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Wild Dingo
03-19-2003, 12:00 PM
In an email from Scot tonight it was requested that I please delete the several threads on the abandonment of the JOHN F. LEAVITT that I had written... hence their disappearance... the fact that I had copied them is apparently a breach of copyright or otherwise a "no no"... and as such I have agreed

I choose to write this short note so no questions be asked regarding why they disappeared.

Thanks fellas!

Rocky
03-19-2003, 12:09 PM
And you typed them all by hand! Bummer, Dingo. How bout posting a photo of the ship?

Bill Dodson
03-19-2003, 01:02 PM
I'm glad I read them all when you posted them. Thanks for the effort, I really enjoyed them.

Bill

Paul Scheuer
03-19-2003, 02:20 PM
Thanks for the effort, professor. Don't mistake the lack of traffic on these threads for lack of interest. I attended every class and was waiting for the final installment to see where the discussion would go.

I've been facinated with the Leavitt story from the first article on the launching. The craft and the similar types that inspired Ackerman's effort have held my interest since I was a kid, reading about the lake schooners.

One book, I may have even done a book report on it, gave the vital statics of all of the vessels including the date, location and cause of their demise. For all the romance, it was apparent that those were tough times. It should be clear that if one wishes to go back in time, one must take all that comes with it. Including an untimely sinking now and then.

Anyone know how to find the movie ?

Dave Hadfield
03-21-2003, 12:10 AM
Thanks for taking the trouble!

imported_Steven Bauer
03-22-2003, 06:47 PM
Shane, I talked to Alex Hadden yesterday at the MBBS. One of the other crew members was at the show and so was Ned Ackerman! Alex said the boat was dry and not in any immediate danger. He was working the manual pumps and was sucking air. And Ned wouldn't even let them try to start the engine that would have charged the batteries. And they never made a second try at heaving to. He thinks they bailed because Ned panicked and just wanted off that ship. Even with the boat wallowing sideways in the troughs of the waves she wasn't taking on water. He definitely thinks there was nothing wrong with the design of the ship - that the problem lay with an inexperienced captain.

Did you see the picture of the cute little Melonseed he built? He's really quite a craftsman.

Steven

[ 03-22-2003, 10:16 PM: Message edited by: Steven.Bauer ]

Wild Dingo
03-23-2003, 04:13 AM
Thanks fellas... Paul Ive got no doubts that people were reading them my fine attentive young student ;) ...the fact that so few responded doesnt bother me in the slightest they were there and people read them or copied them out for later which was the intention with doing so {other than filling Jack in!! ;) } ...while the writing of them helped me to solidify the story in my mind... truely a fascinating yarn.

re: the movie... wouldnt mind getting a gander at that some time or other! although being as its from Ned Ackermans personal perspective I should think it would be somewhat biased... but Ive been known to be wrong before and maybe the movie will be brilliant especially the storm parts!!

Its interesting that Alex veiws that there was nothing wrong with the design isnt it?... Considering that the original design as drawn by Pete Culler had been altered in some areas and not in coresponding areas by Ackerman as he built her... I find that interesting... Petes original design may well have been fine for the purposes he designed her but with the changes Ned made as he went along the design became less that what Culler intended... I think some of the negative comment aimed at Culler over the design of the LEAVITT should have probably rightfully have been aimed more at Ned perhaps

In the story they couldnt get at the bilge in the middle cargo hold due to the watertight bulkheads whilst they could in the forward and aft sections... yet they were drawing air from the pump in the bilge?... again interesting!

I also found it interesting to read in the articles that Ackerman called himself a "merchant adventurer" even before the LEAVITT had been completed... so perhaps his visions and belief was so all encompassing and he believed so wholeheartedly in his own dream he couldnt see the problems he was causing as he changed her shape and without experience headed out there into what was to be in his minds eye at least his glorious future... perhaps as Alex says in the end it became just to frieghtening out there with his lack of actual experience and knowledge that he wanted out? but didnt want to admit that subsequently.

The more I hear of this LEAVITT story the more intreguing it gets :cool:

Now okay having read all three articles none state that the LEAVITT actually sunk... abandoned yes in the north atlantic yes with storms coming and in a bit of bad shape sure... but still no one has yet shown that she in fact sank... so perhaps she be sailin still?...

Thar sails the JOHN F. LEAVITT a ghost ship somewhere out there on the deep blue... just wandering the seas a lady left to time and tide the vaguaries of weather and current... sounds kinda romantic eh? :cool:

imported_Steven Bauer
03-23-2003, 09:25 AM
Shane I just got this in an e-mail from another Forumite:

"I read your reply about the Leavitt. The boat is/was in service in the Baltic, having been recovered by a Soviet Trawler that found it awash and in good shape. This I heard on the waterfront in Lisbon in 1990, from a Russian trawler crew. I don't have specific details as to who/where etc, but I wouldn't be surprised if the Leavitt still sails."

Pretty interesting.

Steven

Paul Scheuer
03-23-2003, 01:02 PM
The Leavitt story sent me back to the bookshelf for this image of the lake schooner Lizzie Metzner, 81 ft, 77 tons, built in 1888, sunk in 1917. http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid56/p582d3ac98c8088622547c08c93c9a7f4/fc75f855.jpg

Ian McColgin
03-25-2003, 05:09 PM
Steve's remarks are most germaine to the Leavett's actual loss. The WoodenBoat article - I was ill and missed the thread but I suppose that's what got reprinted - is quite explicit that the reasons that author was concerned with Leaviett's seaworthiness had nothing to do with her actual loss. In fact, he notes, she might have come out of that storm with an exagerrated reputation and then gone on to a later more catastrophic loss due to the absence of ultimate stability.

This is an important but debatable issue not related to the events of Mr. Ackerman's choises.