Getting started questions

[Mad-Eye Moses]

Hello, everyone!

This is my first posting on this forum, and I'm here because I just bought my first Wooden Boat magazine and, unfortunately, didn't find the information that I needed. Don't get me wrong, I loved the magazine and found it to be very informative, but the magazine assumed I had some basic knowledge that I lack.

I am looking for a single source of basic/getting started information on owning a wood boat. Some friends of mine and I own a 24' Islander Bahaman (fiberglass hull) sailboat, and now we are thinking of getting a 45' wood boat. What kind? I dunno yet... my buddy saw it two weeks ago and we're looking at it this weekend. What I need to know is things like: what are some things I should look for on a wood boat? What are common indicators of a lack of proper maintenance? I know rot is an obvious sign, but what are the places where rot is a show-stopper?

Of course, I plan on getting it inspected, and I'm not afraid of what an inspector would find, I just need to know some of the basics before I spend the time/money on an inspector.

Also, I need a resource that can show me what is involved with the maintenance of a wooden boat. How often does it need to be sanded and painted? How often should it be dragged out of the water for new bottom work? You know... all the beginner stuff!

Any resources y'all can offer me would be appreciated. Thanks!

Mad-Eye Moses

[Captain Pre-Capsize]

I dunno, a forty five foot wooden boat is a bit small. ;) YEOWWWWW! Forty five feet????!!! For your first boat??? And a used, wooden one????!! Man... I now realize just how little self confidence I have...

A little perspective: I built an eleven foot skiff and my feeble skills could barely manage. It took six months and mistakes were legion but hey, with wood you can always buy more. smile.gif

It occurs to me that your inquiry just might be from Candid Camera. Surely you're not serious...

[Thad]

I did a search (above right) search word "maintenance" both "whole message" and "title only" and came up lots of posts. One mentions the following link: http://www.uscg.mil/hq/g-m/nvic/7_95/n7-95.htm . You will want a good wooden boat surveyor. Looking at the boat, if it is clean that is a good sign. If you like the shape, layout, rig, and the general look, then you need the surveyor to inspect her for problems and value.

[Stargazer14]

Now Captain, he said he was going to buy a 45ft. boat, not build a 45ft. boat.
Granted, it is a big dream for a first timer, but do-able with the time, money, knowhow, and -
preparation - and thats just what he's looking for.
I wish i could rattle off some titles for you to read but have none - just search the web for hours for links, posts and articles, wade thru the archives of this forum, and keep plowing ahead while being realistic.
It worked for me and i love every minute i put into my ole wood boat.
...except for that one minute when i was working on the chine board and the huge boat next to mine decided to pump 20 gallons of bilge water on me, my tools, my toolbox, my wood...did i mention me?...

[Stargazer14]

...i hated that minute....

[Ron Williamson]

Wooden Boat Restoration,by Jim Trefethen(sp?)is a good start.
R

[Ex-Oceangoddess]

I wouldn't buy, nay take (for free) a 45' wooden boat unless it was in REEEEALLY good condition, as certified by a legion of experienced wooden boat surveyors.

The reason the previous owner has it for sale is because it NEEDS WORK!!!

Been there, done the work, got all the t-shirts, etc. etc. etc.

A person sells his/her boat because he/she has lost his/her emotional connection to said vessel. This emotional detachment usually happens a year or so BEFORE it is put on the market. This is IMHO so on the west coast - probably not to the same extent on the east coast where people actually understand wooden boats.

I'd bet that a large proportion of those vessels on moorings at Morro Bay are just waiting for a taker. Granted, moorage in that neck of the woods isn't the drain on your pocket that a slip at say, Ventura or Marina del Rey would be, but its still a liability. And the sailing there isn't the greatest - getting out of the harbour can be a challenge for a lot of the year and there isn't anywhere to go anyway.

If you hanker for a large boat, build it. You will know exactly what goes into the hull, where all the systems are, how old the frame and fastenings are, etc. etc.

On the west coast I have seen so many sad tales of someone buying an older wooden boat, and then finding that on top of $350 a month moorage they have a $40,000 bill to make the vessel seaworthy.

Not only wooden boats - plastic ones too.

PLEASE - approach this with much caution and emotional detachment. It could eat you alive....

[R.I.Singer30]

Welcome,you've come to the right place.Beware of the bilge though,once you enter you may never have time to work on the boat. ;)

Don't let em scare you off.Solid frames are important.Age.Motor and tranny.collectability,etc.For something that large certainly get a recomended/competant inspector.Chose a topic in the forum and do a search,you'll find all types of info,good,bad,agreeable,disagreeable or downright funny.Enjoy smile.gif

[Mad-Eye Moses]

Wow. Ha ha... Thanks guys (and gals) for the response...

In typical male fashion, I posted this question yesterday and THEN took the burden of finding out on myself. I did a search on this subject and came up with some very informative discussions. Enough to, dare I say it, maybe scare me off of the 45 foot idea.

I am beginning to like the idea of building a smaller boat and taking it from there. My biggest problem with my buddies and I buying this particular boat is the fact that they would live 6 hours away from it and only see it one weekend per month. That would mean one of two things would happen: I (who actually live near the thing) would be working on it all by myself and neglecting my wife and child, and/or the boat would sink.

I appreciate everyone's comments. I think I may be a year or three away from being able to afford the true cost of loving a wooden boat of this size the way it deserves...

In response to the anti-Morro bay sentiments expressed here, I would like to say that any sailor worth his salt can sail out of the harbor on any given day. You just need one of two things working for you... The tide or a motor! ha ha!

As for places to sail to... well... there's the ocean, isn't there? Who says you have to go anywhere in particular? Isn't the point to simply be fooling around on a boat with friend, enjoying the wind and sea?

[Dave Fleming]

In response to the anti-Morro bay sentiments expressed here, I would like to say that any sailor worth his salt can sail out of the harbor on any given day. You just need one of two things working for you... The tide or a motor! ha ha!
Hmmm, look for the thread on the capsize in Oregon not too long ago.

[Bob Smalser]

".....probably not to the same extent on the east coast where people actually understand wooden boats."

Really?

[Popeye]

and now we are thinking of getting a 45' wood boat.

say, do you like poker? i dont play very much either, howse about a friendly game?

[TimH]

That was an interesting statement. But not only am I not offended easily, I am not originally from here So I will let you other guys handle that one :D

[Stargazer14]

Welcome to the forum, Mad-eye ;) ....

[Scott Rosen]

Originally posted by Mad-Eye Moses:
I am beginning to like the idea of building a smaller boat and taking it from there.You have acquired much wisdom very quickly.

If you spend a few days perusing the WB Forum's posts, you'll unearth a lot of discussions about newbie wooden boat ownership.

You could start here. http://media5.hypernet.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=005967

But be forewarned. The world of wooden boats is not a kind, gentle place. It's a rough and tumble arena, where only those with thick skin and twisted, obsessed minds, can survive.

[ 09-25-2003, 09:46 AM: Message edited by: Scott Rosen ]

[Popeye]

We are now *no longer* the Knights Who Say Ni!

We are now the Knights who say

"Ekky-ekky-ekky-ekky-z'Bang,
zoom-Boing, z'nourrrwringmm".

[ 09-25-2003, 09:55 AM: Message edited by: popeye ]

[ken mcclure]

Welcome!

The issue revolves somewhat around your budget - both in dollars and in patience.

You can spend a little for a boat that needs a lot of work, or spend a lot for a boat that needs a little work.

Or you can spend a moderate amount on a boat you build yourself if you're of that mind.

The first and most important expenditure should be a competent WOODEN BOAT surveyor. Make sure that he or she knows wooden boats and that they have a list of references whom you, of course will call.

Be ready to spend the money for several surveys until you find the right boat - or learn first how to look for the bad problems yourself. Trefethen's book is an excellent reference to give you a base from which to start.

By the way - the above comments are from 10 years of reading and several conversing here on the Forum. I've paid for two surveys so far, and consider the money well spent.

Good luck in your search. Don't get discouraged - patience pays off. Somewhere out there is a boat that is at the right price and condition for you.

[ion barnes]

Be patient grasshop...Mad-Eye. It takes time to absorb all knowledge. Surveyor to choice of boat first, hear what he has to say. Decide, yes/no?

Hey Scot, you forgot 'deep pockets' Actually saw a boat by that name and the dinhy was called "Loose Change"

[Hughman]

Mad-Eye
Good advice here.

Before you go to the boatyards, harbors, boat ads, or anywhere you might be tempted by a wooden boat, go shopping for a wooden boat surveyer. A WOODEN BOAT surveyer. This way lies wisdom.

[redsail]

Hello Mad -Eye.
Your mussings about buying a 45' foot boat made me recall the several months of constructive discussion and tons of soul searching that recently went on in this forum when one of our members posed the question of how to value a Concordia Yawl. I suggest that discussion as required reading for anyone looking to buy any boat.
Next; don't buy more boat than you need! My 32' ketch annually needs only one gallon of bottom paint, 45' probably 2.5 - 3. More hull to paint , bigger surfaces to varnish, more oil come oil change time, bigger fuel bill, higher insurance and moorage costs. etc, etc.The costs go up exponentially with the size.
Now, about your buddies; are any of them boat guys or do they just want to drive out for 3 weekends a year to drink and burn fuel? Sorry, one engine is running a bit rough and the fridge compressor packed up. That will be a grand to have the service guy do it unless you change it out because those guys are 6 hours away and have to work Monday.To keep any boat turnkey takes constant tinkering, where you are the guy poking in all the cupboards and under the floorboards all the time. then you are there to notice right away if something is amiss. Those guys won't be much help.
If you have found a worthy boat that you can love, if you enjoy a project (they all are) and have the wherewithall to take proper care of that boat untill the time comes for the next guy to take over, then go for it.
To go with your buds, rent a Bayliner.