Stain and oil finish- how do they work togehter?

[TomMcKinney]

I am rapidly approaching the finishing stages of my skiff- I was thinking of using an oil finish for the interior-linseed/turp. But I was also thinking of staining it with a white stain to lighten the color. might have some checking, but shouldn't matter with this kind of finish. My question is, what is stain? and how does it work with a penetraitng oil finish? And would Tung oil or one of those exotic ddeck oils be btter than Linseed/turpentine? I know I have asked similar before and I appreciate the help refining this process.
Tom

[Wild Dingo]

From a personal perspective... damned if I know mate... I tend to use basic marveer on the furniture peice I build just clean it down flow the stuff on rub it in leave for a few hours then wipe off use some real good quality sandpaper or steel wool rub it back again then clean the dust off again pour on more marveer leave for a few hours into it again!! finally whenever you reckon its done enough get some bees wax and turps thin em together and whack that on leave it for a day or so then rub it back... hey it works for me!

But maybe others will have a better idea which I will watch and take note off as I dont go too much on varnish... Chemist should be able to give you a pretty indept rundown on the chemical make up of everything from dunny roll to high gloss epoxy!! :D

Let us all know how you get on!!

Shane

[lumberdude]

This sounds like a job for...."Super Chemist!!"

[On Vacation]

Check out the latest and greatest from MINWAX prducts. They sale a finish product with color and sealer together in many shades and colors. I have use it and liked it. Stir it up good before using it out of the can.

[thechemist]

Varnish is made from partly chemically reacted oils from various plants [search varnish and dryers to find more]. Think of stain as a little varnish, a lot of solvent and some pigments.

Oil-base enamel paint is similar to stain in that respect. Oil-base paint is different from stain in that paint hides, whereas stain does not.

The purpose of stain is to allow the wood to be seen, as through a glass, darkly. It adds some color tones to the wood, and can even out irregularly-colored wood.

Manufacturers of stain may use light-stable pigments, or cheap pigments and various dyes which bleach in sunlight or even interior lighting. Hardware-store stain is as good as marine-store-stain if it says it is for exterior use. That is a secret code meaning it is made with light-stable pigments, not light-fading dyes.

Filler-stain has various stuff added to plug up the porosity of the wood and mechanically level the surface. It can interfere with the adhesion of penetrating sealers which themselves are intended to glue down a clear topcoat, varnish or anything else.

The adhesion of one thing to another depends on having points of agreement between the two coatings. People can understand each other when they establish points of agreement. Lacking points of agreement, people fail to understand each other or any subject, and communication becomes less and there is little mutual liking of one-another and an association degenerates into acrimony and they go their separate ways. Coating systems behave the same way. For one thing to stick to another there must be mutually compatible chemical groups. Thus, the resin system of which a stain is constituted plays an important role in a successful coating system.

Actual chemical bonds between wood and/or a stain and a primer/topcoat give the best adhesion.

There are waterborne stains , usually recognizeable by the label statement that they are water-reducible, or that brushes may be cleaned up with water. These usually have acrylic resins for binder [glue] and do not develop good adhesion to the wider variety of solvent-borne clear topcoats or primers.

Water-reducible products applied directly to wood, be they primer or topcoat, in general do not develop as good long-term adhesion to wood as do solvent-borne products.

Mechanically stiff products should not be used between two more flexible coatings. Generally, a gradient of flexibility from a stiffer substrate to a more flexible topcoat produces the best long-term adhesion of a coating system.

I did not make all the stains or primers or topcoats and so I am not privy to their exact molecular formulas. Thus, I cannot tell you exactly what will chemically bond well to what else, or what will not. Aside from some general guidelines, user experience or manufacturer statements of a positive nature [e. g., X bonds Y to wood] are a good indication of what will stick to what.