It's May Day

[Kermit]

May we all have a happy one. 'Tis a good day for remembering.

[ishmael]

It's become tainted by the coopting of it by Stalinists, but it's good to remember this as a day of the original labor movement, an American movement, born of the Chicago Haymarket riots. The riots surrounding that time and place, the bombs, the ugly confrontations, are worth remembrance. I don't have much sympathy for union workers making six figures and fat pensions while not working that hard, just as I don't for CEOs making a hundred times that, for not much more work. What was righteous once on the left has become bloated and power hungry, no less than the bosses they decried. And the bosses have become obscene the measure of any robber barron.

It's part of why America is becoming a joke in world competitiveness.

Where's TR when you need him?

[George.]

"the coopting of it by Stalinists"

Give me a break. Jack. The whole world celebrates it - except for you reactionay Yankees, the only so-called democracy that actually bans a political party.

[ishmael]

You're saying Stalin and the Soviets didn't make every attempt to coopt it? Re-read your history, George.

What political party did we ban? We had that red scare, but the communists weren't banned, and we got over that. Let them speak. "By their fruits ye shall know them."

[Meerkat]

"the coopting of it by Stalinists"

Give me a break. Jack. The whole world celebrates it - except for you reactionay Yankees, the only so-called democracy that actually bans a political party.
The Communist Party is not banned in the US. It is, or at least was, watched very closely! ;)

[Meerkat]

"By their fruits ye shall know them."
Awww, give Ishie a break. Nobody wants to see his fruits and so know him! ;) :D :D :D

[George.]

Did you know that to this day, in order to get a visa - any visa, tourist, business, whatever - to enter the US, you have to answer "no" to "are you or have you ever been a member of the Communist Party?"

[skuthorp]

It was a holiday for pagan religious reasons first, an opportunity for parades and causes later. Spring renewal festivals, hiring fairs, coupling festivals bacchinalia. Eight hour day in Aus.

To quote Ishmael
"What was righteous once on the left has become bloated and power hungry, no less than the bosses they decried"
This is too true, but it's the path that all successful causes take till another 'revolution' renews the cause. True for right or left.

[huisjen]

Happy Beltane everyone.


Origins of Beltane

In Irish mythology, the beginning of the year for the Tuatha Dé Danann and the Milesians started at Bealtaine, great bonfires would herald in the Summer in the hope of good harvest, prosperity and well being to all. Early Gaelic sources from around the 10th century state that the Druids would create a need-fire on top of a hill on this day and rush the village's cattle through the fires to purify them and bring luck ("Eadar dà theine Bhealltainn" in Scottish Gaelic, "Between two fires of Beltane"). People would also go between the fires to purify themselves. This was echoed throughout history after Christianization, with lay people instead of Druid priests creating the need-fire. The festival persisted widely up until the 1950s, and in some places the celebration of Beltane continues today. A revived Beltane Fire Festival has been held every year since 1988 during the night of 30 April on Calton Hill in Edinburgh, Scotland and attended by up to 15,000 people (except in 2003 when local council restrictions forced the organisers to hold a private event elsewhere).

Beltane is a specifically Gaelic holiday, as other Celtic cultures, such as the Welsh, Bretons, and Cornish, do not celebrate it - though they celebrated or celebrate festivals similar to Bealtaine at the same time of the year.

Dwelly (1911) says:

"In many parts of the Highlands, the young folks of the district would meet on the moors on 1st May. They cut a table in the green sod, of a round figure, by cutting a trench in the ground of sufficient circumferences to hold the whole company. They then kindled a fire, dressed a repast of eggs and milk of the constituency of custard. They kneaded a cake of oatmeal, which was toasted at the embers against a stone. After the custard was eaten, they divided the cake into as many portions as there were people in the company, as much alike as possible in size and shape. They daubed one of the pieces with charcoal, til it was black all over, and they were then all put into a bonnet together, and each one blindfolded took out a portion. The bonnet holder was entitled to the last bit, and whoever drew the black bit was the person who was compelled to leap three times over the flames. Some people say this was originally to appease a god, whose favour they tried to implore by making the year productive." (Dwelly, 1911, "Bealltuinn")

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beltane

It's been dry but just started raining. I wonder if I can get a burn permit.

Dan

[ishmael]

I didn't know that George, and I think it's an absurd artifact of a day not that long ago. So? All beauracracies have artifacts.

On the other hand, it might be nice to know how red you are before you walk our soil. LOL.

More seriously, such ideology doesn't die easily. Evil though Stalinism was, many a college humanities prof still hasn't caught on. So yeah man, are you red?

[huisjen]

I see that Jack is posting a bit to this thread, but I don't know what he's saying. He's still on my ignore list. As has been said, I have no desire to see his fruits. :D

Dan

[ishmael]

For a pagan, Dan is peculiarly provincial. I've done or said nothing untoward to him, in fact invited him to a fishfry after Katey left to assuage his wounds, yet he revels in excluding even listening to me, to the point of passing his revel to the rest of you.

It's peculiar fear; maybe passed among web fear mongers.

I don't blame him for it; it's just ignorant.

Some things can't be fixed. Others take time. But it's a poor pagan who can't even listen to other viewpoints and lives. "They are Evil, can never be heard, are stopped from my ears."

I ran into this the first time when at my first sweat lodge. As the talk went around I spoke of how this symbolic death and rebirth were so similar to the symbolic death and rebirth of Jesus. Oops, another rejection by the pagans. Mention Jesus, even in symbolic terms, and you get the boot from that circle.

Peculiar. Anti-intellectual in the extreme.

I haven't done a sweat in fifteen years. The last time on the trading route of the Ojibway on the inland waterway in Michigan. No one could throw me out there because I owned the place.

But, back to the topic. May Day, originally, is the pagan European dance of the spring. Morris dancers, their white gandy struttings, May poles, bells and booze and celebration, the winter is past.

Cheers.

[Rick Clark]

Correct me if I'm wrong but today is Labour day in China.

[Meerkat]

Did you know that to this day, in order to get a visa - any visa, tourist, business, whatever - to enter the US, you have to answer "no" to "are you or have you ever been a member of the Communist Party?"I doubt you'd get very far by answering "yes" to a similar question about Al Queda! ;) :D

[Meerkat]

For a pagan, Dan is peculiarly provincial. I've done or said nothing untoward to him, in fact invited him to a fishfry after Katey left to assuage his wounds, yet he revels in excluding even listening to me, to the point of passing his revel to the rest of you.

I may join you Dan. I'm getting tired of seeing so many words, badly used, to say absolutely nothing of substance. :rolleyes:

[ishmael]

You fit in the right mould, David.

I've done nothing but wish you well, for months. Yet I make you uncomfortable; you have done nothing but decry and denigrate what I've said.

Keep ignoring what makes you uncomfortable. That's the way of enlightenment: Zen, Paganism, Depth Psychology. Yeah man, put me on your ignore list. Oh, we could get into arguments, but I've always wished you the best.

[huisjen]

Assuage my wounds?! Hah! I'm less wounded than he is, and have no desire to wallow in self pitty and mindless blathering the way he does.

Also, I'm not a pagan. I'm basically an athiest who thinks bonfires with people dancing naked around them sounds like an interesting evening.

Dan

[crawdaddyjim50]

Did you know that to this day, in order to get a visa - any visa, tourist, business, whatever - to enter the US, you have to answer "no" to "are you or have you ever been a member of the Communist Party?"

http://www.senri-i.or.jp/amcon/evafframe.html Bull shyte George. I have not been able to find any application form with that question on it. This form asks if you have ever been a member of a nazi group or participated in genocide. But no questions about political affiliation.

[ishmael]

Well, let it be known, about this absurdity between Dan and I, that I looked for his number, to call him and talk this out. No soap, he's not in the book.

I'm in the book, if he wants to call. We're only thirty miles as the crow flys, and I have no idea what this animosity is about.

[Paul Pless]

I'm basically an athiest who thinks bonfires with people dancing naked around them sounds like an interesting evening.


I thought those people were called DeadHeads.

[Wild Wassa]

It was good to see the red flag flying yesterday ... Comrades
... pero esas banderas blancas y verdes rojas es el símbolo de la esperanza de los Estados Unidos.
Warren.

[Nicholas Carey]

For our friends not from the USofA...here's a list of some of the political parties in the US. Most of these have ballot status in at least one state. The remainder generally endorse candidates from other parties. More details on these parties (platform summaries, links to the different party's web pages, etc.) are at http://www.politics1.com/parties.htm

I've made an attempt to sort these parties into something resembling an organic grouping that might have a shot at representing the political landscape in the US.

Note that this list is by no means complete, especially at the local level.

Off In Their Own World
Carrie Nation and the Teetotalers
Prohibition Party
The South Shall Rise Again!
Southern Independence Party
Too Hard to Classify
American Socialist Party
Libertarian National Socialist Green Party
Multicapitalist Party
The Center, Such As It Is
Veterans Party of America
We The People Party
The Third Party
Libertarians/Free Market Capitalists
Libertarian Party
Constitutionalist Party
American Patriot Party
The Right
Radical/Christian Right
Independent American Party
America First Party
American Party
American Heritage Party
American Independent Party
Constitution Party
Constitutional Action Party
Family Values Party
Ross Perot's Reform Party and its children, now co-opted by the Right
American Reform Party
Independence Party
Reform Party
Ku-Kluxers, Nazis and other fascists
American Nazi Party
Knights Party
Christian Falangist Party of America
American Falangist Party
The Left
Somewhere Left of the [current] Democratic Party
The Revolution
U.S. Pacifist Party
New Party
Grassroots Party
Labor Party
Peace & Freedom Party
Deadheads, Stoners & Hippies
Pansexual Peace Party Pansexual Peace Party
Pot Party
U.S. Marijuana Party
Natural Law Party
Light Party
The Greens
The Greens/Green Party USA
Green Party of the United States (Green Party)
Socialists and/or Communists of one flavor or another
Progressive Labor Party
Communist Party USA
Freedom Socialist Party / Radical Women
New Union Party
Socialist Party USA
Socialist Action
Socialist Equality Party
Socialist Labor Party
Socialist Workers Party
Workers World Party
Democratic Socialists of America
Revolutionary Communist Party USA
Social Democrats USA
Workers Party, USA
World Socialist Party of the USA

[Meerkat]

Where do the socially liberal fiscally conservative pro-environmentalists fit in? ;)

[huisjen]

Well, within the Democratic party.

"Some people say that the Democratic Party doesn't stand for anything. Well I say that the Democratic Party does stand for anything!"
--Senator Obama

[Nicholas Carey]

Where do the socially liberal fiscally conservative pro-environmentalists fit in? ;)Right next to the Libertarian National Socialist Green Party. Nothing like politically correct, free-market Nazis, I always say :D

[George.]

"Libertarian National Socialist Green Party"

Obviously, the name was chosen by committee...

[Meerkat]

I think the free market Nazis are in control now and operating under such names as Exxon, WalMart, etc. :eek:

[Kermit]

Phwewie!