View Full Version : Middle Eastern Monotheist Dust-up Coming

Osborne Russel
10-26-2005, 12:32 PM
TEHRAN (Reuters) - Iranian

President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said on Wednesday that Israel should be "wiped off the map," the official IRNA news agency reported.

Support for the Palestinian cause is a central pillar of the Islamic Republic which officially refuses to recognize Israel's right to exist.

"Israel must be wiped off the map," Ahmadinejad told a conference called "The World without Zionism," attended by some 3,000 conservative students who chanted "Death to Israel" and "Death to America." This seems very unwise on the part of the conservative students of Iran. The conservative students of America are their natural allies. Just go to the Air Force Academy and hang around the mess halls and locker rooms. There you will find people who, like Muslims, believe in a community of believers, unlike the ethnocentric Jews. Further, the community of believers in each case holds as its chief belief its special mandate from God, as revealed by His Prophet(s).

So if they'd just drop the "Death to America" bit they might get somewhere. Of course after wiping Israel off the map they'll have to annihilate the Christians, too, but they've always known that. Why not get the Christians to help them get rid of the Jews first? Especially now that America, due to her burning her bridges with the international community over Iraq -- which was formerly Iran's chief enemy, obligingly eliminated by America herself -- is incapable of forming or leading an international coalition against Iran's development of nuclear weapons. Shucks, America has done a lot for Iran, lately. Soon there will be another fundamentalist republic in, guess what, Iraq! And Shiite, too! Iraq didn't have nukes, the US invaded; Iran has nukes, the US dare not invade. Can't hardly get better than that. Unless you can manuver evangelical Christians into taking up some of the load, too. All you have to do is hold back on the "Death to America" a bit, for now.

Bob Cleek
10-26-2005, 01:36 PM
I smell a troll!

10-26-2005, 01:52 PM
Let's have it out there in a dusty place no one would give two farts about if they thought about it. Let's have a minor apocalypse, the Jews taking the temple mount, all that fighting and death. Really, it's time. I don't want the tension anymore.

Either that or let's give the Jews Florida and be done with it.

It all hangs by a thread. There are, incredibly, people who hanker after a millenial theatre. Not a few. Let them have it, but let's keep it controlled.

Osborne Russel
10-26-2005, 06:11 PM
Originally posted by Bob Cleek:
I smell a troll!How dare you speak that way of an elected president! Don't you support democracy in the Middle East?

10-26-2005, 06:21 PM
Good one Ish! Let's have an apocalypse but keep it controlled! Guess you didn't see that 60 Minutes segment a few years back, interviews with evangelicals who are actively promoting Argageddon because it's a fulfilment of prophecy. It sent chills down my spine to see the beautific looks on their faces as they talked about it. They actively support Israel because of course it's the main arena. They would be evil if they weren't so stupid, but you can bet we'll go down with them. Now, guess what the constituency is for the people in power now? And guess who the idea for nuking Iran came from?

And the US is a beacon for the world? More like a laughingstock, or it would be if it weren't so sinister.

Maybe God has a surprise in store for them. Maybe that's what the flu is for.

10-26-2005, 06:38 PM
"..Argageddon.." Is that in Ohio? tongue.gif

10-26-2005, 08:16 PM
That's spelled t-y-p-o, Professor.

10-26-2005, 08:44 PM
What a hot bed!

"Whatever remains unconscious is lived out as fate."

Carl Jung

Let's say ol' Carl was on to something. Wouldn't suprise me, he was a very smart German Swiss.

Now, what was he saying? The apocalypse is afoot is in each of us, or most of us in the Judeo-Christian-Muslim axis of ideation. Even if we don't buy the metaphysics, have strict anti-religious knee jerks, we hold the images of dire straights followed by some peace, brought on by some messenger of God. It dribbles into our minds from the time we're wee. It may well be in our DNA. Whoop, whoop, whoop! Now Jack's getting weird. :D

Let's say this is real, with the possible exception of the DNA. ;) What the hell do we do with it? Are we to live it out as fate? Or are we called to become conscious of it, and what does that mean? I'm, obviously, in the latter camp. We are called to suffer the apocalypse in ourselves. Each who does lends their little weight to the balance against blowing the world up.

It's such a beautiful world. Working to reconcile this tension in oneself, even though it hasn't remarkable results, and may go unnoticed, is where the apocalypse ought to be struggled. If we don't do it there, the Temple Mount is fair game.

Good luck, one and all.

[ 10-27-2005, 07:15 PM: Message edited by: ishmael ]

10-26-2005, 11:48 PM
I said serveral years ago on the forum, much to Sam F's dismay, that we ought to put up a big fence around the ME, reduce them to rocks and slings and leave 'em alone until they settle their differences...

Today, I'd add Pat Robertson and his ilk to the fray... ;)

Osborne Russel
10-27-2005, 05:57 PM
Originally posted by ishmael:
Judeo-Christian-Muslim axis of ideation. Every time I hear the term "axis of ideation", I reach for my pistol. <<-- Just kidding.

This brings up the old argument about whether people do weird things naturally or because they have weird beliefs. Defenders of the MEM-ness of western civilization will say, all the bad things were done in spite of it, that it isn't that deep in the culture -- on the one hand. Then when it comes time for the faith-based porkola they say my goodness, this is after all a Judeo-Christian culture.

I'm guessin that Muslim propaganda is similarly schizoid.

Osborne Russel
10-27-2005, 06:00 PM
Originally posted by Meerkat:
I said serveral years ago on the forum, much to Sam F's dismay, that we ought to put up a big fence around the ME, reduce them to rocks and slings and leave 'em alone until they settle their differences...

Today, I'd add Pat Robertson and his ilk to the fray... ;) Calling all MEMers!

Get on down with your bad selfs in the land where it all began! One, two, you know what to do!

They used to have slings and stuff, now they have nukes.

10-27-2005, 10:54 PM
"Whatever remains unconscious is lived out as fate."

It bears repeating. A complex idea in a very few words. Hopeful, without being overly sanguine.

The difficulty lies in reaching a critical mass of awareness. We aren't very good at that. The stakes may just be high enough this go round, though recent statements all around are stark and unsettling.

[ 10-28-2005, 06:20 AM: Message edited by: ishmael ]