Simple faering question

[BackwoodsEric]

This question is so simple I haven't been able to find the answer in books or the internet. For oselvar type faerings with a very thin stem and stern, how is the hood ends of the planks attached. I would think this area would be subject to temendous forces and through riveting would be very strong (see picture) yet very unprobable due to the angles involved especially with the garboard. I have read one thread that danced around this topic but didn't address this exact issue. I don't know how simple square nails that's unriveted could be stong enough to secure the planks on a thin, unrabbeted keel such as this. Any insights would be much appreciated.
http://i283.photobucket.com/albums/kk301/eric_henderson2718/stem-1.jpg

[StevenBauer]

Our faering is glue lap plywood so there are no fasteners in the whole boat:

http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r241/bauerdad/Small%20Reach%20Regatta%202007/IMG_1241.jpg

There are some good faering sites but I have no Norwegian. :( The links are on the other computer, I'll check later.


Steven

[BackwoodsEric]

Well I suppose that would certainly be one way of doing it. That's a nice faering by the way. As far as construciton goes the best pictures I found are at:
http://home.online.no/~joeolavl/viking/index.htm
which is an excellent site. Clearly along the T-shaped keel the garboard is riveted, but one can't tell from pictures if along the stem if it's a regular ship nail or a rivet.

[Cullen T.M. McGough]

Hum. I've not built one, but I've done repairs on a few with this issue...

All of those chose to go ahead and use screws when it came to the stem. (Counter-sunk and bunged, so the fastener head is 90 degrees to the face of the plank. ) Your stem is rabbited? No?

[lagspiller]

I haven't built or repaired one. Just used them and never offered that question a thought. I can tell you there are no nail or screws there, just roves & rivets. And they all have a metal brace on the inside, as far as I remember the boats I've seen. But that is put in afterwards.
I'm sure one of the norwegian boatbuilders will pop up with the answer, but in the meantime these pictures may be of some help.
http://www.oselvarverkstaden.no/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=27&Itemid=30#
Choose "Bygging". Ten pictures in that series...

[BackwoodsEric]

The pictures from Bygging show fasteners alongthe stem/stern that are clearly ferrous contrasting with the copper rivets on the clinker section. Interesting....perhaps their screws, a modern twist, albiet vikings had no screws (I think). The situation is all convoluted because the fearings from http://home.online.no/~joeolavl/viking/oselvar.htm
looks like they exclusively use copper fasteners.

[StevenBauer]

I thought they used iron rivets not copper.

Steven

[BackwoodsEric]

Yes the Vikings used bog iron, but the modern guys use copper. Less reactive, easier to peen.

[lagspiller]

You get what you pay for. The Oselver shop and the guys here in Austevoll make the boat to your specification. Copper is more expensive, but the Oselver is an expensive boat today so the difference between copper and iron is not a big cost issue anymore.
A new Oselver with a sail rig will run you up to about 70,000 NOK. At today's terrible (for you) exchange rate, that is 14,000 USD.

[norseman]

A new Oselver with a sail rig will run you up to about 70,000 NOK. At today's terrible (for you) exchange rate, that is 14,000 USD.


Hi Lagspiller, add about 40000 NOK, ballpark ;).

As pointed out above, boat nails is the traditional way with rivets along the keel.

[lagspiller]

Really??? :eek: Prices have risen fast in that case. 70,000 was fancy full pakke expensive about 5 years ago. A friend got his more normally made one delivered about 3 years ago and paid around 50-60... course he had ordered it a couple of years before that and he was very happy with the price.

Edit... looked the price up and understand the difference better now. My friend did the finishing work himself.

[Todd Bradshaw]

Looking through the book "Inshore Craft of Norway" which documented the design variations and construction of a whole bunch of old Norwegian boats, it would appear that hood ends were nearly always attached with nails.

[BackwoodsEric]

Thanks guys for all your responses. In going through the forum archives I found a very detailed series of posts by Jon Etheredge. The says, "The fastening into the backbone are galvanized nails. The nails are tapered square nails. They don't have the double taper as is seen on some U.S. 'boat nails' but instead have a single taper from the point to under the head. The rivets are similar but as far as I recall they have less taper."

[BackwoodsEric]

Then he goes on to say the boatbuilders he worked with scoffed at the idea of using copper along the backbone because of strength, but then remarks how other builders in other regions of Norway used copper anyway. So bottom line: it's boatnails driven in 90 degrees to the planking, I think.