Silly query - installing a fore-deck hatch to open aft

[carioca1232001]

Some months ago I started a thread about restoring a newish-deck (1998)- mahogany with in-laid white-wood strips - which was leaking and in need of attention.

I finally did take the epoxy/dynel route and started a thread quite recently concerning UV-protection for the deck, which provoked intelligent and fruitful discussion on this matter.

So here is the deck, all epoxied and dynelled with the new ipê windows and window-columns undergoing installation:

http://carioca.zoto.com/img/45/fff2ff650ad17789605ee83fcf10451e-.jpg

http://carioca.zoto.com/img/45/3739b4bc54c3c6e23a38f68419909746-.jpg

http://carioca.zoto.com/img/45/f0ef0f101180e5baf6d15bebbe09c115-.jpg

As I am retired and eyeing the charter business, I was wondering if it would be OK to install the fore-deck hatch opening aft because :

1. I am contemplating installing a bench (25 cm high) around the contour of the windows over the foredeck; boats like mine were supplied with such a bench in days gone by and I was thinking of seating for 3 (three), duly strapped-in with waist-level seat-belts.

2. The hatch would still ventilate when opened but without the gale blowing through the V-berth and main cabin; in addition, a person could pop-up from the V-berth beneath and hand snacks/drinks to passengers seated/strapped-in on the bench.

Would welcome your thoughts on this.

[ssor]

Forehatches that open from the front are fine on sail boats but I should think that you could get some spray in on a fast boat.
I realy don't see a flaw in the idea or in your reasoning and purpose. Just so that it isn't a toe stubber.

[rbgarr]

One thing to keep in mind is that an aft facing hatch on the foredeck of a powerboat may draw the engine(s) exhaust into the cabin from the cockpit under certain conditions. It's called the "station wagon effect" if that has any meaning for you, and could lead to increased levels of carbon monoxide and unpleasant odors in the interior of the boat.

Some hatches can be hinged so that they will open either forward or aft depending on how you rig them. That might be an option for you.

[JimD]

I can't help with the hatch but nice deck!

[mmd]

I designed the charter powercat below for a client in Barbados and installed all five foredeck hatches opening aft. He threw a hissy-fit at acceptance trials and made us change them all around to open forward. After his second charter and having replaced all of the soaked linens and matresses in the forward cabins, he brought the boat back and had us return the hatches to the original orientation.

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d19/mmd_ns/OceanMistpowercat.jpg

[carioca1232001]

Hinges that would allow the hatch to open either aft or forward sound like the thing.

The engine fumes issue had not ocurred to me. redface.gif

With twin diesels and with a following sea, it can sometimes get uncomfortable sitting over the transom . But the main cabin and V-berth have been fine and fume-free, so is the cockpit area (just some 2,5 metres forward from the transom).

Anyone know how the above hinges are referred to in ship´s chandlers stores ? ?

JimD, I hope the functionality of the deck - weathertightness - holds out over and above the good looks ;)

[Gary E]

I would NEVER have a hatch open that way..

The hatch should open so that you can stand in the hatch and handle the anchor in a storm, that means the hatch hinge at the rear of the opening. If the hatch opens with the hinge forward that will make things extereemly dificult.

Seat Belts??????????
are you NUTZ??????

[ 01-02-2006, 04:06 PM: Message edited by: Gary E ]

[JimD]

The engine fumes issue had not ocurred to me. Carbon monoxide detectors ought to be mandatory on any boat with an engine no matter which way the hatches open. Live long and prosper, eh? smile.gif

[carioca1232001]

mmd,
Thanks for an opposing view, exemplified with real-life experience. This is the Nirvana aspect of WBF ;)

Now I really liked the look of that cat charter boat designed by you :cool: .

Can you supply additional data on construction material/technique, power plant, number of passengers, cruising speed, fuel consumption etc. ?

You never know, I might want to go in for a bigger one, if this current thing gets off the ground ;)

[carioca1232001]

GaryE wrote:


...Seat Belts??????????
are you NUTZ??????
Certainly not !

Seat belts were initially used in airplanes and they did such a good job that they found their way into autos. ;)

If someone rolls off that foredeck with the boat underway, the prop suction...and the rest of it :eek:

[JimConlin]

To the question of being able to deal with the anchor while standing in the hatch, can the hatch cover be hinged such that it would open completely an lie flat on the deck? If so, then the anchor-tending function can be served.

[kc8pql]

I built my foredeck hatch to open both fore and aft. Forward at anchor to catch the breeze and aft while sailing in light to moderate conditions to keep the spray out and let some air in. I used standard loose pin hatch hinges. I move the pins from one side to the other depending on which way I want it to open. Works fine.

http://tinypic.com/jjwema.jpg

[Gary E]

I move the pins from one side to the other depending on which way I want it to open. From the inside?????

[carioca1232001]

To the question of being able to deal with the anchor while standing in the hatch, can the hatch cover be hinged such that it would open completely an lie flat on the deck? If so, then the anchor-tending function can be served. Yes, mine can. I thought as well that there would be no hindrance to anchor-tending.

[kc8pql]

From the outside, obviously. This isn't my idea. Came from Hiscock's Wanderer III.

[mmd]

The powercat - named Ocean Mist - is 60 ft LOA, 55 ft LWL, 27 ft BOA, 8 ft B(hull), and 3 ft Draft. It is powered by twin Cummins 400 hp diesels driving 5-blade 28" props. She has four guest cabins with queen-size bunks and ensuite heads with showers, and two double-berth crew cabins (a husband-and-wife couple and a third crew were to staff the boat). The cruising grounds were originally a 5-day circuit of Barbados - Grenada - SVG - St. Lucia - Barbados, but I lost track of the boat after a few years (it was built in 1995), so I don't know if she maintained this itinery.

The hulls are symmetrical and were built in the usual 'glass method - ply & wood male plug, female mold, and then vacuum-bagged hull. I wanted to make a bit more shapely hull form, but budgetary constraints dictated a developable-panel form with multiple spray chines to make plug construction and fairing easier. The hull was cored, with the exterior hull done in vinylester, then a CoreCell core of varying densities depending on location, and the inner laminates being of regular bagged polyester. The photo shows her immediately after launch. We did acceptance & performance trials, then she went to Trinidad where extensive teak interior woodwork was installed, along with a bit of exterior wood trim.

The innovative feature of the boat was the hull underbody - I designed it with an air-entrapment feature that injected outside air under pressure under the aft 1/3rd of the hull to provide "lubrication" for the hull at planing speed. It worked tolerably well, as the vessel was able to maintain 30 knots in one metre seas at WOT. The hull was pretty wet at that speed, though. It would be nice to do a second boat to apply the lessons learned from this one.

[rbgarr]

mmd-

I was aboard a cruising powercat once and noticed that a good deal of spray was thrust forward out of the tunnel at speed and came back over the bows as a not-so-fine mist. Was that your experience with 'wetness' or are you talking about something else?

[mmd]

rbgarr -

No, we din't suffer from "blowback", though I am confident that it was by luck and not good design. Our problem was a function of the hull shapes - or lack thereof. The bows were so pointy and slab-sided that if we punched into a wave, the resulting spray would be driven up rather than out, and our forward momentum would drive us right through the spray. If the breeze was dead on the bow, only the side decks would get a bit wet, but if there was a quartering breeze you needed rain gear on the flying bridge and scuba gear on the foredeck.

One feature I incorporated into the design was fun in these conditions, though - I put a sunken seat in a footwell big enough for 2-3 people right forward on the main deck on the centreline. It turned out that this stayed dry in all but the most wretched conditions. It was the best seat in the house for high-speed runs - a bird's eye view of the water rushing underneath and (unless you are prone to mal de mer) a ride suitable for the best carnival midway; no slamming, little sideways force, but great vertical contouring of the waves. You were, however, stuck there until the pilot slowed down to a reasonable speed - no handrails unless you went 'round the periphery of the deck, and there you were subjected to the full volume of the spray coming over the railings.

[carioca1232001]

Thank you, mmd. The power cat you describe is definitely in the luxury class.

I was informed about a yard in north-eastern Brazil - I think it is in Paraiba State - that builds smaller power cats, for shallower pockets ;) .

A 30-odd footer can be built there for around 120K US$, complete with 2X 150 HP 4-cyliner turbo-diesels, gear boxes and hydraulic steering.

Still way over what I can presently contemplate for charter craft nº2 :rolleyes:

[mmd]

The Oceam Mist was built in SVG in 1995 for around USD$250,000. I would expect to almost triple that for today's economy if built anywhere in North America. In the Far East or maybe still in the Caribbean and northern South America it will be cheaper due to labour rates.

[Lew Barrett]

Aft opening hatches are standard issue on many boats, certainly the old ones that I'm most familiar with. On mine, I would only install a hatch to open aft because of the issues raised by mmd, although I agree a forward opening hatch would be very nice on a warm day at anchor. The dual opening design sounds like a good compromise, if you can arrange that.
The station wagon effect will not be of concern that far forward on the boat. The station wagon effect occurs because boats (apart from those pointy at both ends) usually have what amounts to a Kamm tail, (wide flat transom) meaning the back eddys of disturbed air are spilling over into the cockpit because of the low pressure area created behind the boat when it's in motion or pointed into the wind. On your boat, it's the back of the boat that "will suck the fumes in first, not the front. You'll already be unconscious by the time the fumes getting in through the forward hatch will make any difference. smile.gif
If I had to pick one scheme on a faster motor vessel, it would be a rear opening hatch, but then I can't reach my ground tackle from my forward hatch anyway, and in any weather snotty enough to make me want to anchor from inside, I'd be reluctant to open a top side hatch to preserve what interior dryness I could. Then again, I'm not a sailor.....
Lew

[ 01-02-2006, 06:12 PM: Message edited by: Lew Barrett ]

[whb]

See if you can pick up a set of hinges like they use for the ceiling escape hatches on buses.

They open either forward or aft or you can push the whole thing up.

Howard

[carioca1232001]

Howard wrote:


See if you can pick up a set of hinges like they use for the ceiling escape hatches on buses.

They open either forward or aft or you can push the whole thing up.

Howard Never got close to anyone of those. Must be quite a contraption to allow for so much flexibility.

After all, an escape hatch loses all meaning of purpose if someone has to climb outside and swap pins from the rear to the forward hinges or vice-versa.

[kc8pql]

Originally posted by carioca1232001:

After all, an escape hatch loses all meaning of purpose if someone has to climb outside and swap pins from the rear to the forward hinges or vice-versa.If it's important to you to be able to open the hatch in either direction from inside the boat, just make a double frame hatch, with one frame hinged foward and the other aft, like a folding screen.

[Gary E]

Yeah... and bolt it on with explosive bolts and a BIG button inside labeled...
LET ME THE H*** OUTA HERE :D :D

[formerlyknownasprince]

Looking at the photo, I'd say the pins are on the outside and the latches are on the inside. What's the problem?

[Ian McColgin]

Hinged forehatches have been opening aft on sailboats for longer than there even were motor boats for a couple of reasons:

In traditional hatch design, the hinged side is less likely to tear off in the event of a boarding sea; and

The natural air movement in a traditional displacement hull is from the aft companion forward and an aft opened hatch enhances that flow while a forward opened hatch may well help establish a stagnant air zone somewhere amidships.

Unless such hatches are fitted with triangular fold down side skirts, as is common aboard finer cruising sail boats, the aft opening hatch will not prevent the vast amount of spray that comes aboard other than dead on from finding its way below. I suspect, especially from mmd's remarks, that we rag and stick folk have more of a problem than speedy stinkpotters.

The forehatch itself will not enhance any "station wagon effect" a boat may face. This happens when the boat is wandering well downwind in calm weather at a speed about equal to or less than the wind, and exhaust laden air is drawn into the companion and remains stuck in the boat. Actually, with the forehatch open, it might well vent right through. The boat I know best where a whole crew was asphyxiated at dinner while the boat murmured along under auto had hatches and ports closed except the companion.

There are boats with dangerous foredecks that have forward opening hatches with a high platform, preferably self-draining, under such one has the deck a nudge below belt level. Any lower and anchor handling will be impeded. Any boat such as this with proper rails certainly does not need an anchor-handling hatch.

There are folk who so persist in the thought of better venting at anchor from forward opening hatches that they go through stunning peregrinations to make working two-way opening inside and outside opening hatches. But then they find the air is not so good and the ring up a nice nylon airscoop for the hatch. I find it better to stick to enhancing the natural air flow and make foredeck hatches open from the aft.

I've seen some wonderful foredeck benches but am not sure you've all the requisites. The brow over the forward coach house is the major problem. Sitting up on that curve with no back support is hard. Sitting on a box that much occludes the windows is also a problem. How about a fine weather - one would hardly sit out there in bad - deck mat held in place with straps to the stanchions and, if leaning against the window brow is uncomfortable, a snap in place cushion for each person. Let 'em recline.

I'd not operate such a boat with folk on the foredeck under conditions that they need seatbelts.

Love the name!

G'luck.

[Gary E]

Fore hinge with aft opening on THIS boat??

http://carioca.zoto.com/img/45/3739b4bc54c3c6e23a38f68419909746-.jpg

That's the one he is talking about, not a 60 footer going 30 knts or a sailboat...

[ 01-03-2006, 09:42 AM: Message edited by: Gary E ]

[Ian McColgin]

Exactly. The biggest issue is air flow in the forepeak and for that, hinge forward, opening aft is the best.

Edited to add: Another advantage to aft opening is deck safety. People right at the bow are apt to step backwards without looking. A forward opening hatch is a lovely pit into which they can fall. People moving foreward on a boat are covering a greater distance and moving towards a smaller space so they will either be looking or hugging the rail.

[ 01-03-2006, 09:19 AM: Message edited by: Ian McColgin ]

[Gary E]

Well... I dont agree...there are only 2 reasons to be there 1 is on a calm day and then it does not matter which way it opens... the other is on a real snotty day when you are standing in the opening and handleing the anchor...

The railings on boats that size are at best knee height and only usefull to give you false sense of security and trip you and are on little boats for looks only...

[Ian McColgin]

I agree with Gary that the railings are lower than sailboat offshore standards, to say the least. Were I to charter such a boat, I'd even give some thought to higher stauncheons and maybe a top wire, keeping the look but enhancing safety. At least I'd not have guests on the foredeck underweigh at any speed over slow bell in a calm.

To me that hatch looks too far aft for anchor handling. Could one even reach the chaulks to get the line in even if one managed to hurl a 45# - 65# object over? And how about getting it back aboard from the hatch without scarring the topsides and deck. No, this hatch is useless and unnecessary for anchor handling.

Were the boat mine, I'd add an anchor platform arranged such that the anchor can self-deploy, and maybe even a nice reel hauler-winch so's all can be done from the bridge.

Even without a platform or windlass, Anchoring will be safe if the crew does what all small boat crews do - kneel and crawl. That's the only way they will get safely out to the bow where they are needed.

I stay with the points about ventilation and deck safety. Aft opening is the better choise for this boat.

But we all have different experiences that shape how we look at this problem.

[carioca1232001]

Ian McColgin wrote:


I've seen some wonderful foredeck benches but am not sure you've all the requisites. The brow over the forward coach house is the major problem. Sitting up on that curve with no back support is hard. Sitting on a box that much occludes the windows is also a problem. How about a fine weather - one would hardly sit out there in bad - deck mat held in place with straps to the stanchions and, if leaning against the window brow is uncomfortable, a snap in place cushion for each person. Let 'em recline.

I'd not operate such a boat with folk on the foredeck under conditions that they need seatbelts.

Love the name!
Priceless !

I was thinking of a low-profile fore-deck bench built of white-wood strips (4cm wide X 1,5cm thick), installed over 4 horizontal wooden beams (5cm wide X 3 cm thick), the aft ends of which would be anchored to the 4 window columns with appropriate SS brackets and fasteners.

The 4 beams would also have 4 vertical supports (wooden or SS) at their fore end affixed to the deck with SS fasteners

Believe it or not, I had also thought about the back rest - would have been in the form of a snap-on cushion, with cushion base resting on the bench ;)

The problem I see is not so much the bench occluding the fore-cabin windows around which it is anchored, but somewhat hampering the captain´s visibility from the cockpit. That is why I said it would be no more than 30 cms high, max., including seating-cushion.

However your deck mat idea sounds enticing as it is much simpler and less outlay too. Another + is that it is coming from someone who has been in the charter business ;) .

Would older people - my target population is 45 + years, 4-star + hotel visitors - be happy to sit on the deck mat, or would they think it to be too hippy-ish ?

As for the seat-belts : my twin-engined turbo-diesel boat does not do more than 15 mph flat-out (nearly so) at 2300 rpm. At 1600-1800 rpm, it is more like 7-9 mph, with accompanying excellent fuel consumption , and this should be the speed that I operate it at, save in emergencies (running from the weather etc.)

But even at the latter slower speed, I would be worried about someone rolling-off the deck-mat (say) - and ending up in the transom danger zone. I would still want to have them use seat-belts, anchored on the deck, the window-columns or whatever. Am I being over careful ?

As for the name, it is derived from Ancient Persian and has found it´s way into the vernacular of Urdu and Hindi. Denoted for wishing "Long Life !" to a person, country, political party or whatsoever. ;) I was intrigued to hear Nepalese also shouting out "Zindabad !" the other day on the BBC when they were clamouring to oust the current Nepalese strongman, brother of former King Mahendra :rolleyes:

If I get myself a second boat, I am going to name it Zindaguy - which is Urdu/Hindi for "destiny" :D

[Gary E]

Your not being anything other than NUTZ allowing non experienced guests on the front deck of that boat at ANY TIME...STAY WHERE THEY WONT FALL OFF...

Maybe use the seatbelts to tie them to the cockpit???

[Ian McColgin]

At dignified middle age, few things beat being lightly clad in a gentle breeze with a cold rum punch. Actually, at any age.

the side decks are tight enough than no body's dowager great aunt is going out there anyhow. Anyone on deck is likely nimble enough to get up off a mat.

A different thing that might work - aesthetics to be worked out with raised railing - could be a couple of deck boxes, one each at the rail with foreward edge just about abreast the aft end of the foredeck hatch, 3'-6" or so long, just enough for two normal sized folk to sit pleasantly chummy.

The rail needs to be high enough to catch at the bottom of the rib cage, small of the back. The lower the seat, the wider it needs to be, so if the box is a bit over a foot high, add some for the cushin, the width should be 24"+.

These boxes might be sized around docking lines, fenders, even an anchor and rode. They should have a grated or slatted bottom that's a half inch or so above the deck. Have the bolts that hold the boxes to the deck inside (no stubbed toes) into a threaded deck fitting so you can get the boxes off for varnishing (dovetailed fine wood of course) or in preparation for a storm. Have suitable little (plastic best) studs to thread in when the boxes are off.

Without high rails, I'd not run even at slow speed with folk standing on deck. The boxes provide some safety by keeping folk either seated or near the center. If folk are standing near the rail, a little side wave like the wake of a passing boat could tip them right over that rail.

I doubt anyone already prone could roll off but you could put a lower wire or (with a tight wire at deck level to hold it properly) netting under the rail.

The look of the boat is important and it would be spoilt by a higher rail. Still, one thing is whether you can insure against a guest coming to harm. Whole 'nuther can of worms there.

G'luck

[Dan McCosh]

I changed the original aft-opening hatch to a forward-opening one mainly to allow it to catch more air at anchor. The original had hinges at the front, apparently to make it stronger in the face of a boarding sea. I also noted once in heavy weather that a sea over the bow could catch a front-opener and rip off the hatch. The dual-hinge arrangement is the best. Any concerns about safety are met by only using one set of hinges at a time. On the other hand, in heavy seas the hatch is dogged down anyway, and the double hinge is very strong when both are pinned.
Most of this is meaningless to a boat such as the one pictured--although I still like the two-hinge system.

[Gary E]

Is this a sailboat / powerboat thing?
I am powerboat experienced... and I have to tell you I have NEVER seen a powerboat with the hinge in the front... a few on the side..but NEVER in the front.

[Ian McColgin]

There were many post WWII mass produced wooden motor cruisers now regarded as classics and well, nay even over, loved by their owners that have the foreward opening forehatch.

Not to be overly snooty and always excepting the intelligently designed anchor handling forehatch (See Bolger for an example), not everything done in fitting out these boats makes the best sense.

If you have a chance to review some of that era's "Yachting" numbers, you'll find the occasional fulmination against the rising fad of foreward opening hatches. LFH, of course, could tear one a new anal oriface on this topic.

[carioca1232001]

Ian McColgin wrote:

Without high rails, I'd not run even at slow speed with folk standing on deck. The boxes provide some safety by keeping folk either seated or near the center. If folk are standing near the rail, a little side wave like the wake of a passing boat could tip them right over that rail.

Seems like deck-boxes by the rails, one on either side, for a total seating of 4 - as you have described - would clutter the deck area at least as much as a foredeck bench for 3 around the foreward windows !.

Guests would need to be strapped-in and seated on the forebench or deck-boxes.

No standing alowed at anytime, except when guests are being seated/leaving their seats, coincident with the boat being at dock - or at anchor, somewhere in the bay, say.

If this still sounds like I am asking for trouble, as GaryE has said quite openly, given:

1.Low-rails;

despite

2. A (future)netting below the rails + taut-wire at the bottom, betwen stanchions, for stiffening the net;

then the proposition of seating people on the foredeck should be shelved, irrespective of forebench, deck-mat or deck-boxes.

Having oneself insured against bodily harm and injuries to guests seems idiotic in the light of turning a deaf ear to more experienced people who have advised otherwise. :rolleyes:

[Ian McColgin]

There are more idiots in the insurance industry than even in politics but the right person, perhaps a good local surveyor who knows what insurers should care about, is worth talking with. What I have in mind is making the boat sanely safe so that she is insurable, not insuring as an excuse to run dumb risks that the insuror was just too ignorant to fully understand.

I do think that even low boxes would look a bit like clutter. Were she mine and I was attempting a high end trip, swim and meal charter trade, I'd probably opt for a big mat all across the coach roof as an at-anchor lounge option, keep the deck clear for walking about, and keep the guests aft and in the boat when moving.

By the way, especially in a slow charactor boat, seat belts are out of place and guests will hate them. If you find you must get guests up on deck when under weigh, no matter what seating you provide you'll just have to raise those rails as well. They may need a break in the height moving aft as it may be too tight between the raised house and the rail if the rail is butt high or higher.

It is an interesting problem.

G'luck.

[carioca1232001]

Ian McColgin wrote:


.....Were she mine and I was attempting a high end trip, swim and meal charter trade, I'd probably opt for a big mat all across the coach roof as an at-anchor lounge option, keep the deck clear for walking about, and keep the guests aft and in the boat when moving .
The bold letters are mine. Sorry to bring you back on topic again, but I will be most obliged if you bear with me.

The seating is quite adequate, come to think of it:

http://carioca.zoto.com/img/45/747ced06bfd6a01f4a90a1d95da94163-.jpg

The bench on top of the cockpit - like a fly-deck - seats 3 comfortably. The transom accomodates 4 - you see three in the pic.
There is also a seat on either side of the rails, to port and stbd of the transom.

Should someone be sensitive to engine fumes - BTW, my diesels are Euro II spec, pretty good - they may elect to sit in the cabin. I have always wondered if people are happy to ride in the cabin - because I am surely not !

The cabin (headroom 6 ft), V-berth, cockpit and transom area soles are mahogany + white-wood stripes, just like my deck - looks OK (nice, maybe!)

Galley:
http://carioca.zoto.com/img/45/4a8f72ce2cbd33ef4b0a91ebcaa9428b-.jpg

Main Settee:

http://carioca.zoto.com/img/45/167ef3f98055f5f5882683191ae04075-.jpg

Dinette:

http://carioca.zoto.com/img/45/5a70b4fec1149c9c9ee1df5b5163d82a-.jpg

Head:

http://carioca.zoto.com/img/45/0a6453793ae39f26660803dd24ae993a-.jpg

Finally, a view of the transom table, looking foreward, towards cockpit:

http://carioca.zoto.com/img/45/4048d9ecc95d6aa86d18502da90214da-.jpg

Would guests be happy to ride in the cabin, if the need arose ?

[Alan D. Hyde]

An attractive boat, Carioca--- the photos are enjoyable.

We have several friends who've had skin cancer, and who now substantially limit sun exposure.

They'd DELIGHT in your cabin, I suspect. :D

Alan

[ 01-03-2006, 02:34 PM: Message edited by: Alan D. Hyde ]

[carioca1232001]

Many thanks for the feedback Alan.

I really do appreciate it. :cool:

[Gary E]

Good looking boat and I see you do have a pulpit for the anchor... how do you deploy and retrieve it?

Dont screwit up with box seats on the front deck.. smile.gif

[carioca1232001]

Gary E,
Using the standard knee and crawl procedure followed by heave ho ;)
An electric windlass is in my plans but she needs to go through her sea trails first, estimated for end of Jan 06 - and demonstrate promise of payback. :D
I have been forking out on this major refurbishment since august 2004, addressing all major issues. In contrast to 1998, when boat yard carpenters did great aesthetics while sweeping major issues underneath the carpet. Time to call it a day, though :rolleyes:

[kc8pql]

I'd say you've got plenty of outside seating too. I count 9? That's enough guests on a boat that size I think. I've been on a number of day trips like this in various parts of the world. The most enjoyable have been the ones that didn't make me feel like a sardine crammed into a can.

[ 01-03-2006, 04:34 PM: Message edited by: kc8pql ]

[carioca1232001]

Good point.
:cool:
I was thinking of no more than 8 (eight) guests at any one time.
Thanks.

[TomMcKinney]

I find it quite interesting that some persist on the fact that the hatch must be forward opening so as to allow anchor handling.

I see no impediment to handling the anchor from the opening if the hatch were aft opening but allowed to open 90 to 180 degrees. In fact I don't see how one could handle the anchor in rough condiyion without the hatch flat on the deck regardless of its orientation.Would you want that hatch over your head while riding up and down big swells?? Not me.

I think this is a prime example of naysaying how something will not work instead of offering solutions to assist the goal. Of course there is also the counter tendency of some (my self included sometimes) to reach a conclusion, then post here for comments, fighting all those who criticize, even when possibly right, and then blindly accepting the posts that re-inforce what we want to do anyway (polyester vs. epoxy anyone, or may I interest you in a debate of latex vs. marine paint?)

That all being said, my vote is aft- Carbon monoxide is a grave concern, but given the distance to the exhaust and lower speed, perhaps not an issue- could also be compated by rear opening vents further back that would serve to suck out any CO before it piles up front.

[htom]

Splendid boat.

My first thought is that there's a way to swing the hatch either fore or aft, using retractable interior pins as hinges, withdrawing two and hinging on the other pair of pins, but I can't find the drawing.

Second thought is to make the hatch & cover symetrical, so that it can be removed and installed either way.

Third, silly thought, is to make a circular track to install the cover on, spin it to the position desired, and open.

I'm sure you'll find a solution that matches the rest of her beauty.

[carioca1232001]

Belated thanks, Tom and htom, for your suggestions and comments.

Not decide yet as to the hardware, but all effort shall be made to keep it simple - and very functional ;)