Can you ever have too much power?

[The Bigfella]

I never thought I'd say yes to that - but .....

http://cache.gawker.com/assets/images/2008/09/custom_1221592837023_R1-kart.jpg

http://jalopnik.com/5050770/six+wheeled-yamaha-r1-kart-ensures-youll-die-smiling

Interestingly, my young bloke - well, the middle kid, eldest boy - 20 year old - told me last night that he's been selected by the University Formula SAE (Society of Automotive Engineers) team to get his racing licence after a test day at the track. Their cars are limited to engines that are only half the power, or less, of this monster.

Last year's car - the one he's driven - powered by a Suzuki 600cc engine:

http://www.aeromech.usyd.edu.au/sae/images/2007car_02.jpg

Peter has built the intake for this year's car.

[coelacanth2]

I dunno...looks cool and fun to me. Of course, I don't have the reactions to DRIVE the silly thing.
I daren't let the kid get a gander at that. He'd be militating to cannibalize the old Yamaha for the motor...:D

[LeeG]

no kidding, I'd need shocks on all the important parts connecting my eyes to my arms or I'd spin out every time I sneezed

[The Bigfella]

It would sure be fun trying it out eh? I get into enough trouble in my go kart - which only has about 17-18hp - a tenth of what that thing has. The Formula SAE car has about 75-80 hp and as Pete said its HEAPS quicker than the M5.

Some rough lbs/hp guesstimates of various vehicles with a driver Pete's weight in them - my go kart 15 lb/hp - the M5 13 lb/hp, the SAE car under 9lb/hp - that monster above, just under 2 lb/hp. Yikes!

[pipefitter]

BF. . . you never saw the gixxercarts?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNmDgnvc93s

[George Roberts]

The problem with high hp/weight machines is keeping them in the proper attitude.

[The Bigfella]

Love it They definitely would benefit with a bit of extra wheelbase.

[Bill R]

OMG. My 6 yo son would go nuts. He has been begging me since he was old enough to comprehend them to help him build a "race car".

[John Meachen]

A bit of a bump for Ian's benefit.I read a report of the Formula SAE event held at Silverstone during the summer and it mentioned that the University of Southern Denmark produced a car featuring wooden bodywork.Could this be the start of something significant?

[The Bigfella]

That's interesting John. I just tried a quick search and their team website is fairly basic, but I wouldn't mind trying to find that one.

Different teams obviously go different directions. I was talking to Pete about the Australian scene and he said that some of the teams have large budgets and outsource a lot of the work - eg carbon fibre tubs and so on. Pete's team approach is to maximise learning for the students - so they do it in-house and with a fraction of the dollars spent by the "winning" teams.

Its very competitive to get on the team. Pete's a second year student, but next year he will be designing part of the car. In fourth year the team members do their thesis on it.

I mentioned earlier that Pete made the induction this year - which has a 20mm restrictor to it as part of the rules. He had to build the mould - which he made by turning up some aluminium and then do the carbon fibre layup. He scored a first-time success - apparently it took them 10 goes last year before they could get one off the mould. He learnt something the other day though - he had a presentation by one of the tooling companies - and found out that he could have made his mould much, much quicker. He had been turning the aluminium 0.2mm at a time. Ahhh - experience eh?

[spirit]

Anyone want to talk about power.... in boats???

I spent 35 years taking part with friends in the steady increase in outboard motor power applied to ever more refined deep-V boats in Florida. How could one chase dolphin (mahi mahi) and tuna and wahoo in the gulf stream if the 2000-8000 pound boat didn't go at least 30 knots into a big chop, and require a motor of 200+ HP, and a gas tank of at least 100 gallons?

Don't get me wrong. I think Ray Hunt was one of the most remarkable inventors of all time, on a level, in my head, with Picasso and Frank Lloyd Wright and the inventors of lasers (which allowed computers to work) and some remarkable geneticists I know. But geez! Those deep-Vs go 25 knots almost all of the time on 50+ gallons a day, whereas you and I know that we can go 15-20 knots in a smaller boat with 25 HP with a gas tank containing 6-12 gallons.

Do I think that we can ever have too much power?
Absolutely.
Absolutely.

[The Bigfella]

spirit - fair point. My little 12' 8" power cat only has 40 hp - but it has certainly suprised some much larger hp slugs in the water.

Its interesting with the cruiser too - last time I went out, some of those big hp plastic boats that like to dig a 3' hole in the water were travelling slower than my displacement boat. Something to do with fuel economy and fuel prces I believe.

The Formula SAE cars btw - are not built for max speed - its a combination of things that are assessed including fuel economy and handling and cost to produce.

[pipefitter]

Anyone want to talk about power.... in boats???

I spent 35 years taking part with friends in the steady increase in outboard motor power applied to ever more refined deep-V boats in Florida. How could one chase dolphin (mahi mahi) and tuna and wahoo in the gulf stream if the 2000-8000 pound boat didn't go at least 30 knots into a big chop, and require a motor of 200+ HP, and a gas tank of at least 100 gallons?

Don't get me wrong. I think Ray Hunt was one of the most remarkable inventors of all time, on a level, in my head, with Picasso and Frank Lloyd Wright and the inventors of lasers (which allowed computers to work) and some remarkable geneticists I know. But geez! Those deep-Vs go 25 knots almost all of the time on 50+ gallons a day, whereas you and I know that we can go 15-20 knots in a smaller boat with 25 HP with a gas tank containing 6-12 gallons.

Do I think that we can ever have too much power?
Absolutely.
Absolutely.


I just had this discussion with my boss the other day about boats and modern HP. Recalling a day when you could put a carbed 115 or a 125hp (at the flywheel) on a 19-20ft Aquasport and have a fast boat. Now it seems they are putting 200hp+ on the same type hulls to gain 5-10mph, not to mention what has been done with propeller design etc.