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VGTL
06-18-2018, 11:28 AM
Hi folks, this is my first post here but I follow this very helpful forum probably since ten years ago, or almost, before I built my first boat.
I have a question wich probably for most experimented boaters and builders is a bit silly, to say the least. Because I didn't found any information about, so probably is a question of commom sense or experience.
When I built my plywood boat, I did the stem post a bit longer, like three inches or less, and used it as a cleat, or samson post or whatever must be called. It resisted very well towing, anchoring in strong waves and never moved.
I suppose is not reccomende because over the years it can suffer for some wearing and then won't be replaced. Or must be uncomfortable in some boats. But mine had a rise deck cuddy over wich I walked to the bow wich (because the rake) was like four feet long. Because the configuration of the cabin, I used to anchor from the cockpit well behind and using a ring in the stem most of the time (I had a small buoy, but wasn't necessary).
I still dreaming to build my next boat since since now I'm ''boateless'' from a few years, and building it by imagination step by step. So any help is thanked in advance.
Thank you very much for let me participate here. 17969

Jay Greer
06-18-2018, 12:02 PM
You could use a cleat that is located near the stem in conjunction with a removable plank that projects off of the bow like a bow sprit. This will keep your boat from fouling the "anchor rode" or "bouy rope".

VGTL
06-18-2018, 09:09 PM
That's a good idea Jay

Gib Etheridge
06-18-2018, 09:32 PM
Welcome.

Call me thick, but I don't understand the question.

VGTL
06-19-2018, 01:46 AM
My question is if the stempost can be used as a cleat. Before calling you anything I must say sorry if my english is not clear enough or my explanations are going around without being precise. Thanks for the interest Gib, I really appreciate.
Gustavo.

Graeme Forrest
06-19-2018, 02:41 AM
A number of Vivier designs utilise an extended stem as an anchor bollard, typically a metal cross pin to form a cleat. See the photographs of the Ilur on his website.

Gib Etheridge
06-19-2018, 02:43 AM
So you speak 2 languages, possibly more. My wife speaks 3. I only speak 1. I admire both of you for that.

It seems to me that if you know you're going to want to moor to the stem all you need to do is build it solidly enough to do so, or put a fairlead on the stem and run the rode through that then to a cleat or samson post on the deck somewhere.

On my next boat I'm planning to anchor to the bow eye via a painter, allowing me to anchor, or launch a sea anchor (drogue), from the cockpit. The painter will reach back to the cockpit, where it will be cleated off when not in use and is where the anchor locker will be located. The anchor line will be doubled, then passed through an eye splice in the end of the painter and tied off with a double sheet bend, which is easier to untie than a single and a bit more secure. The already doubled tail of the sheet bend will then be attached to the rode with a shackle to ensure that it doesn't work loose and pull through due to the cyclical nature of the load, and once the painter has been paid out and is taut I'll connect what's left of the rode to a cleat or samson post on the side or aft deck at the cockpit. I'll just make sure that the bow eye and stem are solid enough to take the strain.

You could do the same, including fastening a tow line to the painter, all from the cockpit.

Now I hope that I have made myself understood. Y:o

VGTL
06-19-2018, 09:46 AM
Now I learnt what a ''painter'' means after a short search. It is a great idea.
This configuration helps to stabilize better the boat at anchor or drogue - in my opinion - as a benefit.
I used the samson posts you see astern in the picture and felt more confident than with a screwed cleat too.

VGTL
06-19-2018, 09:52 AM
I seen the extended stem as a bollard in much classic designs too, from viking longboats to gondolas and some crude skiffs. But as because nobody seems to use it in modern plywood epoxy boats I tought in some way it can compromise structural integrity or wearing of the bollard makes it impossible to replace. Good to know Vivier uses this configuration, I will watch pictures of his boats in detail.

timcooke
06-19-2018, 10:15 AM
https://78.media.tumblr.com/b2a31af95d470132774818a8b48558f0/tumblr_o7am2ctYja1qhceiho1_1280.jpg

Here is my Ilur. It is ply epoxy construction. The stem/ samson post is the handiest thing ever. I keep this boat for 5 months of the year on a swinging mooring using just a clove hitch. It has been out on the mooring, in the six years since I built it, in some pretty fresh weather including a few gales! The stem itself is made from Douglas Fir, and you are right there has been some wear. The wear is actually caused by compression of the post by the rope rather than wear by friction. I'm not too worried about it. A bit of epoxy filler and it will be like new.

Gib Etheridge
06-19-2018, 10:15 AM
Now I learnt what a ''painter'' means after a short search. It is a great idea.
This configuration helps to stabilize better the boat at anchor or drogue - in my opinion - as a benefit.
I used the samson posts you see astern in the picture and felt more confident than with a screwed cleat too.

Yes, it will be more stable holding from down lower, which will be good when sleeping aboard. I think that in my case this will be even more important because the hull will be long and relatively narrow with a lot of sheer, meaning that the stems and fore and aft decks will be quite high. A high attachment would mean that it would be getting yanked over sideways a lot. Well, I hope to not have to anchor in unprotected areas, but stuff happens and it's good to be prepared.

I like it also because I won't need to leave the safety and comfort of the cockpit when things are rough.