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David G
11-24-2018, 12:51 PM
Linear? Loops? Dialectic Splits? Big Bang? Or???


https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/19/opinion/how-would-you-draw-history.html

https://static01.nyt.com/images/2018/11/19/opinion/19stone-linear/19stone-linear-jumbo.gif?quality=90&auto=webp

LeeG
11-24-2018, 12:54 PM
I prefer a broad brush, 3” will do.

LeeG
11-24-2018, 01:02 PM
Ok, read the article. I wouldn’t draw history, I would put it in a library where people of different ages could go to hear and read stories.

David G
11-24-2018, 01:06 PM
Wait... you READ the article? Ain't that against Bilge Bylaws, or summat??? <G>

sharpiefan
11-24-2018, 02:53 PM
I wouldn't try..... there's too much to account for. For example, "The Peloponnesian War" by Thucydides, The Platonic Dialogues by Plato, and the Comic Plays of Aristophanes were all written around the same time and about some of the same people. It's hard to believe they were on the same planet, let alone contemporaries in the same society. To go from reading the pedantic history of Thucydides to the lively dialogues of Plato, some of the most sublime prose ever written (though some of his ideas are abhorrent to the Nth degree), to the rude, riotously rollicking plays of Aristophanes, whose works are still being stolen from today, will induce a strong 'culture shock'. I'm pretty sure the same holds true for any era.

Here's what history looks like to me:

http://www.biolab.si/supp/fragviz/images/graph3-800.png

Sit back and enjoy the ride. :)

David G
11-24-2018, 03:50 PM
Jeebus, s-fan...

Here I was all set to run with 'linear'... because it's ever just so much more easierest to wrap my mind around - and you muddle up the works with THAT bit of unfathomably refined and formidible fancyness. You knotty boy! Floridians! Hah!!

oznabrag
11-24-2018, 04:20 PM
Jeebus, s-fan...

Here I was all set to run with 'linear'... because it's ever just so much more easierest to wrap my mind around - and you muddle up the works with THAT bit of unfathomably refined and formidible fancyness. You knotty boy! Floridians! Hah!!
Here’s yer Floridian
http://forum.woodenboat.com/blob:http://forum.woodenboat.com/704de9f4-0212-4a8f-bb31-bf3e84e045c2

oznabrag
11-24-2018, 04:24 PM
Well, after 2 attempts to post an image of Grayton’s 30-A Beach Blonde Ale from this stoopit phone, I give up.

LeeG
11-24-2018, 04:57 PM
layers and layers of thick latex paint. Different rooms. When that’s done get more paint.

David G
11-24-2018, 05:49 PM
Well, after 2 attempts to post an image of Grayton’s 30-A Beach Blonde Ale from this stoopit phone, I give up.

THIS stuff?? My phone is too danged brilliant - it often outsmarts me...

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/591ebc8e1b631bff6315a243/t/5b22c1786d2a73679d1d028c/1529004454878/_A6B8674-Edit.jpg?format=500w

sharpiefan
11-24-2018, 06:15 PM
Oops. :)
You may draw it as you see fit, but be honest with yourself.

Linear history is propaganda, usually promulgated by a conqueror to justify his conquests. Life, and history, are multidimensional, polyhedral, never as simple as we might like them to be.

"But knowledge is preferable to ignorance. Better by far to embrace the hard truth than a reassuring fable." ..... Carl Sagan

Bob (oh, THAT Bob)
11-24-2018, 06:30 PM
"Must you think so linearly, Jean-Luc?" - Q

Too Little Time
11-24-2018, 06:30 PM
I read the article.

We all experience history differently. We experience it as time passes, but also as others relate what they have seen in their history. We experience it not only in what we read about history, but also in the order we read these accounts, and in the context of our previous learning.

A straight line in a space with billions of dimensions seems good enough for me. But any of the other descriptions in the article seem to be close enough. It all depends on what you purpose is.

David G
11-24-2018, 06:34 PM
Oops. :)
You may draw it as you see fit, but be honest with yourself.

Linear history is propaganda, usually promulgated by a conqueror to justify his conquests. Life, and history, are multidimensional, polyhedral, never as simple as we might like them to be.

"But knowledge is preferable to ignorance. Better by far to embrace the hard truth than a reassuring fable." ..... Carl Sagan

You are too correct. I should have included the 'sarcasm emoji'...

sharpiefan
11-24-2018, 08:39 PM
You are too correct. I should have included the 'sarcasm emoji'...

I got that your post was in jest, and tried to make my response the same. Which smiley do you use for sarcasm? I don't see a "tongue-in-cheek" or "pulling-your-chain" in the FAQ. The closest I find are

[rolleyes] :rolleyes: /sarcasm/

[stick-out-tongue] :p /just kidding/

Keith Wilson
11-24-2018, 10:45 PM
So, right, you have all those cute curves - NONE OF THE &%$^#% AXES ARE EVEN LABELED! Much less any kind of scale on them. Not serious.

I think history is way too complicated to draw in only two dimensions.

Tom Lathrop
11-25-2018, 09:46 AM
Oops. :)
You may draw it as you see fit, but be honest with yourself.

Linear history is propaganda, usually promulgated by a conqueror to justify his conquests. Life, and history, are multidimensional, polyhedral, never as simple as we might like them to be.

"But knowledge is preferable to ignorance. Better by far to embrace the hard truth than a reassuring fable." ..... Carl Sagan

I view history as more like fractile geometry. There is/are underlying direction(s) which are never clearly visible in the moment and only dimly afterward.

David G
11-25-2018, 10:34 AM
So, right, you have all those cute curves - NONE OF THE &%$^#% AXES ARE EVEN LABELED! Much less any kind of scale on them. Not serious.

I think history is way too complicated to draw in only two dimensions.

Spoken like a True Engineer!! <G>

sharpiefan
11-25-2018, 11:29 AM
I view history as more like fractile geometry. There is/are underlying direction(s) which are never clearly visible in the moment and only dimly afterward.

Fractals are a great idea...everything is connected at some level.


https://youtube.com/watch?v=G_GBwuYuOOs