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ahp
09-17-2016, 11:42 AM
I am considering making provision for standing up, facing forward rowing, for my 19 ft Ohio Sharpie. The bare weight of the sharpie is about 300 to 400 pounds. I may have an electric trolling motor also.

I have seen and been on board Chinese sampans that were rowed this way. American small sailing craft, like the Tancook Whaler were rowed this way in calms.

Any comments and suggestions are welcome.

Peerie Maa
09-17-2016, 11:47 AM
Try to find some ships lifeboat sweeps, you will probably need their length and robustness.

Jay Greer
09-17-2016, 01:19 PM
I prefer to row standing and facing fwd. "Red Witch" weighs 10,000lbs and has no engine. She actually rows like a dream after momentum is gained. Then it is just a matter of resting on the single sweep and leaning fwd. rather than exerting much energy.
Jay

ahp
09-17-2016, 05:13 PM
Jay, that is encouraging. I did hear of a young couple cruising in a Folkboat, 4400 pounds displacement empty, using sweeps as auxiliary power.

Do you use one sweep, or have a buddy on the other, or on the tiller?

Could you post a picture of your boat?

Peerie Maa
09-17-2016, 05:29 PM
Jay, that is encouraging. I did hear of a young couple cruising in a Folkboat, 4400 pounds displacement empty, using sweeps as auxiliary power.

Do you use one sweep, or have a buddy on the other, or on the tiller?

Could you post a picture of your boat?

If you are rowing solo with one sweep, set it up so that you can steer with your hip.

Phil Y
09-17-2016, 07:48 PM
I rowed that way in Vietnam on a holiday. Small fishing boat/dinghy. Just for 10 minutes or so. I prefer traditional rowing, but I imagine stand up gets better with practice.

rgthom
09-17-2016, 08:14 PM
Stand-up rowing is my new favorite for maneuvering and forward visibility (on a 250 lb camping rowboat). Thread here on the rowing set-up: http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?203433-Stand-up-rowing-a-Walkabout

https://c2.staticflickr.com/2/1522/25921926406_215fc2f28d_c.jpg

Sitting slide seat is still more powerful and less windage, but standing makes for a nice change in muscles used even on a long trip.

jsjpd1
09-17-2016, 09:13 PM
I row our Caledonia Yawl facing forward both standing and sitting. It is really great when manoeuvring in tight spots. It should work good on your sharpie.

Ben Fuller
09-17-2016, 09:24 PM
Look for Mediterranean fishing boats which were pretty much all rowed facing forward. Venice is another place, where there were more than gondolas. Oars were specialized, quite long, counter balanced with well crossed handles.

Pitsligo
09-18-2016, 12:20 AM
I row Bucephalus standing, facing forward --19', 3000#, Friendship sloop-type (deep keel), no motor. It takes a bit to get her moving, but once she's there, like Jay's Red Witch she glides along just fine. Her rowlock sockets are closer in than they ought to be, but that's because I chose to be limited by mounting them on the cockpit coaming. I might do it differently next time, and enjoy easier rowing.

I don't have a lot of experience with it, but I'd say the success of whatever you decide to try will be determined by how carefully you pay attention to your rowing geometry, e.g. rowlock placement, oar length, etc.

Alex

jpatrick
09-18-2016, 12:49 PM
You guys rowing the larger boats (Jay, Alex)…. What do you do when having to row in windy conditions? Like when entering or leaving a harbor where you cannot sail. I observed a couple of the smaller boats re-entering Port Hudson during the WB Festival after having been out for a sail. They have a prohibition against sailing in the harbor during the Festival due to congestion. There was a pretty good headwind when entering and the crews had to work hard to make any headway. Neither crew seemed to be enjoying themselves at that particular moment.

Although, as I think about it, both crews were using paddles, not oars in rowlocks. That would likely be a big factor.

Jeff

Jay Greer
09-18-2016, 01:12 PM
Jay, that is encouraging. I did hear of a young couple cruising in a Folkboat, 4400 pounds displacement empty, using sweeps as auxiliary power.

Do you use one sweep, or have a buddy on the other, or on the tiller?

Could you post a picture of your boat?
Ironically the "Red Witch" once had an engine that I removed as the boat was not designed to have one. When I pulled out the old Gray Lugger Four the boat came up four inches on her water line aft. I straddle the tiller between my knees and scull with a single eight foot sweep off the stbd. quarter. Larry Pardy used a Yolu on both of his boats. The advantage is that each stroke of the yolu oar is a power stroke. I paced him once on a race around Ensenada bay and it was a dead heat. The Witch is an easy boat to scull as she has a very slippery hull from.
Jay
https://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a4d734b3127ccef74a3c6efaf900000030O00QYsmrNy5bsQ e3nwg/cC/f%3D0/ls%3D00107990352120140915173033139.JPG/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

Clarkey
09-18-2016, 01:41 PM
Look for Mediterranean fishing boats which were pretty much all rowed facing forward. Venice is another place, where there were more than gondolas. Oars were specialized, quite long, counter balanced with well crossed handles.

I rowed a fair bit in Venice and was surprised how light and springy the oars were, even for large boats like Caorlinas. I never saw any counterbalancing.

Jay Greer
09-18-2016, 03:12 PM
That is true. No counterbalancing to my knowledge. I once sculled a gondola under the Bridge of Sighs with my friend Mario de Pita who was head of the gondoliers guild at that time. I even got to sing an aria, Amor ti Vieta. We went through all of the back canals and drank a lot of vino! Damn Fino!
Jay

Pitsligo
09-18-2016, 10:14 PM
You guys rowing the larger boats (Jay, Alex)…. What do you do when having to row in windy conditions?

Sorry Jeff: when it's windy, I don't row. Way too much windage to get any headway. That's what the sails are for. As maneuverable as my B and your ER are, if it weren't for the WBF's regulation, we'd be fine going in under sail.

I think you're right that the reason you saw people working so hard to get back in after a sail was the paddles. I keep a paddle handy aboard B for those moments when a gust of wind stymies me and I just need three (sometimes desperate) strokes to get her to the dock, but otherwise it'd be a miserable way to try and move a sloop.

I'd also like to note that I often scull B with one oar, over the stern, and that for maneuvering around marinas that's a much easier way to go. Sculling, our beam is 6' 6"; rowing, our beam is 19'. I expect a yuloh would have a similar advantage.

Alex

Ben Fuller
09-18-2016, 11:21 PM
That is true. No counterbalancing to my knowledge. I once sculled a gondola under the Bridge of Sighs with my friend Mario de Pita who was head of the gondoliers guild at that time. I even got to sing an aria, Amor ti Vieta. We went through all of the back canals and drank a lot of vino! Damn Fino!
Jay

I think it was the open water fishermen that I saw with counterbalances. Big fat ones on the oars, no idea how they were made. Maybe Spanish or greek or somewhere else in Italy.

Jimmy W
09-20-2016, 11:19 PM
An old photo from Seedtick who is no longer active here.

http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm117/seedtick/IMG_0388.jpg

http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?101959-Louisiana-Boatbuilding-Gotta-see-this!

Jimmy W
09-20-2016, 11:38 PM
There are also systems like on the Reel Foot Lake boats which were rowed sitting facing forward while still pulling on the oars.

http://smallboatsmonthly.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/FFRdeviceweb-800x533.jpg

Ben Fuller
09-21-2016, 10:46 AM
Looks like most of the patent types are well suited to smaller boats than the OP has in mind. Big long pushers seem to be more appropriate for 400 pound boats.

Jamie Orr
09-21-2016, 11:06 AM
I row my Chebacco both sitting and standing. Standing is good for maneuvering in harbour, but for serious distances I add a seat and row normally. With a weight (designer's estimate) of 1200#, a continuous speed of 2 knots is okay, top speed is/was 3 knots that lasted about 10 seconds. At 3-400# you should do better than that.

I made the distance from end of handle to fulcrum 7/25th of the length of the oar. Mine overlap by 2 inches on the stroke but clear each other on the recovery. They're about 12 feet long with the oarlocks mounted on the coamings, about 6 feet apart. This works well on the Chebacco, I use normal oarlocks, extensions are not needed.

Jamie

switters
09-21-2016, 11:32 AM
Dynamite Payson talked about stand up rowing in the book Instant Boat building and may have even given some dimensions and so forth, cant remember much now. If you don't have the book handy i can try to remember to look it up if you. want.

switters
09-21-2016, 02:34 PM
8' oars for Sweet Pea. 10" extensions on the oarlocks.