Adirondack Guide-Boat - Glued-Lapstrake

[Farmer Diddley]

I hope to start building an Adirondack Guide-Boat in January. I plan on using glued-lapstrake construction (using the "Grant-lap" to get a "smooth skin"), as opposed to strip-building. I have yet to find any references on the internet where anyone has actually built a guide-boat using glued-lapstrake... lots of references to strip-building, but none for glued-lapstrake guide-boats.

Any thoughts on the feasibility of this method for building a guide-boat? Is anyone out there currently building a guide-boat using glued-lapstrake?

[Mark T]

Farmer, I too was thinking of the same project. Haven't started looking for any plans yet though. I would think that with the lines from a set of plans it could be converted easy enough. I've been building canoes using Tom Hills methods and feel this would work for the Guide boat too. If I find some plans I'll post back here.
Mark

[Thad]

I'm not a big fan of glued laps, but given the in and out close clinch nailing of the guideboats I would think there would be no problem building just as Grant and others built but gluing the laps. The problem would be to hold the lap tight while the glue sets, so you might end up with nearly the same fastening schedule as the original. I say, use the plan you like and go for it.

[Jon Etheredge]

I hope to start building an Adirondack Guide-Boat in January. I plan on using glued-lapstrake construction (using the "Grant-lap" to get a "smooth skin"), as opposed to strip-building.
Sounds like an interesting project. I have not done this myself or heard of anyone doing it.

When you say 'glued-lapstrake' do you plan to use plywood? It's certainly possible to do a flush lap ("Grant-lap") joint with plywood. After all, it is just a slash scarf on the edge of the ply. But I think that you will have troubles using ply to achieve a smooth skin on a guideboat because of the compound curves (curve in 2 planes) that will be required from the planking stock. It <u>might</u> be possible because you can 'torture' thin plywood into compound curves to a degree. I am doubtful, though, that you will be able to achieve safisfactory results with plywood because torturing is usually accompanied by at least some buckling. But I could easily be wrong. Maybe some experiments are in order?

[Jack Heinlen]

What Jon said; totally seat of the pants.I suspect the solid planking in the original boats underwent a fair amount of shaping in their molded dimension, both the faces and backs of the planking. Something ply, unless you can 'torture' it to do the same, can't do.

What an artful thing a traditionally planked Adirondack boat is. As far as fine, light work goes, it has to be an epitome.

[WayGray]

I have a batten-seam, glued plywood, 14 1/2 foot guideboat hanging in my garage. If you study the shape closely, you can achieve it without any real torturing. I used 4mm ply to follow the fairly severe curves, which makes for a light but delicate boat.

[Lazy Jack]

Kenneth and Helen Durant: The Adirondack Guideboat; ISBN 0-87742-125-0 is available through the Adirondack Museum, Blue Mountain Lake, NY 12812.

All you want to know about the history, use and construction of the traditional adirondack guide-boat are included in this book. Also included are a set of lines with offsets taken by John Gardner from a Grant-built guideboat. Planking the traditional guideboat was high art because in order for the 3 1/4 inch wide planking to lay against the frames it had to be 'backed out' in way of the midship frames and then radiused in the opposite direction as it approached the hollow towards the stems... all while maintaining a uniform 3/16 thickness. Only then could the laps be planed onto the edges. It was not possible to force the cup into a flat uniform plank without significant risk for splitting the plank or breaking the frame. Also the fastenings were very fine and would not have carried that much stress. I'm not sure how you could achieve a smooth skin hull using plywood over an original set of lines unless the plywood were very thin indeed. You might be able to get away with simple glued lapstrake which would also be unique, light and beautiful.

[Farmer Diddley]

Thanks to everyone for all of the responses thus far. As I had expected, the biggest obstacle is going to be torturing the plywood to bend in two planes, following the lines of a guide-boat, and still achieve the smooth skin. The general concensus seems to be that this will be difficult, if not impossible. But I'm a pretty stubborn person, so I'll probably at least experiment a little bit and see what I can achieve. I was planning on using 5mm plywood, which is slightly thicker than the traditional 3/16" planking, but perhaps I'd have better luck using 4mm plywood... although that seems REALLY thin to me, for this type of boat.

I already own a copy of Kenneth and Helen Durant's book, and I'm currently reading it for the third time. I have three sets of plans to choose from (2 purchased from the Adirondack Museum, plus the set up plans included in the Durant's book). So at this point I think I'll keep moving forward, factoring in some time and materials for experimentation, and see what I can come up with.

Any additional feedback is certainly appreciated.

[GROOVY]

I'm still starting my guideboat.............
have laminated the 0 frames, I used SPF 2x4 that I was lucky to find enough clear wood to cut into strips 1/4" thick to use so far I have learned material is hard if not next to impossible to get, then the waste factor.
Started with steaming-bending-drying-epoxy.
Then soaking-bending-drying-gluing.
Thinking of trying thinner strips of white pine next.......as I used white pine for the stems.
As far as the siding..... I would like to try the Grant lap to .... Im thinking if you used ply it would have to be painted wont it?

[Farmer Diddley]

Originally posted by GROOVY:
... I would like to try the Grant lap to .... Im thinking if you used ply it would have to be painted wont it?Yes I plan on painting the plywood, I will have some brightwork on the boat, but most of the planking will be painted (I may varnish the shear strake).