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ishmael
04-20-2007, 07:25 PM
I've posted about this before, but I think it's important, so a new thread.

How many people of a different race have you considered friends? I got to know a black kid in high school enough to break bread, and a guy when I worked for the school system painting schools, and a good fellow in the sciences when I was there, but that's it.

Our distance came from something inherent, not from a lack of desire. They were as chary as I was. What was that about? Cultural, genetic? Just asking. It's clearly there, and nostrums aren't gonna fix it.

George Roberts
04-20-2007, 07:31 PM
In my life I have considered 5 people (not including wife and children) friends - to the extent I would die with them. All were the same race as I - pure chance.

Be careful of friendship. It has obligations.

Tylerdurden
04-20-2007, 08:02 PM
I guess I am a portable melting pot as far as friends go. Maybe it has something to do with my military background but I have never seen race as an issue when it comes to quality company.

JimD
04-20-2007, 08:02 PM
Personally, I'm ok with some forms of racism (and indeed have actively participated in) but not others. For example bicycle racism requires a high degree of athleticism. But on the other hand I don't like car racism because I just can't support forms of racism that are based on burning fossil fuels.

Mrleft8
04-20-2007, 08:05 PM
The only race I openly have issues with (OPENLY I SAID!!!) is the Idiot race.

Vince Brennan
04-20-2007, 08:14 PM
I'm with Tylerdurden.... I guess I must be blind, 'cos race just don't enter into it. People is people to me. Then again, I'm a Heinz 57 meself, so....

Hwyl
04-20-2007, 08:44 PM
What Mark said, sometimes I forget the race of my friends and have to make a positive effort to remember.

I was in a mixed race relationship that produced my two wonderful children.

I've raced boats where I've been the token "white man", somewhat of a turnaround, but true.

peb
04-20-2007, 08:51 PM
In my life I have considered 5 people (not including wife and children) friends - to the extent I would die with them. All were the same race as I - pure chance.

Be careful of friendship. It has obligations.

how sad.

Of course friendship has obligations. And it seems without failure, every friend tends to disappoint you at some point or another. But the benefits far outweigh the cost. This is what charity is all about.

ishmael
04-20-2007, 09:05 PM
I guess I'm confessing my racism, which others have moved beyond. I don't admire it, I don't like it, but it's there. A person of another race, be they Chinese or Black, ups my back. I give my best, which is pretty good, to looking past it, but it's there.


You don't have this? Interesting.

TimH
04-20-2007, 09:07 PM
My best friends growing up were Chinese, Korean, and Iraqi.

WX
04-20-2007, 11:17 PM
My partner is part American Arapaho Indian, part Australian Koori with a bit of Anglo-Saxon thrown in: I have no desire to live with anyone else.
What's on the outside is not important...it's what is going on on the inside that matters.

brad9798
04-20-2007, 11:46 PM
Black, Spanish, Latino, Korean, Malaysian ...

I don't necessarily call it racism ... but human nature has a fear of what is different ... races are different ... in looks, beliefs (often), etc.

Like a told a woman that used to work for me that always thought I was cold-hearted about equality, blah, blah, blah ...

Mind you, she grew up in Redneck, white, smalltown, USA ... always preaching how we are all equal ...

Of course, I do not believe we are all equal ... and that has nada to do with race ... it has to due with core values, socio-economic conditions, etc.

I asked her to join me on a Friday afternoon of rent collecting ... I thought she was going to crap her pants within 30 seconds of getting out of the car ... She learned more about differences in 20 minutes that day than she had learned in her first 30 years! :)

geeman
04-20-2007, 11:52 PM
When I was in school,different races coming to our school was just starting out.I had no experience with other races before that time.And I had never met an Afro- American.So I had nothing to base a friendship on.I DO remember the 1st blacks in our school system having a very rough time and remember the few there were ( about 6 I think) not being involved much other then going to class.( not that I blame them.)
But, I also remember being chased out of the local "Negro College" grounds at night one time when we were late getting home from a bike fishing trip.We took a short cut thinking it would save time.But when we were spotted by the Black students the chase was on, They chased us all the way across the campus and out the front gate.Yep, I remember that.

Tylerdurden
04-21-2007, 05:42 AM
I am going to say something that will not go over well and its the truth. Racism plays into the hands of power.
Like divide and conquer only real idiots fall into it.
Children are not racist, only trained idiots are.

Look around you and see who really benefits from racism?

Most of you here are racists, you hate Arabs though you wouldn't admit it. You have been programmed.

The day we throw off what we are taught and accept other cultures and not molest them is the day peace will take hold.
Arabs don't hate Americans they hate what has been done to them in our name.
When you wrap yourself in the flag, you wrap yourself in chains because you have no real control in what is done in your name.
And you become blinded by patriotism to it.

"A man can be a Christian or a patriot, but he can't legally be a Christian and a patriot--except in the usual way: one of the two with the mouth, the other with the heart. The spirit of Christianity proclaims the brotherhood of the race and the meaning of that strong word has not been left to guesswork, but made tremendously definite- the Christian must forgive his brother man all crimes he can imagine and commit, and all insults he can conceive and utter- forgive these injuries how many times?--seventy times seven--another way of saying there shall be no limit to this forgiveness. That is the spirit and the law of Christianity. Well--Patriotism has its laws. And it also is a perfectly definite one, there are not vaguenesses about it. It commands that the brother over the border shall be sharply watched and brought to book every time he does us a hurt or offends us with an insult. Word it as softly as you please, the spirit of patriotism is the spirit of the dog and wolf. The moment there is a misunderstanding about a boundary line or a hamper of fish or some other squalid matter, see patriotism rise, and hear him split the universe with is war-whoop. The spirit of patriotism being in its nature jealous and selfish, is just in man's line, it comes natural to him- he can live up to all its requirements to the letter; but the spirit of Christianity is not in its entirety possible to him.
The prayers concealed in what I have been saying is, not that patriotism should cease and not that the talk about universal brotherhood should cease, but that the incongruous firm be dissolved and each limb of it be required to transact business by itself, for the future."
- Mark Twain's Notebook

Andrew Craig-Bennett
04-21-2007, 05:49 AM
I guess I'm confessing my racism, which others have moved beyond. I don't admire it, I don't like it, but it's there. A person of another race, be they Chinese or Black, ups my back. I give my best, which is pretty good, to looking past it, but it's there.


You don't have this? Interesting.

Jack,

I'm sorry to say this, but you should be ashamed of yourself. You truly should. Please delete this thread.

Andrew

S.V. Airlie
04-21-2007, 05:59 AM
you hate Arabs though you wouldn't admit it. You have been programmed.

Tyler.. is it hate or not understanding others? I would tend to go towards not understanding vs. hate.

As to friends.. I have several categories.. Those I have known and grown up with... for years.. 1st grade and before.. A very small crowd. As I grew up in a tech white neighborhood, most of these are white.
Category 2.. those that I have met along the way and befriended.. A very mixed crowd. Race has not played a part nor has it been an issue. Different from group one as those have known me for so long and so well, sometimes words don't need to be spoken.
As having been a teacher in schools with very racially mixed students.. I never looked at my kids and said to myself.. umm, he is Iraqi.. he is Greek, he is black.. They were all my students and were treated equally.
My last year in England, I had 12 advisees.. They picked me.. not the other way around..
I had 7 girls and five guys... French, Israeli, Palistinian, Iraqi, American, Lybian..umm,, Irish...I can't recall all but the races and nationalities are correct for what I can recall.
As they picked me as an advisor, they must have figured out that I was NOT that racist...:D

ishmael
04-21-2007, 06:05 AM
Andrew,

Why does it bundle your undies? I'm not overtly racist, in fact go out of my way to try and include everyone I meet. But that doesn't change what I think is a native issue that goes on with most people. If you've moved beyond it, good on you! I haven't.

When you encounter a flamboyant male homosexual, for example, are you telling me you are instantly accepting? Isn't there a moment when you draw back because he is so different? It doesn't mean you hate him, it's just a native reaction.

I think not talking about it out of a sense of what's proper is more dangerous than being open about it.

Andrew Craig-Bennett
04-21-2007, 06:10 AM
Why?

Because my children have brown skins.

S.V. Airlie
04-21-2007, 06:14 AM
Going out of your way to include " them " Ish is actually racist.
I think most if not all.. and this includes everyone, wants to be equally treated. The more you treat others equally, the less "racist " you are..
Think about that.

pss.. My neice happens to be from Thialand.. I don't look at her skin color etc.. She is my neice and that is all that matters...I don't treat her any differently than her cousins who are basically WASPS...( not written in the negative sense ).

seanz
04-21-2007, 06:26 AM
I guess I'm confessing my racism, which others have moved beyond. I don't admire it, I don't like it, but it's there. A person of another race, be they Chinese or Black, ups my back. I give my best, which is pretty good, to looking past it, but it's there.


You don't have this? Interesting.

Ups my back?
As in "to get ones back up"?
This usually means to provoke someone to anger.
What did you mean by "ups my back"?

Tylerdurden
04-21-2007, 06:27 AM
[quote=S.V. Airlie;1555462]you hate Arabs though you wouldn't admit it. You have been programmed.

Tyler.. is it hate or not understanding others? I would tend to go towards not understanding vs. hate.

[quote]

I was trying to point out state sponsored racism like we have right now. The understanding part I think has more to do when in contact.
Most Americans really hate from afar, like Ish.
I don't want to soften what I said because it needs to be said in all its ugliness.
I hear it daily from people that never got closer to an Arab than the Taxi or 7/11 counter and they hate and wish we Nuked the Middleast. Its just plain Ignorant and if you call them on it they question your Patriotism.
I see that as the biggest problem so far. Maine has very little diversity so I expect it here (like Ish) but its everywhere in this country.

Hwyl
04-21-2007, 06:29 AM
Jack I have to agree with Andrew, actually I embrace his point of view. He and I are just two of the people on here with "mixed race" (what an awful term) children.

You assume in this thread that if other people don't have your reactions they are actually having them and denying them. Once again you're wrong.

ishmael
04-21-2007, 06:30 AM
I said, "everyone I meet" not "them" Jamie.

When I lived in Baltimore my boss and good friend was lesbian, so I hung out with the homosexual crowd quite a bit. I've never had leanings that way, and it was a bit odd at times. Fending off passes became a regular joke. But initially it was a bit disturbing. Not to equate this with race, but it was similar.

Andrew, I know you've got brown skinned young 'uns. Maybe we aren't communicating well because of the American Brit static. I'm not at all against your union and kids. All I'm pointing at is something visceral I've experienced that I think is pretty common. It's not exemplary, but I admit it's there, and I'm working on it. That this makes you upset is interesting in itself. Why is it not a fit topic for conversation?

S.V. Airlie
04-21-2007, 06:36 AM
So.. your real issue is with sexuality?
I still hold to what I have written even with a change of subject. I have lesbian friends.. Several... They too are good people.
I have not had passes made at me even when I was fairly good looking. Now, it wouldn't be an issue:D
But.. I also have a fairly good handle on my sexuality. Maybe you just don't feel comfortable in your own skin Ish. I mean, you do seem to post a lot of threads dealing with sexuality. More than most of us...I'm still trying to figure out how we switched from racism to homophobia.

ishmael
04-21-2007, 06:58 AM
We seem to fall so easily into categories. Big sigh. Because I broach the topic I'm immediately categorized. Which, ironically, is the topic!

I'm hoping to be a seed, dropped into a saturated solution. It's not my intention to offend or cause problems. The problems were well established before I arrived. Now I'm channeling Walt Whitman's apologist. Saints preserve us! LOL.

Seriously though, why the reluctance to talk about this?

I'm clear about my sexuality, Jamie. It was interesting, as a cute young man, hanging with men who were hitting on me. I've always gotten that, until recently with the gray hairs. They were alwayz, well almost always, kind and respectful of my NO. One guy, before Baltimore, wouldn't leave it alone, but we worked it out without fisticuffs.

Andrew Craig-Bennett
04-21-2007, 07:05 AM
What Seanz said. And what Hwyl said.

Andrew Craig-Bennett
04-21-2007, 07:19 AM
Well, we could consider the term "friend", I suppose.

George Roberts put the bar very high for that one, but let's assume we mean something more than "acquantance" anyway. At the lowest, perhaps, people whom you invite round to your house, or onto your boat (tricky, that one, on quite different grounds) socially?

At this very moment the Downs Syndrome Bangladeshi - Filipino child of one of my wife's friends is playing with my two children. I have several Chinese friends, of both sexes, two of whom proved, when I suddenly found myself out of work, to be true friends indeed. I have two Japanese women friends and two black male friends, a very good friend who is a Sikh and I even have a friend who is Irish!

bamamick
04-21-2007, 07:20 AM
What does that mean? I have a lot more in common with the folks where I live than I do with people from Maine or the UK or anywhere other than here, regardless of what color their skin is. And so do you, Jack. A guy with a brown skin who grew up in Maine is going to have a lot different backround than one who grew up in Alabama, I would think.

What does the Methodist church tell us to do? Celebrate our differences? My father and mother taught me to take every person one at a time and that's what I have always tried to do. I have friends and coworkers that have a different skin color than mine, but it's no big deal, is it? We are all just people trying to make the best of a tough situation. Doesn't matter about skin color. Any person who will look me in the eye and shake my hand can be my friend. It's the way that I was taught and the way that I tried to teach my kids. Anything else would make me a hypocrite.

Mickey Lake

ishmael
04-21-2007, 07:22 AM
Look, if some of you have genuinely moved beyond negative reaction to people different, I'm glad. As I said, living amidst homosexuals made me accepting of their difference.

I'm not saying you haven't made these leaps, or are lying to yourselves. How could I know that? I do think an awful lot of the talk is just that, and if confronted with someone different it's a native reaction to recoil. Not right, not what we should choose, maybe we can learn better, but just native reflex.

Why does looking at it get people so bothered?

S.V. Airlie
04-21-2007, 07:23 AM
ACB.. I kinda defined my interpretation of friends.

ishmael
04-21-2007, 07:31 AM
BTW, Andrew, a book I've mentioned before about Down's syndrome you would like to read, I think. "Expecting Adam." A very fine American writer, Martha Beck. It's probably, from what I've read since, her magnum opus.

Andrew Craig-Bennett
04-21-2007, 07:34 AM
ACB.. I kinda defined my interpretation of friends.

Yes, and it's a good one.

bamamick
04-21-2007, 07:40 AM
of racial diversity. My next door neighbors in Spanish Fort are Chinese. My neighbor across the street and one down is a retired minister who is black. The little dirt road that leads to my cabin at Fish River goes by the homes of several families of immigrants from Mexico. I work with a guy who was born and raised in India and another who was born in Pakistan. Half of my bosses are German. We've got an operator from the UK and another from Germany. And of course, the county where I am right now is 40% black. I 'look at it' every day, or rather, I don't look at it. It's life, mate. It's what it is.

You may doubt the sincerity of some of us who claim that color is not a big issue. I understand why you may think so. I have always thought that a lot of the folks who post here about racism didn't really understand it very well because where they lived there was basically just one race of people, but that is not fair and would be stereotyping. Those of us who live with other races, work with other races, go to church with other races, whatever. We just deal with our differences. It just is what it is. I don't make a big deal out of it because it is not a big deal.

Mickey Lake

Andrew Craig-Bennett
04-21-2007, 07:48 AM
Jack,

When you wrote:

A person of another race, be they Chinese or Black, ups my back

did you remember that some of the people reading this are Chinese and some are Black?

That's why I would like you to delete this thread - that comment is unacceptable.

S.V. Airlie
04-21-2007, 07:49 AM
Damn.. I'm gonna have to institute my ignore button Andrew.. Really?
If only I had known...:eek:

Andrew Craig-Bennett
04-21-2007, 07:54 AM
Damn.. I'm gonna have to institute my ignore button Andrew.. Really?
If only I had known...:eek:

??? Sorry, that one did make it over the Atlantic.:confused:

Edited to add: Sorry; I eventually got it.

I seem to be suffering sense of humor failure today - on this subject, anyway.

S.V. Airlie
04-21-2007, 07:58 AM
What I was saying Andrew.. It makes no difference to me.. here on the forum, ( or anywhere for that matter ) where formites come from, what color we are, what nationality any of us are.
I>E...I'm just glad we are here...as all of us contribute.
The above was written tongue in check.. big time.

George Jung
04-21-2007, 08:01 AM
We don't have much diversity in my rural area, but I have friends who are African American, Korean, Chinese, and several Native Americans. I grew up with parents with issues of racism, but recognized the injustice and fought against it. I do recognize that, and as such that can have an 'undertow' effect. Works in progress. Sometimes I think I over compensate, for just that reason. But thats a good thing.

ishmael
04-21-2007, 08:05 AM
Andrew,

I didn't say this upping of my back was a good thing, I said it was there. As someone who's moved beyond it, help me move beyond it.

I really do just take folks for their actions, not their peculiarities. I'm one of the least prejudiced people you could meet. Yet I know it's there.

I also know there remains extreme hatred, based both on the color of skin and other peculiarities such as religion. I'm trying to have an open discussion of it.

bamamick
04-21-2007, 08:07 AM
that probably the most joy that I have taken from having access to the internet has been the chance to 'meet and make friends' with people from Australia, New Zealand, Germany, the UK, Pakistan, Norway, Canada, Brazil, etc., and many of these friends I met right here on the WoodenBoat forum. What a treat to get to discuss and compare notes with people about the different boats and issues they have with boats and boating in their countries.

Some of you may know that I race boats in several international classes. Through this I have friends in Canada, the UK, Holland, and in Australia that I talk with at least once a week. This thing (the net) is a wonderful resource and a wonderful way to break down barriers. Through the internet many of us are finally becoming citizens of the world rather than being confined to our small corner of it. I'd like to see more threads on this sort of thing. And one more thing, what 'color' are you on the internet? Of what 'race' are you? Is this person who makes these posts, is this the 'real' you? Or is some sort of skin color or an accent the real you? On the internet you can and usually are judged for what's on the inside. I hope that one day that's all that people will be judged for.

Mickey Lake

Hwyl
04-21-2007, 08:10 AM
Let's dissect this one


Look, if some of you have genuinely moved beyond negative reaction to people different, I'm glad. As I said, living amidst homosexuals made me accepting of their difference.

Your phase "moved beyond" implies that we were there in the first place, not true in my case, somewhat because of the teaching of my parents, somewhat of my own volition. I like you Jack but am insulted by your implication that I was once a racist or a homophobe.




I'm not saying you haven't made these leaps, or are lying to yourselves. How could I know that? I do think an awful lot of the talk is just that, and if confronted with someone different it's a native reaction to recoil. Not right, not what we should choose, maybe we can learn better, but just native reflex.

Once again your phrase "made these leaps" implies that your reader has undergone some dramatic change, see my earlier paragraph.




Why does looking at it get people so bothered?

Speaking personally, calling me a racist or a homophobe, which, as I explained, you have just done, gets me more than bothered

Implying that my children are somehow less worthy than your implied master race, annoys the hell out of me, and merits an abject apology fom you.

Andrew Craig-Bennett
04-21-2007, 08:12 AM
Yup.:mad:

George.
04-21-2007, 08:19 AM
How many people of a different race have you considered friends?

Believe it or not, I cannot tell. One of the good things about Brazil.

I have had friends who would be considered black by most people, including themselves. I have had friends who are clearly Japanese, Chinese, or Indian. But there are so many with whom one just can't tell, and it doesn't matter...

Just like in Brazil you might have friends who are Jewish, or Muslim, or whatever, for years, and never know it.

ishmael
04-21-2007, 08:27 AM
Geez, Gareth, I never said you or anyone else was racist or anti whatever. I said my tendency toward xenephobia seemed native, let's talk about it. If you took it as a personal accusation, I'm sorry. That's not how it was intended. It's fine with me that you have a different way of looking at it. I like the different way. I'm just trying to understand how it sits.

Touched a nerve. Let's talk about it rather than getting all self righteous. Find a place on this thread where I said I didn't like people who were different.

P.I. Stazzer-Newt
04-21-2007, 08:29 AM
.... And one more thing, what 'color' are you on the internet? ....
Mickey Lake

What he said.

I had the pleasure of working for six years with a team of people who were spread right around the world - Every continent except antarctica - and I never knew what colour any one of them was - took five years before I realised that I had no idea - and started to enjoy that fact.

This is essentially a Colour-blind medium, and I think that is a great thing.

Hwyl
04-21-2007, 08:32 AM
I struggled over that long post. It conveyed my feelings and I think, it laid out well your connections between your thoughts and your way of saying something like "admit we're all suppressed (insert fault here)". I'm not admitting it. I think I proved in my long post the ties between your statements.

I'm off to enjoy the day. The Carps are about to be seized

ishmael
04-21-2007, 08:51 AM
Gareth, Godspeed. If you don't have these foibles, more power to you.

George. There is no racial divide in Brazil? From what I've read of your country I find that just about impossible to believe. I can believe you don't hold them, perhaps. But it's huge, from what I've read.

Look gents, we ain't gonna get beyond being ostriches.

Tylerdurden
04-21-2007, 09:17 AM
Ish, you really need to walk on the wild side. You have built yourself a nice and tidy little box that you live in, except your a mess.
Pondering those questions that you have on the net won't do you a bit of good. You need to put yourself at risk of falling down.
The getting back up is the hard part we are all afraid of, but that is life and it can be a good time if you let it.
Life is pain so go with it. We are all cast from the same dung heap.
The trick is throwing it off and getting a long shower.
I love long showers, especially with my redheaded Irish girl.
Highly recommended!

geeman
04-21-2007, 09:30 AM
OK, where is your redheaded Irish girl located?

bamamick
04-21-2007, 09:35 AM
that the redheaded Irish girl in the shower has completely undone any serious contemplation that I was giving the thread. The power of suggestion. I guess that it's a good thing for my wife that I am at work or she'd be getting a shower about now :).

Mickey Lake

ishmael
04-21-2007, 09:47 AM
Well, I guess I'm checking out of this discussion. I know what's up with me, and that's all I know. So it goes. A nod to our recently passed, not terribly good, pundit.

Cheers. Try to be good to one another.

Memphis Mike
04-21-2007, 09:50 AM
Gentleman, I think you have to consider the source, here.

brad9798
04-21-2007, 10:03 AM
I admire Jack for at least admitting his honest feelings ... probably feelings that over half the world population feels (right, wrong, ugly, or bad) ... he at least opened up.

ACB, I too took a bit of offense at the Chinese/Black statement ... don't forget my thread about my family procreating with their slaves a few generations ago.

I detest plenty more white folks for their lifestyles than I ever will blacks, Asians, Latinos, etc. Simply because I know many more crackers.

What I do not like is fanaticism, self-pity, self-disrespect, disrespect of others and property, coupled with arrogance and entitlement ...

That being said, that translates more to the black community in this country. I am not endorsing that ... and I wish it would change somehow, some way.

Hell I haven't seen my aunt (and whatever husband she is on ... 4 or 5) either of my ONLY two cousins in years and years ... WHY? The are no-good, freeloading, caniving, theiving, drugging, hillbillies.

I thought my oldest cousin was coming out of it ...

But THEN- he lost his job as a prison guard because he had lost all his teeth by the ripe old age of 26!

You might be a redneck if you lose your job at the prison because you lost your teeth. You REALLY are a redneck when you sleep with your wife's BEST friend WHILE you have no teeth ... I'd be scared to meet that be-otch.

If they were black, Latino, Chinese or anything else, I would despise JUST as much ... but many would consider me racist then.

ishmael
04-21-2007, 10:04 AM
Yeah, that's it, I'm just a bad boy. There's no honesty people need to look at, just go back to sleep. It's worked forever, so why not now?

botebum
04-21-2007, 10:38 AM
Tonya is part Cherokee Indian(Native American...whatever:rolleyes: ) and I try not to let it bother me. It's just when she puts on that silly headband with the feather and does a rain dance or sits cross legged in the front yard and grinds corn on a rock that I get a little bothered. Is it racism or just cultural differences that bother me? Hell, I don't know.

Doug

geeman
04-21-2007, 10:56 AM
Well might I suggest you ask her to JUST wear the silly headband and the feather,,, and see if it isnt easier to handle,,,,,,,,,,,,

botebum
04-21-2007, 11:01 AM
There are times, geeman when you have the most absolutely brilliant ideas! Why the hell didn't I think of that?
"Oh Tonya! Honey. We could stand a bit of rain, the tomatoes are drooping."

Doug

geeman
04-21-2007, 11:03 AM
I'm just a simple ole guy, with simple wants,,,,,,,
And tend to be extremely horny, tho at my age I dont really remember ,,, why,,

Tylerdurden
04-21-2007, 11:18 AM
OK, where is your redheaded Irish girl located?

I left out that you have to get your own. LOL

geeman
04-21-2007, 11:19 AM
damn,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, lol

geeman
04-21-2007, 11:20 AM
I think I need some of Jacks "firewater',,,,,,,,,

brad9798
04-24-2007, 08:15 PM
so folks have danced away from this poignant topic? THAT says a lot ... ;)

seanz
04-24-2007, 09:09 PM
A person of another race, be they Chinese or Black, ups my back.

It will probably be here until ishmael deletes it.
I haven't 'danced away',I'm still waiting for an answer as to what degree people of another race anger the poster.Mild annoyance? Psychotic Rage?
What's his stance on people of a different race who aren't Chinese or Black.
If a black person delivers chinese take-out to him,would his head explode?

ishmael
04-24-2007, 10:06 PM
Just logging on and telling stories. I don't hate anyone, or desire them ill. If encountering someone different doesn't "up your back" good on you. It's not a huge deal with me. Just something I notice. A native fear. It's not good, but not admitting it is worse.

It can be anyone who's different, for whatever reason.

seanz
04-24-2007, 10:54 PM
Perhaps not admitting it (your xenophobia) to yourself is a bad thing but if you were admitting it in public (and well,you just did) you might choose your words a bit more carefully.Perhaps you could delete this thread and start again?

Rational Root
04-25-2007, 01:53 AM
Found the best people and the worst people in the world come in all colours. I found people ready to befriend you and people ready to rip you off in every country.

I also found that Racism is not limited to Caucasions.

In my experience Saudi Arabia was a hugely racist county.

There are some cultures that I am not wonderfully happy with. Mostly because they are intolerant and would happily stone me to death. Does that count as racism ?

hokiefan
04-25-2007, 10:46 AM
I grew up in a racist little rural town, roughly 50/50 caucasion and african-american. My parents were racist, but knew it was wrong, so they tried to teach us to see people for what they were underneath. As the result, my childhood friends were basically caucasion. In high school, I basically associated with the good students. Several were african-american, and I considered them friends. Until I went to college I had not to my knowledge met anyone who wasn't caucasion or african-american.

When I went to college, I began meeting a much more diverse group of people. The only thing that was really an issue was the other persons ability to speak English, as my two years of Spanish in High School didn't get me far. Once I learned to understand a person, I could make friends with them if there was enough in common for us to relate. I currently work in a chemical plant with a diverse group of operators. They represent the general demographics of the area primarily caucasion and african-american. While I don't have any close friends in the group, I would consider most to be friends.

On the subject of friends, I have had 4-5 close friends in my life to this point. These are the people I can confide in, and most of them are old childhood friends. I haven't tended to make this kind of friendship as an adult. There are many people along the way though that I have met and consider to be friends as opposed to acquaintances. These are for the most part, whoever comes along that I spend any amount of time with, be it at work, in the neighborhood, at the kids soccer practice, etc. So, as the people in my life have become more diverse, so have my friends.

My kids best friend in the neighborhood is african-american, being raised by his caucasion grandparents. His best friend at school is Indian.

When I was in High School it was a scandal that the caucasion Quarterback was dating the african-american cheerleader. Now, this doesn't raise an eyebrowe. Looking back, I'm always amazed he was comfortable enough with himself to go out with her back in 1978, I guess the fact she was hot helped. :D

I think with each generation things get a little better.

Bobby

Popeye
04-25-2007, 11:06 AM
i have found that racism is largely ,
silent

brad9798
04-25-2007, 11:56 AM
We are all equal, as long as I approve of them! :D

Popeye
04-25-2007, 12:16 PM
when we have ruled out reason , law , science , morals , sound ethics , the logical argument , the technical , all other intelligent basis for one to make decisions

all we have left is the arbitrary , all we have left is racism