Skiff vs Whitehall for rowing

[Brian Kelly]

Several posts on this forum are searching for plans for a whitehall type boat that can still sail well. I also read that sharpies such as the 14 foot sharpie in Reuel Parker's book "rows easily" and sails fast. The dimensions for this sharpie are 14'1" LOA and 4'3" beam. That strikes me as about ideal dimensions for rowing. Just a bit short.

But what does "rows easily" mean? Can anyone describe how much such a sharpie gives up under oars compared to a 14 foot pulling boat with the more classic wineglass transom?

Brian

[htom]

I suspect that the sharpie will have a larger waterline beam, which might be the determiner.

[Thorne]

Well, few designers are gonna say, "My boat rows like a piece of dog-doo."

As usual for these comparisons you need to be a lot more specific. Since I don't have his book and can't find the sharpie in question, there is nothing specific to consider. And there are also many Whitehall variations, some purely pulling boats, others more of a combo for row/sail.

Here is what I can find in Parker's site that might compare -
http://www.parker-marine.com/eastpage.htm

From what I understand of boat design, pulling boats have transoms that are not in the water -- i.e. the waterline passes under the transom so the boat could be double-ended or flat-transomed with no difference in wetted hull surface.

http://www.luckhardt.com/ls-sail1.jpg

Here is my Chamberlain dory skiff sailing on her lines with practically no transom in the water -- and performance pulling boats or true dories have narrower or wineglass transoms to keep it all out of the water.

Sailboats often have much wider sections aft, which allows carring more sail without the boat squatting into the water aft. This often results in transom areas in the water, similar to small low-powered skiffs designed for outboards.

If you want specifics, give us specific designs to compare. Otherwise we are at the "Are blondes or brunettes nicer?" stage of comparisons..

;0 )

[Brian Kelly]

Thorne, the link you found gets the general idea. The 14' design is absolutely flat at the stern. The difference as I see it is that the whitehall keeps something like a canoe shape in the water, where the sharpie brings the transom clear of the water, but with more of a flat plane. So I guess the whitehall would part the water, while the sharpie rides on the wave shape.

Your point is well taken about designers not casting aspersions on their own designs. And I don't really know how to figure this out theoretically. so I was thinking maybe someone had experience trying to row such a flat bottomed boat with only a 4'4" beam.

Brian

[JimD]

So I guess the whitehall would part the water, while the sharpie rides on the wave shape.

How the water flows at the stern and backfills the hole in the water left by the boat as it moves forward is at least as important a hydrodynamic consideration as how the bow parts water. Deadwater behind the stern is a cause of drag and I'd imagine a wide flat bottom at the stern would contribute to deadwater even with the transom properly out of the water. It would be much more of a problem rowing than sailing since sailing the boat would be heeled and would not present a flat horizontal surface exiting the water. Or something like that.

[Thorne]

Yabut -

if you look at the drawing of Parker's Eastern Shore 16', even though the wide flat bottom extends to the transom, the rocker pulls the final part out of the water, so it isn't all dragging in the drink...

You'd certainly have more flat bottom in the water than in a dory with similar rocker, but the Parker boat would sail and power much better.

http://www.parker-marine.com/east16.jpg

By the way, I really don't like the dramatically raked foremast -- looks like the boat was in a collision and looking for another -=- what fun to pull that puppy up to a crowded dock! Seems like everyone else uses bowsprits to get the CE that far forward.

;0 )

[Brian Kelly]

Reuel's 14' Oystering skiff has a vertical mast with a sprit boom. The referenced one has the basic sharpie hull with a slight V at the stern and is called a "stick up" rig. An unusual rig that was supposedly able to go well to weather. I can only guess that if it works at all, it is because it smooths the airflow over the lee side of the main, resulting in greater efficiency of the main.

Brian