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LeeG
02-15-2008, 12:59 PM
Obama=Socialism,,I think is going to be the main one. Any others?

LeeG
02-15-2008, 01:12 PM
I'm seeing it pop up in other boards, Bob Smalser made a similar allusion.

John of Phoenix
02-15-2008, 01:15 PM
She has a new campaign manager. Gotta have a new mantra.

Back to Obama's swiftboating. "Did you know he's black?" Spoken in a half whisper of course.
No kidding, I've actually heard a few people say that. Scary on several levels.

Greg P H
02-15-2008, 01:15 PM
Barak Hussein Obama = Saddam Hussein= terrorism= 9/11

Milo Christensen
02-15-2008, 01:19 PM
. . . Any others?

Is this a rhetorical question?

Turn your enemies strength into weaknesses and prevail with little effort.

Keith Wilson
02-15-2008, 01:21 PM
Yep, the meme of the week this week was "Sure, Obama gives inspiring speeches, but he;s all fluff, no real substantive policy proposals". The "candidate with solutions" thing is a mutated version of that. It's completely false, of course, as most of them are. Obama has at least as many concrete policy details as any other candidate, but of course truth doesn't matter to memes; they just want to propagate.

A previous one was that Obama's really a Muslim; there was a viral e-mail circulating about it a few weeks ago with some BS about how he won't salute the flag or something. I guess being a member of the United Church of Christ is just a ruse? Snopes has that one debunked by now, although the unspeakable Coulter was talking endlessly about "B. Hussein Obama". Sometimes it's enough to make one want to leave the planet, seriously.

Milo Christensen
02-15-2008, 01:31 PM
Wouldn't it be so, so, deliciously ironic if the Clinton campaign started to appeal to the "less educated demographic" by playing the intellectual card?

Isn't there a recent thread about dumb and dumber?

LeeG
02-15-2008, 01:38 PM
The socialism one is a good one because it dovetails well with "tax and spend liberals", old folks are still a disproportionate voting group so the repetion of a term with negative associations with a cold war enemy can stick. "he'll change things too fast"

Following Milos suggestion what would McCains SwiftBoatII material be?

bob winter
02-15-2008, 01:44 PM
I had a couple of friends of mine from Florida stay with me for a couple of weeks in Barbados when I was down there recently. They had a morbid fixation with the stock market, which was doing one of its free-fall things and the US primaries. They are absolutely convinced that that email about Obama being a Muslim was true. I argued with them until I finally gave up but I don't think I changed their minds. After all they have lived in Florida for the last fifty-odd years so I guess you have to make allowances.

Bob Smalser
02-15-2008, 01:59 PM
Obama=Socialism,I think is going to be the main one. Any others?

It won't take any lying. Obama's class warfare message is as left as anything seen lately. Far left of McGovern.

Wonderland.

http://online.wsj.com:80/public/page/8_0004.html?bcpid=86195573&bclid=212338097&bctid=1416869244

Bruce Taylor
02-15-2008, 02:06 PM
Bill must have thought he was pretty clever to come up with....

Obama = Jesse Jackson.

The fact that it blew up in Clinton's face doesn't mean the Republicans won't try it again.

For Jackson, substitute Louis Farrakhan, Al Sharpton, or anyone associated with racial redress or black identity politics.

LeeG
02-15-2008, 02:14 PM
It won't take any lying. Obama's class warfare message is as left as anything seen lately. Far left of McGovern.

Wonderland.

http://online.wsj.com:80/public/page/8_0004.html?bcpid=86195573&bclid=212338097&bctid=1416869244

"he's a downer"
"tiresome"

"Obamas message is that that the present is negative"

"McCain is positive"


Bob, I don't get a supporting argument that Obama is promoting socialism. Just that Obama is appealing to core Democrats who are a bunch of negative nabobs. No, lying isn't necessary when it comes to using words for effect. The article I found was about Obamas suggestion for increased foreign aid as proof of a socialist agenda.

Wasn't Edwards promoting the old time democrat message about class issues?

http://online.wsj.com/public/page/8_0004.html?bcpid=86195573&bclid=212338097&bctid=1416869244

Here he is again talking about the "downer message". Sounds like this fellow is unhappy with the bad news. It's as though people see negative possibilities into the future.

Keith Wilson
02-15-2008, 02:14 PM
Obama's class warfare message is as left as anything seen lately. Far left of McGovern.LOL! Bob, do you have ambitions of being a stand-up comic? I realize you may not have a very good idea of the differences between those left of center, having not spent much time over there, but seriously now - "far left of McGovern?" Slightly to the right of Johnson and Hubert Humphrey, I'd say. I bet Paul Wellstone would have said he was a conservative.

Milo Christensen
02-15-2008, 02:25 PM
. . . Following Milos suggestion what would McCains SwiftBoatII material be?

The 1962 version of The Manchurian Candidate (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Manchurian_Candidate)will be aired by several of the networks.

But, Norm's off to a good start on this thread (http://www.woodenboatvb.com/vbulletin/upload/showthread.php?t=75811), isn't he?

Milo Christensen
02-15-2008, 02:33 PM
Ironic that I just watched it the night before last, on cable....

You're kidding me, right? Has it started already?

PatCox
02-15-2008, 02:33 PM
Haven't you all heard? He likes to smoke crack while getting blown by guys.

John of Phoenix
02-15-2008, 02:41 PM
TheStranger.com, WA - Feb 13, 2008
Netflix will have to order 10000 more copies of The Manchurian Candidate to fill the requests of conservative cinemaniacs.
Conservative cinemaniacs? Go rush, GO! :D

Is it true that the WSJ is getting a series on Comedy Central? (See how easy it is?)

Bob Smalser
02-15-2008, 02:42 PM
Odd. I thought y'all wanted to know how Obama would be attacked.

LeeG
02-15-2008, 02:42 PM
that aren't Republicans either!

LeeG
02-15-2008, 02:47 PM
It's appreciated Bob.

http://www.aim.org/

AIM Says Media Cover-Up Obama’s Socialist-Oriented Global Tax Bill
February 13, 2008
Accuracy in Media editor Cliff Kincaid disclosed today that a hugely expensive bill called the “Global Poverty Act,” sponsored by Democratic Senator Barack Obama, was quickly passed by the Senate Foreign Relations Committee on Wednesday and could result in the imposition of a global tax on the United States.

http://www.gopusa.com/commentary/ckincaid/2008/ck_02151.shtml


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Other Columns by Cliff Kincaid
Cliff Kincaid Bio



Obama's International Socialist Connections
By Cliff Kincaid
February 15, 2008

Campaign workers for senator and presidential candidate Barack Obama are under fire for displaying a flag featuring communist hero Che Guevara. But Obama has his own controversial socialist connections. He is, in fact, an associate of a Chicago-based Marxist group with access to millions of labor union dollars and connections to expert political consultants, including a convicted swindler.





http://www.usasurvival.org/index.html

Our mission is to educate the American people and to expose the influence of global institutions, including an International Criminal Court, on their lives. Our president is veteran journalist Cliff Kincaid.

Keith Wilson
02-15-2008, 02:57 PM
Bob, are you telling us how Obama's going to be attacked, expressing your own views, or both? Hard to tell just from the posts.

LeeG
02-15-2008, 03:00 PM
I think Bob is participating in the grape vine of ideas.

Keith Wilson
02-15-2008, 03:02 PM
Fermented or not?

Bob Smalser
02-15-2008, 03:07 PM
I think Bob is participating in the grape vine of ideas.

Well, that's much of the problem. The Wonderland message is all pleasant mush. Where does Obama stand specifically?

Kaa
02-15-2008, 03:07 PM
Here's some yeast :D or maybe ergot, really :D :D

http://barackobamaisyournewbicycle.com/

Kaa

Keith Wilson
02-15-2008, 03:13 PM
Ergot, definitely. Wow! He baked me a PIE!! :D

Bob, you can look it up. No secret.
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/

LeeG
02-15-2008, 03:17 PM
That wonderland message is an op/ed from the WSJ and didn't say ANYTHING about Obamasocialism,,just that democrats were trotting out that tired old line that everything is bad. The implication of course is that everything is good.

Which makes me wonder where you got the Obamasocialism idea. Socialism really isn't a good word in the American vocabulary.

LeeG
02-15-2008, 03:20 PM
Here's some yeast :D or maybe ergot, really :D :D

http://barackobamaisyournewbicycle.com/

Kaa

that's good,,ok,

Obama is a mantra

John of Phoenix
02-15-2008, 03:30 PM
This is interesting. Hillary has been defined and redefined for the last 15 plus years. We all KNOW why we hate Hillary.

Obama? He's new meat. Even rush and ann and bill are having trouble finding good hate material. Maybe that's why John (the Manchurian Candidate) McCain is walking on flak these days.

But I have faith in the republican machine. They'll find something - even if they have to invent it. Again.

Bob Smalser
02-15-2008, 03:30 PM
Bob, you can look it up. No secret.
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/

Like I said. Complete mush. This means he'll get us out of NAFTA? Other free trade agreements? On what goods and against what countries will he apply tariffs? As the WTO hasn't worked for US interests lately, how exactly will he turn that around? His lack of substance here may work for true believers, but I ain't one.


Fight for Fair Trade: Obama will fight for a trade policy that opens up foreign markets to support good American jobs.

He will use trade agreements to spread good labor and environmental standards around the world and stand firm against agreements like the Central American Free Trade Agreement that fail to live up to those important benchmarks.

Obama will also pressure the World Trade Organization to enforce trade agreements and stop countries from continuing unfair government subsidies to foreign exporters and nontariff barriers on U.S. exports.

Tom Montgomery
02-15-2008, 03:31 PM
All the culture warriors will try to paint B. Hussein Obama as 1) a socialistic CLASS WARRIOR who 2) is weak on terrorism, if not actually sympathetic with the terrorists.

Romney gave us a hint of how the GOP will campaign when he bowed out by explaining, "In this time of war, I simply cannot let my campaign be a part of aiding a surrender to terror."

The GOP is going to attempt to frighten the bejeebus out of the American public.

John of Phoenix
02-15-2008, 03:32 PM
And McCain's grand plan? Besides the next 100 years in Iran I mean.

Oops, did I say Iran?

PatCox
02-15-2008, 03:34 PM
Part of the reason its hard to swiftboat Barack is because he's black. A lot of the republican attacks tend to be based on racism; McCain has a black child, Clinton has a black child, Dukakis let vicious black rapists out of prison, Hillary is gonna take your guns and you'll have nothing to defend you from the black criminals, he's in favor of welfare for the blacks, and on and on. They're really good in doing the innuendo, don't vote for him, what with the welfare and soft on crime, the negroes will run amuck if he gets in office. But when the candidate is black himself, its harder to use subtle, unstated racism. It almost forces them to put the Klan hat on and come out with it.

PatCox
02-15-2008, 03:37 PM
Many republicans are praying for a terror attack, hopefully right before the election, kinda like that obviously fake Osama Bin Laden endorsement of Kerry right before the election, except with people dying. Some republicans are in a position to allow, or even make, such a thing happen. Now that we have seen Bush and Cheney's character and trustworthiness, its almost inconceivable that they will not do this. Just as Bush's father colluded with terrorists to prevent the release of the Tehran hostages until after Reagan was elected. Treason just comes naturally to a Bush.

Keith Wilson
02-15-2008, 03:40 PM
Like I said. Complete mush. Partial mush, yes. It is political propaganda, after all, and the guy is a politician, not God's Messenger. Compare it with the stuff from every other candidate. If you find one that's better or mere realistic, vote for him or her.

Kaa
02-15-2008, 03:52 PM
Partial mush, yes. It is political propaganda, after all, and the guy is a politician, not God's Messenger. Compare it with the stuff from every other candidate. If you find one that's better or mere realistic, vote for him or her.

Well, yes, but the original question was his position on the issues. It is still mushy-fuzzy on a lot of them and I assume that's by design.

Really, I can only read so much of such stuff before my gag reflex takes over...


The Obama comprehensive energy independence and climate change plan will invest in America's highly-skilled manufacturing workforce and manufacturing centers to ensure that American workers have the skills and tools they need to pioneer the first wave of green technologies that will be in high demand throughout the world.Kaa

C. Ross
02-15-2008, 04:23 PM
I bet Paul Wellstone would have said he was a conservative.

Not too hard being to the right of that milepost.

I think Sen. Obama is gaining steam because of who he is, and how he communicates, much more than his position on specific issues.

Quick: What are Sen. Obama's top five priorities for his administration? I can't snap them off, can you?

We used to talk about Reagan Democrats, soon we'll be talking about Obama Republicans.

Swiftboat memes:

Sen. Obama:
* Public slogan: Who can we trust to face down Islamic extremists? Barack Obama or John McCain?
* Repeated at Rotary lunches and coffee counters in the Red state near you: "The Democrat nominee, Barack Osama, oh, sorry, I mean Barack Bin Laden, ooops, darn, I sure have my tongue tied... Mr. Barack Obama..."

Sen. McCain:
* Which candidate wants us to spend the next 100 years in Iraq?
* Private whisper: He stood up to torture in Vietnam, but it seems to have made him a little...edgy.

PatCox
02-15-2008, 04:49 PM
BOOOOM.

Fox News: "Obviously even the prospect of a democrat president and the likely capitulation in Iraq emboldened the terrorists to once again attack our shores. Initial estimates indicate over 300 vehicles were on the Golden Gate bridge at the time . . .

Hwyl
02-15-2008, 05:18 PM
Thanks for teaching me a new word. i thought this was going to be a thread about Franco American grandmothers.