Making Mistakes

[neilm]

I just started working on my first kit boat and I've already made a couple minor mistakes. First was to forget one piece of wax paper on one scarf and glue the board to the plank. Thankfully the Spruce board broke before the plywood did. The second mistake was assuming my wall was straight and measuring from it. Now my scarfed plank is off by 1/8". So I need to step back and say to myself will I continue making mistakes at this rate? Are mistakes preventable? Any advice or words of wisdom? Perhaps I should build a moaning chair before I build a boat.

Neil

[Jim Ledger]

Making mistakes is inevitable and in direct proportion to the amount of things you actually try to do.

The alternative is to sit quietly in a comfortable chair and read about building a boat.

Your choice.

[boatbear]

Neil, that's all part of the fun. Figuring out how to work around those mistakes makes the experience even more worthwhile.
If you were now able to start again from scratch, you would not make those little blunders again, would you? Just keep saying, "Note to self, ...", and get that moaning chair installed. Confessing here to your imaginary friends may be cathartic for you - it certainly cheers me up. Grin.
Charlie

[Ken Hutchins]

I don't mistakes, I make BTU's. :D
Chuck it wood stove, sit in the moaning chair for a bit.:D

[P.L.Lenihan]

Neil,
Imagine,if you will, how terribly tedious and predictable "boatbuilding" would be if one never made an error? Where would the challenge lay or the sense of accomplishment if it were truly mistake proof? Everyone and his dog would build boats if that were the case and never would the occasion exist to shine with your incredible patience , perserverance or talents(choose the one best suited to you ). Also, one would forfeit, forever, the chance to bore loved ones and dear ones with all the crafty work-arounds you "discovered" to address a nasty boatbuilding problem.Losing ones right to brag until the cows come home must also count for something :)

So, relax,enjoy the process and rest assured that legions of good folks have gone before you and have made the same boo-boos.Do not allow yourself to sink into despair and/or sink too deeply into the faibled "moaning chair".

I propose a "HAPPY CORNER" instead of the moaning chair. A place to celebrate your daily achievements,entertain helpful friends and to simply fuel your dreams of when your boat will finally carry you over happy waters to all sorts of adventures and pleasent destinations.

Happy Building!!

Peter

http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b8df08b3127cceb432541d5c5a00000026102BauGzJmyZQ

[Bob Adams]

If you ain't making mistakes, you ain't doing nothing!

[ssor]

And I thought that you were needing a helper for making mistakes. I was gonna offer my sevices. My common one is putting the fraction on the wrong side of the inch. So that a wanted 36 1/4 comes out 35 3/4. Sometimes I cut it off three times and it is still too short.

[willmarsh3]

Mistakes!!! - welcome to the boat building club. :)

[Oscarvan]

I never make mistakes...... okay you may wipe the expectorant of your computer screens now.

Actually, my biggest mistake is that I haven't gotten started yet.....but I'm getting closer.

[switters]

I started keeping a boat journal to send to my brother who is leaving for the big sandbox soon. I posted this in the bilge last week but thought you might appreciate it here also. I will use the line about BTUs not mistakes soon. Thanks in advance.

Confession time: I am not a professional boat builder.

After this morning I have a pile of wood which would claim to be tortured by power tools if it could speak. I'm not so sure who was torturing who. Regardless, I now have a frame and transom in clamps and other bits cut out for a one sheet skiff. Its a warm up for the garage and I before starting the GIS. My most technical carpentry accomplishment in the last ten years would be repairs to the chicken coop. I have never had to rely on woodworking to pay bills. The coffee tables I built in college could have doubled as engine stands, with slightly lower esthetic standards.

Things we have learned today:

It takes twice as long to dress an edge that was cut without setting up a jig as it does to set up the jig.

Gorilla glue is slick for the amount of time it takes to set the clamps then it is sticky: this may seem obvious to you in your comfortable chair right now, but when you put the glue on and clamp, everything moves. The natural tendency of the neophyte is to stick a finger in there to square things away. As soon as it is touched it becomes sticky, transferring itself to clamps, clothes and working surfaces, kind of like a cold virus.

That whole measure twice cut once is for professionals only: I'm not going to explain this one, but I have plenty of kindling right now. And I'm short a 1" x 2" x 8'.

Either my chop saw cuts every angle correct except 20-degrees or Herb (boat designer) has been screwing with people. The other option is that I don’t know what I'm doing. (cant be, see above)

two by fours which were bought perfectly straight will warp horribly as soon as they come into contact with a flat concrete floor, possibly even the bed of the truck.

I've learned a lot more but I think you get the idea. Tomorrow morning I will probably be trying to figure out how to unglue my clamps from my boat bits in time to enter the chili contest at the local pub.

Feb 3, 2008

I was lucky and didn’t glue any boat bits to other items that should not be part of the boat. Cleaned shop. Wrestled with the two sides and the stem piece. They go together at a compound angle so there is no way to lay anything flat. The pieces won, next weekend we will have a rematch. I think I will have to use screws. Don’t make me fire up the chainsaw.

[Robmill0605]

Mistakes?

It's how you learn, and what you learn from them.

Here's an example. Last year, I set up my steambox to steam in my planking on my Hacker replica project. I carefully made full size templates of each plank as I was paranoid not to waste my book-matched honduras mahogany planks. I fussed and fitted, marked my planks etc.
Then i enlisted my wife to help me.
I carefully explained that we had about 60 seconds to fit each plank and temporaliy fasten it before it took a set or it would ruin a pair of planks. I felt like quite the expert craftsman, hey, I know what I'm doing....
Out of the steambox comes the precious mahogany planks( that had been soaking in sets in swimming pool for days,) I take the correct planks while I'm yelling instructions to my wife which went loosly like this.....

wife: "Uh, the plank is on backwards hon"
Master boatbuilder(me): " no it isn't, keep bending it" while i'm quickly stapling it into place.

wife: " I'm telling you it's backwards"
MB: " I built the GD thing, so I should know, keep bending it".:mad:

wife: "ok, but don't say I didn't warn you ".............:rolleyes:

Master builder gets to end of the plank to install the fasteners and......


MB: " the GD thing is on backwards!!!":eek::eek::eek:

The plank fit ok anyway, and she gets a kick out of pointing out that it's
"on backwards, like i told you"

So, my advice is, you are going to make mistakes.
Just don't do it with witnesses.:D

[sv Lorelei]

Remember, as I often (too often) say:

Measure Twice

Cut Wrong Once....er twice....er.....wha?

Dyslexics of the world Untie !!!!!

[outofthenorm]

The only way I know to avoid mistakes is to work slower ... no wait, that's wrong ... you should work faster ... or maybe it's work smarter. That's close to right. I'm sure of it. But I could be wrong.

[davebrown]

I built a skerry from a CLC kit. It's my 4th boat, and I don't like the idea of kits. They don't save any time and you can't say they're your boat then.

The directions say, DO NOT CUT GAINS ON THE WRONG SIDE OF THE PLANKS.

I carefully avoided cutting gains on the wrong side of the planks. I carefully stacked my planks so that I wouldn't be tempted to cut the gains on the wrong side. I used great caution and care. Then I sawed through one of the planks while it was lying on a table. I thought the end was scrap and didn't stop an unrelated cut. You could say I even did it deliberately, because I thought, Hey, there is some scrap wood that looks just like that Skerry plank.

This cost me a half day to drive to Berkeley, $80 or so for one full sheet of plywood, and another half day or so to cut it out, scarf, and re-glue.

That got me primed for my grand finale. When I built the rudder, I put the tiller on upside down AND backwards.

I had a 50/50 chance on each event, and got them both wrong. It works fine.

My motto: If there is a mistake, I figure out how to make it.

In other words, I can make mistakes that even a pro doesn't know exist. Sure, you think a simple cut on a board is mistake free, right? I'll saw through the electrical cord, or superglue a coffee cup to my forehead.

My wife has learned not to panic when she sees me running around the yard holding my hand/elbow/ankle.

[rbmichup]

I like the saying: The measure of a craftsmen is not in how many mistakes he makes, but in how well he covers them up.

[Jay Greer]

"I never make mistakes. I only learn lessons."
Mark Twain

"He who listens to too much advice, ends up making other people's mistakes."
Jay Greer

Enjoy the adventure! Fortunately today's boat builder has quarter inch as well as up to six inch putty at his disposal.
Jay

[Concordia...41]

That's ok, I know somebody that's restoring a classic 41' sailboat and who, while thinking herself at least within sight of the home stretch, installed the recessed panels in the heretofore perfectly matched German white pine bulkheads um ... er... maybe backward. :rolleyes:

What's more, she decided that it'd be better to epoxy the panels in place because the little brads that had been used in previous applications to hold the panels in place left dark marks on the edges of the panels - not like the marks showed or anything, but gosh you can't have little marks on the unfinished edges behind the trim... :rolleyes:

She's been praying for Divine intervention for about three days now, but is going to have to break down soon and do something about it. :( As it stands I - I mean she - can't even pick up the bulkhead and look at it. :(

[Seagull]

Look at making mistakes and its cost as tuition costs. l When considering todays college tuition costs, a piece(s)of wood that ends up in the wood stove is really not all that bad. One college credit today can run several thousand dollars. That one college credit can still buy a lot of lumber at least for the time being. Being perfect is a wish if not a myth. When ever I get to feeling perfect I test myself by trying to walk across Corey Creek without getting wet. Never happened, but God help us if I ever succeed.

Mostly working with wood is not so much doing things without making mistakes but perhaps more about being able to correct, find a way to fix them. I'm an old timer and now worry more about my fingers than a sheet of plywood a plank of wood.

[mcdenny]

BTW, another relevant notion to this thread is that symmetry is over rated. You will know what I mean after the boat is done.

[S/V Laura Ellen]

The only mistake that matters is personal injury, so make mistakes, just be careful while you're doing it. - Sir Limpsalot

[Lew Barrett]

I make all my most annoying mistakes when in the home stretch of any given leg of a project. Just as I start to feel like I have something licked, I will get bitten by thinking one step ahead of myself instead of being focused precisely on the job at hand. The job at hand...hell....it's all but done, so the next step becomes the mental focus point. It's a common failure mode for me.

[boylesboats]

Mistakes...
I made a few myself.. I ain't gonna list them all..
You just gotta think ahead, at least three possibles before you act on it...
I don't have a moaning chair... I do got a thinkin' chair, when I am in it, I think about my next plan of action..

If I do screw up... I take action to correct it.. Sooner, the better..

[tattooed john]

First Boat-

Father to son- "You're setting your standards so high. Dont worry about that and move on."

Son to father (the wisest I've ever been) "This whole huge (for me at the time) project is a long series of mistakes. If I don't set my standards high and fix my mistakes as I go imagine the end result."

Accept your mistakes- Then fix em if you can. Dont let them compound.

[Lars Silen]

There is a saying in Norway that could be translated into:
Don't stress me, I'm doing mistakes as fast as I can ...

[Clinton B Chase]

I'm printing this out and sharing this wonderful, funny thread with my students. I've been laughing, a lot. That is how I try to deal with my mistakes while I lean against this one part of my bench that affords a great view of the boat. I then try to think of all the things that have gone well on the project. I then thank the Gods for epoxy technology and go to fixing the problem. Cranking some great tunes, like Paul Simon's concert in the park Live or some screaming classical gets me pumped for the next steps.

KEEP THE STORIES COMIN'. I will post more on my mistakes: need some time to write it all out!

Cheers,
Clint

[adampet]

Just remember to try to not make the same mistakes twice.....that way you get to make all new mistakes!

Adam

[Rational Root]

From my blog::::

I'm a software engineer by profession, not a carpenter. But that basically involves three skills.

Break a problem into little problems.
Solve little problems.
Keep an eye on the big picture.Anyone see a resemblance to boat building here.

In addition, I've done a lot around the house, like plumbing, tiling floors (the tiling you see in the background of some of my photos), showers, baths, putting down wooden floors. (All with the assistance of my beautiful wife).

Boats, wooden floors and tiling seem to have one thing in common, it's hard to mess it up at one fell swoop. Break a tile, cut another. Cut a frame wrong, cut it again. If you are prepared to redo, then you can do.

If, however, you mess up and persist in going in the wrong direction in spite of knowing that something's not right, then I suggest that you buy the more expensive life jacket :(

Somewhere in the middle are mistakes that can be shimmed. There's probably a lifetime's experience in figuring out what can be shimmed and what needs to be recut.

Carpets (and Lino) on the other hand are different. Cut them too short and they're pretty much ruined. one single mistake and you're toast.

And this

http://bp3.blogger.com/_-jLgHzfXWAU/RqztIpVXf_I/AAAAAAAAAIE/_kPTKMK0Fs0/s160/IMG_0091.JPG

[Mrleft8]

As I've reported before, a very brief comment by one of my teachers whom some of you may have heard of...
When asked how he could build such beautiful pieces of furniture without ever making mistakes, he replied; " It's not that I don't make mistakes. It's just that when you've been making mistakes as long as I have, you get very good at hiding them.".
(James Krenov.)

[ssor]

My wife was fussing because I had mis-cut a 90 dollar sheet of plywood. I picked up a handful of pencils from her desk. They were still quite long but the erasers were gone. I asked her why this was so. She explaned that sometimes she needed to change some numbers. I told her that so far they haven't made erasers for saws but when they do I won't ruin any more material.

[tchiffriller]

I wish I had known about the measure twice cut once rule. It woud of saved me alot of work. haha. o well. I just back track and draw another one. If only they had an eraser for wood...

[emichaels]

Well, Neil, this sounds like your first boat so when you finish the second boat you can stand back and exclaim 'Man I wish I had built the second boat first'.

Eric

[neilm]

I feel better now, thanks everyone.

Neil

[gert]

I have gotten this far with only 3 (won't count all the little ones)some what serious mistakes (stern inner stem is installed upside down)
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2176/2144033823_e61118442b_m.jpg
My favouret mistakes are the ones where I had it right the first time and talk myself into believing it's wrong (thats how the stem ended up upside down) Early in this project I had that feeling of "Is this going to be a comedy of errors?" but I got past it (for now) As they say 'you can tell a tradesman's skills by how well he covers his mistakes'. Then there are the mistakes you don't know you've made till way later. I remember when I launched my other little lapstrake boat, I fully expected her to fall apart when she hit the water; and that was 5 serious sailing seasons ago.

I would also suggest that you don't look at the whole project too often; it can be overwelming.

Just enjoy the journey

[tchiffriller]

I like that idea of not looking at the whole project too much but just focusing on the step that you are on.

[prestonbriggs]

BTW, another relevant notion to this thread is that symmetry is over rated. You will know what I mean after the boat is done.

I'm sure I read this on this forum, but it bears repeating:

"It'll take a wide-eyed son of a bitch to see it."

(regarding some asymetry or another)

Preston

[ssor]

I live by the man on a galloping horse rule. If it looks good to him, it is fine.

[andrewe]

SSOR, sounds like when I was fixing up old aircraft, on the paint job
"It will look all right at 2000ft"
Andrew

[boylesboats]

SSOR, sounds like when I was I was fixing up old aircraft, on the paint job
"It will look all right at 2000ft"
Andrew

Oh, I can still see that you miss a spot in the paint job...

Really, I am serious...:D


Do you really wanna drive someone nuts?:D...
I know it's ornery as hell..
When you see someone doing a camouflage paint job... Just tell them it looks nice, but miss a spot... Watch them stand back with a dripping paint brush in hand, looking for a "bare" spot...:D
It is so funny to watch them to do this, and 15 minutes later, they'll have paint drips all over the area

[ssor]

Another one that makes trouble. After looking at the fine work by someone ask if they plan to leave it like that?

[Oscarvan]

When you say to yourself...."Wow, I'm gettting pretty good at this...."

PUT DOWN THE TOOLS AND SLOWLY WALK AWAY.......:D

[gert]

God aint that the truth!

I am actualy very superstitious about this at work. We have done million dollar millwork projects; there aint no bragging allowed untill the punch list is complete. The wood gods are always listening and just waiting to jump on you when you start to think you might actualy know what your doing after 35 years.

[Oscarvan]

Once, the evening before a 1000 mile week of sailing, and after a few days of hard prep, I sat at the helm all smiles and said to my friend...."You know that everything on this boat is working right now?" Seconds later the wind/sounder/boat speed display at the helm died and I did the entire (solo) trip looking around the bimini up a 60 foot mast at a wind vane....at night with a flashlight......

[jimmy lee]

I'm sitting here laughing and crying at the same time. Oh! please help! I've measured twice many a time and cut WRONG!!!! That DAM saw cut on the wrong side of the line!!!! I'm left handed so I went out and bought a left-hand Porter Cable saw, thinking that would help. Darn it! That saw did it too!! It cut on the WRONG side of the line. My wife tells me to chill, settle down, but I tell her that don't work! Mistakes....... They just show up without warning.

[Oscarvan]

My grandfather was a carpenter who became an architect, and then after retirement he did both, mostly for himself.

One time (early 70's) we (him late 60's, me 13 or 14) were building a structure in his back yard....(a 60x40 building to house a pool). A huge pile of lumber arrived, and for two days he measured and scribed, and I moved the pieces around. He used one of these:

http://www.2college.nl/tech/begrippen/duimstok.jpg

And NEVER looked at a drawing....

On the third day one of his former foremen showed up with a very sharp (hand) saw and started cutting, just looking at the scribing. Never asked my Grandpa what any of it meant, he just knew. Then we put it together, the three of us. And it all fit.

The point of this story is that Grandpa would put an arrow next to the line, telling him on which side to cut......

[ssor]

It is easy _____________________________________
/\ Just a little tic like that is standard for marking the waste side of the line.

[ssor]

When you lay out framing you put a big X on the side of the line on the plate where the stud goes and you mark top and bottom together.

[Raka025]

I was going to say think things through and don't rush but I have the tendency to build things two or three times in my mind first. Perhaps the wood is cheaper? Enjoy the process.

[SparkG]

Couple of thoughts:
- Measure once, buy twice. Measure twice - still a crap shoot.
- Nobody's going to see both sides of your boat at the same time.
- Everything I've ever built has in it what I call "The Mark of Spark" - that's the character showing through.
- I don't want stuff I've built to be perfect...I want people to come up to me and say "Wow, you built that yourself?"
- My problem is I'm a perfectionist that can't do anything perfect...
but I'm still workin' at it!

[Mad Scientist]

Two quick replies:

1. I like to be proven wrong - that's how I learn things!
2. Every day when I learn something is a GOOD day!

[Canoez]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UbuU1OtaX4g

Mr. Joel said it better than I could.

:cool:

[Mad Scientist]

Could be my second time trying this...
CA cement has been used (for years) to attach little parts to miniature railroad locomotives/trains...
One of the well-known problems is the ability of CA adhetives to cement your fingers together...I suspect that this class of adhesives is useless for boatbuilding...

[switters]

from the weekends journal.

Friday night I glued the other site to the stem of the One sheet skiff. Had to use screws to get everything in place. Sunday morning I went out to put in the single cross member and stern. That’s when I realized that someone in the boat shop had forgot to get the bevels in the side and bottom pieces last weekend before they glued said pieces together. . As this is a one man boatshop I don't think the dirty sob can get very far. I was so happy last weekend after measuring once and then cutting until something looked close enough until pieces all fit together just like the plans. I couldn’t wait to glue them together into a real boat part. So now the parts won’t fit in the table saw, and it’s time to get creative with the skill saw and a plane. The boatshop owner is too cheap to buy a beltsander this close after christmas. But everything has been clamped together and resembles a boat so I will keep going, as soon as the bevels are cut. And some more sanding is done. Lots of sanding.

[switters]

From yesterdays boat journal, hope you enjoy.

Boat building is a very Zen experience. With a little reflection and patience mistakes can be corrected, and harmony is restored. The bevels were cut without a lot of problem once I thought about how to use the tools at hand. Some scrap wood was used to get a flat surface for the skill saw.

I have been experimenting with different types of adhesives as I deform tree bits into the general (very general, think Salvador Dali) shape of a small rowing skiff. For the benefit of future boat builders I offer the following.

The directions on the gorilla glue bottle say to wet only one surface, what they mean is only the surface you want the glue to stick to. If, say you wanted the glue to join two wood surfaces together for some odd reason, you should really wet both surfaces.

Gorilla glue does not stick to ply wood itself, just the first paper thin veneer

The voids caused by my workmanship and filled with gorilla glue have no structural value whatsoever, rendering the entire joint null, and well…void.

These are some important construction “tips” that he novice boat builder should know. But not the most important. The most important thing a novice boat builder should know about gorilla glue is that it will not come out of your beard. This is Chuck Norris’s kryptonite, get this glue in his beard and you can stick him face first to anything, rendering him harmless.

In the cause of brevity, it is not important to go into detail how I know this. Just keep in mind that the only thing you do not need to wet prior to the application of gorilla glue is your beard.

I’m off to do some sanding, some planning and some personal grooming with small scissors, then maybe a bit of sanding. Tomorrow I will open the West system epoxy. If I don’t post in the next few days it is because I have become “one with the boat”.

[switters]

Feb 22, 2008

Well the chine logs were ready to epoxy on. Once I clamped one side I had a level on the boat and realized that it was warping out of shape. After consulting the salts on the forum I determined that both sides should be stuck on at the same time and more clamps were obtained. Then the first batch of epoxy was mixed and applied and the chine logs clamped. Actually not all of the chine logs were clamped, the very front of the bow didn't want to clamp down and I was afraid the epoxy was going to go off so I ended up putting several screw holes and cobbleing up some blocks to draw the very front on the stem in tight. I was actually pretty frantic trying to get the front to clamp, probably looked like a goat rodeo.
Feb 23, 2008
Turns out it was a dress rehersal. The epoxy never kicked, or cooked or did anything resembling an adhesive. I started taking the clamps off of the stern and boing, out they sprang. Fortunately I had a friend over to help with scribing the bottom. Therefore I have a witness to see the look of disbelief on my face. I dont know if it was because I didn't have enough hardner, due to the pumps not being primed all the way and getting a "short pour". Or it could have been the temperature in the garage. It was 50 out today and I had the electric heater in the garage going, my thermometer read 65 but that may have been inaccurate. So this week the slimy unhard epoxy has to get cleaned off. Not a very funny weekend in the boatshop. Tragedy+time=comedy. Give me a week and when I rewrite this it will be hilarious.

[AussieBarney]

Im not sure how it is in your part of the world but here in oz we have Murphy's law which reads "If it can go wrong, it will go wrong" The way I see it is that I have to recognize when Mr Murphy has decided to come along to visit. Mind you, sometimes, I think the bludger has moved in permanetly. Do it anyway, mistakes can be fixed, that is the fun of any woodworking:) I am about to start the great adventure myself and I reckon you fellows will be cracking up with laughter when I describe mine, anyway, I hope you do, it will take the sting out of the situation and Im sure there will be someone who can set me right

[gert]

Re Mr.Murphy:

Around here we not only think he is along for the ride but we are pretty sure he driving and may even own the bus ;)

[Banjo]

LOL, thank you for posting Switters.
Your journal entries kick my days off with a chuckle, (not at your exspense, but with empathy brother).
This observation is gold and should be framed for posterity! :D
"These are some important construction “tips” that he novice boat builder should know. But not the most important. The most important thing a novice boat builder should know about gorilla glue is that it will not come out of your beard. This is Chuck Norris’s kryptonite, get this glue in his beard and you can stick him face first to anything, rendering him harmless."

Keep at it mate, your doin fine!

[hokiefan]

Im not sure how it is in your part of the world but here in oz we have Murphy's law which reads "If it can go wrong, it will go wrong" The way I see it is that I have to recognize when Mr Murphy has decided to come along to visit. Mind you, sometimes, I think the bludger has moved in permanetly. Do it anyway, mistakes can be fixed, that is the fun of any woodworking:) I am about to start the great adventure myself and I reckon you fellows will be cracking up with laughter when I describe mine, anyway, I hope you do, it will take the sting out of the situation and Im sure there will be someone who can set me right

My Dad was a big advocate of Murphy's Law and collected all of the versions, corollaries, etc he could find. One of my prized possessions is his engineering humor file from his office at work. I have my own, started with copies made from his file when I first went to work. His favorite corollary was;


"If everything seems to be going well, you have obviously overlooked something."
And by the way, Murphy has a least one cousin that works 24/7 everywhere I've ever worked.

Cheers,

Bobby

[Banjo]

.....

[Banjo]

Here is another one that I like.

"Due to budget cut backs, the light at the end of the tunnel will be turned off indefinitely"

:D

[J. Dillon]

Mistakes are part of the process,:o as long as you learn from them. I personally am still trying to do that.;)

JD

[backsaw]

Hello: I am a long time amateur woodworker and first time boat builder. I am also new to this forum. I have been reading it for a while and have picked up some good ideas. When I saw the thread on Making Mistakes, I had to register. I can't tell you how many times through this build I have ended a work session beating myself up over a mistake. None of the mistakes were critical, but I would usually tell the wife, "if I wasn't so dumb, I could probably be a good boat builder." If experts like yourselves own up to making mistakes, it makes a hacker like me feel much better. Thanks again.

[djtil]

Don't forget the Peter Principle: Murphy was an optimist.

[switters]

I finally got the epoxy off. I literally shaved the boat parts that had the slimy epoxy on it. Then, I glued it up again. And found out what happens when there is still some epoxy left on. It don't stick. Visions of whirling chainsaws flashed through my mind but what the hell, it'll still make a nice book case. So we have added some hardware in unlikely places that will hopefully be easy to fair out. In order to punish the epoxy technician in my shop I determined that he should epoxy the whole boat, to get the mistakes out before the next boat begins. On another subject, anchoring the chine logs to the stem seems to be a pretty important step, especially if your epoxy removal system needs to be reevaluated. I will put that theory to test with the gunls this weekend.

Stiff upper lip and all that. Carry on.

[BFR]

Mistakes mad in the last week.... drilled holes fo cam cleats in wrong places.... nobody will notice 10mm I hope... got all the padeyes i've installed 90deg out of alignment (everybody picked up on that one) just about had 1800kg of keel slip off a transporter coz we didn't strap it down well enuf.

oh and to top it all off installed the port chain plate on the stbd side and the stbd one on the port side.... about 4 hours before the boat was tobe rigged and launched.

plenty more to come i'm sure of it.

just remember to look at the big picture..... most ppl won't notice the little mistakes or fix's.

[David W Pratt]

Just imagine what you would say to your child if he/she had made the mistake.
Cut it to fit, or pack it with s**t.

[switters]

so, a few things didn't turn out as planned, the project is taking twice as long as anticipated. (nothing like revisiting the literature and seeing a single mom and her son with the caption "we built ours in one weekend") So its time to get happy, and when you are feeling down and you need to get happy, go buy paint. Sure, you have 40 more hours of sanding and fairing on an 8 foot boat, but buying paint is the mental stimulus needed to get the job done. I thought a bottle of wine might work but then flashed back to the epoxy debacle.

Want to make the paint buying experience even more effective? Go to the local hardware store if you are still lucky enough to have one near, and find the returned paint section. This way you can save money and not know the color of the boat until you paint it. There was a reason someone returned a whole gallon of "desert sunrise". thats because it looks like a crime scene with chainsaws. It is probably not a cheerful red, but it could be.

I'm trimming mine in something called solar yellow, I hope it doesn't burn someones retinas.

[jollymon]

Practice doesn't make perfect, it just makes permanent.

[SchoonerRat]

I NEVER make mistrakes!!!

I cut it short on purpose so I could see how much longer it needed to be.

That porthole is for watching the fish swim by.

I made that picture out of focus so the rest of them would look so much better.

It's not a bug, it's a feature.

[Hwoodworks]

One of the difference between a good woodworker, and a master woodworker is he knows how to fix his mistakes and does.

[alkorn]

Besides knowing a lot about boats, Howard Chapelle was a really eloquent guy. One of my favorite bits from his Boatbuilding is:

"If an augur breaks off in the hole, do not become upset."

Whenever I read that I imagine the choice words Mr. Chapelle would have used when an augur broke off in one of his holes.

[jgerber]

One thing to remember is that your dealing with natural materials and perfect is just not a realistic goal. All of those little rough spots that have grown into mountains in your mind will disappear with a little time and you will wonder what you were ever stressing about. You just got to learn to take a few steps back, close one eye and appreciate all your effort and hard work.

Jack

[SchoonerRat]

One thing to remember is that your dealing with natural materials and perfect is just not a realistic goal. All of those little rough spots that have grown into mountains in your mind will disappear with a little time and you will wonder what you were ever stressing about. You just got to learn to take a few steps back, close one eye and appreciate all your effort and hard work.

Jack
All those little flaws and imperfections jump right out and hit me in the face every time I see almost anything I have created. But right from the moment of the blunder, I put it in context.

Remember--

Do a good job on the repair, and you will probably be the only person to ever notice it.

I look at those "divots" when they hit me in the face, and I do a kind of a replay of the event that caused it.
"Why did that chisel slip from my hand when I hit it with a hammer?"
"How did I feel when I saw the large chunk of wood separated from the timber on which it belonged?"
"Can I recall the pain I felt when that chisel embedded itself in my left foot?"

Each one is a lesson I need to be reminded of once in a while. A little nudge to make me more careful next time. Some I think of more fondly than others. Some have even become good friends.

But whatever you do-----like the man says above----stop----step back a couple of steps------

Look at what you have created. Be proud! It's a very good feeling.

[switters]

a little closure here, since I hijacked this thread with a pseudo build journal. The One Sheet skiff is done, and spent fathers day on the water, enjoyed by my two teenage sons and several friends, one of which used the boat to tow in a swamped 15' Coleman canoe.

The boat is full of imperfections, but it floats, doesn't look bad until you get within a foot and it was a great time to have friends there to watch it launch and enjoy taking it for a row.

so I think I might offer some advice to someone who is looking for plans and thinking about building a boat.

The worst mistake you can make is never start building.

I apologize for the lack of pictures, I've got to find time for the hosting thingy.

[LGJohnnyAce]

I used to have a boss named Sandy that I admired greatly, because he always made thigs come out "as designed" the very first time. He had worked for the Smithsonian as a furniture restorer, and reportedly had owed a business where he installed high end custom stuff in the houses of the very rich and famous.

One day he was sensing my frustration at the amount of expensive kidling I was creating and he let me in on a secret.

"The secret," Sandy said, "is knowing how to fix your *F#$-ups." :)

That always gives me a lot of peace as I toss another hunk of teak in the bucket.

[pila]

I haven't really built a boat since the 50s, but I'm building a 12 1/2 foot outboard runabout from some old Wm Jackson plans I used back in those days. It's called the Meteor. I started remembering some of the tricks I used in those days (but not enough of them) Why put a piece on backward when you can put it on up-side down:)
I'm back in the learning curve. I have it framed up with Honduras mahogany which I've had here for a long time.

[switters]

http://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk221/switters_bucket/DSC01339.jpg


experimental right now

well now that worked, kind of, I'll resize some stuff and post what the rest of it looks like.

[switters]

http://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk221/switters_bucket/DSC01307.jpg


finished hopefully this is smaller

[switters]

still making mistakes:D

http://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk221/switters_bucket/DSC01449.jpg

[switters]

http://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk221/switters_bucket/DSC01462.jpg



still making mistakes:D

so I changed the ones further up and made it a little more consistent.

beware of pirates

[pila]

I often wondered if the movie "Murphy's War" was titled because things really went wrong at the end:)

[WX]

Because the runners for my sliding main hatch are slightly out of parallel, I am now have a hinged main hatch cover. It actually works out better in my opinion because if I add a hinged triangular piece each side I will be able to prop the hatch open enough to get in or out but keep the weather out.
I tell Kerry I don't do perfect...she calls them Pickisms...my last name is Pick:D

[Dan from Jersey]

one of my favorite pieces of forum advice is "better done than perfect".

... and one of the arts of boatbuilding is making mistakes look like it was supposed to be that way in the first place.

[WX]

Dan I can not agree with you more :D

[Lew Barrett]

Perfect is the enemy of good.

[Captain Blight]

I learned something about squares last week: They're like chronometers in that you rely on them for accuracy. At some point, you need a cornerstone, a place on which to stand and say, "This is [i]proper.[i]"

So lets say you're leaning against the wall, just put a new table on your 1951 DeWalt Radial-Arm Saw and squared everything up. Let's say you've opened the first beer in a week. Let's say that you notice the two squares you have lying on the workbench, and start playing with them.

Let's say you notice that neither squares up with the other.


Let's just say.


So how do you know which one is out?

I solved this by running out to a few different antique stores and finding an old Stanley framing square that's just under an eighth inch thick. It would take an act of Congress to move it out of square (and it werren't cheap, neither), and I used it to check my other two squares. They both were out but I got one (out less than a degree, I'd say) bent back to pretty damn close and the other one to "good enough."

I'm just glad I caught it before I started cutting up wood. I'd have run myself ragged trying to figure out why miters weren't matching up.

[ChrisBen]

So how do you know which one is out? Or you could just measure it. 3"x4"x5" or any multiple.

[Banjo]

Most of you guys would already know this, but ya never know, we might have a few young uns drop by that don't.

"So how do you know which one is out?"

You didn't need to buy anything to check your squares.
All you need is a nice flat straight edge on something, like the factory edge of a sheet of ply and a tape measure.
At some point on the edge of the sheet, measure out 400 mm and mark each end, then measure in towards the middle of the sheet from the outside edge 300 mm, scribe a line there paralel to the sheets edge. now measure from the from your first mark on the sheets edge (400mm) angled to intersect with your scribed 300mm line and mark off 500mm where it crosses the line.
Mark a line from the outer sheet edge (the starting mark) to intersect with the last mark you made when measuring the (500mm hypotenuse) leg and mark that off. This line will be exactly dead square with the sheet edge.

Always remember the old 3,4,5 rule. Any multiples of distance can be used as long as they are still divisible by 3,4,5 on each leg of your triangle.

another method that can be useful if your a mathematician is the good old Pythagorean theorem.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/math/3/a/e/3ae71ab3eb71d3d182a3b9e437fba6ee.png
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pythagorean_theorem

[Captain Blight]

I measured out a 3/4/5 with dividers, and I could tell they each were out but I reckoned it was high time for me to get a decent framing square anyhow.

What, you want me to pass up a perfectly decent chance to rummage through dusty bins full of crap? Scored a Stanly #36 transitional plane in great shape while I was at it, too!

[onobleboat]

Actually saw this sticker on a piece of oak plywood some 30 years ago and still laugh at it "Flaws and imperfections are and intricate part of this products design" maybe the Wooden Boat guys could make a bunch and sell them in their store.

[Captain Blight]

Well, that's a much better marketing tool than "This is the minimum grade we figured we could charge you this much money for" or "Our parent company raped all the good trees years ago and this is the best we have left."

[S B]

To check a framing square for accuracy,strike a perp from a base line,flip the square over and measure from the opposite side, if the lines match the tool is accurate. The same works for levels. Plumb bobs don't need to be tested.:)

[Banjo]

On the grand scale of things (gravity, air pressure, spin of the earth, pull of the moon, Zen mysteries etc etc),
there is no such thing as "dead level or plumb".
So the term "near enough is good enough" is usually accurate enough :D

[AussieBarney]

My dad was and is a master woodcarver, he did not use measuring tools at all. Most of his work was by eye, he had a neverending list of measurements, such as, a bee's dick, a poofteenth, ad nauseum. But when he worked he would have given the incomparable Mr Ledger a run for his money;):D. (That was a compliment, Jim) He did not do one job in his entire life that he considered perfect. That word did not exist for him He just did his best. Barney

[rufustr]

Ahhhhh Barney,

Had to be an Aussie to mention the proper units of measurement, the Bee's Dick and the Poofteenth, but you forgot the most important unit, the Fly ****, which is a more accurate unit of measurement.

I've bought several sets of plans for boats over the years, and I am a building designer and a builder, and I think most mistakes can be avoided if one remembers the proper relationship between Fly ****s and Poofteenths.

Rufus.

[rufustr]

"And so it goes ,and so it goes, and you're the only one who knowns."
Billy Joel.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eELB6NxrZ7A&feature=user

[Banjo]

Oy! Don't forget the "Gnats Knacker" fellers, very important measurement that one. :D

[MikeVT]

What they all said. I am glad you've started, I can use the company. Finishing my first boat and all I keep thinking is," love the process", including the mistakes.

[Mrleft8]

Oy! Don't forget the "Gnats Knacker" fellers, very important measurement that one. :D
Most builders around here use a measurement called "A red hair". There's actually a longer version of that description.... But I haven't gotten Scotted yet, and I don't intend to start now! ;)

[S B]

Most builders around here use a measurement called "A red hair". There's actually a longer version of that description.... But I haven't gotten Scotted yet, and I don't intend to start now! ;)
That sort of measurement is only applicable to old people, the razor eliminated it from younger builders vocabulary.;)

[Captain Blight]

And thank Crom for that!!

[switters]

http://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk221/switters_bucket/DSC01488.jpg


what to do with 7.5 foot practice skiff to get it out of the garage for the next build? make a book case.

I glued the cleats to the side after leveling everything up, would like to have used the frame but that came out badly (practice boat) and the shelves are removable, so I can go rowing later.

In retrospect I would have made the cleats under the shelves smaller and further back from the edge of the shelf so they didn't show as much, but this is a practice book case also.;)