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Swimpy
01-16-2008, 04:26 PM
In an earlier thread I mentioned finding a source for plantation teak at attractive pricing.
As mentioned, I intend to use it replacing the deck of my 46' connie.
I have done a Google search and also searched this forum for information on "plantation teak".

The country of origin is Columbia.

Can anyone comment on the (general) quality of plantation grown teak versus old growth?

I don't know much except the plantation grown trees are harvested at a younger age.

Thanks,
Terry

mamllc
01-16-2008, 06:28 PM
Old growth is a rather vague term. Usually very close spacing of the annual rings is an indication of old growth, different people have different definitions though. Tropical trees have no annual rings, so determining old growth from plantation grown by looking at the lumber would be difficult. The plantation, by virtue of its more controlled circumstances may produce trees with more consistent qualities to the wood. I see no reason to be afraid of it, if you are unsure call the supplier and ask for a sample.

David M

DaveWhitla
01-16-2008, 08:38 PM
Teak has only been growing in Columbia for a relatively short period of time. The kind of teak traditionally referred to in boatbuilding - eg logs of > 60cm (~20") is at least 100 years old and found natively in the forests of Burma and surrounds.

I've read that plantation timber, apart from not being available in particularly large diameter logs, is generally less rot resistant and not as strong (teak is already not particularly strong for its weight). But I only know what I've read in books and what I can find on the web. The stuff is so hard to get in Australia that I've never seen it in a log.

I'm having trouble getting it from Indonesia or Vietnam and I live relatively close. In fact if anyone knows of reputable suppliers in SE Asia that will export a small order to Australia I'd love to hear from you.

Dave

paladin
01-16-2008, 09:41 PM
Dave...in Vietnam the local teak is known as Gao Mun and is not as good as the Burmese/Thai teak. I purchased several logs at a lottery quite some time ago and don't have much left, but it's what is known as watered teak. They submerge the logs in klongs for a few years and it drives most of the oil and natural grit out, then they dry and process the logs into very fine high grade furniture, then re-oil it or apply varnish. I used very little teak in my last boat, just some basic exterior stuff and the cabin sole, and trimmed the interior in rosewood, which was cheaper than lumberyard douglas fir is/was in the U.S.
Depending on how much you need...........

DaveWhitla
01-16-2008, 09:58 PM
Dave...in Vietnam the local teak is known as Gao Mun and is not as good as the Burmese/Thai teak. I purchased several logs at a lottery quite some time ago and don't have much left, but it's what is known as watered teak. They submerge the logs in klongs for a few years and it drives most of the oil and natural grit out, then they dry and process the logs into very fine high grade furniture, then re-oil it or apply varnish. I used very little teak in my last boat, just some basic exterior stuff and the cabin sole, and trimmed the interior in rosewood, which was cheaper than lumberyard douglas fir is/was in the U.S.
Depending on how much you need...........

Thanks Chuck, this info will definitely help me compare some options.
Water and peat are used elsewhere I think in very slow seasoning. I wonder how driving out the oils affects teaks resistence to marine organisms? Bit off topic but I read in Jerry Sousa's thread that he had some badly rotten teak which had been submerged in garbage aboard his rebuild.

paladin
01-16-2008, 10:23 PM
Yeah...but where Jerry Sousa's boat was there's literally tons of unknown microscopic critters that eat anything and everything.....I visited Cheoy Lee's yard there but the backlog was crazy so I had my 49 foot tri built at Anthony W.K. Wong's yard in Aberdeen. You could get gangrene of the foot just by sitting on the deck barefoot..

kulas44
01-16-2008, 10:39 PM
I purchased about a hundred 6" x 8/4, 8 foot long rough teak boards, plantation grown, a few years ago. Some were really good and some were fair. The were resawn into 1/4 inch strips and used for interior sole covering, trim and ceiling. They would have been perfectly fine for a glued exterior deck, maybe not so good for a traditional laid deck.

Swimpy
01-17-2008, 10:56 PM
I went ahead and ordered 500 BF today. (C.O.D.) that way I can inspect it before I pay for it.

DaveWhitla
01-17-2008, 10:58 PM
I went ahead and ordered 500 BF today. (C.O.D.) that way I can inspect it before I pay for it.

I think that's the best plan if you have the option. Let us know how it looks, and the vendor if you end up being satisfied with them.

DuncanvdH
01-18-2008, 07:12 AM
Ofcourse one kind of plantation teak is not the other.
But here is a website of a timber firm, that sells only 'natural' teak, and they have a picture of some typical plantation teak used for cheap
lawn furniture:
http://teak.af.nl/plantage-teak/

(text is in Dutch, but pictures speak for themselves).

BETTY-B
01-18-2008, 04:41 PM
Chuck,
Is it possible to buy logs that were not sunk in the canals? It seems their teak would be so similar to Thai teak if they didnt do that. The climate is nearly the same. The geology is the same. I have seriously considered this for a long time. Going there and getting it is what I'm talking about. Ever since 1988 while walking through slash and burn hill tribe stuff in Thailand. The teak trees laying on their sides were massive. Millions of BF everywhere. But the Thai gov had decided that none of it could leave. Boo hoo...

DAN

john welsford
01-18-2008, 05:14 PM
There is plantation teck coming out of the Phillipines and Fiji among other places, the quality is not brilliant and its rather lower density than the product from large original forest in S/E Asia, and its prone to insect damage ( pinhole ) . It can be attractively cheap but I'd be concerned about its strength and would not use it for structural members.

JohnW
QUOTE=Swimpy;1739596]In an earlier thread I mentioned finding a source for plantation teak at attractive pricing.
As mentioned, I intend to use it replacing the deck of my 46' connie.
I have done a Google search and also searched this forum for information on "plantation teak".

The country of origin is Columbia.

Can anyone comment on the (general) quality of plantation grown teak versus old growth?

I don't know much except the plantation grown trees are harvested at a younger age.

Thanks,
Terry[/QUOTE]

Swimpy
02-16-2008, 07:17 PM
Well we finally received the teak!

The source, (Daniel Leibster) of Daniel Leibster Fine Carpentry of Ontario, CN. was on the ball. After we had talked on the phone a couple of times and established a rapport, I decided to order 500 Bd. Ft. @ $6.50 per ft. We discussed my intended purpose for the lumber. to resaw into 13/4" x 7/16" (the stock is flatsawn) Thus he said he would pick all wide boards for me. They range from 9" to 13" wide x 8/4 x 9' to 101/2' long. He even planed one side of every board so I could see what I was getting on delivery.

We only had one item to get around. I didn't know him and he didn't know me. He wasn't going to send the stock without payment, and I wasn't going to send payment in advance. We settled on C.O.D.

The stock is not grade A no.1 clear, but has some split ends and small knots. laying it out in my mind's eye I did not see where I would lose an excessive amount. Besides, he sent an extra 100 Bd. Ft. to cover defects. Overall, I am very pleased with the stock, and extremely well pleased with Daniel's honesty.

Here is how it wound up:
cost fo stock: $3,250 @ $6.50 U.S. per bd. ft.
Truck shipment: $1,050.00 froom Toronto to MS.
C.O.D. charges: $520.00

I've got about $10.00 per bd. ft. total in the stock compared to U.S. retailers quoting me $32.50 per bd. ft. for Burmese teak.

P.S. The side he planed feels very oily, has beautiful color, and good grain. If anyone is interested Daniel still has about 12,000 bd. ft. from 4/4 thru 10/4. His phone is 416-232-9712

Terry

ronaldklondike
10-06-2010, 01:02 PM
Terry, you should check out Proteak's plantation teak (http://www.proteak.com/plantation-teak.php). They have some slow growth plantations in Mexico and will ship to the US. I bought some teak lumber for an outdoor gazebo and the quality of the wood was better than expected. If you are looking for info on the different types of teak, I think their site has some good info on the subject.

paladin
10-06-2010, 02:24 PM
Any plantation grown teak should not be considered for cutting under 25 years, preferably 50, and 100 would be better......I am very new, relatively speaking to the timber trade, but I listen to the guys that are watching their income and their childrens income in their old age.

ronaldklondike
10-06-2010, 10:00 PM
As far as the timber trade goes, just be sure the teak you are getting isn't Burmese. That stuff is like blood diamonds over there. Search for "conflict teak" or "burmese teak" and you'll find some pretty horrific stuff.

Lew Barrett
10-06-2010, 10:49 PM
Thanks for mentioning it. Burma....Myanmar, we can remember them, eh? Just because the governments of the world can't get it together to give these people a wide berth, it doesn't mean we shouldn't.

kc8pql
10-06-2010, 10:54 PM
As far as the timber trade goes, just be sure the teak you are getting isn't Burmese. That stuff is like blood diamonds over there. Search for "conflict teak" or "burmese teak" and you'll find some pretty horrific stuff.
In fact I believe there's been an embargo on importing teak into the US from Burma for quite a while now. I've heard reports of it being mislabled and shipped in from third countries anyway though.

Lew Barrett
10-07-2010, 11:01 AM
In fact I believe there's been an embargo on importing teak into the US from Burma for quite a while now. I've heard reports of it being mislabled and shipped in from third countries anyway though.

That is the norm. From what I understand, we get it sent third party from places like India. The general run of googled info on the web seems to confirm the ineffectualness of our embargo. Although, I do believe it is proper in spirit, as is frequently the case, it seems to fail in execution.

It's my belief that the last boards I bought (sourced through East Teak and Crosscut) are plantation stuff. I found it entirely adequate to my needs.