Mackenzie Cuttyhunk- What do I do?

[Jim Fitz]

Big question! I have the potential to buy a 23' Cuttyhunk for a good price. Upon inspecting the boat, I found some areas of minor to scary concern as follows:

1. The bottom planking was a bit punky; buried my knife about 3/16"-1/4" in somewhat wet planking (big rains early today). Don't know if this is a real concern or not.

2. Upon getting down and looking under the boat found that she had settled onto her keel cribbing. One pile was just forward of the prop shaft and appeared to have caused a 1/2" hump in the keel. Maybe a concern, maybe not.

3. At the bow, she settled onto the cribbing so it appeared that there is a 1"=/- hump- kinda hard to tell because the cutwater cut awat right in the same spot. VERY noticable hump.

4. Upon getting on deck and pulling up deck plate to see if the keel was cracked at the stern hump, found the boat to be holding a good deal of rainwater. Logic would say if the water is staying in on land it should stay out when she's floating. Good news? Only bad thing is that she's been on the hard for the last couple of years, so she's been holding fresh water for that long. Again, could bury my knife 1/4" or less. No cracking at stern hump.

5. Dug around in the cabin to see if there was any crack at the bow hump. No perceptable crack. However, did happen to look at the butt end of the stem where it meets the keel and IT WASN'T THERE! At least most of it wasn't there. Most of the after end of the stem had rotted away. THere were also a number of screws coming through the planking that obviously went into some long lost piece of wood that was living in the vicinty of the end of the stem; now they are just poking into space. It appears that the boat must have been operated with this problem exisitng, since there was no debris visible in the immediate area. Looks like bad news.

So, I need some advice from those more wise than I in the ways of resurrecting a fine old boat. Are the problems above fatal, or at least requiring dramatic life saving measures or are they easily repairable (Git rot in the punky planks and sistering up the stem area). I need to know before I purchase was could be the boat of my dreams or the boat of my nightmares. I appreciate your opinions.

I have some pictures of the bow hump, but I can't quite figure out how to get them posted here. If I can, I'll get them on later.

[nedL]

Mackenzie Cuttyhunk.. Real nice boats, well worth saving. Unfortunately it sounds like the one you've found is well beyond 'some Git-Rot and sistering'. Poor blocking & all that rain water has taken it's toll. By your description it sounds like some major bottom work is in order, good chance a new stem & keel are called for along with possibly some new frames & planks. If the keel is solid there is a chance that given time in the water it may regain some of its straightness, but Mackenzie's are not as flexible as a traditional lapstrake skiff. They are sawn frame, hard chine construction with a reverse lap bottom. If you email me your pictures I'll post them for you & then we might be able to make some more specific comments.

[nedL]

Here you go Jim, (I've already emailed my thoughts).
I meant to ask how long is she, -- looks to be maybe about 28'?
Also, is that the prop shaft that is visable in the 'stern blocking' picture? as I remember Cuttyhunks have a fairly substantial external keel, that should run from the base of the stem aft to a reverse angle cut away for the shaft. Is it a possibility that this boat has lost its keel(?) which would certainly help explain why she sagged so badly so fast.
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid84/p955606f600730fa5ea927449db46b799/facf66c5.jpg
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid84/p300dfa1c2e1b6ed7b18f8703ba5dd945/facf66b9.jpg
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid84/p29a17d0dd2fcda5f91f2b4d85928a5e0/facf66ca.jpg

[whb]

That one really noticeable hump over the bow blocking does not seem to extend back or forward more than one frame.

She might just straighten out on her own with proper blocking :confused:

Looks like an interesting project.

May be able to remove a layer of wood and then add a fairing compound.

Howard

[Jim Fitz]

The boat is a 23 footer. There was no external keel- the cutwater stopped short right before the block at the bow, which would suggest that the keel is missing.

[Jack Heinlen]

Define 'good price'.

How's the motor and other gear?

The boat, from what I can see, needs a complete rebuild to bring it back, and the price should reflect that--like almost free. The fact that they left it open to the rain doesn't reflect well as far as all other systems. What you can see is doubtless less than what you will need to do.

That sag aft of the support really bothers me. This boat, unless it has severe structural problems, shouldn't sag like that methinks.

Unless you are in love, I'd walk away.

P.S. The sag, on second look, seems forward of rather than aft. It's still very worrisome. If the boat were under cover and the sag in the middle I'd be less concerned. Sag like that, in the ends of the boat like this, almost certainly means it's pretty rotten.

[ 10-16-2003, 02:19 PM: Message edited by: Jack Heinlen ]

[holzbt]

I'm not familiar with the 23' model but I owned a 26' and worked on several others and will assume they are similar. This boat should have a skeg that runs from the aft end of the stem to just forward of the shaft log. I can't remember the sided dim. but it is fairly heavy (2 1/2"- 3") and would pull much of the sag out of the keel batten if properly bolted. I would carefully inspect the keel batten at the shaft log and at the rudder post for cracks/breaks. Most have some electolysis problems in this area. I'd also check all chine bolts and bottom frame to side frame bolts in the after end as these are generally galvanized and in poor condition. This usually causes quite a bit of damage to the ends of the frames. The after bottom planking also deserves a close look, these boats are very flat aft and can pound enough to flex the bottom a bit. Years of this abuse will turn the planking into a rubbery mess that has little strength. If you check classifieds for higher priced ones they have all had their bottoms replaced. The last thing is check the windshield and deck area around it for rot. I'd guess that this should be a free boat unless it has a diesel or new gas engine with it.

These are very nice boats when put back into good condithion. Don't be scared off right away if you really like this boat. There is (used to be) an owners association that publishes a newsletter with quite a number of members who have rebuilt their own boats. IIRC almost every common problem with these boats was written up with articles about someone's firsthand account of repairs/rebuilds. These are really simple boats and can be repaired by almost anyone with the desire to do so.

[ 10-17-2003, 10:06 PM: Message edited by: holzbt ]

[Jim Fitz]

Thanks for the responses. I decided to pass up on the boat, unless the owners wanted to donate it to a good home. I have always admired these boats, but I also had to be realistic about how much I was willing to pay for a boat that was going to require significant rebuilding. As it is, I picked up a 20' Simmons Sea Skiff this year that needs some moderate TLC over the winter, so having only one project boat at one time is probably more prudent (not to mention having to finish the kayak that has been in the back of the shop for the last two years). Maybe someone else will pick up the torch for the MacKenzie.

[Bob Smalser]

I decided to pass up on the boat Wise choice.

[Jack Heinlen]

Yup.