PDA

View Full Version : McCain: I was post 9/11 before you were



Osborne Russell
06-18-2008, 12:04 PM
Reds struggling to make the switch from the Chimp to McCain are enamored as ever of bone-head simplifications. The simplifications will not bear the slightest scrutiny, which, to Reds, is one mark of their full-blooded truthiness.

Like this:

1. I want someone full-blooded.
2. What does that mean?
3. Can’t say.
4. How can you avoid the implication that it’s not merely a mask for ignorant bigotry?
5. Can’t say.

Let’s play again, this time, with “post-9/11.” What does it mean, exactly, tell us, full-blooded ones ! This is the question, which I will repeat, and dare you to answer:

What was changed, fundamentally, by 9/11?

It's the GOP position so you better get started on an answer. Shouldn't be hard since you've already given it so much thought, rationalizing the continuing imperialism, torture and general contempt for law and indeed anything not full-blooded.


http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/06/17/mccain-advisers-accuse-obama-of-having-sept-10-mindset/

John McCain’s advisers accused Barack Obama Tuesday of suffering a ‘September 10th mindset’ for suggesting that the prosecutions of the 1993 World Trade Center bombers were the best approach for dealing with terror suspects.

“Senator Obama is a perfect manifestation of a September 10th mindset. He brings the attitude, the failures of judgment, the weakness and the misunderstanding of the nature of our adversary and the dangers posed by them to a series of policy positions,” said Randy Scheunemann, McCain’s senior foreign policy adviser.

Separately, McCain’s campaign issued a statement from former New York City Mayor Rudy Giuliani, who said he fears Democrats are taking a step back in how to address the “clear and present danger” of terrorism.

“Barack Obama appears to believe that terrorists should be treated like criminals — a belief that underscores his fundamental lack of judgment regarding our national security. In a post 9/11 world, we need to remain on offense against the terrorist threat which seeks to destroy our very way of life. We need a leader like John McCain who has the experience and judgment necessary to protect the American people,” he said.


OK, if everything is different after 9/11, then McCain’s and Obama’s experience are equal, in duration. Both were in Congress. Was McCain in some way more closely involved in the operations of the executive branch, i.e., the Chimp Squad? Involved how? Vote for me for more Chimpishness and more Rumsfeldoes? Is that the pitch?

Vince Brennan
06-18-2008, 12:10 PM
I'd like to propose that every terrorist who enters the USA shuld me made to wear a distinctive badge so that they may be shot on sight.

Any terrorist not wearing the badge may be shot on sight.

There. That pretty much takes care of the problem, dunnit?

Thermo
06-18-2008, 01:01 PM
i
I'd like to propose that every terrorist who enters the USA shuld me made to wear a distinctive badge so that they may be shot on sight.

Any terrorist not wearing the badge may be shot on sight.

There. That pretty much takes care of the problem, dunnit?

Ali has a few more good ideas in that respect:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDQNpr2RnFI

Osborne Russell
06-18-2008, 03:23 PM
Well no, Obama was an Illinois state senator from 1997 to November, 2004.

That means McCain has three more years of Congressional experience, and three more years of responsibility.

Yeadon
06-18-2008, 04:07 PM
Therefore, our current situation is more of McCain's fault than Obama's. Good enough. Can we vote now?

Osborne Russell
06-18-2008, 07:52 PM
And, McCain's three years over Obama were the critical ones, right? Right after 9/11? When his experience would have been called upon to respond to the situation? What did he do during those critical first three post 9/11 years that puts him ahead of Obama?

I don't know why, as my wife keeps asking me, I try to give these people the benefit of the doubt, and help them shore up their logic. "They don't have any," she says. "They're (expletive deleted). Logic is the last thing they want to talk about."

ccmanuals
06-18-2008, 09:08 PM
That reminds me of the 1992 Presidential debates when President Bush(#39) was criticizing Ross Perot for his lack of governmental experience to which Perot replied ; " Well he has a point! I don't have any experience in running up a $4 trillion debt. I don't have any experience in gridlock government, where nobody takes responsibility for anything and everybody blames everybody else."

I remember that. Priceless and when you think about it still holds true.

mdh
06-18-2008, 11:51 PM
First of all, George H.W. Bush, was President #41, not #39,. Prior to 9/11, the policy was that when you had irrefutable evidence of a man like Bin Ladin's responsibility for the deaths of Americans, you checked the winds of public sentiment via polls and journalistic discourse. Then given intelligence to his whereabouts, you might decide to do a rendition, and begin the lengthy process of prosecution, divulging contacts, operatives, and surveillance techniques along the way. Post 9/11 it's more of a take it to them attitude, and if the Supreme Court says anyone we capture alive will be afforded the civil rights to be acquitted on technicality, what do you think this does to his chances of being captured alive?

Chris Ostlind
06-19-2008, 10:13 AM
... what do you think this does to his chances of being captured alive?

And your concept of war is......??

Tanbark Spanker
06-19-2008, 02:13 PM
That's right, OP, you and I know that the election of a president is just so much pointless societal masterbation. There is no real democracy in the US.

htom
06-19-2008, 02:17 PM
What would Pooh do?

We might have caught half of those involved in the first WTC bombing, but not many more.

D K Carman
06-19-2008, 02:36 PM
I've never understood why people bought into Bush II's, and his cronies, supposed justification for invading Iraq, when the perpetrator/planner of 9/11 was in Afgahnistan? Perhaps they never read the manifesto of the New American Century. It laid out the empire-building that was eventually performed and the signatores read like a list of Bush's administration. Once again a war started by business and their politicians to enrich themselves at the expense of the common people. After all the administration/Pentagon just gave another non-bid contract to KBR for 150 million over 10 years. Eisenhower warned against the industrial-military complex.

Tom Montgomery
06-19-2008, 02:42 PM
Who was gonna stop Dubya and his cronies? There are too many cowards and fools in the Congress for that. I'm voting against Senator McConnell in November for that very reason. If everyone would do the same, we might see some change in Washington. Insiders say the Repugnics up for re-election in the Fall are scared to death. That's good.

Tanbark Spanker
06-19-2008, 02:43 PM
What the hell is 'societal masterbation?' Never mind.

Osborne Russell
06-19-2008, 04:55 PM
First of all, George H.W. Bush, was President #41, not #39,. Prior to 9/11, the policy was that when you had irrefutable evidence of a man like Bin Ladin's responsibility for the deaths of Americans, you checked the winds of public sentiment via polls and journalistic discourse. Then given intelligence to his whereabouts, you might decide to do a rendition, and begin the lengthy process of prosecution, divulging contacts, operatives, and surveillance techniques along the way.

Any examples?


Post 9/11 it's more of a take it to them attitude

That's it? That's all "post 9/11" means?



and if the Supreme Court says anyone we capture alive will be afforded the civil rights to be acquitted on technicality, what do you think this does to his chances of being captured alive?

I don't get it. None have been acquitted and very few have been charged. That's the problem.

Tom Montgomery
06-19-2008, 05:03 PM
Post 9/11 the Bush administration took the Al-Qaeda threat seriously.

Pre 9/11 they didn't give a rat's ass despite being extensively briefed and warned of the Al-Qaeda threat by the out-going Clinton administration.

Osborne Russell
06-19-2008, 05:08 PM
Pre 9/11 they didn't give a rat's ass despite being extensively briefed and warned of the Al-Qaeda threat by the out-going Clinton administration.

Did they ever figure out who set the Reichstag on fire?

jbelow
06-19-2008, 06:49 PM
Post 9/11 the Bush administration took the Al-Qaeda threat seriously.

Pre 9/11 they didn't give a rat's ass despite being extensively briefed and warned of the Al-Qaeda threat by the out-going Clinton administration.

Tom , that is sad . The only way to prevent the 911 terrorist attack by the Clinton administration was to brief a Rebulican !

Typical talk your way to peace Democrap . Maybe the mooselum terrorist lover , Obama can talk to his kin folks in Iran. Maybe he can talk Actmed Ineedajob out of going nuclear.

Yeadon
06-19-2008, 06:51 PM
Tom , that is sad . The only way to prevent the 911 terrorist attack by the Clinton administration was to brief a Rebulican !

Typical talk your way to peace Democrap . Maybe the mooselum terrorist lover , Obama can talk to his kin folks in Iran. Maybe he can talk Actmed Ineedajob out of going nuclear.

This is a keeper.

Tom Montgomery
06-19-2008, 07:15 PM
LOL! I love this place. :D

Tom Montgomery
06-19-2008, 07:28 PM
Tom , that is sad . The only way to prevent the 911 terrorist attack by the Clinton administration was to brief a Rebulican !Nope. Remind me, on who's watch did 9/11 occur? Oh yeah... Dubya's.

What I am saying is the only way the Bush administration could have prevented the 9/11 attack would have been to have taken the Al Qaeda threat seriously prior to the attack. They did not. This is not news. Where have you been for the last couple of years?

Read it and weep: http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB147/index.htm

FYI, that is the website of George Washington University in Washington, D.C.

jbelow
06-19-2008, 07:47 PM
Nope. Remind me, on who's watch did 9/11 occur? Oh yeah... Dubya's.

What I am saying is the only way the Bush administration could have prevented the 9/11 attack would have been to have taken the Al Qaeda threat seriously prior to the attack. They did not. This is not news. Where have you been for the last couple of years?

Read it and weep: http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB147/index.htm

FYI, that is the website of George Washington University in Washington, D.C.

This is like shooting fish in a barrel.

That could be true but it would depend on what your definition of what is is.

Tom Montgomery
06-19-2008, 07:53 PM
Okaaay..... :rolleyes:

jbelow
06-19-2008, 08:23 PM
Okaaay..... :rolleyes:

Tom , read your hyper link . Bill Clinton is being questioned by Wallace.
We know when Bill is lying when he opens his pie hole.

enough said

Tom Montgomery
06-19-2008, 08:54 PM
I take it you are unimpressed by the Richard Clarke memo and the testimony before the 9/11 commission? Bill Clinton said that his administration briefed and warned the incoming Bush administration of the Al Qaeda threat.... and you consider him to be a liar. End of story, as far as you are concerned.

Dubya is a lucky SOB. He deserved Admiral Kimmel's fate. Instead, Bush remains commander-in-chief and a big hero to the 28%. A pity.

mdh
06-19-2008, 09:10 PM
[QUOTE=Osborne Russell;1870640]





I don't get it.

Tell me something I don't know.

James McMullen
06-19-2008, 09:14 PM
At least 28% of the people you meet are morons or ignoramouses. . . and Dubya's consistent fan base hovers around 28%. . . . . .
Eerie coincidence? You tell me!

LeeG
06-19-2008, 09:21 PM
you guys must be smarter than me because I think it's 10% who are honest morons, the remainder of GWs supporters are willfully ignorant.

jbelow
06-19-2008, 09:49 PM
I take it you are unimpressed by the Richard Clarke memo and the testimony before the 9/11 commission? Bill Clinton said that his administration briefed and warned the incoming Bush administration of the Al Qaeda threat.... and you consider him to be a liar. End of story, as far as you are concerned.

Dubya is a lucky SOB. He deserved Admiral Kimmel's fate. Instead, Bush remains commander-in-chief and a big hero to the 28%. A pity.

Tom , help me get this straight . Bill Clinton knew Al Qaeda was a threat and did nothing but reported it to George Bush who did not take action on the word of Bill Clinton.

If this is how it went down , then it would implicate the lier Bill Clinton.

LeeG
06-19-2008, 09:57 PM
Jbelow is the honest 10%

mdh
06-19-2008, 10:00 PM
If you were a member of
Al Qeada, who would you rather be president? GWB or Kerry? McCain or O'Bama?

Tom Montgomery
06-19-2008, 10:06 PM
If I were a member of Al Qaeda i would hope that Dubya conducted a coup and remained in office. Barring that, I would want someone who would continue the current policy. Their long-term strategy is to financially bankrupt the US. Dubya has been playing right into their hands.

Tom Montgomery
06-19-2008, 10:12 PM
Bill Clinton knew Al Qaeda was a threat and did nothing....See, that's yer problem right there.

By the way... did you get the Admiral Kimmel reference? He was a native of Kentucky, by the way.

Osborne Russell
06-19-2008, 10:15 PM
Typical talk your way to peace Democrap . Maybe the mooselum terrorist lover , Obama can talk to his kin folks in Iran. Maybe he can talk Actmed Ineedajob out of going nuclear.

Not only is it authentic frontier gibberish . . .

Osborne Russell
06-19-2008, 10:16 PM
If you were a member of
Al Qeada, who would you rather be president? GWB or Kerry? McCain or O'Bama?

Bush by a mile.

Now I answered your question, you might consider answering mine.

mdh
06-19-2008, 10:44 PM
Irrelevant.

jbelow
06-19-2008, 11:04 PM
If you were a member of
Al Qeada, who would you rather be president? GWB or Kerry? McCain or O'Bama?

mdh , that is a political question used by the Republicans to jerk the chain of the Democrats. The Democrats hate it because they are weak on the defence of our country.

Al Qeada would like BHO because he is young and dumb , next would be Kerry because he is anti-war . They fear GWB because he put the hurt on them . Al Qeada would piss in their pants if McCain was president. McCain has a military heritage , it is in his blood to be a warrior. I would fear to walk the streets Teheran if he was president. McCain feels the effects of war in his shoulders every day. McCain is no war monger but he would sure know how to win a war. I do not like McCains politics I do not think he is a natural at it but my old fat ass would follow him into battle any day.