Red Pine

[TAF]

Another wood question. What about Red pine for planking? Or even for backbone use? For small boat construction, like carvel planked craft 15-20 ft.

The reason I ask this is I recall reading somewhere that it can be used as a substitute for yellow pine. That's quite a statement, as yellow pine is one of the few woods that can be used to build the whole boat, backbone and planking all. I came across this today in "Trees of Michigan and the Upper Great Lakes"

"'Pinus resinosa' The wood of the red pine is reddish and stiff. It is slightly heavier, harder, and more resinous than white pine. It is classed with the so-called "hard pines" found in the southern states. In Michigan it is used chiefly in construction, millwork, piling, utility poles, barn poles, cabin logs, highway guardrail posts, mine timbers, chipboard, and pulpwood. The lumber is a competitor of southern yellow and western ponderosa pines. A cubic foot of seasoned wood weighs 34 lbs"

At the very least it sounds like a great wood for planks. I've got a couple of trees in my woodlot about 3 1/2 foot diameter, that could probably make enough planks for a lifetime of small boat projects.

Anyhow, has anyone worked with red pine, observed it's characteristics in other uses, or heard of it's use in boatbuilding. Any thoughts or comments would be appreciated.

Thanks, TAF

[reddog]

TAF;
Here on the East coast when you buy pine you would get white or red mixed unless you deal with a local mill and specify.I've seen it used,along with white pine for boatbuilding.The main use would be for planking.I wouldn't recommend it for backbone or deadwood as it's pretty soft.Also known as Norway pine here I believe.Quite resinous and you can still find it in decent widths and lengths if you know where to look.It can also be quite knotty.It's also showing up as pressure treated construction stock.I don't think our stuff has much in common with the hard pines.
Earl

[WWheeler]

White pine is usually preferred for planking, since it's less likely to have humungous knots, it cuts and works better under the saw, less inclined to split, and more rot resistant. Red pine is often the tree of choice for plantations, so it's much more available. I think Gardner mentions using it for dories etc.

[Ron Williamson]

The plantation crap from around here,rots in six months,lying on the ground.The white cedar logs,right beside them,look like they were put there last week.
R

[reddog]

Hi again;
Just for the record the pine down east here is not plantation grown.We cut some last fall around 70 or 80 years old.Again both white and red.I'm sure the plantation grown stuff would suffer for quality.The red pine is a bit more difficult to work but still good for planking.
All the best;Earl

[ishmael]

reddog,

This brings up an interesting point/question. I've heard that it's common that far down east to use even spruce for planking stock, and because of the cooler weather? it holds up fairly well. But take the boat to say Long Island Sound, and forget it. Is that true?

What does red pine look like sawn? Similar to white?

[NormMessinger]

What species are considered "red pine?"

--Norm

[reddog]

Ish;
Yes,in days past spruce was common for planking up this way.I believe it may still be used some in Newfoundland.It was used of necessity along with yellow birch and red oak.Most of the boats were built for work and used hard for the 10-20 years of their lifespan.White oak,cedar,mahogany,etc. were not available to rural builders and was expensive to ship,(well that much hasn't changed).Boats built of these woods,(local variety), seem to have a bad reputation when taken to warmer waters but,I believe,part of the problem is they were old,hard used hulls with poor maintenance at the end of their working life.Proper care and maintenance along with design goes a long way to preserving a hull.Probably one of the best boat woods locally would be black locust and you have to dig around to find that.
Norm;I believe the red pine is "pinus resinosa" and the white "pinus strobus"???
All the best;Earl
PS Ish,the red pine is darker when sawn with a red tinge,(no surprise there).The grain is a bit coarser than white pine with more definition between the early and late wood.Has a stronger pine smell too,probably due to the resin.

[ 10-26-2002, 05:06 PM: Message edited by: reddog ]