyancy and storage, and a rear camp stove set up for cruising. She a has a genny too for offwind speed and some high aspect foils. I think she's gets into the mid teens speed wise. AWOL's sail plan was drawn to balance single handing and gusty conditions. David Perillo fast cruises his AWOL around New Zealand.




http://home.xtra.co.nz/hosts/david77/gallery12.html

For a longer AWOL type planing hull with a cabin added (to same length as a Pathfinder) is the Sweet Pea design for a fast cruising boat...she can plane on a reach or run, rigged as either a high aspect bermudan sloop (and genny) or more cruisy yawl rigged for keeping her head to wind at anchor. For a sailor who wants his partner to come along, an enclosed area for a toilet, is also a big deal to many ladies, for a sailor with overnighting or long day sailing plans. In my experience that aspect of a cabin shouldn't be under estimated.

17.5ft long Sweet Pea planing day boat...should point high as well as go fast.

[skaraborgcraft]

on a boat like sweet pea,the cain/cuddy looks in proportion. Maybe having seen many pathfinders in original open form,the cuddy look may take a while for my eyes to find it acceptable. I considered sweet pea but decided on a Hartley TS16 hull for my next experimental day boat......lots of form stability and proven planing performance,relatively light for easy trailer launchings and recovery,and simple rig,easy set up. Couldnt imagine rowing it very far (scull),but as the above AWOL shows,a wee 2hp is plenty.
Brian,my wife would agree,somewhere to perform bodily functions in the privacy of cuddy cannot be underestimated, but on smaller boats,that cuddy seems to become just a floating head! Cheers

[keyhavenpotterer]

Cripes. Check out David's close encouter. Shots taken from his Welsford Navigator Jaunty in New Zealand! Is that a killer whale?



Thats a clever hunting organism, amoung its techniques its designed to grab mammals off ledges...


Talk about a butt clencher...watching a killer whale going UNDER your dinghy!

[skaraborgcraft]

white knuckle ride indeed,yes thats an Orca,probably more curious than anything,i have a Spanish film maker friend who free dives with pods of Orcas off the Canary Isles.....hes never had a problem.....they are supposedly scarily intelligent, as the case of the orca drowning its trainer in the US last year shows. Tip of the Day, dont try to get a wild orca to jump through hoops and expect it to be happy with a dead fish as a reward.....

[keyhavenpotterer]

I was surprised to learn we can see them off Orkney & Shetland.

http://www.orkney.com/whales

[AnalogKid]

Cripes...Thats a clever hunting organism, amoung its techniques its designed to grab mammals off ledges...!

I don't want to take anything away from David's superb photo, and I'm sure it's scary whenever you're near an animal as big or bigger than your boat but, the NZ orca population mainly eat stingrays. Other prey includes other types of rays, smaller sharks and other cetaceans (probably whale and dolphin calves), but no seals or sea-lions. Hunting techniques tend to be a cultural thing within populations of orca, and the one's here don't beach themselves like the famous scenes from wildlife TV programmes.

I heard a story related friend-of-a-friend style of a spear fisherman snorkelling among some rocks out in the Hauraki Gulf. He felt this overwhelming sense of being watched, so slowly turned to see a large orca in a head down position only a metre or 2 away watching his every move. That'd pucker the back of your wetsuit!

[skaraborgcraft]

That'd pucker the back of your wetsuit!

HO LORDY.....That must be quote of the day! Thanks for the laugh.

[Paul G.]

Here they come!

[Paul G.]

While we are strolling down memory lane...

[skaraborgcraft]

the above shot explains everything i miss from having a keelboat,and having to have the associated tender to go ashore.... anybody in the market for a 1949 Nordic Folkboat??

[AnalogKid]

OT - Another close Orca encounter.

[john welsford]

Thanks for the memory Paul, Anzac cove? By the way people thats Pathfinder number one, superb build by Paul considering his boatbuilding experience when he began was one simple skiff. In fact, pretty good by anyones standards.
We're up over 350 sets of PF plans gone out now, about 60 of them sailing. It never fails to humble me when I see the results of my mumbling away at my drawing board.

John Welsford

While we are strolling down memory lane...

[ILikeRust]

John,

My favorite sailing blog is Steve Earley's "Log of Spartina". His boat surely is quite lovely, he sure sails the hell out of it, and he takes fantastic pictures!

Makes me want one.

But then again I want one of almost every neato boat I see!!

[BobW]

I'm leaning toward building a Pathfinder but I ordered the study plans for the Navigator and Pathfinder to take a closer look at both of them.

Bob

[David G]

Bob,

You certainly have good taste in boats! <G>

[BobW]

Thanks David,

I didn't used to.

BobW

[CapnJ2ds]

Thanks for the memory Paul, Anzac cove?

West side of Putiki Bay "proper', John. That's Bernie Rhode's "Magic Carpet" on her mooring on the far right of the pic, and part of the infamous collection of slowly disintegrating boats on the foreshore to the left.

For non-Kiwis, those orca shots were taken only just outside the Waitemata Harbour heads, only a couple of km from the Auckland CBD as the sober seagull flies.

[john welsford]

Thanks John, its a while since I did much sailing around there, hope to see more of it this summer.

JohnW

West side of Putiki Bay "proper', John. That's Bernie Rhode's "Magic Carpet" on her mooring on the far right of the pic, and part of the infamous collection of slowly disintegrating boats on the foreshore to the left.

For non-Kiwis, those orca shots were taken only just outside the Waitemata Harbour heads, only a couple of km from the Auckland CBD as the sober seagull flies.