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Concordia...41
12-17-2007, 11:27 AM
how I felt when I saw this...

http://images.boats.com/photos/160/7/6/2/16076220074196461197_102_1concordia-yawl-whisper-002.jpg

This is #9, Whisper, and it is one of the boats that I've been trying to get a picture of to document the claim that all 103 continue to exist.

Maybe I shouldn't have clicked on the link... :(

Why is it these boat strick such an emotional chord???

Listing:

http://www.boats.com/listing/boat_details.jsp?searchtype=buy&entityid=103339401&searchid=1

Hwyl
12-17-2007, 11:34 AM
It lists the seller as being in Fort Lauderdale. It does not look like Lauderdale to me.

You've almost finished Sarah Margo. It's time for a new project.

Paul Stohlman
12-17-2007, 11:51 AM
Is the boat close enough for you to have a look?

(I'm Florida geography challenged)

Do you have any of the past history? How long has she been laid up?

BTW, don't worry she will be saved...

Canoez
12-17-2007, 11:53 AM
That's a sad sight. Sadder still if it rots into the ground before it sees a rescue.:(

Paul Pless
12-17-2007, 12:04 PM
BTW, don't worry she will be saved...looking pretty bad...
http://images.boats.com/photos/160/7/6/2/160762200741964739805_102_0concordia-yawl-whisper-015.jpg

TimH
12-17-2007, 12:09 PM
An affordable Concordia yawl!


Amazing someone let her get that far....

ssor
12-17-2007, 12:09 PM
It has been a long time since anyone cared about that boat. Seems to still be in shape though.

mike hanyi
12-17-2007, 12:37 PM
well at least he was smart enough to remove the garboards, would have been a total mess with water sitting down there for years.

Hope they are selling cheap as the ballast and the centerline are about the best parts left on her.

TimH
12-17-2007, 12:42 PM
A little bit of elbow grease and you would have this:

http://homepage.mac.com/wildswan/.Pictures/Wild%20Swan/DSCN0223.jpg

Concordia...41
12-17-2007, 01:38 PM
It'll take more than elbow grease, but it's certainly doable. My understanding (gleaned from one Internet posting) is that the price is very reasonable.

I've met the owner. He stopped by Sarah and introduced himself years back. The owner is in Florida, but the boat is in Massachusetts. I would very very much like to see someone take on this project.

TimH
12-17-2007, 01:51 PM
I wonder what all those chunks of stuff are on the deck. Almost looks like pieces of delaminated plywood.

Canoez
12-17-2007, 01:52 PM
If only I were a sailor.

...and one with a bottomless bank account, at that.

TimH
12-17-2007, 01:53 PM
Ive been scrutinizing that picture of Wild Swan trying to find flaws, but the only thing I can come up with is that the buff color on the cabin top is a little bit too yellow.
That boat is unbelievably perfect....

paladin
12-17-2007, 02:02 PM
are blueprints/plans available for a restoration job or do you need to carefully disassemble it and make new patterns.....

Concordia...41
12-17-2007, 02:21 PM
Chuck - Good question. Mystic Seaport has the standard blueprints/plans and some individual boat plans as some were modified a touch here and there.

Tim - I think the cabin top color is fine. The fender covers don't quite match the blue cove stripe though ;)

TimH
12-17-2007, 02:33 PM
Doesnt Concordia have patterns for the interior parts and such?

TimH
12-17-2007, 02:37 PM
The fender covers don't quite match the blue cove stripe though ;)

You are right! Dark Green would be better :D

Concordia...41
12-17-2007, 02:41 PM
Concordia has patterns for pretty much everything.

With the exception of the Herreshoff resources, I don't know of any other restoration projects where you can just pick up the phone (remember when we broke the rudder pintle :eek:) and call and get the information and/or (in Concordias' case) the part itself!

Yes, it's a full-scale restoration, but you know that going in and can plan accordingly. A lot of folks buy a boat thinking it just needs a frame or two or a leaky deck addressed and before they know it, the boat is half apart and they're writing checks with lots of zeros... ;)

Come on! If I can do it, anybody can.

In all seriousness, this is a very good project for someone.

Concordia...41
12-17-2007, 02:43 PM
You are right! Dark Green would be better :D


Dark green my right foot. :rolleyes:

They need to be navy blue. (As do his dock lines, but now I'm being really picky...)

Men! :p

Canoez
12-17-2007, 02:49 PM
A lot of folks buy a boat thinking it just needs a frame or two or a leaky deck addressed and before they know it, the boat is half apart and they're writing checks with lots of zeros... ;)


Isn't that always pretty much always the case, tho? - the checks with lots of zeros?

Oh yeah, and a couple of spare cases of elbow-grease and two or three calendars full of lost-time...:rolleyes:

Paul Pless
12-17-2007, 02:51 PM
I wonder what all those chunks of stuff are on the deck. Almost looks like pieces of delaminated plywood.Its the remains of a teak deck veneer that was epoxied over the original Concordia decks.

Hwyl
12-17-2007, 02:56 PM
Ive been scrutinizing that picture of Wild Swan trying to find flaws, but the only thing I can come up with is that the buff color on the cabin top is a little bit too yellow.
That boat is unbelievably perfect....


A properly furled staysail with a cover on it would be a baby step in the right direction.

Pierce Nichols
12-17-2007, 03:40 PM
That boat is far gone, and very sad to look at. However, a Concordia Yawl is one of the few kinds of boats worth resurrecting from such a state. I hope someone good gets a hold of her and brings her back to her former glory.

BTB -- anyone want to take a guess on what that kind of restoration would cost, from the visible signs? It's more money, time, and tears than I've got, that's certain.

John B
12-17-2007, 03:54 PM
1/2 a mil?
But its like old goldfields and some of the new oilfields, The time comes when its economic.
That boat needs to be stabilised and preserved till the benefactor comes along.

Paul Pless
12-17-2007, 04:09 PM
That boat needs to be stabilised and preserved till the benefactor comes along.That's a good point.

John, do you have any Concordia Yawls down there? have you been on one?

TimH
12-17-2007, 04:42 PM
Maybe I am being anal, but it seems to me in this age of digital cameras there is no excuse for a picture like this:

http://images.boats.com/photos/160/7/6/2/160762200741964739805_102_1concordia-yawl-whisper-016.jpg

John B
12-17-2007, 05:05 PM
That's a good point.

John, do you have any Concordia Yawls down there? have you been on one?
no, yes, no.

No I haven't Paul but like our Classics they're a finite resource . I know from Sarah what size the boat is and where it fits from a handling and volume point of view. Big enough but not too big, a good spot in the 'market'. I also now understand where they lie in the prestige *** intrinsic value so I can see where its quite conceivable that a weathly person could own a boat like that and just say " fix".

Now the funny thing is that there actually is a new build Concordia yawl here somewhere. As far as I know its not in the water but I think Margo knows about that one. Quite what the provenance is or will be from it being built out of yard I have no idea, but its happening.

ahahaha I've been edited for using pig latin.There's a first ,ROFL!

Peter Malcolm Jardine
12-17-2007, 06:15 PM
The owner of that boat should give it to someone who will restore the boat. It's a damn shame to see it uncovered and rotting. What an idjit.

TimH
12-17-2007, 06:55 PM
The owner of that boat should give it to someone who will restore the boat. It's a damn shame to see it uncovered and rotting. What an idjit.

as long as its the right person.
Too many idjits would think "cool! free boat! lets glass it up and go sailing"

Paul Stohlman
12-18-2007, 12:24 PM
I've been in contact with the owner (in FL), and the person who has her stored in his yard (East Haddam, CT).

The owner e-mailed some photos, and once I have his permission to post them, I will.

The fellow in CT gave me an overview of her condition. As expected it is a major restoration. Frames, floors, some planking, deck, re-glue or replace the main mast, and of course...refinish every square inch.

It is a doable project. The problem is that someone with enough money to do it (easily $250,000) has a pick of many boats that are in commission now.

Ideas?

TimH
12-18-2007, 12:44 PM
I wonder if the Concordia Company would be wiling to take the boat until the right person comes along? They might be able to make some money off of it.

They have a web site for the boat.

http://www.concordiaboats.com/yawl.php?id=9

Concordia...41
12-18-2007, 12:53 PM
$250k is the number I would place on an average full-scale rebuild. You can spend more, I doubt you'll spend less.

Not just Concordias, I'd say that's a round number that can be applied to anything in that general size range.

You certainly need to go into the project aware that the total expended will be large, but it's not like you just write a check for that amount as you would if you were purchasing a new or completely restored vessel outright.

If you do the work yourself, as I and several others on the Forum have, that cost is spread anywhere between 5-15 years. Believe me, it is a lot easier to swallow in small bites. :eek: If you have the work professionally done, the cost would be spread over 18 months or so. If you have - or your brother-in-law has - a boatyard, and you use the restoration for fill-in work (this has been done in several cases), it'd be more about time and materials.

It's no secret and a table of costs is included in my CYS paper, but I have over 200k in Sarah, but: a) way too much of that went to yard storage and the warehouse rental; and b) at the conclusion of an 8-year project, I have a beautiful classic vessel that I: 1) know to be rebuilt to my standards; and 2) would have never had any other way

The goal of this thread is to draw attention to the vessel, because I believe it is a boat well-worth saving and an amazing project for the right person.

- M

Paul Stohlman
12-18-2007, 01:12 PM
Any Forumites near East Haddam, CT willing to have a look?

PM me.

TimH
12-18-2007, 01:33 PM
Its a long haul from there to here Paul :-)

Paul Stohlman
12-18-2007, 01:47 PM
I could never do it with my present circumstances...I just want to be "involved"...go figure...:-)

John B
12-18-2007, 03:55 PM
If you do , don't forget the golden rules.

Document.. a photo or paper record of everything as it is.
Stabilise , to attempt to stop further deterioration.
Preserve ,by location under cover ,or covering .

Dan McCosh
12-18-2007, 03:57 PM
$250k is the number I would place on an average full-scale rebuild. You can spend more, I doubt you'll spend less.

Not just Concordias, I'd say that's a round number that can be applied to anything in that general size range.

You certainly need to go into the project aware that the total expended will be large, but it's not like you just write a check for that amount as you would if you were purchasing a new or completely restored vessel outright.

If you do the work yourself, as I and several others on the Forum have, that cost is spread anywhere between 5-15 years. Believe me, it is a lot easier to swallow in small bites. :eek: If you have the work professionally done, the cost would be spread over 18 months or so. If you have - or your brother-in-law has - a boatyard, and you use the restoration for fill-in work (this has been done in several cases), it'd be more about time and materials.

It's no secret and a table of costs is included in my CYS paper, but I have over 200k in Sarah, but: a) way too much of that went to yard storage and the warehouse rental; and b) at the conclusion of an 8-year project, I have a beautiful classic vessel that I: 1) know to be rebuilt to my standards; and 2) would have never had any other way

The goal of this thread is to draw attention to the vessel, because I believe it is a boat well-worth saving and an amazing project for the right person.

- M

That's quite a realistic appraisal. On the downside, I know of at least one such project in the hands of so-called professionals that has consumed the money and has gone on for seven years with no end in sight.

TimH
12-18-2007, 04:04 PM
I am suprised this boat isnt in a calendar somewhere...

http://homepage.mac.com/wildswan/.Pictures/Wild%20Swan/DSCN0227.JPG

TimH
12-18-2007, 04:05 PM
http://homepage.mac.com/wildswan/.Pictures/Wild%20Swan/DSCN0001.JPG

JimConlin
12-18-2007, 04:09 PM
One of the benefits of the Concordia yawl is that, because there are a relatively large number of 'em, there are some yards that worked on many Concordias, know them inside out and can be (relatively) more reliable and efficient at restoring them. Were I to undertake such a project, I'd use one of those yards.

Hwyl
12-18-2007, 04:19 PM
One of the benefits of the Concordia yawl is that, because there are a relatively large number of 'em, there are some yards that worked on many Concordias, know them inside out and can be (relatively) more reliable and efficient at restoring them. Were I to undertake such a project, I'd use one of those yards.
If I were to restore one I'd use Jim Conlin, and if Jon Wilson (Okay not a 39) can have a carbon stick goshdurn, so can I.

JimConlin
12-18-2007, 04:49 PM
If I were to restore one I'd use Jim Conlin, and if Jon Wilson (Okay not a 39) can have a carbon stick goshdurn, so can I.
Waaaaay beyond my capacity in several ways.

sv Lorelei
12-19-2007, 01:28 PM
If there's any legitimate real interest beyond spectatorship, I'm probably within about a twenty minute drive depending on where in town the boat is located and would be willing to go over and have a look-see, snap some digital shots and render a non binding opinion of her condition.

I've just started preliminary component construction for Tally Ho Major, so I'm not interested in taking a project like this on right now...another time and another place....maybe. But I'd hate to see this boat turn into garden mulch.

Let me know.

Concordia 33
12-19-2007, 04:54 PM
The current owner had her for 12 years. When he needed to move to Florida, he left her on the hard under a tarp. The tarp blew off in a storm, and he didn't find out for quite some time and much of the damage you see ensued. He loves the boat very much and wants her to go to someone that will bring her back. Though it is in sad shape, so is hull number 2 Malay which is at IRYS. She is even more gone. At least whisper has 99% of her original parts. IRYS estimates that Malay is a $250,000 restoration and she is worse than Whisper so maybe in the right hands - (Concordia for example) she might be brought back for less. IRYS does a great job, but sometimes their costs get a little out of hand. They had 2 students who as an "internship" were offering to restore a Bateka for $16,000. I'm sure it's high quality work, but that's a little pricey. Jim Conlon is very knowlegeable about these matters, but I think he is being a little modest when he says this is beyond him.

Hey Margo... I haven't see any photos of your boat with her mast stepped yet?

paladin
12-19-2007, 06:38 PM
A couple of questions.....can she be moved without much damage.....and how accessible is she.....

and.....there are two sets of plans of Whisper....the original standard plans for the type....and a separate set for her particular rig and interior as it appears to be non-standard...

Concordia yawl
39 10 x 28 6 x 10 1 x 5 8
Design #14



Tube 1
keel plan, 3/4 = 1
measurement plan, 3/4 = 1
special sloop rig for ACTAEA, 1/2 = 1, 3/1952
sail plan--sloop rig , 1/2 = 1, 1/1952
cockpit details, 1 1/2 = 1, 11/1951
displacement curves, 7/19/1952
mainmast construction, 1947 -- blueprint; will not copy well
deck framing plan, 3/4 = 1, 11/1946
cabin sections, 3/4 = 1, 11/1946
outboard profile and deck plan, 3/4 = 1, 12/1946
inboard elevation and arrangement plan, 3/4 = 1, 12/1946
sail plan, 1/2 = 1, 12/1946

Tube 11
cabin sections, 3/4 = 1, 4/20/1939
outboard profile and deck plan, 3/4 = 1, 4/14/1939
sail plan -- proposed yawl rig for auxiliary 28 cutter, 3/8 = 1, 2/3/1939
sail plan (superseded), 1/2 = 1, 3/14/1939
sail plan, design #14-B, 1/2 = 1, 3/21/1939 -- has many pencil notations which probably will not copy
lines, 3/4 = 1, 12/28/1938
offsets, 11/22/1938

elf
12-19-2007, 07:25 PM
I'm pretty sure Joyant looked like that by the time she was hauled out to SF for restoration.

py
12-19-2007, 07:39 PM
You know guys I reckon you could sheath her in fibreglass, paint her up a bit on the inside and she'd be a keeper.

Sorry, just a silly joke.

Have a great Christmas.

Phil

sv Lorelei
12-19-2007, 07:47 PM
Well Chuck,

Just say the word and I'll toodle over there and find out for you. Interesting about the plans. The first set seem to indicate a sloop rigged variant and the second set smacks of developmental and background info for preceeding design tracks leading up to Design #14. I find the sloop variant idea intrigueing to say the least.

She's a beautiful boat, though too much of a long drink of water for my nerves here gunkholing amongst the taters. She looks to me like she's probably a coin toss. The way she's laid up there indicates she wasn't just parked out in back of the barn, however you really can't tell until you get up close and personal with the scratch awl and the plastic hammer.

Bill Griffin
12-22-2007, 05:59 PM
Bump

Joe (SoCal)
12-22-2007, 07:06 PM
Dark green my right foot. :rolleyes:

They need to be navy blue. (As do his dock lines, but now I'm being really picky...)

Men! :p

I say Black with gold embroidery with the name and year.

http://www.sealine.com/siteadmin/WEB-INF/uploads/shopproducts/Fender%20Socks.jpg

With black dock lines.

http://www.synergymarine.ca/shock_line2.jpg

Or tan ;)

Thad
12-22-2007, 07:10 PM
JOYANT was MUCH worse, ends touching the ground worse.

Nanoose
12-22-2007, 07:18 PM
Joe - you're talking about a bigger boat....

Maybe this is a good fit for you? Seriously! It's a project you could work on over the next 5-6 years - fall and winter evenings when you can't be out on Tidbit. About the time the boat's done, you're taking Tess for her grad sail.

Someone near you's gotta have a barn you can rent reasonable....and she's located close to you now.

Maybe this is the one! :D

Joe (SoCal)
12-22-2007, 07:20 PM
In a word ........ Nope

JimD
12-22-2007, 10:28 PM
S'matter, Joe? Don't ya want to spend every second of your free time and every nickel you make over the next ten years fixing up an old boat? Think of the respect you'd get from the forum peanut gallery when you relaunched her - Well done! Good job! Looks great! :D

katiedobe
12-23-2007, 09:18 AM
Please Joe. I would love to watch you restore her to her former glory.
Besides I am sure you can get a good price for her after she is completed. It is a Concordia Yawl after all.

Benchdog
12-23-2007, 09:39 AM
I live down the road from the Concordia yard. They are rebuilding a yawl in there at the moment that was an absolute mess. Jerry Smith (former yard manager) told me they (the yard) purchased the boat to sell on spec after completing the rebuild. I guess they've done this several times over the years and it's worked out well financially (with the high price of the yawls).
Maybe...

rbgarr
12-23-2007, 10:30 AM
Makes you wonder then why Concordia didn't pick up this boat. She's been close enough and they surely knew about her.

JimD
12-23-2007, 10:47 AM
Makes you wonder then why Concordia didn't pick up this boat. She's been close enough and they surely knew about her.

They set her aside for Joe.

wbrent
12-24-2007, 02:59 PM
This is the type of project I've been thinking I would like to tackle. But it would probably take me up to ten years. Some how I don't feel worthy. I'm certainly no professional builder (just finished a Haven12 1/2)and I certainly don't have deep pockets. Thats why ten years seems reasonable. I live near Harry Bryan. I wonder if he would offer his services from time to time. So what makes a person worthy to restore a boat like this? Incidently how tall of a door do you need to get this boat inside?

JimD
12-24-2007, 04:11 PM
So what makes a person worthy to restore a boat like this?

Your willingness to do it. Nothing else.

Paul Pless
12-24-2007, 05:27 PM
This is the type of project I've been thinking I would like to tackle. But it would probably take me up to ten years. Some how I don't feel worthy. I'm certainly no professional builder (just finished a Haven12 1/2)and I certainly don't have deep pockets. Thats why ten years seems reasonable. I live near Harry Bryan. I wonder if he would offer his services from time to time. So what makes a person worthy to restore a boat like this? Incidently how tall of a door do you need to get this boat inside?

Isn't Margo presenting a paper on her restoration of Sarah at the Classic Yacht Symposium? Probably be worth showing up for that. Sounds like your thoughts mirror how her project proceeded.:)

wbrent
12-24-2007, 08:15 PM
Where and when?

Paul Pless
12-24-2007, 08:22 PM
click the following: Classic Yacht Symposium (http://www.herreshoff.org/frames/symposium_frame.htm)

S/V Laura Ellen
12-24-2007, 08:30 PM
So what makes a person worthy to restore a boat like this?


Your willingness to do it. Nothing else.

and deep pockets.

Concordia...41
12-25-2007, 08:12 AM
Thanks for the plug Paul. My paper is going to be presented on Saturday. I expect the full schedule, which will include Saturday's agenda, will be posted on the Herreshoff site shortly.

As to being worthy, Dave and I weren't worthy when we bought Sarah. We were just two folks with a plan to have a boat to sail. As the enormity of the project unfolded, we somehow managed to make good on our responsibilities to this vessel.

For anyone thinking about this, this is no magic formula - money helps, but it doesn't guarantee sucess. Same thing with heart and skill. I'll venture it is a combination of the three.

There are lots of things to consider - even if you have the skill and ability to do most of the work yourself (and a place to store the boat so that yard bills don't eat you alive), at the end of the project you're still going to need a fair amount of $$$s for engine, electronics, rigging and sails. And then you have a 40' boat that needs a mooring / dockage, regular upkeep, bottom paint, etc.

The last thing I want to do is disuade anyone, but the paper I'm presenting closes with a section on making good decisions so that your project is a challenge and an ongoing dream and not a bloody nightmare.

P.S. I think the door height was 14', but I need to double check.

Concordia 33
12-26-2007, 12:29 PM
Makes you wonder then why Concordia didn't pick up this boat. She's been close enough and they surely knew about her.

The boat they are working on now is Weatherly (formerly Sunda) which is going through an extensive restoration www.concordia-yawl-weatherly.com (http://www.concordia-yawl-weatherly.com) . They have Diablo waiting in the wings, and IRYS has already been trying to get Concordia to rebuild Malay. In addition to this, Concordia is doing a complete restoration of a Luders 6 meter http://web.mac.com/annice/iWeb/Site%203/Blog/3EBBD9AB-C978-4964-8A1B-4380A6A40D50.html for the 2009 6 Meter Worlds in Newport and their usual maintainance and repair projects to the existing fleet of Concordia's et. al. I think they have their hands full already. That said, Brodie MacGrgor hates to see these boats fall on hard times, works hard to obtain/restore/sell when possible or on occasion assists someone in obtaining and restoring one through other means. Unfortunately there are probaly 10 or so Concordia's on the endangered list.

wbrent
12-26-2007, 12:52 PM
Does anyone know how much they want for it. I shot off an email last week but no reply.

Henning 4148
12-26-2007, 01:45 PM
Abeking and Rasmussen built ...

Concordia 33
12-26-2007, 01:45 PM
He wants $10,00 and he says that she has 99% of her original parts. I think he is more interested in getting her to a good home than getting top dollar. He had her for 12 years, and (condition aside) has a strong affection for her.

kengrome
12-28-2007, 05:06 AM
$250k is the number I would place on an average full-scale rebuild. You can spend more, I doubt you'll spend less. I wish someone would ship her to me because I could do it for less with my Filipino builders and better materials prices and all. Even the shipping costs back and forth would not make a dent in the overall price. Oh well, such is life ...

Concordia 33
12-28-2007, 04:40 PM
She's yours for $10,000. Fix her up and sell her back here. Dame of Sark is currently on the market for $285,000 so it sounds like you could get a good return on your dollar.

Concordia...41
01-02-2008, 09:02 AM
Good luck to her new stewards. Thank you for accepting this "special needs" boat and good luck with your project.

When you need there will be plenty of encouragement and advice here.

- Margo

Concordia 33
01-02-2008, 11:36 AM
Concordia's always reward their owners for a good restoration.:)

wbrent
01-02-2008, 12:36 PM
Who got her?

paladin
01-02-2008, 01:07 PM
dunno...the dude was asking 20K, reportedly took "a little less"...10K was rejected......

sv Lorelei
01-02-2008, 02:16 PM
Yeah, Margo.....do you know something we don't? Hmmmmm......




Good luck to her new stewards. Thank you for accepting this "special needs" boat and good luck with your project.

When you need there will be plenty of encouragement and advice here.

- Margo

wbrent
01-02-2008, 02:24 PM
I spoke to him a week ago and he was asking 10 then and probably would have gone lower.

Raka025
01-03-2008, 11:02 AM
Ok, the rumors are correct. #9 Concordia has found a benefactor. We've taken in or have a handful of "special need" horses and now I have my own "special needs" project.

Any advice at this stage and everyother stage now and in the future will be appreciated and some no doubt will be taken with a grain of salt.

I will be leaning towards spring for the long haul, 1600 miles or so, to the Ozarks of Arkansas. Visually the boat appears in good shape - no visible hogging that is. Any good suggestions to assuring it arrives here in the condition that it presently is? Competent haulers for this condition and age boat?

I will be preparing a pad prior to it arriving and would like to predig a place to drop the rudder. Best guess for dimensions?

Paladin: You mentioned some tubes of plans and drawings above, where could those be acquired?

Thanks everyone for all your past contributions.

davidagage
01-03-2008, 11:09 AM
Congratulations! It is great to hear that #9 is now in the WBF Family!
PM me your email and I will gladly send you the spreadsheet of shippers we talked to when getting quotes of shipping Black Spirit from Maine to Tennessee..

You are now under obligation to post lots and lots of pictures!:D

Way to go!

DG/CG

paladin
01-03-2008, 11:13 AM
Mystic Seaport has the drawings.....

Thank you for your inquiry. Our collection houses two sets of plans for WHISPER #9. The first set is for the standard Concordia Yawl, and I've attached the inventory for that set. In addition, our collection also houses plans that were created just for WHISPER: a sail and an arrangement plan.

We also house the Concordia manuscript collection, which has correspondence between the owners, builders, and Concordia. Within the collection, WHISPER has a folder of such correspondence.

If you are interested in ordering any of the plans, please fill out our online order form https://www.mysticseaport.org/library/services/spcopyorder.cfm or call us at 1-860-572-5367. For future reference, copies of our plans are available for $25.00/sheet and Members of the Mystic Seaport receive a 10% discount on all plans. For more information, such as shipping and handling, please refer to the online order form.

I hope this information is of some assistance to you. If you have any additional questions, please feel free to contact us at anytime.

Regards,

Quinn Sayles

Collections Access and Research
Mystic Seaport
The Museum of America and the Sea
PO Box 6000
75 Greenmanville Avenue
Mystic, CT 06355
Phone: 860.572.5367
Fax: 860.572.5394
collections@mysticseaport.org

rbgarr
01-03-2008, 11:20 AM
You could also 'predig' for dropping the keel in order to check/replace the ballast keel bolts and repair/replace the keel/deadwood.
Dimensions big enough to be able to stand/work next to/steady the dropped keel and have big jacks to lower and raise it?

The 'pit' may also need a sump pump.

Good luck!

Concordia 33
01-03-2008, 11:49 AM
Congratulations Raka025. I don't have the time or the know-how to restore one of these beautiful boats, so I'm having Concordia do it http://concordia-yawl-weatherly.com/default.aspx but I have grown up around these boats - I sailed out of Padanaram and, when in college, spent my summer as a Launch Driver at the local yacht club there. Since there were always 15 or more Concordia's through those years, I saw them constantly and sailed on them occasionally. I always appeciated them for their beauty and sea kindliness. I feel very fortunate to have one of my own. From my reading of the various WB Fourm threads it is obvious that you will be spending several years on this restoration, but you won't be dissappointed. Thanks for taking in one of the orphaned Concordia's. With it's 70 reunion this August it's nice to know that all 103 still exist and that the few special needs Concordia's are getting cared for. Maybe you should plan to join the reunion in Padanaram this August?:D

Ed Harrow
01-03-2008, 01:08 PM
Oh, man...

I think I (well, with Finbar's help) dug about four feet down. Thankfully rocks were not an issue.

You might ask Simms Bros who they'd recommend for the haul: 781 834 6070. Paul Haley of Giffy Full might also have a suggestion: 508 255 6685.

j2us
01-03-2008, 01:10 PM
We bought a "basketcase" Concordia 39 in FL in the 70's and brought her back magnificently - after 5 years, lots of money and 4 local locust trees! I may even have a little hardware left.

It was worth it!

Right now I've got an Alerion, coincidentally named "Whisper", that needs some work. And I need some advice on modern boat building matieries that I'll be starting a post on.

Jim

raycon
01-03-2008, 01:17 PM
See if Jim over at Anchor Marine Transport Old Saybrook,CT wants to travel that far. (860) 388-3389
He has the experience and equipment (39'? I'm at 34' 8'6 beam) . Brownell might be an option as well http://www.brownellsystems.com/

Bill Griffin
01-03-2008, 02:58 PM
Another possible is Dayton Marine transport here in Maine, I don't have ph# with me at the moment.

MarkC
01-03-2008, 04:21 PM
Abeking and Rasmussen built ...

YES!

and it may be of interest to some of you that Abeking and Rasmussen's photo documentation of many of their builds (the stages of the build - ribs, planks, deckhouse, the launch etc) are now being scanned into the 'Yacht-Sport-ARchive' of the German classic yacht association. Build no. 5000 looks a lot like these concordias.

the German classic yacht association web site - http://www.fky.org/ has the yacht-sport-archive http://www.yachtsportarchiv.de/

They also have a PDF of all the A&R build numbers with names and details.

StevenBauer
01-03-2008, 04:28 PM
Great news Raka!


Steven

Concordia...41
01-03-2008, 07:37 PM
MarkC -

5000 isn't a Concordia (4999 yes, 5001 yes).

And 5005 is my beautiful SARAH :)

http://www.fky.org/yachtsportarchiv/dokumente/AundR-baunummer5000_b/abeking-5005-002.jpg

OMG OMFG!

http://www.fky.org/yachtsportarchiv/dokumente/AundR-baunummer5000_b/abeking-5005-007.jpg


Speechless (spelled right this time :o) does not even begin to describe...

Raka - your builder # = 4754 and Concordia33 you are 5043 but I'm not finding those pictures (my German is abysmal...)

John Turpin
01-03-2008, 08:16 PM
I will be leaning towards spring for the long haul, 1600 miles or so, to the Ozarks of Arkansas.

Raka, I'm not too far from you. If you need some extra hands some weekend, let me know. I'm punctual, conscientious and generally stay out of the way of skilled laborers.

Please don't make me beg.

Raka025
01-03-2008, 11:22 PM
Hi John,

I hear banging out some rusted in keelboats is a real fun job. If you pass that initiation you can help with the skilled labor stuff.

Thank you for your offer and I'm sure there will be stuff to do over the coming years. Do you have a big osage orange tree in your back yard that you could bring?

Rob

John Turpin
01-04-2008, 08:07 AM
No. But, I do have a huge oak that the ice storm felled and almost put into my pool. It's yours if you want it, but you've got to come get it.

Raka025
01-04-2008, 01:28 PM
Thanks John for the offer on the oak. I have some on the property.

Also, thanks for the boat haulers numbers.

Evidently, on the Concordia's (from Margo), there are bolts through the rudder post and rudder so no prep is necessary with the predig thought to drop the rudder. Though Sarah is a few years younger so it is possible it could have been changed?

Rob

Concordia...41
01-04-2008, 02:01 PM
I forgot to mention you need to remove the rudder shoe (which you'll have off anyway if you're replacing the deadwood).

I'll try to find some pictures

Concordia...41
01-04-2008, 02:10 PM
http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b8df25b3127cceb3bfd0d0a3ab00000026108BYtG7lsxbq

Dave Dremeled the epoxy from around the bolt heads and drove them out through the curved end of the rudder post.

Actually, you don't need to remove the rudder shoe. Just the pintel or gudgeon and the rudder literally sets in and out of the rudder shoe.

http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b8df25b3127cceb3bf2c72a37700000026108BYtG7lsxbq

paladin
01-04-2008, 04:11 PM
There's a giant of an Osage Orange tree on granddad's property at Webbers Falls, but I'm gonna post guards with auto weapons on it 27/7........:D

JimConlin
01-04-2008, 05:16 PM
For boat hauling, i've had good luck with Barden's BoatYard in Marion, MA. 508 748 0250.
He trucks boats nationwide.

Raka025
01-04-2008, 11:41 PM
There's a giant of an Osage Orange tree on granddad's property at Webbers Falls, but I'm gonna post guards with auto weapons on it 27/7........:D

I have my eye on a few north of here so mums the word?? Webber Falls is safe as I don't know where it is.

I know osage orange was mentioned in one of the WB articles in 98 or 99 with some schooners. They even mentioned Arkansas as the source. Does anyone have any personal experience with it in keels, deadwood, floor timbers? Where would you rate it in priority of use if you had white oak or osage orange? How dry would you want for either choice?

Raka025
01-04-2008, 11:44 PM
http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b8df25b3127cceb3bfd0d0a3ab00000026108BYtG7lsxbq

Dave Dremeled the epoxy from around the bolt heads and drove them out through the curved end of the rudder post.

Actually, you don't need to remove the rudder shoe. Just the pintel or gudgeon and the rudder literally sets in and out of the rudder shoe.

http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b8df25b3127cceb3bf2c72a37700000026108BYtG7lsxbq

Wow, very interesting rudder. Thank you.

John Turpin
01-05-2008, 08:39 AM
Webber Falls is safe as I don't know where it is.

It's not that safe. I know where it is!

Hwyl
01-05-2008, 08:53 AM
I know osage orange was mentioned in one of the WB articles in 98 or 99 with some schooners. They even mentioned Arkansas as the source. Does anyone have any personal experience with it in keels, deadwood, floor timbers? Where would you rate it in priority of use if you had white oak or osage orange? How dry would you want for either choice?

No personal knowledge, the schooner you're refering to is the Sultana http://www.sultanaprojects.org/ .

Having said that, I'd throw in a vote for using wood as similar to the ones A&R used.

You've already started tapping into the depth of knowledge on Concordia's. I'd suggest a visit to Concordia and IYRS when you come to get the boat, and then there's Margo.

Mrleft8
01-05-2008, 09:58 AM
Osage is only a little bit more rot resistent than White Oak. I imagine it's going to be a lot easier to get the big hunks of timber you're likely to need in WO than Osage...
One little thing that was brought up on Margo's other thread that I would like to drum into you so you never ever forget it..... Label EVERYTHING. And take lots of pictures BEFORE you take anything out of the boat, and continue taking pictures as you remove things. Take detail pictures of where things such as bulkheads and furniture attach to other things. Make sure the labels are readable in the pictures...It will save you (and anyone else who might be working with you) lots of headaches and hair pulling.

paladin
01-14-2008, 06:34 PM
The longevity of Osage Orange is better than white oak, and the primary advantage is that it will take epoxy very well when laminating it....and even if you aren't using epoxy, other adhesives and caulking will adhere much better. I actually purchased my last stock from Texas as it was used for everything from mooring bits to handles for belaying pins and shells for blocks....the longer pieces were laminated for the stem etc.....granddad used it for wheel hubs, rims and spokes and the hub and bearings on our old windmill....which still works.

Raka025
01-18-2008, 08:47 PM
The longevity of Osage Orange is better than white oak, and the primary advantage is that it will take epoxy very well when laminating it....and even if you aren't using epoxy, other adhesives and caulking will adhere much better. I actually purchased my last stock from Texas as it was used for everything from mooring bits to handles for belaying pins and shells for blocks....the longer pieces were laminated for the stem etc.....granddad used it for wheel hubs, rims and spokes and the hub and bearings on our old windmill....which still works.

Would doing the keel, floor timbers and stem be considered an upgrade in wood over white oak given your experience? What about laminating frames? Thanks in advance.

PeterSibley
01-18-2008, 10:02 PM
Wouldn't it be lovely if t here was some really objective way of comparing the durability of different timbers from around the world ??

For instance you fellas seem to use white oak as a base line ....but I have no idea how it compares to Australian hardwoods .