paint or decal ?

[ohiomike]

getting ready to put the name on our new transom and was wondering what would be the best type of lettering traditional gold leaf or the new computer generated decals that can be made??

any comments

ohiomike

[Mike Vogdes]

I just bought a computer generated gold leaf decal for my transom... Looks pretty good for a decal too..

[Wooden Boat Fittings]

.
We use both, Mike. I've found that the gold decals available here have rather a metallic-foil look about them, and don't really look like gold leaf. (Mike V's experience might be different.) However, setting off a coloured decal with a gold outline can look pretty nice.

Here are two boathook shafts -- Kalihilani's is true hand-lettered gold leaf with a blue outline, whereas Aileen Louisa's is a die-cut decal with a gold (vinyl) outline. (In fairness, this is now some years' old, and has dulled a little.)

Also for reference is AL's transom, where her name was done in gold leaf.

Whichever you use comes down to the good old cost-benefit comparison eventually, I suppose -- gold leaf is a good deal more expensive.

You might like to check Jay Greer's varnishing comments on this thread (http://www.woodenboat-ubb.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=011254) too.

Mike
.

http://www.woodenboatfittings.com.au/public/bh-al-s.jpg

http://www.woodenboatfittings.com.au/public/bhkh2-s.jpg

http://www.woodenboatfittings.com.au/public/al-transom2.jpg
.

[JimD]

I vote for paint provided whoever does it is a talented caligrapher. Decals are for racing cars, not wooden boats. Just my humble and irrational opinion.

[NormMessinger]

Nothing is as beautiful as genuine gold leaf but... I agree with Mike V. The "gold" lettering on Prairie Islander's transom sure is purdy.

[ 04-02-2005, 02:50 PM: Message edited by: NormMessinger ]

[rbgarr]

I've used the cg decals and it's real easy to put on a new set right over the old ones when needed. I just had to make sure the original font, size and curve stayed in the computer memory.

[Alan Peck]

Any recommended sources for these decals?

[rbgarr]

In my case, I went to a local 'Speedi-Sign' shop, sought out the owners, looked over their fonts and ability to make different curved decals, store my template long-term, and got a quote. Went to several others and did the same. Chose the business owners who seemed most enthusiastic and helpful.

Later, I gave them a picture of the decal on the boat's transom which they display in their shop now. Good will goes a long way.

There are also web based business that do it, maybe cheaper, too: West Marine, etc., but I didn't care for their fonts.

[ 04-02-2005, 07:41 PM: Message edited by: rbgarr ]

[Mike Vogdes]

I have been using Fast Signs for the last 6 or 7 years, they are good and very reasonable.

Fast Signs is a small advertising chain that does all types off signs. The boat name I just had them do is 8 feet long 10 inches high, black border with gold leaf, the hailing port is black. All for $85.00

Of course its not real gold leaf but it looks great and holds up well. Real gold leaf I suspect would cost in excess of $500.

[pcford]

JimD wrote:
I vote for paint provided whoever does it is a talented caligrapher. Decals are for racing cars, not wooden boats. Just my humble and irrational opinion. Hardly irrational. There is just no comparison between a "decal" and a hand painted and/or gold leafed transom. First, what is currently being called decals are actually simply vinyl letters. In my recollection decals are those things you put in water slide off a films. I have had true decals for boat lettering (Chris-Craft on side) and they seemed ok.

I am finishing up a boat (a '47 17' Chris Deluxe runabout.) The owner had mentioned that he had purchased a decal for the side of the boat where it says "Chris-Craft." We looked at them and they were vinyl letters with the script done so badly that I suggested that we not put them on the boat. The letter forms were poorly done and the spacing (so-called "kerning") was very clumsy. Besides that the thickness of the vinyl stick-ons would be less than sleek.

Computer generated graphics make it very simple and quick to do a mediocre job.

If you cannot tell the difference, you have not compared quality hand work with computer generated stuff. Or maybe you have not the eye to tell the difference.

As to cost, I had an owner, very nice guy, insist that I put vinyl lettering on a fiberglass sailboat for which I was supervising a paint job. boat. Cost about the same or more than hand painting.

My sign painter costs about $35 to put on numbers. Name on the rear end-cost will vary of course but the job I'm finishing up now was $300 to $400. Spun gold leaf. A beautiful job.

Maybe this is too "philosophical," but it seems so contradictory to put machine made lettering on a hand made boat.

Just my humble opinion.

Regards,
pcf

[cbob]

Mike, I have a sailboat with a clear transom, about 4' wide, 3'deep, about 15 degree rake.(I made myself), anyway I used swirled gold faced vinyl stick on for name and hailing port, Helvetica, with a red boarder, I know traditional boarder is black as it is for the hailing port. 4" and 3", as required, with the boarder it's a little over that. The plus is from a few feet it appears to be gold leaf, and after many years of varnishing it still glitters like new, some gold leaf jobs lack this kind of longevity, and there is no time waisted in the boat yard lining up a professional sign painter of this era, that have their own idea of what you should have, rather than what you told them you wanted. These were put on while afloat from the dock. The negatives are, that with the rake, the light reflected is from the water surface, which some how gives it a some what greenish more dull, not so sparkling appearance, sometimes. I think that a real gold leaf job wouldn't have this reflected light problem, but maybe someone out there knows. Also the sign lady had to buy a minimum order of the swirled gold gold material. There was a lot of waste also, but thats how it has to be. The material cost was quite a lot more than the West marine Gold sheet, which is gold looking brass, very greeny with reflected light. Now if you have a runabout with a verticle transom, no problem, direct light. Good Luck, cbob

[paladin]

as above.....nuthin', absolutely nuthin' izz as purty as real gold leaf.......but the 'varnish' will make it or break it...

[Steve Miller]

My friend Pete is a sign painter. He does gold leaf and hand lettering etc. He is an artist who found a way to earn a living doing what he loves. The guys that do this type of work, the sign painters, really love doing boat names and other personal stuff he tells me. There is more art to it than grocery store signs for example and it seems to jive with their sense of what is right, if you know what I mean. As artists they know color, scale, lighting and proportion which can make the name on that curved transom look right not computer made. They especially love designing the project. When Pete does a special custom job he often makes a mock up or even an actual second piece to make sure it will work the way he wants. He saves the really cool ones. Artist.

As pointed out already costs are generally very reasonable. Gold leaf is not all that expensive. A little goes a long way.

I am not sure I explained this all that well but if you need a boat done anywhere near Portland Oregon shoot me an email and I'll put you in touch with my pal Pete. A tour of his shop is worth it.

[pcford]

Regarding previous post:

Yup. The sad thing is that many of these talented guys are having a hard time making a living because so much sign work has gone to computer/vinyl shops. Most people evidently can't tell the difference.

I should mention that my sign painter will take a photo of your boat's transom and then lay out a design on it digitally so that you know what you are getting.

Heretofore, the tricky part of the business was getting the client's idea to the sign painter's fingertips. The mock-up helps a lot.

Likewise, if anyone needs name on a transom in Seattle, let me know and I will pass along a name.

[SNagy]

While we are on this subject, can anyone recommend a good sign painter in the Philadelphia vicinity ?

Thanks,

-Steve