Repair or Let go

[CapeSailor]

I have a vintage 1930's 17' Winabout sailboat made by New England Marine Co. of Boston. Merriman bronze fittings, mahogany trim, original nameplate Hull #30. It was glassed in the 1950's. This boat is very similar to a Cape Cod Knockabout.

The interior planking was a bit soft, so we put a few coats of epoxy to strengthen it. The problem is where the fiberglass ends inside the centerboard trunk. It really needs to reach up higher but the opening is so narrow. This is where my leak is and perhaps also at the centerboard pin down low on the forward part of the centerboard trunk.

I question how much money to "sink" into this, especially a boat that was never designed to be fiberglassed. It is great to sail and has lovely lines, but I cannot do this work myself. I also wonder how fragile the fiberglass is-- it on and off the trailer, if I nudged a sandbar.....

Welcoming any input/advise. Thanks.

[Thorne]

Get a survey - no way we can tell you much without a lot more info.

[TimH]

Here is one for $1,000

http://capecod.craigslist.org/boa/768094658.html

[CapeSailor]

The advertised winabout is my boat. Excuse my ignorance, but what do you mean by a survey? On this website?

[Lew Barrett]

It's hard to say from here, but "where the fiberglass ends" is a somewhat telling statement, I think. If the boat is not worth repair (and who knows?) why offer it on the List with a comment like "it needs a little work?" How about "free to a good home?" Either statement, the notion that it "needs a bit of work" or "it may not be worth repairing" could be equally valid.

In any case, to the question at hand, there are people who make their living at assessing the condition of boats to determine what work might be needed to return a boat to service, and they are called "surveyors." Surveying a small open sailboat is a relatively modest and simple affair as these things go. For $100 bucks plus or minus, a good local surveyor, or even a skilled shipwright, can tell you what her prospects are. Probably well spent both for the boat and the education.

The question could be resolved by saying where the boat is located and asking the forum if anybody knows a good surveyor, or someone with an eye for these things in your area.

[Canoeyawl]

You have a classic there.
Not a Fife or a Herreschoff, but just as special in it’s own right.

I learned to sail in Winabouts.
White hull, buff decks, varnished trim, they were popular camp boats and there were probably hundreds of them scattered around New England. Very few left now.
These are great boats and I think it should be preserved. Or at least conserved so that future generations can know how idyllic summer life was in that era.

Winabouts in 1930's Camp brochure
http://world.std.com/~chucko/cinewcat/Pg%2018%20Sailors.jpg

[Lew Barrett]

At which point it pays to offer the following opinion, I think. Old boats are almost never really a good economic proposition. They fall into the realm of "hobby" or avocation. And as many here will tell you, almost anything can be restored to good working order depending on how far one is willing to go and what one means by "restoration."
I think the first determination one needs to make is about what type of boat one wants. If the boat fits the mental picture, then it's usually worth at least investigating the options, and often enough, worth pursuing the repairs. Most of the people in this hobby will admit that the value of a boat after repair or construction is rarely equal to the money expended, but just as frequently, will allow that the rewards of the process were worth the costs.
Wooden boats are not for everyone, but the lessons learned (sometimes painful, but very often the best kind of lessons) , the satisfactions of personal progress, and the object one has at the end are counted as among the prizes of one's personal achievements for a surprising number of advocates. A seventeen foot boat, even in relatively deplorable condition, is well within the means and abilities of the average working stiff. Thus, if it seems to fit the bill, it's well worth taking the time and effort to determine if this one is in the cards for you. The modest expenditure will result in valuable information, either for you or the next guy, and may lead you down a path of surprising and unexpected pleasures. Or, depending on your own sensibilities, save you from an experiment gone awry and provide the next fellow with a valuable head start.
Few of these boats are ever really restored for just the money.

[Roger Cumming]

Mr. Barrett, rarely does one hear so succinct an explanation of why and how old wooden boats are saved and brought back to life. It remains a human activity that sometimes defies logic, and whose economics aren't always obvious. Bravo!

[CapeSailor]

Thanks for the input.....my emotional attachment to this lovely vintage boat it what keeps me on the fence. Selling it for $1,000 is basically selling the trailer and the boat is free. I am conflicted about letting her go.

I am in West Hyannisport, MA. Know a surveyor who could help?

[Larks]

A small word of warning when contacting Surveyors for your boat....(and I'll probably get shot down in flames here)....If you are talking to a "Surveyor" ask about his knowledge or expertise in wooden boats before commissioning him/her to survey your wooden boat.

I very often see "contact a surveyor" on the forum however most Marine Surveyors these days (in Oz at least) are generally qualified as surveyors to deal with such things as safety, stability, engineering, structural etc issues for commercial vessels and more often than not very well experienced and qualified with modern vessels and modern construction tchniques but not necessarily experienced with wooden boats and traditional construction techniques. They might be able to tell you generally that you have rot in your boat or broken frames but not necessarily provide sufficient advice on the extent of the problems, how to fix them or what work needs to be done to bring her up to speed.

I suggest talking first to any wooden boat builders or general shipwrights in your area and if they can't/won't offer advice they may at least know of a surveyor with proper wooden boat experience and knowledge.

cheers
Greg

[Lew Barrett]

Thanks Roger. I have whittled that speech down from prior experience!

Greg you make a good point.

For a person starting out in the hobby a trip to a couple of boatyards might be in order. Speak to owners of like boats. They don't have to be the same boat, just alike.

I believe Ian McColgin is in your general area, though I admit an embarrassing lack of geographic knowledge about MA's south shore. You might try pinging him and see where he can steer you. It might be that if you are close enough, he could take a look at it and set you on your way. In any case, these things take time. No hurry if you have a decent place to keep her, and you can decide over a few weeks, month or longer if this is for you. A seventeen footer can be a pleasant way to fill a garage for a year or so. They look bigger in a garage, and if you scatter the right sort of detritus about, your friends will be impressed.
Little better in life than working on a boat you can get your arms around. Think about that. Everybody starts somewhere and few are born with the skills in our modern world. Working on boats makes you a better plumber, electrician, painter, and of course, woodworker and overall problem solver. Not small change for payback. It's changed my life, almost all for the better except for my finances. But if I had the money, I'd buy another boat!

You won't really know until somebody with a dispassionate, critical eye helps you along, and there's no shame in it. Everybody with a boat of any substance should know a good surveyor and or shipwright.

[Gary E]

I am sorta aginst the idea of the usuall recomendation of "have it surveyed" specially such a small boat. Take a buddy with you to look at it, a buddy with no interest in owning it, just someone who can see rotten wood and aint afeared to tell you about it while your wearing rose colored glasses.

If you do get a so called Xpert to look at it, first ask him to send you copies of surveys for like boats and if they are like the ones I have read, they are written about like a discription that all but Ray Charles could of writtten, like, it has 2 Detroit engines, and tanks, etc, but nothing about actual condition other than it apears in decent shape. I would expect a detailed description of what it has, the condition, and for a 45 ft Sportfish at least 5 or 6 pages, instead they write minimal fluff. And I'm talking about boats in the 45 ft twin Diesel catagory, I really think these so called xperts have racket going.

[Captain Blight]

Um.

At least, by virtue of geography, you are in the neighborhood of several people (or businesses) who are quite knowledgeable about the things you wish to know. I am not in your area, but I will gladly give free advice on the Intertube:

Keep the boat. Replace the centerboard trunk, and be prepared to replace at least part of the keel and several frames in way of the centerboard. It sounds like a bigger job than it is; we're not talking about foot-square timbers, tens of feet long. This is pieces of wood that are furniture-sized-- a couple of inches square, six feet long at the most.

What is or will be important is the selection of the wood and of course fitting it to the existing structure precisely. The learning curve seems steep, but really it's not. What's cool about it is that you can train yourself to work to a tolerance of a few thousandths of an inch; and in relatively short order, you'll find that this ability to work precisely has infused itself into your daily life.

I'm no surveyor--heck, I'm even between boats right now-- but my vote is to save the boat and make a stab at fixing it yourself. You'll do a better job than an incompetent marina, and it'll cost less than a gold-plater restoration. Plus you get to keep the tools, and sail the boat when you're done. Win/win.

[onobleboat]

I'm with Capt Blight, fix her yourself, even a bad repair will float her for a few years and it's not that hard to do, if you get a few books on the subject and over a course of a couple of years you may gain the confidence to tear her down to the keel and stems and replank. Boats were made to enjoy, not worry about, whats the matter, you afraid of a " New Adventure" ? Thats what lifes about my friend.
http://www.freewebs.com/onobleboat/

[C. Ross]

For comparison's sake, if you want to see another small boat that isn't "worth" restoring but is repaying its owner with pride and satisfaction, I'd recommend the "Mighty Pippin" thread in Building and Repair.