Unknown Wood and Canvas Canoe

[Rocky Clipper]

My son lives in a northern Canadian community in the province of Alberta. He has found an old wood and canvas canoe outside a used store and wonders if it would be worthwhile to purchase and restore. He tells me the canvas is peeling and rotted but he doesn't see much structural damage. I don't know of rot in the wood but he says it has been exposed to the weather for a couple of years so this may be likely. What is a reasonable price to pay and is a woodshop and special tools required if some strucural replacement is necessary?

[bob goeckel]

might need to post some pictures and it would be a good idea to post to the wood canoe heritage ass. site. www.wcha.org. (http://www.wcha.org.) special tools and construction techniques are needed to repair canoes properly. good luck! what are they asking for it?

[WWheeler]

Rocky,

In our area, old cedar canvas canoes can be worth $1,000-$2,000 depending on their condition. Depending on how much you pay for the canoe, you could have someone do it for you, depending on how much the canoe is worth.

Alternatively, you could tackle the restoration yourself. I took a canoe-building course this year, which also included a restoration area. Re-canvassing is not considered too difficult, and can be done in several days.

[Bruce Hooke]

As others have said, a lot depends on condition. WCHA is a great resource for information about any matters related to wood and canvas canoes.

If the canoe is of a desirable make and model (Chestnut Canoe Company is one well-known and desirable model, especially in the Canadian north) that will make it much more valuable both in its current condition and restored. If it is an unknown make and model it could be just as functional a canoe, but it may be harder to tell in advance if you don't have a good understanding of canoe types and shapes, and the price should be a good bit lower. Be careful of claims that the boat is XYZ make and model unless there is clear evidence on the canoe to support this claim. Many used canoes are labeled as "probably a Chestnut Prospector" or the like without any clear evidence of that being the case, and in some cases with plenty of evidence to a knowledgeable observer that it is not the case!

I would start by going over the canoe carefully to try to determine what condition the wood is in. Replacing canvas is relatively easy; if lots of the wood is also shot then that means a lot more work. One area to look carefully at is the bow and stern decks and nearby wood. On canoes stored upside down birds often like to nest in these areas, which retains moisture, which promotes rot. Another thing to check is the overall shape of the boat. A boat that has lost its shape is obviously a LOT more work to repair.

As to whether it is worth it...from a financial perspective it is not likely to be if you "charge" for your time. It is like most amateur wooden boat related projects -- you do it because you like doing it and like the end product, and possibly because your sweat equity allows you to get something that you otherwise would not be able to afford.

Lastly, beat up wood canvas canoes, while not around every corner, are not exceptionally rare, so I would advise some careful thinking to determine whether this is the right boat to take on. The WCHA website has classifieds in which used wood canvas canoes in all conditions are listed. It is true that listings in or anywhere near northern Alberta are likely to be VERY rare.

[Rod Tait]

As stated by others, there are still many old canvass canoes around so it may not be worth any more than what you pay to have it restored (yourself or someone else).

You can always look for serial numbers which would be stamped on one of the inside stems. The shape of the decks may give you a clue. Chestnuts tend to be small and round across the gunwales. Another common canoe is a Huron, made by a Canadian company and sold in department stores as late as the 50's for as low as $500 Can. They can be identified by a small, thin cap on the gunwales to cover up the relatively poor fitting of the deck and to bring the height of the inwale as high as the dado cut outwale. The ends of the gunwales will run into the deck, whereas on Chestnuts and Old Towns, the inwales usually run right to the stems.

Whenever someone asks me how much it will cost to repair and old cedar/canvass, my first question is to determine how much sentimental value the boat holds for them. Often the boat will be worth less than the cost of repair. I have had people give boats to me when they find out what it would cost to get it back in the water, leaving me to dispose of it or slowly restore it and MAYBE sell it.

[Rocky Clipper]

Thanks to all for your input. I have forwarded the link to my son. Should he decide to take the project on he can make a more informed decision.
I will see if he is interested in obtaining photos to post for your opinions.

Brian

[Rocky Clipper]

Originally posted by bob goeckel:
might need to post some pictures and it would be a good idea to post to the wood canoe heritage ass. site. www.wcha.org. (http://www.wcha.org.) special tools and construction techniques are needed to repair canoes properly. good luck! what are they asking for it?

[Rocky Clipper]

Originally posted by WWheeler:
Rocky,

In our area, old cedar canvas canoes can be worth $1,000-$2,000 depending on their condition. Depending on how much you pay for the canoe, you could have someone do it for you, depending on how much the canoe is worth.

Alternatively, you could tackle the restoration yourself. I took a canoe-building course this year, which also included a restoration area. Re-canvassing is not considered too difficult, and can be done in several days.Alas, all is mute. My sone returned to the junk store and the boat is gone, apparatnly sold to an old timer from a community called Assumption. Hopefully he has the skill and time to make her floatworthy again.