Can't find material

[Phillip Allen]

I want to build a boat using lapstrake method but can't find material locally (Northwest Arkansas)...any ideas

[paladin]

Well..over near fort Smith and up in the mountings...(that's yankee fer mountain) they izz all kinds of good wood...some of the best around if ya go look....whatch wanna build?

[Phillip Allen]

A wherry from Duck Trap

[Phillip Allen]

The tie mills cut oak and popular but the smallest dimension is one inch thickness...a bit much for the planks. I may get a cheap surface planer but from one inch to one quarter inch is too much I think.

[paladin]

Philip...I'll talk to my brother and brother-in law in the next couple of days.....do you have a "wish list" of material that you need....and can you use something other than oak....I sorta may have some suggestions.....If you can keep it a secret and dunno let other folks know...there's a lotta Osage Orange around there and down toward Stigler......

[Hughman]

Chuck, Can you arrange to have some bodark smuggled to Maine?

;)

Cheers, Hugh

[Phillip Allen]

I went around to five lumber yards today (a rare afternoon off) without finding the marine plywood (suggested by the designers) or dimentional cedar or other hardwood. I haven't ordered the plans yet as I wanted to find out if I could get the material before I invest most of $100 in plans and books. I suppose the plans will have suggestions as to the material but emails to the company haven't helped much. The guy insists all I need do is order it from any local lumber yard...it may abe possible in Main but no luck here...yet. Still...I'm just starting...do you live near here?

[Phillip Allen]

Our local boise-d-arc (sp) is never very long and prone to have fence staples and short lengths of barbwire through out

[Bruce Hooke]

As far as marine plywood goes, in many parts of the country the only way to get good quality stuff is to order it and have it shipped in by truck. It does add a bit to the cost but it's not wildly out of site, especially when you consider how much a sheet of the stuff goes for anyway. If you need many sheets it can sometimes be cheaper to order it from far away because you get a better price per sheet.

A couple of places that come up regularly as a source from which to order marine plywood are:

Harbor Sales (http://www.harborsales.net/) in Maryland, and

Boulter Plywood (http://www.boulterplywood.com/) in Massachusetts.

As far as hardwoods go, it's relatively rare that you will find hardwoods for sale in thicknesses of less than 1" (4/4) rough or 13/16" surfaced two sides. If you need thinner stock it is usual to either run it through a thickness planer or resaw it on a bandsaw. This is just part of the process of working with hardwoods. Some hardwood lumber yards will thickness wood for you for a charge (usually by running it through a planer rather than resawing it on a bandsaw).

If you are having trouble finding hardwoods at all a good general resource is http://www.wdfinder.com
Through this site you can find out about hardwood lumberyards through North America. Note: hardwood lumberyards will usually also deal in high-quality softwoods, I say "hardwood lumberyards" to distinguish them from you local building supply place, which at most will usually have a VERY limited supply of hardwoods.

You might also want to check with Paxton Lumber (http://www.paxtonwood.com) in Kansas City, MO. They carry a wide range of hardwoods and plywoods (they probably even have douglas fir marine plywood). They deliver throughout a WIDE area so their trucks may even get down to your area.

If you can post a list of exactly what you are looking for (e.g., 1/2" cedar in wide boards) that will make it much easier for us to guide you to sources or alternatives. There's a lot of forested land down your way so I'd be real surprised if there were not some small local sawmills that would be happy to supply something suitable at a very reasonable price -- however, if you go to a small sawmill you may well be getting green wood, which you will need to dry before you can use it.

One tip when inquiring about marine plywood from places like Paxton that are not used to supplying boatbuilders. Make sure you specify that you want marine plywood with equal thickness veneers. Some hardwood marine plywood comes with very thin surface veneers. This is fine for some purposes but not so good for the outsides of boats because it is a bit weaker than the equal thickness stuff and you are also less more to sand through the surface veneer. As far as I know this is not an issue with douglas fir marine plywood but that has so many other problems that many boatbuilders are avoiding it these days.

Finally, it's important to realize that hunting down the right woods is part of the building process. Even here in Rhode Island, which should be darn near the mecca for boatbuilding materials, I have to drive an hour or so to get to a good hardwood lumberyard.

[Domesticated_Mr. Know It All]

Gas up the truck. :D
Woodfinder suggests this place, about a days drive (400 miles one way)

Robichaux Lumber Company
Contact: Francis, JR, Jimmy, David & Karen
Address: 2755 Highway 308
Raceland, LA 70394
Phone: (985)447-7035
Phone: (877)223-5879
Fax: (985)447-7036

In Ohio I live an hour away from this place---> www.homsteadhardwoods.com (http://www.homsteadhardwoods.com)

Most Local lumberyards can "special order" marine grade Douglas Fir plywood around here too. Price varies greatly as well as quality.

Another wood I'd consider would be Southern Yellow Pine or Longleaf Pine.

[ 09-13-2004, 11:01 PM: Message edited by: Mr. Know It All ]

[Bob Smalser]

I suspect that buying plywood right now isn't such a good move....solid stock is likely cheaper.

You are in the middle of sawmill country...I'd look harder but not in the usual places.


http://www.sawmill-exchange.com/index.htm

http://www.mobilemfg.com/

http://www.baileys-online.com/

http://www.woodmizer.com/welcome.html

http://www.powersources.com/timberwolf/?43,62

Check the phonebook and the mill manufacturers/sellers for portable sawmillers locally. The mill builders are happy to provide names of local guys who own their mills. Local tree service guys will know of them, too. Few advertise.

A lot of them sell their excess lumber on the Wood Exchange, which is also beginning a sawyers directory:

http://www.woodweb.com/cgi-bin/forums/lumber.pl

A whole number of arborists or their employees run their own mills to salvage something more useful than firewood out of the trees they cut....I know 4 arborists here and each one has a mill somewhere in their firm....and they know guys like me with portable mills they sell special logs to.

[kc8pql]

If all of that fails, call around to your local cabinet shops and ask where they get their hardwood. Most shops have 4 or 5 sources. They may be willing to add what you need to their order the next time they they place one. I've done that for people myself.

[ 09-13-2004, 11:27 PM: Message edited by: kc8pql ]

[Jon Etheredge]

You should be able to find sawmills that saw hardwoods for framing, etc. without any problem. You might consider using sassafras. It is usually inexpensive and it has good rot resitance, steam bends exceptionally well, glues very well, is easy to work, and finishes nicely. It isn't as strong or stiff as oak so you may want to increase the scantlings (width and thickness) a bit if you are using it to replace oak. Or you can leave the scantlings the same and end up with a lighter weight boat. Sassafras is one of my favorite hardwoods for small boats.

Most boats that are planked with solid wood are planked with softwoods. Cedars are usually favored because of their light weight. This will be the stuff that may be hard to find in your area. It doesn't seem like there are cedars in northwest Arkansas but you can use white pine if that is available. The boat will end up heavier and you'll want to keep it out clean and dry when not in use to avoid rot problems if you use pine. In my opinion, lumberyard southern yellow pine would not be a very good choice for planking on a small boat because it is too heavy and it moves too much.

You might be able to get Western Red Cedar from fencing supply places. Usually, the 3/4" or 1" stock is not very good. Often times, the nominal 2" (2x6 or wider) will be better quality. Of course, you'll have to resaw or plane it to the desired thickness.

Another option would be to order Atlantic White Cedar (Juniper) or Northern White Cedar from the east coast. Several dealers advertise in the back of WoodenBoat magazine.

Yet another option is to use Cypress. There are sawmills that mill Cypress in Louisiana and East Texas.

Marine ply is a good option too. Others have covered that topic well but I'll mention that Houston Hardwoods in Houston, Texas stocks marine grade fir, occume, and sapele plywoods if you ever get that far south.

[ 09-14-2004, 12:05 AM: Message edited by: Jon Etheredge ]

[Phillip Allen]

WOW! Lots of ideas...thanks to all (I'm much encouraged).

[Bruce Hooke]

Originally posted by Bob Smalser:
I suspect that buying plywood right now isn't such a good move....solid stock is likely cheaper.
Have the prices for hardwood marine ply been going up recently too (beyond the usual inflation in this market)? I haven't been paying much attention to this market recently. It seems like this market would be pretty independent of the market for construction grade plywood. I could see where the price of douglas fir marine plywood might have been pushed up by the rise in prices for construction grade plywood.

[Venchka]

There's a guy in Jonesboro, AR who advertized sinker cypress on the internet. He turned up in a GOOGLE search for sinker cypress.

Thank goodness for saved emails:


Will cut the dimensions you need , just let me know what you need and will cut it to your spec. your cost will be $ 3 a board foot, I don,t know what the shiping will be to you have never shiped to Canada, but can find out. Delivery date is not a problem
Joe Patterson , joepatt@seark.net , ph 870 538 5207
That quote is old-don't hold him to the price.

I'll second Robichaux Lumber in Raceland, LA. Been there. Drooled a lot. They have enough doug-fir, WRC and cypress on hand to build the ARK! In large sizes up to 12x12 for the doug-fir. If you had a bandsaw you could get most anything you need out of their stock.

By the way, welcome to club. Boat lumber ain't easy. Good plywood from Harbor Sales is easy.

Go easy on the bo'dark in such a wee boat. It's great for chocks, cleats, mast steps, breasthooks, centercase logs, etc.

Since you haven't bought plans yet, did you look at Paul Gartside's clinker plans? Several of Iain Oughtred's designs can be built clinker fashion as well. Many of Iain's plans aren't limited to glued plywood.

Good luck!

Wayne
Exiting the Swamp. :D

[ 09-14-2004, 09:08 AM: Message edited by: Venchka ]

[Garrett Lowell]

Phillip Allen:

I have used this (http://www.easycreeklumber.com/index.html) company for my Alaskan Yellow Cedar. Their prices are fantastic, but shipping to Arkansas may hurt your feelings.

[Venchka]

Originally posted by Garrett Lowell:
Phillip Allen:

I have used this (http://www.easycreeklumber.com/index.html) company for my Alaskan Yellow Cedar. Their prices are fantastic, but shipping to Arkansas may hurt your feelings.Might hurt in the wallet but Alaska yellow cedar never ever hurt anybody's feelings! :D

Wayne
Exit stage left from the Swamp. :D

[Domesticated_Mr. Know It All]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Wood and Wood Products
Robichaux Lumber Company offers a full line of many wood products, including *Marine Plywood--26' long; *Cypress & Spanish Cedar; *Douglas Fir Timbers--40' long; *Rough Hardwoods and Stripping; *Complete line of building Materials; *Treated Lumber; *Re-saw and Plainer Facilities; *Paints--Lucite and Olypmic

Our Line of Dimensional and Random Width / Random Length Wood: ALDER, AROMATIC CEDAR, ASH, BASSWOOD, BALSA, BIRCH, COCOBOLO, CHILEAN CYPRESS, CHERRY, FIR, HONDURAS MAHOGANY, MAPLE, PONDEROSA PINE, PECAN, SOUTHERN YELLOW PINE, POPLAR, PECKY CYPRESS, PURPLE HEART, RED WOOD, RED OAK, SPANISH CEDAR, TREATED PINE, TEAK, TUPELO BLOCKS, WESTERN RED CEDAR, WHITE PINE, WHITE OAK, WALNUT, ZEBRA WOOD

Stock plywoods from 1/8" to 1" include: American Birch, Ash, Baltic Birch, Cedar, Cherry, Cypress, Fir, Mahogany, Maple, Marine, Meranti, Red Oak, White Oak, Teak, Teak & Holly, Walnut - Other species and special sizes available upon request.

[raycon]

http://www.forestryforum.com/cgi-bin/board/YaBB.pl?board=sawmill;action=mmall;defmap=usa

Hopefully the link takes you to a point & click list of portable mill owners.

[Wind of Heaven]

Hey Wayne, do you know if Robicheaux sells green or air-dried stock?

[Eddiebou]

Wind-
Pay attention to the post dates of these threads. Some of these guys are no longer on the forum.
But it got my attention when Venchka mentioned Robichaux Lumber, Raceland, Bayou Lafourche, (the ditch across from Wal-Mart). I've got family down there.

[Mrleft8]

Wind-
Pay attention to the post dates of these threads. Some of these guys are no longer on the forum.
But it got my attention when Venchka mentioned Robichaux Lumber, Raceland, Bayou Lafourche, (the ditch across from Wal-Mart). I've got family down there.
Some of these guys are not even still on earth, but the information hasn't changed much....
So..... Phillip..... How'd that Wherry build come out? Maybe time to take it back up?

[JimD]

Some of these guys are not even still on earth...Maybe they're back.

[Jay Greer]

Bois D Arc is entirely inappropriate for framing or planking a small boat. The wood is highly insect rot resistant but also very heavy and bend resistant. It is great for cleats, knees and mallet heads however. So far as planking goes, do you have any sassafras wood in your area? Not commonly used for boat building it is moderatly usable for planking, bends well enough for dry fitting and is resistant to rot. For frames of a clinker built boat, you are still better off seeking out green white oak.
Jay