Stem on a Penobscot 14

[Bob Quick]

Working on cutting parts for First Try and a question crosses my mind.
On the outer stem, which direction should the grain run for the laminations? Short or long on the laminations?
Any Thoughts?

Bob Quick

[almeyer]

Bob, the grain runs along the length of the lamination; i.e., from the top of the stem along the curve towards the keel. I built my inner stem from white pine (cheap and easy to work), but used ash for the outer stem for better resistance against dings. When you start making the laminations, make a couple of spares, just in case! I could not get the ash to take that much a curve cold, so I steamed them in the shower, clamped them all around the inner stem for about a week to get a "memory", then took it all apart and epoxied the laminations together. You're going to need a lot of clamps, which I didn't have, so I made a bunch of homemade boxes with wood wedges to hold everything together. Don't forget to put a layer of saran wrap or wax paper between the first lamination and the inner stem or you'll wind up permanently gluing the outer to the inner stem. Let the epoxy cure at least a week, then when you remove the outer stem, screw a couple of diagonals from one end of the outer stem to the other so the outer stem keeps it's shape. It's going to be awhile before you permanently install it.
Al

[Railmeat]

I used white oak, but regardless of the wood you use, the grain has to ruin the long way. The bend is severe enough that I think you will snap the laminations if the grain runs the short way.

Don

[Bob Quick]

As usual, I have not made myself clear. I am speaking of the grain direction looking at the end of the lamination. In other words, should it be quarter sawn or flat sawn.
I was going to us Douglas Fir but the idea of oak or ash is probably a good one. How thick did you guys cut the laminations? Arch Davis says 3/16 inch but that seems heavy for oak or ash.

Bob Quick

[Bruce Hooke]

Since ash in particular can be split into layers (as for basketmaking) by pounding on the outside of a log and crushing the weaker summerwood layers it would seem to make sense to use quartersawn stock to prevent the same effect from causing the outer stem to split into layers. Other woods are less prone to this splitting but can still fracture in a similar way during the bending process so again I would probably lean towards quartersawn but when it comes right down to it I think either way would work.

[Railmeat]

Go with quarter sawn. I used flat sawn 1/4" laminations, and the outer one split.

Don

[jefl456]

I am building a Penobscot 17. I used flat sawn ash but made the laminations a bit thinner to accomodate the radius of the bend. I went ahead and bought a BUNCH of clamps at a "Bargain Depot" beofre starting the boat. I have been glad ever since. Although most of the "clamping" is done with screws, a bit of help from clamps to pull things to is always a good idea.

Jeff

[almeyer]

When making the outer stem, I used every clamp I had which wasn't near enough. I then cut up some 1x4 stock to make a series of boxes, using drywall screws to hold the boxes together. When assembled, I screwed three sides together, wrapped the u-shaped piece around the inner and outer stem, then screwed the fourth piece of the box in so that the stem assembly was inside the box. Some wood wedges between the box and the laminations provided the clamping pressure. It sounds goofy, and looked pretty cheesy, but it worked.
I did something similar when installing the gunwales and caprail, as I didn't want to have screws showing, and the stock was too thin to countersink the screws and plug with bungs. The gunwale is 3/4" thick, so I ripped some 1/2" thick doug fir and glued and screwed it on. I thin ripped some 1/4" to serve as a rubbing surface, and expoxied it over the doug fir using c-shaped wood brackets and wedges. Again, it looked pretty cheesy, but it was cheap and it worked.
Al

[almeyer]

Finally figured out how to use ImageStation - I think. If it works out, here's a pic of what I'm talking about.
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid116/pba550d2a204854f4d5a53a541ca97f1c/f8ab6801.jpg.orig.jpg

[Bob Quick]

Al:
Couldn't see your picture. I'd sure be interested.

First Try I coming along. I've got the Jig and frames are setup, stem is set, keel is on, sheers are on and I working on the stringers now. I just came in from the shop because I broke a stringer and I figured it was time to quit for the night.

I have been taking pictures but haven't had the courage or maybe the additude to try to post them yet.

Been following your posts. It sound like your nearly ready to launch.

Bob Quick

[Bob Quick]

Al:
Couldn't see your picture. I'd sure be interested.

First Try I coming along. I've got the Jig and frames are setup, stem is set, keel is on, sheers are on and I working on the stringers now. I just came in from the shop because I broke a stringer and I figured it was time to quit for the night.

I have been taking pictures but haven't had the courage or maybe the additude to try to post them yet.

Been following your posts. It sound like your nearly ready to launch.

Bob Quick

[almeyer]

I'll try this again. When I posted last night, the picture came out frigging huge. Seems that posting pictures is even more complicated than building boats....
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid116/pba550d2a204854f4d5a53a541ca97f1c/f8ab6801.jpg

Bob, if this doesn't work out, send me an e-mail and I'll send you the pic that way. File size is about 500kb. Address is almeyer36@yahoo.com

[Bob Quick]

Thanks, I can see that. I've used similar appraches on other projects. The fact of the matter is that it doesn't make adifference what the fixturing looks like it is the product that counts. I've seen lots of "box clamps" in old literature for every thing from furniture to catapults. Arch told me that one of the skills very high on the list for boat builders is problem solving. Looks like you have that skill and are doing a great job.

I'll see if I can figure out how to post. I have Norm's instructions and I just need to sit down and do it.

I replaced the broken stringer this morning.

Bob