Proper dynel texture

[Figment]

I'm running into a bit of a problem with laying dynel on my decks. The texture of the cloth isn't really reading through after the epoxy cures. I'm getting a texture that's more like 60 grit paper than anything else. Looks for all the world like nonskid paint, not at all like other dyneled decks I've seen.

What am I doing wrong?

I'm on my second test-panel. At first I thought I just didn't squeegee-out enough resin on the first panel, so I put in a little extra effort on the second, but the result is the same if not worse. Am I thinking in the wrong direction? should I be spreading the resin with a roller to minimize disruption of the fibers?

Thanks all.

[RodB]

This will be interesting, this has been asked about before and mostly it was said to be quite easy to get good results...very simple.

I could hazard a guess... it just seems likely you are just applying too much epoxy film thickness and filling up the weave of the fabric. I have read about the dynel being saturated with solvent thinned epoxy instead of full strength resin.

The only example of dynel as a non-skid I have seen was done by a professional builder (on a 28 foot sailboat), who insists on using the thinnest epoxy (he used MAS's lowest viscosity clearcoat)and he achieved fantastic results with a great uniform texture. He used the very thin linear polyurathane paint on top of this. He didn't offer any comments on technique except for using the lower viscosity resin...applying two coats. I didn't trust him for authentic information, and I wouldn't be surprized if a specific technique was used like saturating the fabric once with a thinner type of resin, then applying linear polyurathane in a couple of coats..thus applying the least amount of materials (fixatives) to keep the maximum texture of the fabric but provide a tough finish to withstand abuse over time.

I have considered dynel non-skid for my fishing skiff but have decided the dynel will trap too much dirt compared to other methods of non-skid.

Hopefully others here will offer some advice based on solid direct experience.

RB

[ 06-01-2005, 06:33 PM: Message edited by: RodB ]

[Ellis Rowe]

I recently used Interlux epoxy on a dynel deck with good results. It wets the dynel out better than either West or MAS which are the other two that I've tried.

[Figment]

I'm using System Three "Silvertip", just in case it matters.

[WoodenBNut]

Figmet -- I assume that you are putting the Dynel over a wooden (plywood) deck?? I will be doing the same thing in a month or two. I have 4oz Dynel fabric. I have replace some of the decking that needed replacing with marine ply. The rest of the deck was stripped of the original canvas/paint and all glue was removed. Then sanded with 60 - 80 - 100 grit to get a new wood surface. I then will apply 1 or 2 coats of Smith's CPES. I was then going to dry fit the dynel to the deck and then roll on West System epoxy (that's what I have) until I got the desired look. I am trying to get a nice non-skid look with the dynel fabric showing thru - somewhat. We will see if I can do that??? I'll then paint the deck with either a 1 part or 2 part poly urethane. Oh, the boat is a 1964 Chris 35' Sea Skiff. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

[Figment]

I'll let you know when I get it figured out. :(

I think I'm onto something, though. Based on the test panel I did yesterday, I think my above hunch was right... I was overworking the cloth. gentle squeegee-hand must be developed.

Either that, or the epoxy was starting to cure too quickly and that's what produced the unkind texture. If so, I'll need to order slow-cure epoxy to get the results I want.

[Bob Cleek]

Been there and done this. You have to THIN the epoxy quite a bit and use multiple coats even. The customary thinner is alcohol for WEST System. The fabric will appear to have a "fuzz" on it when first done because the epoxy clings to the fibres. Do a few tests. Try starting with epoxy mixed the thickness of cream and work up or down from there.

[RodB]

Bump

[Figment]

I think we have it figured. Bob's tip was the key... thin it until you think it'll work, and then thin it some more. My last test was thinned 50% (so thin that at one point I lost track of which cup had the thinned resin and which had pure alcohol) and I'm going to lay some paint on it today so I can really see the results.

[WoodenBNut]

Ok - I just read the tech tips on the West System site. They said to thin epoxy with toluene, or acetone, or MEK. But, you are saying alcohol is Ok too. Is that denatured methyl or ethyl alcohol or does it make a difference? Also, I am assuming that you are 1st measuring out the resin and hardner (2 separate mixing containers). And then thining just the resin with the alcohol before you add the unthined hardener?

[Figment]

No, I treat the alcohol as I would a pigment or microballoons or any other "additive".... mix the resin and hardener together, then add the thinner as the last step.

I'm using System Three. Alcohol is among their reccommended solvents. I dunno if it makes a difference, but I'm using ordinary hardware-store denatured alcohol.

[Bob Cleek]

The choice of the solvents mentioned is not important for the use we're discussing. I happen to prefer alcohol because it is cheaper than acetone or MEK and a lot less toxic and "fumey" to work with. I may not have mentioned that it helps to lay the dynel down on a wet coat of unthinned, or less thinned, epoxy, and then use the thin stuff to wet down the top side. This ensures good adhesion to the ply deck without gooping up the top of the dynel where you want to keep your texture.

I'll also mention that neat effects can be achieved by taping off the dynel after coating and filling in the taped areas with epoxy thickened with sanding filler and then sanding that fair. Sometimes there's a place where a seam must be run, overlapping the dynel and creating a slight bump. By taping either side of an even strip on top of this, you can slap some thickened sanding compound epoxy between the tape and then take the tape up and sand the strip fair. You get a nice smooth line on top of the dynel texture which hides the seam. This technique can also be used where you have to butt the dynel up against something which does not have a quarter round covering trim piece. Tape around the obstruction and fair the edge where the dynel meets it with a filet of sanding epoxy.

[WoodenBNut]

Thanks!!! Great suggestions.