Table saws

[bischoffboatworks]

I've been using my old Delta cheapo cabinet table saw for the last ten years and am now serious enough to invest in something decent with a great fence. Have looked at high end Delta, Grizzly, General, etc. Anyone out there have strong feelings about table saws for boat shops? Straight, clean, quiet is good. Thanks.

[landlocked sailor]

I love my 15 yo Powermatic 66 but I would look at the Bridgewood line at Wilke Machinery. Rick

[wgstephens]

There are so many used 3 phase saws on the market at 1/10 the original price. I have a northfield 3 phase with a micrometer fence cost 1000.00. Look at governmentliquidation.com there are often decent machines at this auction. check blade mfg they often have new blades that were not picked up for these larger saws.

[wgstephens]

I just looked at governmentliquidation.com. There is a 3 phase Jet 5 hp 440volt probably dual votage auction starting 8/23 ending 8/25 in Pa. A 10 inch unisaw 1-ph in Wa.

[GregH]

Brought a Grizzly 10", 2HP #1023 a few years ago with Shop Fox fence, and couldn't be happier. Was really struggling between it and a similer Delta($1500)- Glad I went with Grizzly(<$1000)- solid, and accurate. Do get the opitional roll-around base though- it's heavy!!

[Paul Girouard]

I've got a Grizzly cab saw, with Biesemeyer fence. Very happy with it.

The cab shop I worked at had a Powermatic 66, the good part , and why that saw was purchased was the tilt goes to the left , away from the fence in normal operation ,( good for finished end pnl miters, miters in general ), with the Biesemeyer fence.

Very easy to make jigs to slide on the Biesemeyer , they had a Uni fence / with Delta saw we sold it once the powermatic was up and ready.

Lot of money , lot of saw.

[Peter Malcolm Jardine]

I bought a high end chiwanese fence, on an old unisaw that I bought used. total money (including a 3hp 220v motor): $600 bucks US. I did some clean up and tweaking on the trunion, but it's a great old saw. In saying that, I'm sure the $2500 saws are better.

[JimConlin]

I have Powermatic 66 , 3HP, Biesemeyer fence. If I had to choose between it and SWMBO, it's be a hard decision. Look also at the General.

[Bruce Hooke]

I have a Delta Unisaw with a Unifence and I have been very happy with it.

I think a lot depends on just how good a saw you are looking for and how much work and money you are willing to put into getting such a saw. For example, used 3-phase saws are likely to be a good deal and very rugged, but if you have to account for the time spent shopping for such a saw and the cost of either getting a 3-phase converter or swapping out the motor (assuming your shop does not have 3-phase power) then they may not be such a good deal. Similarly, a lot of people seem to be quite happy with Grizzly power tools. On the other hand, my general impression from reading tool reviews is that Grizzly tools are cheaper for a reason, which is that they find ways to cut corners on making the tools. HOWEVER, for many people the corners Grizzly cuts are very reasonably trade-offs because the minor inconveniences created or the fact that the saw will wear out in 30 rather than 50 years does not really matter...

[pipefitter]

Alot of times if you get a used 3 phase saw or tool and want it to be converted,Alot of electric motor rewind shops will trade you for a similar single phase or maybe even rewind it as one for half cost of a new one. My experience with rebuilt electric motors have been great and in alot of applications prefer them as the older motors were wound with solid copper and sported cast iron housings and are usually much quieter/cooler running than the new ones.

[wgstephens]

http://www.exfactory.com look at this THEN buy a chung foo or whatever for about the same price . The quality work you can do with an accurate 2 thousand pound saw made in america vs. a sheet metal base chinese saw. Aska professional saw sales person who sells to the woodworking industry. Or follow the advice of someone who has never used a moak or oliver or other similar high performance is like buying a chevy because the person whose advice you are using has never heard of a mercedies The closing of american manufacturing companies has left a glut of these high quality variety type table saws available at scrap values. Do your self a favor investigate this. My Northfield # 4 goes for 11,000 new I bought mine used for 1000.00 Northfield will sell a 1 phase motor but buy a roto phase or build one like my buddy did. then you can buy a 3 phase band saw etc. Home hobby types don't want 3 phase machines for their garage so there is little competition for the 3 phase machines

[cs]

A few years ago I bought the Grizzly table saw and it always gets mixed reviews here. I've been very happy with mine. I got more saw for the money by going with Grizzly.

Chad

[Garrett Lowell]

I have a Ryobi BT3000, and I despise it. If I had my choice, I'd go with a General 650-T50-M2M. I think, though, that I'll be getting a good bandsaw before I upgrade my table saw.

[Bob Perkins]

Delta Unisaw w/Beismeyer Fence.

The Unisaw has been around FOREVER... It works.. You never hear complaints..

Kind of hard to beat that I think smile.gif

Take Care,
Bob

[George Roberts]

bischoffboatworks ---

I spend about 6 hours a day in my shop. I use my table saw as an outfeed table for my bandsaw.

Unless you have a lot of table saw specific work to do you might be better off buying a cheap saw.

[willmarsh3]

I got a Ryobi BT 3000 also. It's ok for cutting thin wood but probably not more than 2" thick. It doesn't do well when cutting 1/8 x 2" strips for laminations. I burned up the motor trying to cut something thicker, then had to drive 2 hours to Birmingham to get to the authorized service center to get a new motor. Then again a week later to pick it up. Next time I'll try to make sure it can be serviced closer to home.

Will.

[Keith Wilson]

Hoo boy, exfactory.com is a fun site. Now this is a table saw!

http://www.exfactory.com/photos/ST/28029804.JPG

Or how about a reconditioned Northfield?

http://www.exfactory.com/photos/ST/28030102.JPG

[ 08-24-2005, 09:23 AM: Message edited by: Keith Wilson ]

[wgstephens]

Check out Taunton press Fine Woodworking and Fine Homebuilding magazine reviews of machinery very non biased, the also have a book/magizine on table saws I believe. http://www.forrestblades.com/dampner.htm this site is very informative. Decreasing run out of current saw and blade set up may give you alol you need in the way of accuracy inprovement. A blade dampener is a must for accurate cuts. Check out Enco or another source for angle blocks and dial indicators for set up. This is an absolute!! how else can you know the accuracy of a new used saw or of your current saw. What does your current set up read ? http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INPDFF?PMPAGE=188 also http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INPDFF?PMPAGE=229 # 418-4820 Angle set up plates $ 22.70 these or similar are necessities for accuracy for any saw

[pipefitter]

circular saw/carbides and a straight edge,a good long bodied plane...the world is your shop. smile.gif

[wgstephens]

Amen

[Paul Girouard]

Ya,,, where is "Ole bingie" :confused: We had this discussion some time ago , table saw Vs. Skilsaw.

I'd still want a table saw / with a outfeed table. Bigger is better , depends on what you need to cut , sheet goods bigger is better. Lumber longer is better, out front of the blade run out.

Get the Griz w/ the biesemeyer, it will work for ya .

[wgstephens]

Look at what these saws went for http://www.irsauctions.com/index_search_results.asp?pg=auction&id=8079*8080*8081*8082*8083*8084*8086*8085*8089*80 90*8091 *8092&pid=8079 a moak $1000.00 a # 4 northfield $ 1225.00 . since america is going to dismantle it's manufacturing industry, lay off it's workers and cripple it's economy you might as well take advantage of it.

[BrianY]

The Grizzly 1023 has been highly rated by Popular Woodworking and other wood working magazines and is very highly rated by amateur and professional woodworkers that post on The Oak woodworking tools forum that I check in on now and again. But then again, these folks are only making furniture, not boats, so what do they know, right??? ;)

In any case, do some research and I think you'll find (as I did when I was looking at table saws about a year ago) that the Grizzly is rated as the best value for the money, and the Powermatic and Delta cabinet saws both have well-deseved reuptations (not to mention very vocal advocates!), but they cost considerably more than the Grizz.

But what do I know anyway.... read the reviews in the the magazines and on other woodworking forums and decide for yourself. All the information you need is out there if you dig for it.

[pipefitter]

My boss found a 10" unisaw at an auction for 220.00 with the Beismeyer fence with it at a cabinet shop going out of business auction. There was 2 of them and he failed to snag the other for me(he didn't think I was interested in that kind of stuff?).I remember telling him the sound they make on start up over the 2 way.He restored it nicely and it is pretty nice to use.

[wyndham]

I grew up in a shop, my fathers family were woodworkers my mothers family were boat builders. I have been a gneral contractor for twenty two years. The delta unisaw is the standard as far as I am cncerned for on site and most shops. I went with a Dewalt ten inch a few years ago because I like the machining of the tilt and elevation assemblies. The miter guide is very well machined as well with zero play side to side. The fence is a beismeyer knock off but very accurate and very easy to set. It is a great cabinet saw.
That being said the table saw is not a great boat building tool unless all you are doing is ripping straight stock for a stripper.
If you are going to invest money in tools to build boats, as in more than one, spend a few thousand on the biggest baddest band saw you can find. Then buy a good skil saw and learn how to make it your best freind.
Just my two cents.........

[cs]

I'm sure glad to see more supporters of the Grizzly coming out of the woodwork. I enjoy mine and will buy from Grizzly again.

Chad

[pipefitter]

I'd have to 2nd a thumbs up on the dewalt portable 10". It does work very well. Also agree with the bandsaw choice as first tool to have for boat building.
I took an old sears craftsman band saw,souped it up with nicer blade guides and belt and it works well.
Have used craftsman bandsaws(same ones) for the last 14 yrs in an aluminum fab shop and they keep on going. We also have a delta 2 speed bandsaw that I never use because I prefer the craftsman for some reason.Maybe I am just used to it.After using hand tools for so long,I guess any power tool seems like a pretty good one to me.I can still shave a door faster with my bench plane faster than it takes to get out the cord and stuff for the power planer.

[Jay Greer]

If you can lay your hands on an old Oliver or Yates American 12 incher, you will be in hog heaven! These cast iron behemoths of yesteryear are still by best option for an indestructable boat shop saw.
Both were built with sliding tables and are well worth looking for. They come up on auction from time to time and there are those who specialise in reconditioning these fine machines.

[wyndham]

Pipefitter; there is nothing portable about my Dewalt 10" unless you are a hell of lot stronger than I am.
I know the saw you are thinking about, mine is the one with the BIG base and the extended tables.
I would agree that the old Olivers are the ones to find if you are going to buy a bandsaw. The bigger the better.
I worked in a cabinet shop that had a 36" saw of unknown origin. The wheels weighed a good two hundred pounds apiece. For really tricky or delicate stuff we didn't even bother to turn it on, we would just spin the upper wheel by hand. Once it was moving it would stay moving for quite a while. The babbit bearings had to be repoured every once in a while to keep it all true and smooth. I'd give my right nut for a saw like that.

[Paulyboy]

The latest in saws is manufactured by the company called Sawstop. This is the company that came out with the safety device that stops the saw literally in the nick of time and saves lotsa fingers. Theres a write up about the saw in one of this months wood mags, with a demo picture of the hot dogs they used as stunt doubles for fingers going into the blade. If you work with juniors or apprentices or others that may lose, and then miss, their digits, you might consider this.

[sdowney717]

WEAK MOTOR!!
I bought a 10 inch grizzly with 2 HP motor about 10 years ago. It was around 400$.
The motor was the weakest link here and I burned it out within 2 years. Replaced it with a 3 HP from Ebay and then it was perfect. The stock motor simply did not have enough power.

Also the miter is poorly made. I prefer having a spring pin to set it to 90 degrees, 45 degrees etc... I would say it is a decent saw but knowing what I like to do, the 12 inch 3 HP cabinet saw was the one I should have bought.
I did find you can get an adapter washer and swing a 12 inch blade in my saw.

[sdowney717]

I also run the saw on 240 volt single phase and it is much better than 120.

[Bruce Hooke]

Originally posted by Paulyboy:
The latest in saws is manufactured by the company called Sawstop. This is the company that came out with the safety device that stops the saw literally in the nick of time and saves lotsa fingers. Theres a write up about the saw in one of this months wood mags, with a demo picture of the hot dogs they used as stunt doubles for fingers going into the blade. If you work with juniors or apprentices or others that may lose, and then miss, their digits, you might consider this.This system got discussed here a while back and it seems like there were a couple of key concerns:

1. The (potential) frequency of "misfires," which would destroy your expensive sawblade.

2. It seems like the system cannot be retrofited onto existing saws and that the big makers are not likely to adobt it, so options for saws with this feature will be limited.

That said, if I ran, say, a woodshop used by lots of undergraduates I might well consider this saw.

What might be more interesting is if they came up with a similar feature for a bandsaw. They cause more injuries anyway...

[cs]

I've got the Grizzly contractors saw and I've never had a problem with the motor having enough power. White oak is no problem and it goes through pine like it is butter. Angelique was a little tough, but methinks that would be tough on anything.

Chad

[guillemot]

I have the grizzly 10" 1023Z with cast extension tables. It was the best value I found in a saw. Runs great. The stock fence set up easily and is rock solid (Bies. knockoff). A great saw for the money.

I understand that earlier incarnations of this saw were not favorably reviewed, but that Grizzly responded with appropriate changes. The 2HP motor has been more than sufficient for most of my work.

Next saw will have a bigger motor, though (for the "big boat" i'll build someday :D ).

Jeff

[Paul Girouard]

Here's how I'm setup , could be cooler , draws , doors etc under , vac system etc. But it works for me . I have a old door (stored in the shop ) that I can quickly (ten minutes) setup to extend the table out in front of the blade for ripping long stock , Like 18' and up. 16' I can handle as she sits, alone no problems.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b299/PEG688/aug2005013.jpg

Now if I did it right redface.gif Seems like I got it , still to big. ( Well third try I like the size of the pic now redface.gif redface.gif )

The dusty Penobscot 14' plan is to the left of the garden hose. On the back wall :( Some day ,maybe :cool:

[ 08-28-2005, 12:49 AM: Message edited by: Paul Girouard ]