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Boatfix
06-10-2016, 06:18 PM
Calling for enforcing our immigration laws does not make anyone a racist or bigot.


Sen. Sessions: Immigration Control is ‘Just and Biblical’


- See more at: https://www.conservativereview.com/commentary/2016/06/sen-sessions-immigration-control-is-just-and-biblical#sthash.bEWmpKxQ.ZJVMrenu.dpuf


...“If you bring in more labor than we can absorb, poor people have their wages go down. Poor people have their job prospects go down,” Sessions remarked. “Things aren’t going good out there for the American people and one of the reasons is the extraordinary, unprecedented rate of immigration into our country, particularly in lower-skilled jobs.” “It’s hammering good and decent people who need to be able to raise a family and take care of their children and they’re not able to do so effectively. I believe we can do better on that.”
- See more at: https://www.conservativereview.com/commentary/2016/06/sen-sessions-immigration-control-is-just-and-biblical#sthash.bEWmpKxQ.ZJVMrenu.dpuf...

The former United States Attorney also went on to chastise open-borders American lawmakers and activists, arguing that the legislative goals sought by such groups are out of touch and contradictory to those of the American people.
“I just think we need to understand that we in the government of the United States represent the interests of the American people,” he said. “We can’t do everything for everybody in the world. We are a nation state and nation states act like they’re supposed to.”
- See more at: https://www.conservativereview.com/commentary/2016/06/sen-sessions-immigration-control-is-just-and-biblical#sthash.bEWmpKxQ.ZJVMrenu.dpuf

Keith Wilson
06-10-2016, 06:22 PM
This is the sort of nonsense that could give 'common sense' a bad name.

S.V. Airlie
06-10-2016, 06:23 PM
Sessions is a flaming Jerk who probably wants to be VP. Anything else?

Ian McColgin
06-10-2016, 06:24 PM
Yeah, like the huge waves of Cuban immigrants totally tanked the Florida economy. Actually, immigrants are new labor, new market participants, new entrepreneurs, and new tax payers all at once. People with the energy and drive to leave a bad situation in search of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness have always been the backbone of American dynamism.

Boatfix
06-10-2016, 06:31 PM
Most on this forum have no clue as to the truth about the damage unchecked immigration has on America. this is written in 2015, and leaves out the last year and a half which I will follow up with.


http://www.anncoulter.com/columns/2015-07-01.htmlMEDIA HIDE FACTS, CALL EVERYONE ELSE A LIAR

July 1, 2015

When Donald Trump said something not exuberantly enthusiastic about Mexican immigrants, the media's response was to boycott him. One thing they didn't do was produce any facts showing he was wrong.

Trump said: "When Mexico sends its people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're not sending you. They're sending people that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems to us. They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists. And some, I assume, are good people."

The first thing a fact-checker would have noticed is: THE GOVERNMENT WON'T TELL US HOW MANY IMMIGRANTS ARE COMMITTING CRIMES IN AMERICA.

Wouldn't that make any person of average intelligence suspicious? Not our media. They're in on the cover-up.

A curious media might also wonder why any immigrants are committing crimes in America. A nation's immigration policy, like any other government policy, ought to be used to help the people already here -- including the immigrants, incidentally.

It's bad enough that immigrants, both legal and illegal, are accessing government benefits at far above the native rate, but why would any country be taking another country's criminals? We have our own criminals! No one asked for more.

Instead of counting the immigrant stock filling up our prisons, the government issues a series of comical reports claiming to tally immigrant crime. The Department of Justice relies on immigrants' self-reports of their citizenship. The U.S. census simply guesses the immigration status of inmates. The Government Accounting Office conducts its own analysis of Bureau of Prisons data.

In other words, the government hasn't the first idea how many prisoners are legal immigrants, illegal immigrants or anchor babies.

But there are clues! Only about a quarter of California inmates are white, according to a major investigative piece in The Atlantic last year (http://www.theatlantic.com/features/archive/2014/09/how-gangs-took-over-prisons/379330/?utm_source=huffingtonpost.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=pubexchange) -- and that includes criminals convicted in the 1960s, 1970s and 1980s, when the vast majority of California's population was either black or white.

Do immigration enthusiasts imagine that more than 75 percent of the recent convicts are African-American? Blacks have high crime rates, but they make up only about 6 percent of California's entire population.

A casual perusal of the "Most Wanted" lists also suggests that the government may not have our best interests in mind when deciding who gets to live in America.

Here is the Los Angeles Police Department's list of "Most Wanted" (http://www.lapdonline.org/top_ten_most_wanted) criminal suspects:

-- Jesse Enrique Monarrez (murder),

-- Cesar Augusto Nistal (child molestation),

-- Jose A. Padilla (murder),

-- Demecio Carlos Perez (murder),

-- Ramon Reyes, (robbery and murder),

-- Victor Vargas (murder),

-- Ruben Villa (murder)

The full "Most Wanted" list (http://www.lapdonline.org/all_most_wanted)doesn't get any better.

There aren't a lot of Mexicans in New York state -- half of all Mexican immigrants in the U.S. live in either Texas or California (http://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/mexican-immigrants-united-states-0) -- and yet there are more Mexican prisoners in New York than there are inmates from all of Western Europe.

As for the crime of rape specifically, different groups have different criminal proclivities, but no one takes a backseat to Hispanics in terms of sex crimes.

The rate of rape in Mexico is even higher than in India (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/05/25/travel/women-alert-to-travels-darker-side.html), according to Professor Carlos Javier Echarri Canovas of El Colegio de Mexico. A report from the Inter-American Children's Institute explains that in Latin America, women and children are "seen as objects instead of human beings with rights and freedoms."

All peasant cultures have non-progressive views on women, but Latin America happens to have the peasant culture that's closest to the United States.

The only reason our newspapers aren't chockablock with reports of Latino sexual predators is that they are too busy broadcasting hoax news stories about non-existent gang-rapes by white men: the Duke lacrosse team (Crystal Gail Mangum), University of Virginia fraternity members (Jackie Coakley) and military contractors in Iraq (Jamie Leigh Jones).

In fact, the main way we find out about Hispanic rapists is when the media report on dead or missing girls -- hoping against hope that the case will never be solved or the perp will look like the rapists on "Law and Order." When it turns out to be another Latino rapist, that fact is aggressively suppressed by the media.

New Yorkers were horrified by the case of "Baby Hope," a 4-year-old girl whose raped and murdered body turned up in an Igloo cooler off of the Henry Hudson Parkway in 1991. After a 20-year investigation, the police finally captured her rapist/murderer in 2013. It was her cousin, Conrado Juarez, an illegal alien from Mexico, who disposed of the girl's body with the help of his illegal alien sister.

New York City is the nation's media capital. But only The New York Post reported that the child rapist was a Mexican.

In 2001, the media were fixated on the case of Chandra Levy, a congressional intern who had gone missing. All eyes were on her boss and romantic partner, Democratic congressman Gary Condit. Then it turned out she was assaulted and murdered while jogging in Rock Creek Park by Ingmar Guandique -- an illegal alien from El Salvador.

There was a lot of press when three Cleveland women went missing a decade ago. By the time they escaped in 2013 from the sick sexual pervert who'd been holding them captive, it was too late for the media to ignore the story. The girls hadn't been kidnapped by the Duke lacrosse team, but by Ariel Castro.

Now, get this: While investigating Castro, the police discovered that he wasn't the only Hispanic raping young girls on his block. (All in all, it wasn't a great street for trick-or-treating.)

Castro's erstwhile neighbor, Elias Acevedo, had spent years raping, among many others, his own daughters when they were little girls. The New York Times' entire coverage of that case consisted of a tiny item on page A-18: "Ohio: Life Sentence in Murders and Rapes."

The media knew from the beginning that the monstrous gang-rape and murder of Jennifer Ertman, 14, and Elizabeth Pena, 16, in Houston in 1993 was instigated by Jose Ernesto Medellin, an illegal immigrant from Mexico. But over the next decade, with more than a thousand news stories on that case, the fact that the lead rapist was a Mexican was not mentioned once, according to the Nexis archives.

Only when Medellin's Mexicanness was used to try to overturn his death sentence did American news consumers finally find out he was an illegal alien from Mexico. (After years of wasted judicial resources and taxpayer money being spent on Medellin's appeals, he will now be spending eternity way, way south of the border.)

Who is this media cover-up helping? Not the American girls getting raped. But also not the Latina immigrants who came to the U.S., thinking they were escaping the Latin American rape culture. So as not to hurt the feelings of immigrant rapists, the media are willing to put all girls living here at risk.

No wonder the media is sputtering at Trump. He broke the embargo on unpleasant facts about what our immigration policies are doing to the country (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1621572676/ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=9325&creativeASIN=1621572676&linkCode=as2&tag=anncoulter-20&linkId=ZKHLJQQ6PALCJQ5O)http://ir-na.amazon-adsystem.com/e/ir?t=anncoulter-20&l=as2&o=1&a=1621572676.

S.V. Airlie
06-10-2016, 06:33 PM
He doesn't pay any attention to facts, when does he use facts ever?

Boatfix
06-10-2016, 06:35 PM
He doesn't pay any attention to facts, when does he use facts ever?

Another lame response. My second post is all facts.

S.V. Airlie
06-10-2016, 06:39 PM
Lame because it's the truth. Hence it's lame for you to think he does. He hasn't told the truth yet on anything.

Chris Smith porter maine
06-10-2016, 06:50 PM
I agree illegal immigrants drive wages down, I see groups of roofers come threw now every summer, no safety gear, but low prices, the guys work about 60 hours a week get no OT and $8 an hour. They throw lots of bodies at a job (think 25 guys on a 1500 sqft ranch) and finish fast, but do very sloppy work, most of the roofs I have seen leek the first or second winter but there long gone by then.

S.V. Airlie
06-10-2016, 06:55 PM
Hey, I deal with "fly by nights" all the time here. Not Hispanics just the usual who put a sign on their trucks saying they are professional this or that. The only thing professional is the freekin' sign. Oh and they are cheap though even though they have to do the work again several times if you are lucky to find them again.

Nicholas Scheuer
06-10-2016, 06:59 PM
I happen to know a number of folks of Mexican heritage who are fine citizens.

S.V. Airlie
06-10-2016, 07:06 PM
I happen to know a number of folks of Mexican heritage who are fine citizens.So do I! Proud of knowing them too!

Chip-skiff
06-10-2016, 07:10 PM
When's the last time we fought with Mexico. 1846.

We should have kept the Germans out. Damn kraut SOBs. We (true Americans) had to fight 'em twice in the last century, killing our men while they were murdering millions in camps, in service to their twisted ideology.

And now the Volkswagen diesel thing. I don't know how any true American can ever trust a German again.

We should deport the whole lot and build a wall. . .somewhere.

Ron Williamson
06-10-2016, 07:14 PM
Berlin?
Wait....never mind.
R

Paul Pless
06-10-2016, 07:17 PM
Calling for enforcing our immigration laws does not make anyone a racist or bigot.I agree. I also would like to see common sense immigration reform and enforcement. Let's look at some facts though. Illegal aliens in the United States as well as illegal border crossings rose every year of the Bush presidency and peaked his last year in office. Illegal aliens in country as well as illegal border crossings have decreased every year of Obama's presidency. During Obama's presidency we have seen more deportations each year and in total than during the Bush presidency.

As far as fighting illegal immigration, my strategy would be to investigate, prosecute, and sentence harshly those responsible for hiring undocumented workers. The day a plant manager of a large chicken processing plant goes to prison or the CEO and director of personnel of Fortune 500 company in the service or ag sector goes to prison for hiring undocumented workers, well that'll be the day that we start making a serious dent in the illegal immigration problem in the country.

S.V. Airlie
06-10-2016, 07:22 PM
You are going to hit a major snag there. Even Trump hired what appears to be illegal aliens and believe me, no white man will pick tomatoes or any crops grown. It's beneath them.

Osborne Russell
06-10-2016, 07:31 PM
I'm currently reading an account of a shipload of convicts from England being "transported" as a means of punishment in lieu of imprisonment or execution, but in the early days of that policy, where they shipped them to Virginia instead of Australia.

Very striking parallels to the slave ships, in terms of how all manner of negligence and sadism toward the prisoners was rationalized. But race was not involved.

Cheap labor is money. Money creates jobs. Money pays for national defense and balances the budget. What is the Republican objection?

Boatfix
06-10-2016, 07:59 PM
I happen to know a number of folks of Mexican heritage who are fine citizens.


How is this relevant to the OP. This is all about enforcing our immigrations laws. Over 1/4 of the population of Mexico have come into this country, see below. We either have a country or not. Borders, language and culture make a nation.




http://www.allenbwest.com/michele/ann-coulter-reveals-astonishing-fact-about-immigration-in-the-u-s


Ann Coulter reveals astonishing fact about immigration in the U.S.Written by Michele Hickford, Editor-in-Chief (http://www.allenbwest.com/author/michele) on May 29, 2015
http://www.allenbwest.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/soccer_fans-300x180.jpg


Prolific author and commentator Ann Coulter never shies from controversy. She regularly makes statements that raise eyebrows on both the right and the left, but this latest claim is perhaps the most outrageous thing I’ve ever heard her say – particularly because it’s not just an opinion,it’s apparently true!


As IJReview (http://www.ijreview.com/2015/05/331923-ann-coulter-reveals-stunning-claim-immigration-not-generally-known/?utm_source=Iterable&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=morning_newsletter) reports, Coulter was appearing on Fusion TV with host Jorge Ramos to promote her new book Adios, America! She shocked Ramos when she claimed that the United States has already taken in ONE-FOURTH of the population of Mexico.
How can this be true?
In 2013, Zack Taylor, chairman of the National Association of Former Border Patrol Officers, Inc said in a letter (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/sep/9/nearly-20m-illegal-immigrants-us-ex-border-patrol/) that the number of illegal immigrants in the country is probably closer to 20 million, rather than the usual Homeland Security Department estimates of 11-ish million.


In case you missed it, Taylor had some very frightening things to say (http://allenbwest.com/2014/07/disturbing-former-border-patrol-agent-calls-immigrant-surge-asymmetrical-warfare/) about the “assymetrical warfare” occurring on our borders.
Anyway, when you add Taylor’s 20 million to the 11.6 million LEGAL immigrants (http://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/frequently-requested-statistics-immigrants-and-immigration-united-states#Mexican%20Immigrants)from Mexico, you get a total of 31.6 million people from Mexico.


IJ Review says in 2013, the CIA estimated the total population of Mexico at 120 million.
Voila! (or perhaps I should say “aquí”). Thirty-plus million is basically a quarter of 120 million.
Yes, we have already taken in the equivalent of one-fourth of the population of Mexico. Now do you understand why you have to “press 1 for English?”
This has to end SOMEHOW. And right now it doesn’t look like it’s going to end well.
By the way, here are some other interesting tidbits about global immigration from Ms. Coulter (http://www.anncoulter.com/columns/2015-05-27.html)

> In 1970, there were almost no Nigerian immigrants in the United States. Our country is now home to more Nigerians than any country in the world except Nigeria.
> America takes more immigrants from Nigeria than from England.
> There are more foreign inmates in New York state prisons from Mexico than from the entire continent of Europe.
> Hispanics are less likely to be in the military than either whites or blacks, and a majority of Hispanic troops are women. On the other hand, Hispanics are overrepresented in U.S. Prisons.
> In Denmark, actual Danes come in tenth in criminals’ nationality, after Moroccans, Lebanese, Yugoslavians, Somalis, Iranians, Pakistanis, Turks, Iraqis and Vietnamese.
Getting xenophobic yet?

Boatfix
06-10-2016, 08:13 PM
I agree. I also would like to see common sense immigration reform and enforcement. Let's look at some facts though. Illegal aliens in the United States as well as illegal border crossings rose every year of the Bush presidency and peaked his last year in office. Illegal aliens in country as well as illegal border crossings have decreased every year of Obama's presidency. During Obama's presidency we have seen more deportations each year and in total than during the Bush presidency.

As far as fighting illegal immigration, my strategy would be to investigate, prosecute, and sentence harshly those responsible for hiring undocumented workers. The day a plant manager of a large chicken processing plant goes to prison or the CEO and director of personnel of Fortune 500 company in the service or ag sector goes to prison for hiring undocumented workers, well that'll be the day that we start making a serious dent in the illegal immigration problem in the country.

You have it all wrong. The Obama administration counts "turn arounds as deportations". The Administrations in the past did not. Whether you like it or not, believe it or not, pretty much anything put out by the Obama administration is disinformation. This includes unemployment numbers, folks on food stamps, deportations, or any stats related to Obamacare just to name a few. You need to do some googling on the comments on this by the Border Patrol.



http://money.cnn.com/2016/02/06/news/economy/obama-us-jobs/

http://www.wnd.com/2014/07/obamas-doctored-jobless-rates-masks-danger/

http://nypost.com/2013/11/18/census-faked-2012-election-jobs-report/

Boatfix
06-10-2016, 08:15 PM
When's the last time we fought with Mexico. 1846.

We should have kept the Germans out. Damn kraut SOBs. We (true Americans) had to fight 'em twice in the last century, killing our men while they were murdering millions in camps, in service to their twisted ideology.

And now the Volkswagen diesel thing. I don't know how any true American can ever trust a German again.

We should deport the whole lot and build a wall. . .somewhere.

Either you don't believe in borders or you completely support the Democrats rapidly changing the demographics in the country despite the damage to America, to stay in power forever.

S.V. Airlie
06-10-2016, 08:16 PM
How long have you been here? Are you by chance, second, or third or, off the boat in 1900? I mean if you are, how can you deny anyone immigrating here?What makes you so special?

Bobcat
06-10-2016, 08:16 PM
I agree. I also would like to see common sense immigration reform and enforcement. Let's look at some facts though. Illegal aliens in the United States as well as illegal border crossings rose every year of the Bush presidency and peaked his last year in office. Illegal aliens in country as well as illegal border crossings have decreased every year of Obama's presidency. During Obama's presidency we have seen more deportations each year and in total than during the Bush presidency.

As far as fighting illegal immigration, my strategy would be to investigate, prosecute, and sentence harshly those responsible for hiring undocumented workers. The day a plant manager of a large chicken processing plant goes to prison or the CEO and director of personnel of Fortune 500 company in the service or ag sector goes to prison for hiring undocumented workers, well that'll be the day that we start making a serious dent in the illegal immigration problem in the country.

That's an approach that has never really been tried because business likes cheap laborers that can't complain or blow the whistle.

Canoez
06-10-2016, 08:17 PM
Gee, Boatfix - you're Native American?

S.V. Airlie
06-10-2016, 08:17 PM
Gee, Boatfix - you're Native American?Must be, full blooded too!:(

Canoez
06-10-2016, 08:19 PM
Must be, full blooded too!:(

Days like this, I really miss Chuck.

Paul Pless
06-10-2016, 08:21 PM
Either you don't believe in borders or you completely support the Democrats rapidly changing the demographics in the country despite the damage to America, to stay in power forever.
Republicans have been in full control of Congress for some time now, have been in control of both houses for the majority of the last two decades; yet we've seen not one single meaningful piece of legislation aimed at immigration reform from the Republicans in all that time. And you stand here castigating Democrats?

S.V. Airlie
06-10-2016, 08:21 PM
Days like this, I really miss Chuck.Yup, he'd do more than throw his two cents in with some polite but, appropriate comments. People like boat broke wouldn't know what hit him.:)

Boatfix
06-10-2016, 08:21 PM
How long have you been here? Are you by chance, second, or third or, off the boat in 1900? I mean if you are, how can you deny anyone immigrating here?What makes you so special?

I'll answer this one lame post. We are talking about illegal immigration which has led to 1/4 of the population of Mexico invading this nation in recent times. The USA allows more than one million legal immigrants to come into the US every year. These are two distinctly different issues. Get it?

Boatfix
06-10-2016, 08:23 PM
Gee, Boatfix - you're Native American?

Another lame response to the illegal immigration issue. No borders is ok, I guess?

Paul Pless
06-10-2016, 08:24 PM
We are talking about illegal immigration which has led to 1/4 of the population of Mexico invading this nation in recent times. why do you feel the need to lie? is your argument so weak otherwise?

S.V. Airlie
06-10-2016, 08:24 PM
It's lame because it goes directly to the problem AND you refuse to answer my question. Figures! Just to let you know, I'm 12th generation American, not a measly three which by not answering you probably is close to being correct..

Canoez
06-10-2016, 08:25 PM
Another lame response to the illegal immigration issue. No borders is ok, I guess?

Apparently not - your family managed to get in.

Ian McColgin
06-10-2016, 08:26 PM
Actually, the percent of the Mexican population that's immigrated to the US, both documented and undocumented, is more like about 10%, which is huge and the lying scare tactics of the racist right don't really need to exaggerate that point.

Boatfix
06-10-2016, 08:29 PM
Republicans have been in full control of Congress for some time now, have been in control of both houses for the majority of the last two decades; yet we've seen not one single meaningful piece of legislation aimed at immigration reform from the Republicans in all that time. And you stand here castigating Democrats?

You do know the Obama administration has clearly laid out what they will pass and what they will not. I agree, they should have passed the first or second part of this then let Obama veto it. I'd say the reason is either they know Obama will veto so why waste the time or the Republican leaders do not want immigration reform either and thus you have Trump now. Republican voters are quite sick of the leaders of the house and senate.

S.V. Airlie
06-10-2016, 08:29 PM
Hey boat fix, half of the SW was owned by Mexico, Mexicans are just coming home!:(

And Trump is 3rd Generation German and 2nd Generation Scottish. We should have denied his ancestors entry, saved us a lot of grief.

Paul Pless
06-10-2016, 08:33 PM
You do know the Obama administration has clearly laid out what they will pass and what they will not. I agree, they should have passed the first or second part of this then let Obama veto it. I'd say the reason is either they know Obama will veto so why waste the time or the Republican leaders do not want immigration reform either and thus you have Trump now. Republican voters are quite sick of the leaders of the house and senate.
With regards to immigration it would seem, given the facts, that your partisan castigation of Democrats is ignorantly misplaced, to say the least.

S.V. Airlie
06-10-2016, 08:34 PM
With regards to immigration it would seem, given the facts, that your partisan castigation of Democrats is ignorantly misplaced, to say the least.No kidding!

Boatfix
06-10-2016, 08:34 PM
Actually, the percent of the Mexican population that's immigrated to the US, both documented and undocumented, is more like about 10%, which is huge and the lying scare tactics of the racist right don't really need to exaggerate that point.

Your flat out wrong, most likely cooked book numbers by the left. I posted a link that shows the estimate of the CIA etc. . Even more persuasive is the research Ann Coulter did for her book "Adios America" which is probably the most realistic study done on the available literature.


From above in this thread.


IJ Review says in 2013, the CIA estimated the total population of Mexico at 120 million.
Voila! (or perhaps I should say “aquí”). Thirty-plus million is basically a quarter of 120 million.
Yes, we have already taken in the equivalent of one-fourth of the population of Mexico. Now do you understand why you have to “press 1 for English?”
This has to end SOMEHOW. And right now it doesn’t look like it’s going to end well.
By the way, here are some other interesting tidbits about global immigration from Ms. Coulter (http://www.anncoulter.com/columns/2015-05-27.html)
> In 1970, there were almost no Nigerian immigrants in the United States. Our country is now home to more Nigerians than any country in the world except Nigeria.
> America takes more immigrants from Nigeria than from England.
> There are more foreign inmates in New York state prisons from Mexico than from the entire continent of Europe.
> Hispanics are less likely to be in the military than either whites or blacks, and a majority of Hispanic troops are women. On the other hand, Hispanics are overrepresented in U.S. Prisons.
> In Denmark, actual Danes come in tenth in criminals’ nationality, after Moroccans, Lebanese, Yugoslavians, Somalis, Iranians, Pakistanis, Turks, Iraqis and Vietnamese.
Getting xenophobic yet?

Norman Bernstein
06-10-2016, 08:44 PM
I agree. I also would like to see common sense immigration reform and enforcement. Let's look at some facts though. Illegal aliens in the United States as well as illegal border crossings rose every year of the Bush presidency and peaked his last year in office. Illegal aliens in country as well as illegal border crossings have decreased every year of Obama's presidency. During Obama's presidency we have seen more deportations each year and in total than during the Bush presidency.

As far as fighting illegal immigration, my strategy would be to investigate, prosecute, and sentence harshly those responsible for hiring undocumented workers. The day a plant manager of a large chicken processing plant goes to prison or the CEO and director of personnel of Fortune 500 company in the service or ag sector goes to prison for hiring undocumented workers, well that'll be the day that we start making a serious dent in the illegal immigration problem in the country.

God will get you, for actually trying to disseminate facts here in the bilge.....

You should know better :)

Boatfix
06-10-2016, 08:47 PM
With regards to immigration it would seem, given the facts, that your partisan castigation of Democrats is ignorantly misplaced, to say the least.

Are you paying attention to what the Obama administration is doing these past couple years. Executive action? 10,000 Syrians scheduled to be brought into the country against most American's wishes. Open borders to minors and others secretly bussing/ flying them around the country with no medical exams. Hello, knock knock, are you awake?

Boatfix
06-10-2016, 08:50 PM
With regards to immigration it would seem, given the facts, that your partisan castigation of Democrats is ignorantly misplaced, to say the least.

Say what you want, at least I'm aware of the truth and that anyone who knows anything about immigration would know we need to seal the border before any other measures will make any difference.

Boatfix
06-10-2016, 08:55 PM
why do you feel the need to lie? is your argument so weak otherwise?

I posted the link to the estimate of the percentage of the Mexican population that has come into the USA illegally.

Reynard38
06-10-2016, 09:05 PM
How long have you been here? Are you by chance, second, or third or, off the boat in 1900? I mean if you are, how can you deny anyone immigrating here?What makes you so special?

I think we need to differentiate between legal immigration (how most of our ancestors got here) and illegally crossing a border.

hokiefan
06-10-2016, 09:39 PM
My god Keith is right. It's RodB in the flesh. Down to the multi-sized,
bolded c&p's.

Durnik
06-10-2016, 10:38 PM
10,000 Syrians scheduled to be brought into the country against most American's wishes.

hmmm, 10,000 Syrians. 330,000,000 'muricans. That's what, .003%? Be Afraid. Be Very Afraid.

I challenge your 'most Americans' claim. Either way, many Americans, sane Americans, are happy for the Syrians (& others) to come. Honestly, I fear far more the irrational, fundy & frightened RRW's.

Sorry, Rod. You're sanity seems unimproved by your vacation.

as for 'common sense immigration control', the natives would have been justified to immediately execute all foreign invaders right from the get-go - not that it would have done any good anyway.

bobby

pipefitter
06-11-2016, 12:20 AM
I think we need to differentiate between legal immigration (how most of our ancestors got here) and illegally crossing a border.

No matter how hard you try, you can't. But then again, that is not why 'some' are in this discussion in the first place.

leikec
06-11-2016, 01:06 AM
I think Keith is right. Next we're going to hear how decent white people can't even visit a food truck in Austin without being menaced by those evil Mexican thugs...

Jeff C

CK 17
06-11-2016, 01:29 AM
Most on this forum have no clue as to the truth about the damage unchecked immigration has on America. this is written in 2015, and leaves out the last year and a half which I will follow up with.
I see a lot of damage from unchecked guns. . . .

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 05:37 AM
I think we need to differentiate between legal immigration (how most of our ancestors got here) and illegally crossing a border.The American natives had borders or territories. All pretty well defined.

Chris Coose
06-11-2016, 05:51 AM
Republicans have been in full control of Congress for some time now, have been in control of both houses for the majority of the last two decades; yet we've seen not one single meaningful piece of legislation aimed at immigration reform from the Republicans in all that time. And you stand here castigating Democrats?

Oooops!

ccmanuals
06-11-2016, 07:26 AM
You have it all wrong. The Obama administration counts "turn arounds as deportations". The Administrations in the past did not. Whether you like it or not, believe it or not, pretty much anything put out by the Obama administration is disinformation. This includes unemployment numbers, folks on food stamps, deportations, or any stats related to Obamacare just to name a few. You need to do some googling on the comments on this by the Border Patrol.



http://money.cnn.com/2016/02/06/news/economy/obama-us-jobs/

http://www.wnd.com/2014/07/obamas-doctored-jobless-rates-masks-danger/

http://nypost.com/2013/11/18/census-faked-2012-election-jobs-report/

Boatfix, you are going to need to up your game. Ann Coulter and WND sources are not going to get it.

Jim Mahan
06-11-2016, 07:42 AM
... completely support the Democrats rapidly changing the demographics in the country...

The class of stupid, greedy, selfish and frightened white bigots is inexorably swirling around the drain, and it's Obama's fault for making it too easy for everyone else to procreate and otherwise go about their business in the land of opportunity for all, the land of the brave and free. How dare they continue a signature tradition of three hundred years standing?

Boatfix
06-11-2016, 08:40 AM
My god Keith is right. It's RodB in the flesh. Down to the multi-sized,
bolded c&p's.

????? WTF Weird

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 08:47 AM
????? WTF WeirdIt is isn't it? You don't see the comparison, that's what's really weird!

Boatfix
06-11-2016, 08:47 AM
Oooops!

Your right, it seems the leadership on both sides do not seem to care about this issue. After the last midterms the Republicans have become disgusted with their leadership thus Trump.

Keith Wilson
06-11-2016, 08:57 AM
????? WTF WeirdThere was a fellow here for a few years who went by the screen name of RodB, also from Texas. He's now banned. Your posts resemble his to a surprising degree; similar political convictions, similar topics of interest, similar writing style, similar way of posting C&P articles with lots of bold and multiple-size fonts, similar feel and tone. I started a thread suggesting that you might be the same person under another screen name, which is frowned upon by management. The thread appears to have disappeared. Apologies if you aren't him; the similarity is remarkable, but I'm sure you aren't the only person in Texas who thinks that way.

Boatfix
06-11-2016, 09:07 AM
There was a fellow here for a few years who went by the screen name of RodB, also from Texas. He's now banned. Your posts resemble his to a surprising degree; similar political convictions, similar topics of interest, similar writing style, similar way of posting C&P articles with lots of bold and multiple-size fonts, similar feel and tone. I started a thread suggesting that you might be the same person under another screen name, which is frowned upon by management. The thread appears to have disappeared. Apologies if you aren't him; the similarity is remarkable, but I'm sure you aren't the only person in Texas who thinks that way.

There might be about 12 million people that think the way I do on many issues especially on immigration, the amount that voted for Trump at least.

leikec
06-11-2016, 09:16 AM
There was a fellow here for a few years who went by the screen name of RodB, also from Texas. He's now banned. Your posts resemble his to a surprising degree; similar political convictions, similar topics of interest, similar writing style, similar way of posting C&P articles with lots of bold and multiple-size fonts, similar feel and tone. I started a thread suggesting that you might be the same person under another screen name, which is frowned upon by management. The thread appears to have disappeared. Apologies if you aren't him; the similarity is remarkable, but I'm sure you aren't the only person in Texas who thinks that way.

Not just Texas, Austin, TX...a remarkable coincidence:D

Jeff C

Dan McCosh
06-11-2016, 09:27 AM
When's the last time we fought with Mexico. 1846.

We should have kept the Germans out. Damn kraut SOBs. We (true Americans) had to fight 'em twice in the last century, killing our men while they were murdering millions in camps, in service to their twisted ideology.

And now the Volkswagen diesel thing. I don't know how any true American can ever trust a German again.

We should deport the whole lot and build a wall. . .somewhere. FWIW, The U.S. Army was fighting with Mexico in 1916.

Boatfix
06-11-2016, 09:27 AM
The class of stupid, greedy, selfish and frightened white bigots is inexorably swirling around the drain, and it's Obama's fault for making it too easy for everyone else to procreate and otherwise go about their business in the land of opportunity for all, the land of the brave and free. How dare they continue a signature tradition of three hundred years standing?

Pie in the sky detachment from reality, isn't California broke because of a perspective like yours with no regard to the welfare of its citizens. Sanctuary cities or for that matter sanctuary states do not have the best interest of the American people in mind but only an ideology run amuck. Legal immigration is a good thing.

Paul Pless
06-11-2016, 09:54 AM
Pie in the sky detachment from reality, isn't California broke because of a perspective like yours with no regard to the welfare of its citizens. Sanctuary cities or for that matter sanctuary states do not have the best interest of the American people in mind but only an ideology run amuck. Legal immigration is a good thing.

It'd be nice if the hyperbole on both sides would decrease a bit. I'm sure I'd really enjoy talking policy with you if you would stick to facts rather than relying on propaganda so much.

Jim Mahan
06-11-2016, 10:09 AM
isn't California broke

No.

http://www.trbimg.com/img-568ec330/turbine/la-jerry-brown-budget-20160107/750/750x422

Look at the chart title, then make be sure to look and see that the big dramatic drop is forecasted, if 'more permanent spending combined with a recession' occurs. Now look at the short black bars indicating a current surplus. Governor Brown is simultaneously increasing funding for education, and for helping the poor, while adding to the state's rainy day fund, for when the economy tanks again.


Pie in the sky detachment from reality...a perspective like yours with no regard to the welfare of its citizens.

That's a real hoot; project much?


Sanctuary cities or for that matter sanctuary states...have the best interest of the American people in mind... Legal immigration is a good thing.

This is true, as long as this part is removed:
...only an ideology run amuck. You're on a roll with the projection.

Self delusion runs strong in this one.

Isn't it just a little ironic that a former forum member, having been deported for violation of the forum's simple rules on civilized participation, should return under another pseudonym to, in effect, illegally immigrate back into the free and mostly left-leaning land of the WBF? What's a life-time ban to a sock puppet, when there are still frothing liberals to challenge?

Or maybe Boatfix really isn't RodB, and it's actually a case of that sliver of the electorate, the twelve million with whom he self-identifies, being Borg, mindlessly assimulated drain-swirlers. Resistance [to reality] is futile.


Apologies if you aren't him; the similarity is remarkable, but I'm sure you aren't the only person in Texas who thinks that way.

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 10:10 AM
http://www.brainyquote.com/photos/a/arnoldhglasow109105.jpg (http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/keywords/facts.html)

Boatfix
06-11-2016, 10:47 AM
It'd be nice if the hyperbole on both sides would decrease a bit. I'd sure I'd really enjoy talking policy with you if you would stick to facts rather than relying on propaganda so much.

Lets start with the reasonable premise that this invasion of approx 1/4 of the population of Mexico over the past 20 years is very damaging to our country and not only financially. You might take a look at "They Come to America" by Dennis Michael Lynch. He has made three films I think and they are all very well done documentary films that show factual situations that cannot be denied. Over the past few years many of those stopped coming into our borders are not mexican and the security of our nation is at risk. Once the border is secured, the solution to the immigration problem will likely be some form of work permit that allows us to know who is in the country along with their paying taxes on their earnings. If you won't even consider the facts about the cost to American of rampant illegal immigration and sanctuary cities its hard to have an objective discussion.


https://youtu.be/YU3BL8O5Gac

bobbys
06-11-2016, 11:01 AM
????? WTF Weird.

If one is not a liberal one is immediately linked to a long gone righty in order to discount what one has to say.

It's paronia..

I was " dutch" for the first 4 thousand posts...

They pick a person they disliked to link the new one, a polite way of saying one must be a jerk like that one was..

It's only used by libs one way.

Keith Wilson
06-11-2016, 11:04 AM
Let's start with the reasonable premise that this invasion of approx 1/4 of the population of Mexico over the past 20 years is very damaging to our country and not only financially'Reasonable premise'? Hardly. No, assuming what you'e trying to demonstrate is perhaps a plausible debating tactic, but it's not a good way toward the truth, nor is using utterly bogus numbers. The immigrant population illegally in the US from Mexico is now about 5.6 million, down from a peak of 6.9 million in 2007. That's about 4.5% of the 122 million population of Mexico, not 1/4. Some real numbers, not propaganda, can be found here. (http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/11/19/5-facts-about-illegal-immigration-in-the-u-s/) The total number is about 11 million, down a bit from a peak of a bit over 12 million in 2007. The number here illegally rose all through the Bush administration, and has been falling slightly during the Obama administration. Trump's unsupported claim that there are really 30 or 34 million illegal immigrants was rated "Pants on Fire' by Politifact, the worst possible rating.

bobbys
06-11-2016, 11:05 AM
No.



That's a real hoot; project much?



This is true, as long as this part is removed: You're on a roll with the projection.

Self delusion runs strong in this one.

Isn't it just a little ironic that a former forum member, having been deported for violation of the forum's simple rules on civilized participation, should return under another pseudonym to, in effect, illegally immigrate back into the free and mostly left-leaning land of the WBF? What's a life-time ban to a sock puppet, when there are still frothing liberals to challenge?

Or maybe Boatfix really isn't RodB, and it's actually a case of that sliver of the electorate, the twelve million with whom he self-identifies, being Borg, mindlessly assimulated drain-swirlers. Resistance [to reality] is futile..

One lib makes the accusation and right off others jump in to discredit the new poster...

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 11:07 AM
You know all about self delusions don't you bobbys?:(

hokiefan
06-11-2016, 11:08 AM
'Reasonable premise'? Hardly. No, assuring what you'e trying to demonstrate is perhaps a plausible debating tactic, but it''s not a good way toward the truth, nor is using utterly bogus numbers. The immigrant population illegally in the US from Mexico is now about 5.6 million, down from a peak of 6.9 million in 2007. That's about 4.5% of the 122 million population of Mexico, not 1/4. Some real numbers, not propaganda, can be found here. (http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/11/19/5-facts-about-illegal-immigration-in-the-u-s/)

Don't go confusing this dude with facts. He doesn't do facts.

Boatfix
06-11-2016, 11:27 AM
'Reasonable premise'? Hardly. No, assuming what you'e trying to demonstrate is perhaps a plausible debating tactic, but it's not a good way toward the truth, nor is using utterly bogus numbers. The immigrant population illegally in the US from Mexico is now about 5.6 million, down from a peak of 6.9 million in 2007. That's about 4.5% of the 122 million population of Mexico, not 1/4. Some real numbers, not propaganda, can be found here. (http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/11/19/5-facts-about-illegal-immigration-in-the-u-s/) The total number is about 11 million, down a bit from a peak of a bit over 12 million in 2007. The number here illegally rose all through the Bush administration, and has been falling slightly during the Obama administration. Trump's unsupported claim that there are really 30 or 34 million illegal immigrants was rated "Pants on Fire' by Politifact, the worst possible rating.

Your article is very doubtful. Lets agree to disagree.
http://dailysignal.com/2015/12/27/you-only-think-you-know-how-many-illegal-immigrants-live-in-the-us/

Keith Wilson
06-11-2016, 11:30 AM
I can't prevent you from disagreeing, but you're consistently using bogus data. You are entitled to your opinions, but not your own facts.

Boatfix
06-11-2016, 11:38 AM
I can't prevent you from disagreeing, but you're consistently using bogus data. You are entitled to your opinions, but not your own facts.

The Heritage foundation garners plenty of credibility and if you read the link I posted you will see the fantasy of so many believing in the number 11 million for so long. Ann Coulter spent a lot of time researching how and where such numbers could be acquired and she also found the basis for the 11 million was a fantasy. It truly is amazing how so many on the left automatically anything written that they disagree with is based completely on lies.

I'll go with the Heritage foundation's review of the facts.

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 11:42 AM
You have to be kidding, right down to the list of potential SC nominees Trump came up with, all right, or far right judges. Just what we need, turning the clock back to the 1800s.Right out of the Heritage Foundation playbook!

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 11:52 AM
As far as fighting illegal immigration, my strategy would be to investigate, prosecute, and sentence harshly those responsible for hiring undocumented workers. The day a plant manager of a large chicken processing plant goes to prison or the CEO and director of personnel of Fortune 500 company in the service or ag sector goes to prison for hiring undocumented workers, well that'll be the day that we start making a serious dent in the illegal immigration problem in the country.

... that was Romney's strategy, impose real and harsh fines on employers and Illegals will "self Deport" for lack of employment.

The Pro Illegal immigration group called the plan Racist... but it was even MORE un popular with the powerful SERVICE INDUSTRY sector of the American economy. Major Multi Million dollar Corporations that PROFIT from the Broken Borders policies of Democrats and Republicans...

At least now we have a candidate who claims he wants to fix the problem.

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 11:53 AM
And Romney lost, go figure!

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 11:58 AM
sobering stuff...

A casual perusal of the "Most Wanted" lists also suggests that the government may not have our best interests in mind when deciding who gets to live in America.

Here is the Los Angeles Police Department's list of "Most Wanted" (http://www.lapdonline.org/top_ten_most_wanted) criminal suspects:

-- Jesse Enrique Monarrez (murder),

-- Cesar Augusto Nistal (child molestation),

-- Jose A. Padilla (murder),

-- Demecio Carlos Perez (murder),

-- Ramon Reyes, (robbery and murder),

-- Victor Vargas (murder),

-- Ruben Villa (murder)

The full "Most Wanted" list (http://www.lapdonline.org/all_most_wanted)doesn't get any better.

There aren't a lot of Mexicans in New York state -- half of all Mexican immigrants in the U.S. live in either Texas or California (http://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/mexican-immigrants-united-states-0) -- and yet there are more Mexican prisoners in New York than there are inmates from all of Western Europe.

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 12:01 PM
Lets start with the reasonable premise that this invasion of approx 1/4 of the population of Mexico over the past 20 years is very damaging to our country and not only financially. You might take a look at "They Come to America" by Dennis Michael Lynch. He has made three films I think and they are all very well done documentary films that show factual situations that cannot be denied. Over the past few years many of those stopped coming into our borders are not mexican and the security of our nation is at risk. Once the border is secured, the solution to the immigration problem will likely be some form of work permit that allows us to know who is in the country along with their paying taxes on their earnings. If you won't even consider the facts about the cost to American of rampant illegal immigration and sanctuary cities its hard to have an objective discussion.


https://youtu.be/YU3BL8O5Gac

25 years of Broken Boarder Illegal Immigration... And then we Look around with a pretend quizical look and wonder "what could possibly be the reason for Wage Stagnation over the past 20 +- years??? Geeee a real mystery."

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 12:25 PM
More like thirty. Reagan your GOP idol just gave them amnesty. And republicans controlled the congress much of those 30 years.

Keith Wilson
06-11-2016, 12:35 PM
Ann Coulter spent a lot of time researching . . . Her record on factual matters is astoundingly bad. I wouldn't believe Ann Coulter if she told me she had pizza for dinner last night without seeing the restaurant receipts, and if you are concerned with facts in the real world rather than something which will reinforce your opinions, you shouldn't either.

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 12:38 PM
I doubt she eats pizza, Heck I doubt she cooks!

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 12:42 PM
More like thirty. Reagan your GOP idol just gave them amnesty. And republicans controlled the congress much of those 30 years.

Yup... thats why so many people are done with BOTH establishment MORONS Dem and Repub they are equally as bad... this year there seems to be a clear choice though.

A vote for Hillary is a vote for increased Illegal Immigration.

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 12:44 PM
So, when did the US let you in?

Ian McColgin
06-11-2016, 12:46 PM
And as Daniel knows well from Trump's business record, a vote for Trump is a vote for rapacious money manipulators to bring in immigrant labor whenever they feel the need to pay less than US citizens can afford.

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 12:46 PM
Why don't you do it yourself as you are so worried about it.Oh why bother, I'll do it for you!



Enact comprehensive immigration reform to create a pathway to citizenship, keep families together, and enable millions of workers to come out of the shadows.

Defend President Obama’s executive actions to provide deportation relief for DREAMers and parents of Americans and lawful residents, and extend those actions to additional persons with sympathetic cases if Congress refuses to act.

Promote naturalization and support immigrant integration.

End family detention and close private immigrant detention centers.

“We have to finally and once and for all fix our immigration system—this is a family issue. It’s an economic issue too, but it is at heart a family issue. If we claim we are for family, then we have to pull together and resolve the outstanding issues around our broken immigration system. The American people support comprehensive immigration reform not just because it’s the right thing to do—and it is—but because it will strengthen families, strengthen our economy, and strengthen our country. That’s why we can’t wait any longer, we can’t wait any longer for a path to full and equal citizenship.”

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 12:55 PM
Well, it isn't deporting 11 million Illegals. For starters, who is going to pay for that along with deporting Muslims at the same time! Are you?

Keith Wilson
06-11-2016, 01:02 PM
Give us a brief description of your immigration policy.I'll give that some thought. Good question, worth the time.

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 01:06 PM
Give us a brief description of your immigration policy

Wow got to remember that one... "Give us a brief description of your immigration policy"

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 01:08 PM
We have, I posted it for you, can you do the same for Trump? Keep in mind, he quit saying they were policies but, suggestions!

Ian McColgin
06-11-2016, 01:09 PM
We have seen from the last few decades that when Republicans tank the economy immigration goes down and when Democrats grow the economy immigration, both legal and illegal, grows. Enforcement has nothing to do with it.

Limiting immigration by causing a bad economy is not something I could favor. My first priority is a vibrant economy, which means limiting the currently extreme concentration of wealth, democratizing economic activity, and reforms to enhance democratic self-governance.

Florida experience with Cubans proves that in a democratic capitalist society immigrants are part of economic growth, not privation, I'd actually not do too much about current immigration laws except create paths to citizenship for those here or getting here.

Once we have a just economy, I'd then examine the facts to determine if immigration is actually a problem and if so, in what way.

For example, most of our "problem" is people from Latin America, especially Mexico. More than most other places in the world, US capital has played an historic role in Latin American repression. If we can change our own economy and our trade laws to help Latin American nations develop actual democratic self-governance and democratic economic institutions, then we will share hemispheric prosperity that will of itself reduce both legal illegal immigration. And while we ought to help in the Islamic world's horrific population displacements, we'll never face that as an unmanageable flood.

Shortest answer - I'd work on almost all aspects of our social economy before turning my attention to immigration. Whether legal or illegal, immigration is not one of the major problems of our society.

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 01:10 PM
Why don't you do it yourself as you are so worried about it.Oh why bother, I'll do it for you!



Enact comprehensive immigration reform to create a pathway to citizenship, keep families together, and enable millions of workers to come out of the shadows.
Defend President Obama’s executive actions to provide deportation relief for DREAMers and parents of Americans and lawful residents, and extend those actions to additional persons with sympathetic cases if Congress refuses to act.
Promote naturalization and support immigrant integration.
End family detention and close private immigrant detention centers.

“We have to finally and once and for all fix our immigration system—this is a family issue. It’s an economic issue too, but it is at heart a family issue. If we claim we are for family, then we have to pull together and resolve the outstanding issues around our broken immigration system. The American people support comprehensive immigration reform not just because it’s the right thing to do—and it is—but because it will strengthen families, strengthen our economy, and strengthen our country. That’s why we can’t wait any longer, we can’t wait any longer for a path to full and equal citizenship.”

so nothing about stoping more illegal immigration... actually sounds like your policys would encourage more illegal immigration, so it would be supported by the big Multinational Corporations and industries that make use of Cheap, Controllable, Exploitable, Illegal labor in the USA already.

The Jobs that the Wealthiest 1 Percent can not EXPORT they IMPORT illegal immigrant labor to fill

Keith Wilson
06-11-2016, 01:11 PM
Florida experience with Cubans proves that in a democratic capitalist society immigrants are part of economic growth, not privation . . .Most immigrants in most places, in fact.

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 01:14 PM
OKAY, go for it but, tell me what the alternative plan is if you have one. It's always easier to complain than come up with your own Daniel!

Just like Obamacare, can't wait to get rid of it but, don't have a better alternative!Even Ted Cruz who wants to eliminate Obamacare had to sign up because his wife's health insurance didn't cover him while she was on sabbatical. Says quite a lot but, he still hates Obamacare even though he was covered by it.

Chip-skiff
06-11-2016, 01:24 PM
FWIW, The U.S. Army was fighting with Mexico in 1916.

That rant was satire, amigo. I hope you didn't take it serious-like.

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 01:25 PM
so nothing about stoping more illegal immigration... actually sounds like your policys would encourage more illegal immigration, so it would be supported by the big Multinational Corporations and industries that make use of Cheap, Controllable, Exploitable, Illegal labor in the USA already.

The Jobs that the Wealthiest 1 Percent can not EXPORT they IMPORT illegal immigrant labor to fill

It's all about driving DOWN the cost of production, a big percentage of that is Labor costs, especially in Industries like Home Construction, Agriculture, Retail, Food Services...

To reduce the cost of labor in the economy industry PROFITS by importing Illegal Immigrants to under cut wages and keep wages LOW. Then they take money from the middle class and use it to subsudize the income of the Poor through Welfare Payments, ensuring that the poor never make it into the middle class but ensuring they at least have enough money to put gas in the car to make it to work.

Also Industry gets the Government to tax the middle class and pay for educating an Illegal Immigrant work force that US Citizens must then compete against in the JOB MARKET...

BrianW
06-11-2016, 01:28 PM
So do I! Proud of knowing them too!

How magnanimous of you. :D

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 01:29 PM
Sounds like the republican way of life, practiced indiscriminately at that. Yup, make the 1% richer at all costs.

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 01:29 PM
Sounds like the republican way of life, practiced indiscriminately at that. Yup, make the 1% richer at all costs.

Then why is it the Democrats who have so much big business support? Why are Dems in favour of Broken Borders?

Why do you Dems think we have a Porous Border with Mexico? You really dont' believe the silly children's story that it is TOOOO BIG a border to patrol and secure???

The Border is Broken because major US Industries and Corporations WANT it to be BROKEN.

Ian McColgin
06-11-2016, 01:31 PM
"Thats all mumbo jumbo...give us a brief description of your immigration policy" [#95]

Let me dumb it down a bit then.

I could favor a bit of justice reform for those already here and for those who manage to evade existing laws in the near future but beyond that I do not have an immigration policy that fits the current conditions.

It is impossible to craft a policy to justly fit an unjust society.

For that reason, first things first.

We must limit excess concentration of wealth, democratize major parts of our economic system, and make the political reforms consistent with democratic self-governance. Once we get on that road, we can study the impacts of immigration and determine whether by direct means such as quotas or indirect means by playing a role in global economic justice rather than our current exportation of oppression. I rather fancy the latter.

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 01:32 PM
I did, you asked for a brief summary which you complained about. (nothing new there). I expect the same courtesy in return but, haven't gotten it!

BrianW
06-11-2016, 01:35 PM
I agree. I also would like to see common sense immigration reform and enforcement. Let's look at some facts though. Illegal aliens in the United States as well as illegal border crossings rose every year of the Bush presidency and peaked his last year in office. Illegal aliens in country as well as illegal border crossings have decreased every year of Obama's presidency. During Obama's presidency we have seen more deportations each year and in total than during the Bush presidency.

As far as fighting illegal immigration, my strategy would be to investigate, prosecute, and sentence harshly those responsible for hiring undocumented workers. The day a plant manager of a large chicken processing plant goes to prison or the CEO and director of personnel of Fortune 500 company in the service or ag sector goes to prison for hiring undocumented workers, well that'll be the day that we start making a serious dent in the illegal immigration problem in the country.

Holding employers responsible is a good common sense policy.

In your first paragraph, it seems though you are comparing two different matrix's. For Bush, you're quoting number of illegal aliens entering the US, and for Obama, you're quoting the number deported. Fairly different activities. We need stats for each.

If we're seeing more deportations under Obama, could that mean more are getting in, hence a need for a better 'fence'? ;)

BrianW
06-11-2016, 01:38 PM
Republicans have been in full control of Congress for some time now, have been in control of both houses for the majority of the last two decades; yet we've seen not one single meaningful piece of legislation aimed at immigration reform from the Republicans in all that time. And you stand here castigating Democrats?

Neither Party has a good record on this issue. One candidate used to be for a "fence", but now chastises the other for wanting to build a "wall".

So which candidate is at least being honest about their policy, and which one is pandering to a certain population. ;)

BrianW
06-11-2016, 01:41 PM
Here's our man Paul...


Gary Johnson on Immigration Libertarian presidential nominee; former Republican NM Governor

Arizona anti-immigrant law leads to racial profiling Immigration is an issue on which most of the so-called "mainstream" politicians in the US have shown a striking LACK of courage. A 2010 interview reported [on my] disdain for hardliners [regarding] the incendiary new immigration law passed in AZ: "I just don't think it's going to work," he says. "I think it's going to lead to racial profiling. I don't know how you determine one individual from another--is it color of skin? --as to whether one is an American citizen or the other is an illegal immigrant." Source: Seven Principles, by Gary Johnson, p.126-127 , Aug 1, 2012
A 10-foot wall just requires an 11-foot ladder [One journalist] noted, rightly, that I favor an expansive guest worker program and am uncomfortable with the idea of mass deportation. So, he asked me about the idea of increasing security by means of a border wall."I have never been supportive of the wall," I answered. "A 10-foot wall just requires an 11-foot ladder."
Source: Seven Principles, by Gary Johnson, p.127 , Aug 1, 2012
2 year grace period for illegals to get work visas
Potential immigrants should be issued a Social Security card, which would allow them to pay taxes.
There should be a two-year grace period for illegal immigrants to attain work visas so they can continue contributing to America and begin taking part in American society openly.
Immigrants should be able to bring their families to the US after demonstrating ability to support them financially.

Source: 2012 presidential campaign website, garyjohnson2012.com , Nov 15, 2011
1 strike & you're out for legal immigrants who violate terms
It should be easier for a potential immigrant to get a work visa.
Streamline the legal immigration process to reduce illegal immigration and allow the U.S. to know who enters the country and for what reasons.

Enforce a 'one strike, you're out' rule for immigrants who circumvent the streamlined work visa process.
Impose and enforce sanctions on employers for noncompliance with immigration laws.



http://www.ontheissues.org/2012/Gary_Johnson_Immigration.htm

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 01:53 PM
Neither Party has a good record on this issue. One candidate used to be for a "fence", but now chastises the other for wanting to build a "wall".

So which candidate is at least being honest about their policy, and which one is pandering to a certain population. ;)

a "fence"... right

http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/736x/0b/ec/04/0bec04658e84fb81ed5f8a9a8d82f36a.jpg

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 01:56 PM
Sounds like the republican way of life, practiced indiscriminately at that. Yup, make the 1% richer at all costs.


Then why is it the Democrats who have so much big business support? Why are Dems in favour of Broken Borders?

Why do you Dems think we have a Porous Border with Mexico? You really dont' believe the silly children's story that it is TOOOO BIG a border to patrol and secure???

The Border is Broken because major US Industries and Corporations WANT it to be BROKEN.

The Broken Borders "policy" is a PRO-Big Business, Wealthiest 1 Percent policy, supported by Democrats and Republican Elites... not the Republican BASE.

Illegal Immigration benefits the Wealthy... as we have seen over the past 20+- years

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 02:02 PM
The borders aren't broken. But, that's no excuse to build a wall. 100% living in the US came as immigrants or were the descendants of immigrants and their are some here who want to deny everyone, anyone from coming. You may as well return the Statue of Liberty to France. Doesn't work here unless they are WASPS LIKE YOU APPARENTLY. I bet some are here who came over after the Irish Famine, late 1840's. A lot of Catholics and there were a lot of people demanding the gov. not to take them then too but, brains prevailed, and we have a lot of Irish Catholics living here with few problems other than the gift of Blarney!:(

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 02:09 PM
http://www.fasttrackteaching.com/burns/Unit_4_Cities/Irish_cartoon_1883_dbloc_smaller.gif (https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&ved=0ahUKEwjkh5aR1qDNAhXFpx4KHZiLDGMQjRwIBw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.fasttrackteaching.com%2Fburns %2FUnit_4_Cities%2FU4_Immigrants_and_Discriminatio n.html&psig=AFQjCNHdBoh2sDxu0aEvfZP0XIptAw3Cpg&ust=1465758459531039)

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 02:13 PM
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/48/15/c6/4815c667ba3ab9319118b83ecd537e86.jpg (https://www.pinterest.com/cartoonpic/satire/)

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 02:15 PM
The borders aren't broken. But, that's no excuse to build a wall. 100% living in the US came as immigrants or were the descendants of immigrants and their are some here who want to deny everyone, anyone from coming. You may as well return the Statue of Liberty to France. Doesn't work here unless they are WASPS LIKE YOU APPARENTLY. I bet some are here who came over after the Irish Famine, late 1840's. A lot of Catholics and there were a lot of people demanding the gov. not to take them then too but, brains prevailed, and we have a lot of Irish Catholics living here with few problems other than the gift of Blarney!:(

Pro Broken Borders propaganda always makes arguments on the basis of EMOTION, (they cant just come out and say to the citizens "this is going to be bad for you but great for BIG BUSINESS) either appealing to the plight of potential Illegal Immigrants (a potent argument for any one with a heart) or sites some sillyness about how we are all immigrants...

OK we are all Immigrants (lets leave the illegal part off for the moment)

how did that work out for the Native Americans? Was Immigration all Roses, Free Ice cream and fluffy Unicorns for them?... can Immigration be BAD for the citizens of a country?

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 02:18 PM
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/48/15/c6/4815c667ba3ab9319118b83ecd537e86.jpg (https://www.pinterest.com/cartoonpic/satire/)

dont forget the Native Americans didnt want the WASP's to immigrate

http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/736x/24/e7/11/24e7114a1b9df4c46d353dc68f16c584.jpg

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 02:20 PM
http://www.mapspictures.com/ireland/history/Victorian-Health-Work-Employment-Immigration-Cartoons-Punch-Magazine-Leech-1848-07-15-27.jpg (http://www.mapspictures.com/ireland/history/ireland_population.php)

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 02:22 PM
dont forget the Native Americans didnt want the WASP's to immigrate

http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/736x/24/e7/11/24e7114a1b9df4c46d353dc68f16c584.jpgWell, They didn't keep us out did they! Three of my ancestors were on THE BOAT.

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 02:24 PM
http://www.mapspictures.com/ireland/history/Victorian-Health-Work-Employment-Immigration-Cartoons-Punch-Magazine-Leech-1848-07-15-27.jpg (http://www.mapspictures.com/ireland/history/ireland_population.php)

If only it were that easy... wouldn't it be grand!

Pro Broken Borders propaganda always makes arguments on the basis of EMOTION, (they cant just come out and say to the citizens "this is going to be bad for you but great for BIG BUSINESS) either appealing to the plight of potential Illegal Immigrants or sites some sillyness about how we are all immigrants...

OK we are all Immigrants (lets leave the illegal part off for the moment)

how did that work out for the Native Americans? Was Immigration all Roses, Free Ice cream and fluffy Unicorns for them?... can Immigration be BAD for the citizens of a country?

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 02:24 PM
Well, They didn't keep us out did they!

Not for lack of TRYING...

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 02:28 PM
Not for lack of TRYING...I don't think they tried actually, the Indians far outnumbered the Pilgrims. I think there were 52 members who survived on the Mayflower.

And yes, one of the blights on American History, the treatment of many Native Americans I won't deny was horrendous!.

Much because of greed which the GOP exhibits much of the time now in Congress!

Gerarddm
06-11-2016, 02:35 PM
Anybody citing Ann Coulter and Jeff Sessions as authoritative sources is seriously in need of therapy, which I am unwlling to devote the time to. Onto Ignore you go.

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 02:36 PM
Well, They didn't keep us out did they! Three of my ancestors were on THE BOAT.


I don't think they tried actually, the Indians far outnumbered the Pilgrims. I think there were 52 members who survived on the Mayflower.

And yes, one of the blights on American History, the treatment of many Native Americans I won't deny was horrendous!.

Much because of greed which the GOP exhibits much of the time now in Congress!

It's actually a very interesting story around here in Newengland.

the Local Massachuset tribe was severly weakened by Small Pox about 1600 some historians estimate as much as 80% death rates among the tribe. Tribes to the west who had always admired the temperate costal climates and fertile land of the Massachuset began to threaten their very survival. The Chief Masconomet petitioned the Puritans to settle among his people because he saw them as a saviour from the tribes to the west, and so the English settled essex and middlesex county.

In a similar way the USA body Politic has been weakened, split into waring camps, by the Disease of Liberalism, the Counter Culture has spread like a Pox and it's members are looking to Illegal Immigrants to bolster it's voting power to over power and defeat Traditional American Values.

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 02:44 PM
Yup, small pox brought in from Europe. What western tribes were you referring to by the way! Crows, Blackfeet Sioux, maybe Apache!:(The Indian post you put up was not an eastern tribe!

Basically, the Pilgrims were accepted, otherwise they wouldn't have survived. As I said, only 52 survived the first year. How depleted did the American natives have to be to utterly destroy them. Look what happened or assumed to have happened in Roanoke!

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 02:46 PM
... keep guessing, just one more "iconic" tribe to go... think of a very trendy Hair Style...

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 02:53 PM
I'm not guessing that much, I'm using facts and logic. I have no idea what you are using nor what you are basing your comments on. Yup, there have been stories but, I refer to journals written at the time, not heresay.

Kevin T
06-11-2016, 02:56 PM
How is this relevant to the OP. This is all about enforcing our immigrations laws. Over 1/4 of the population of Mexico have come into this country, see below. We either have a country or not. Borders, language and culture make a nation.

In a nation of immigrants? Get real, or better yet, ask a native american what they think of the bolded part of your claim above.

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 03:00 PM
Daniel, you notice the epidemic mentioned started in 1614. So, as the Mayflower is 1620, therefore, the epidemic may not have been small pox. Please note, the Indians mentioned were not western tribes.

Much of what is known about early Wampanoag history comes from archaeological evidence, the Wampanoag oral tradition (much of which has been lost), and documents created by seventeenth-century English colonists.
The Wampanoag people have lived in southeastern New England for thousands of years. In 1600 there were as many as 12,000 Wampanoag who lived in forty villages. Both oral tradition and archaeological evidence suggests that Native peoples lived in the area for 10,000 years. Wampanoag means “People of the Dawn” in the Algonquian language. There were sixty-seven tribes and bands of the Wampanoag Nation. Three epidemics swept across New England between 1614 and 1620, killing many Native peoples. Some villages were entirely wiped out (such as Patuxet). When the colonists we now call Pilgrims arrived in 1620, there were fewer than 2,000 Wampanoag. After English colonists settled in Massachusetts, epidemics continued to reduce the Wampanoag to 1,000 by 1675. Only 400 survived King Philip’s War. Today there are 3,000 Wampanoag who are organized in five groups: Assonet, Gay Head, Herring Pond, Mashpee, and Namasket.
EUROPEAN COLONISTSIn 1620, a group of Europeans, today called Pilgrims, landed and settled around Cape Cod.
One band of Wampanoag, led by Sachem (or leader) Massasoit, made an alliance with these colonists. The Wampanoag population had been greatly reduced by epidemics. The Wampanoag believed that the colonists, with their powerful weapons, could be an ally in the case of a Narragansett attack. The colonists also could benefit from the alliance. The Wampanoag, Samoset, and Tisquantum all helped these Europeans learn how to adapt to the land in this “New World.” The two groups cooperated for some time. The colonists actively worked to convert the Wampanoag to Christianity. Those who did convert were called “praying Indians.” There were many differences between the groups, which eventually led to conflicts. For example, colonists let their livestock run loose and destroy Wampanoag crops. Still, the treaty was honored until 1662, when Metacomet, known to the English as King Philip, became the tribe’s leader, and relations between the Wampanoag and colonists became very tense. In 1675, hostilities broke out in the town of Swansea. The conflict, know as King Philip’s War, soon spread to the New Hampshire and Connecticut colonies. King Philip’s War was one of the bloodiest and costliest wars in American history.

bobbys
06-11-2016, 03:00 PM
I thought some Indian tribes killed ,took slaves ,tortured to keep their borders

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 03:02 PM
They did, what's your point? Captured enemies often became slaves if they were young and worked.

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 03:26 PM
Daniel, you notice the epidemic mentioned started in 1614. So, as the Mayflower is 1620, therefore, the epidemic may not have been small pox. Please note, the Indians mentioned were not western tribes.

Much of what is known about early Wampanoag history comes from archaeological evidence, the Wampanoag oral tradition (much of which has been lost), and documents created by seventeenth-century English colonists.
The Wampanoag people have lived in southeastern New England for thousands of years. In 1600 there were as many as 12,000 Wampanoag who lived in forty villages. Both oral tradition and archaeological evidence suggests that Native peoples lived in the area for 10,000 years. Wampanoag means “People of the Dawn” in the Algonquian language. There were sixty-seven tribes and bands of the Wampanoag Nation. Three epidemics swept across New England between 1614 and 1620, killing many Native peoples. Some villages were entirely wiped out (such as Patuxet). When the colonists we now call Pilgrims arrived in 1620, there were fewer than 2,000 Wampanoag. After English colonists settled in Massachusetts, epidemics continued to reduce the Wampanoag to 1,000 by 1675. Only 400 survived King Philip’s War. Today there are 3,000 Wampanoag who are organized in five groups: Assonet, Gay Head, Herring Pond, Mashpee, and Namasket.
EUROPEAN COLONISTS

In 1620, a group of Europeans, today called Pilgrims, landed and settled around Cape Cod.
One band of Wampanoag, led by Sachem (or leader) Massasoit, made an alliance with these colonists. The Wampanoag population had been greatly reduced by epidemics. The Wampanoag believed that the colonists, with their powerful weapons, could be an ally in the case of a Narragansett attack. The colonists also could benefit from the alliance. The Wampanoag, Samoset, and Tisquantum all helped these Europeans learn how to adapt to the land in this “New World.” The two groups cooperated for some time. The colonists actively worked to convert the Wampanoag to Christianity. Those who did convert were called “praying Indians.” There were many differences between the groups, which eventually led to conflicts. For example, colonists let their livestock run loose and destroy Wampanoag crops. Still, the treaty was honored until 1662, when Metacomet, known to the English as King Philip, became the tribe’s leader, and relations between the Wampanoag and colonists became very tense. In 1675, hostilities broke out in the town of Swansea. The conflict, know as King Philip’s War, soon spread to the New Hampshire and Connecticut colonies. King Philip’s War was one of the bloodiest and costliest wars in American history.

"western tribes"... no of course not, from my post... "tribes to the West" Western Mass, Connecticut river area

Our local Tribes were not Wampanoag, Masconomet was chief of the Agawam, Algonquin

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 03:31 PM
Not what you wrote but, I'll accept your correction. I still have my doubts as there were coastal tribes involved. Mainly the Narragansett which is not an MA tribe. The name alone should tell you that!

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 03:35 PM
In a nation of immigrants? Get real, or better yet, ask a native american what they think of the bolded part of your claim above.

Seriously... and while your at it as a Native American if UN-Controlled Illegal Immigration worked out well for them.

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 03:36 PM
Not what you wrote but, I'll accept your correction. I still have my doubts as there were coastal tribes involved. Mainly the Narragansett which is not an MA tribe. The name alone should tell you that!
it is... I didn't change it "tribes to the west"... go back to my post, it's un-edited...

sure sounds reasonable, I had heard the story as possible Mohawk encroachment...

Boatfix
06-11-2016, 03:37 PM
In a nation of immigrants? Get real, or better yet, ask a native american what they think of the bolded part of your claim above.

Let me get this straight, it is wrong to enforce our immigration laws? We don't have the right to protect our sovereignty? It this your looney tunes policy?

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 03:39 PM
Regardless, you reds don't want immigration, you want the US to be your little fiefdom inhibited by people just like you. I'd almost think you are a member of the KKK by how you act.

By the way, Narragansett, RI is south of MA.:(

Ian McColgin
06-11-2016, 03:42 PM
The issues of Native American cultures, especially the preColumbian cultures, have been profoundly rethought since many of us were in school. It's a side issue to today's immigration anyway, but for those interested, I recommend "1491: New Revelations of the Americas Before Columbus", Charles C. Mann, 2005.

Chris Smith porter maine
06-11-2016, 03:43 PM
I agree with Paul on this one go after the employers, even down to the guy who hires an illegal to mow his lawn or picks up a couple as day workers at the home depot, as well as the regular. First offence $10,000 per head, second $25,000 per head, third offence $25,000 and thirty day in jail per head. No money here for illegals they will not come, no wall needed.

BrianW
06-11-2016, 03:44 PM
Well, They didn't keep us out did they! Three of my ancestors were on THE BOAT.

One of these?..


The Solutrean hypothesis, first proposed in 1998, is a hypothesis (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypothesis) about the settlement of the Americas (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Settlement_of_the_Americas) that claims that people from Europe (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europe) may have been among the earliest settlers of the Americas (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americas).[1] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solutrean_hypothesis#cite_note-1)[2] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solutrean_hypothesis#cite_note-2) Its notable proponents include Dennis Stanford (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dennis_Stanford) of the Smithsonian Institution (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smithsonian_Institution) and Bruce Bradley of the University of Exeter (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Exeter).[3] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solutrean_hypothesis#cite_note-3) The Solutrean Hypothesis contrasts with the mainstream archaeological view that the North American continent was first populated by people from Asia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asia), either by the Bering land bridge (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bering_land_bridge) (i.e. Beringia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beringia)) at least 13,500 years ago,[4] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solutrean_hypothesis#cite_note-4) by maritime travel along the Pacific coast, or by both.
According to the Solutrean hypothesis (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypothesis), people of the Solutrean (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solutrean) culture, 21,000 to 17,000 years ago,[5] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solutrean_hypothesis#cite_note-5) in Ice Age (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Last_glacial_period) Europe migrated to North America (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_America) by boat along the pack ice (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pack_ice) of the north Atlantic Ocean. They brought their methods of making stone tools (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithic_technology) with them and provided the basis for the later (c. 13,000 years ago) Clovis (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clovis_culture) technology that spread throughout North America. The hypothesis is based on similarities between European Solutrean and Clovis lithic technologies.
Supporters of the Solutrean hypothesis refer to recent archaeological finds such as those at Cactus Hill (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cactus_Hill) in Virginia, Meadowcroft Rockshelter (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meadowcroft_Rockshelter) in Pennsylvania, and Miles Point in Maryland as evidence of a transitional phase between Solutrean lithic technology and what was later to become Clovis technology.
In 2009, anthropologist David Meltzer criticized the hypothesis, stating, "Few if any archaeologists (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archaeology)—or, for that matter, geneticists (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geneticists), linguists (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linguistics), or physical anthropologists (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biological_anthropology)—take seriously the idea of a Solutrean colonization (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colonization) of America."[6] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solutrean_hypothesis#cite_note-6)

Paul Girouard
06-11-2016, 03:47 PM
I agree with Paul on this one go after the employers, even down to the guy who hires an illegal to mow his lawn or picks up a couple as day workers at the home depot, as well as the regular. First offence $10,000 per head, second $25,000 per head, third offence $25,000 and thirty day in jail per head. No money here for illegals they will not come, no wall needed.

That's a great plan, how many police of border patrol agents will you hire , how many prison camps will you build?
Maybe pay other citizens to "turn in their neighbors" for cash rewards!
Where's the SS when you need them?

BrianW
06-11-2016, 03:48 PM
dont forget the Native Americans didnt want the WASP's to immigrate

http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/736x/24/e7/11/24e7114a1b9df4c46d353dc68f16c584.jpg


Well, They didn't keep us out did they! Three of my ancestors were on THE BOAT.

How'd that work out for the Native Americans?

:D

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 03:48 PM
I agree with Paul on this one go after the employers, even down to the guy who hires an illegal to mow his lawn or picks up a couple as day workers at the home depot, as well as the regular. First offence $10,000 per head, second $25,000 per head, third offence $25,000 and thirty day in jail per head. No money here for illegals they will not come, no wall needed.

It's a great idea... that BIG BUSINESS hates!!!

Romney proposed just this during his run for the WH and was labled a Racist... Par for the course, the R word has lost all meaning due to overuse-Abuse by Liberals... like the word Awsome does not mean Awesome any more

Racist is just a political attack word that means "the political opponent of a Leftist"

Boatfix
06-11-2016, 03:49 PM
I agree with Paul on this one go after the employers, even down to the guy who hires an illegal to mow his lawn or picks up a couple as day workers at the home depot, as well as the regular. First offence $10,000 per head, second $25,000 per head, third offence $25,000 and thirty day in jail per head. No money here for illegals they will not come, no wall needed.

This might work.

S.V. Airlie
06-11-2016, 03:55 PM
This might work.No it won't Republicans want profits, they won't pass anything to break the chain between the company, the immigrants and their pockets. The 1% would go ape shyte!

BrianW
06-11-2016, 04:12 PM
No it won't Republicans want profits, they won't pass anything to break the chain between the company, the immigrants and their pockets. The 1% would go ape shyte!

How do you correlate this statement with Trump's desire to build a wall to stop illegal immigration?

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 06:01 PM
That's a great plan, how many police of border patrol agents will you hire , how many prison camps will you build?
Maybe pay other citizens to "turn in their neighbors" for cash rewards!
Where's the SS when you need them?

The Border is Broken because major US Industries and Corporations WANT it to be BROKEN.

It's all about driving DOWN the cost of production, a big percentage of that is Labor costs, especially in Industries like Home Construction, Agriculture, Retail, Food Services...

To reduce the cost of labor in the economy industry PROFITS by importing Illegal Immigrants to under cut wages and keep wages LOW. Then they take money from the middle class and use it to subsudize the income of the Poor through Welfare Payments, ensuring that the poor never make it into the middle class but ensuring they at least have enough money to put gas in the car to make it to work.

Also Industry gets the Government to tax the middle class and pay for educating an Illegal Immigrant work force that US Citizens must then compete against in the JOB MARKET...

The Jobs that the Wealthiest 1 Percent can not EXPORT they IMPORT illegal immigrant labor to fill

BrianW
06-11-2016, 07:55 PM
The Border is Broken because major US Industries and Corporations WANT it to be BROKEN.

It's all about driving DOWN the cost of production, a big percentage of that is Labor costs, especially in Industries like Home Construction, Agriculture, Retail, Food Services...

To reduce the cost of labor in the economy industry PROFITS by importing Illegal Immigrants to under cut wages and keep wages LOW. Then they take money from the middle class and use it to subsudize the income of the Poor through Welfare Payments, ensuring that the poor never make it into the middle class but ensuring they at least have enough money to put gas in the car to make it to work.

Also Industry gets the Government to tax the middle class and pay for educating an Illegal Immigrant work force that US Citizens must then compete against in the JOB MARKET...

The Jobs that the Wealthiest 1 Percent can not EXPORT they IMPORT illegal immigrant labor to fill

Since you and Jamie share the same viewpoint on this issue, it's only fair I ask you the same question I asked him...

"How do you correlate this statement with Trump's desire to build a wall to stop illegal immigration?"

ccmanuals
06-11-2016, 08:15 PM
Neither Party has a good record on this issue. One candidate used to be for a "fence", but now chastises the other for wanting to build a "wall".

So which candidate is at least being honest about their policy, and which one is pandering to a certain population. ;)

Brian, that's not entirely accurate.

Republicans and democrats in the REPUBLICAN controlled Senate spent a year hammering out a very comprehensive and bipartisan immigration bill that addressed all aspects including border security, what to do about illegal aliens already here and a host of other issues to help solve the problem.

The Senate sent the bill to the REPUBLICAN controlled House and not only did they refuse to vote on the bill they refused to even talk about it or even send it to committee so they could talk about it.

So why do people like Daniel or Bobbys believe that somehow Trump and the republicans will solve the immigration problem? That is a real mystery.

Reynard38
06-11-2016, 08:20 PM
The American natives had borders or territories. All pretty well defined.

And they enforced those territories very vigorously.

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 08:35 PM
Since you and Jamie share the same viewpoint on this issue, it's only fair I ask you the same question I asked him...

"How do you correlate this statement with Trump's desire to build a wall to stop illegal immigration?"

According to Trump... He is not a member of the Establishment, and has enough money that he does not need to be BOUGHT by corporate interests, like he claims Clinton is.

Trump likens the Presidency to being CEO of a major corporation, he claims he is accountable to the United States voters and not SPECIAL INTERESTS, neither Corporations or Illegal Immigrant special interest groups... Groups that Clinton is obliged to KOW TOW to in order to harvest enough votes to win the election.

Paul Pless
06-11-2016, 08:39 PM
Trump likens the Presidency to being CEO of a major corporation
A couple of problems with this being, a. The United States is not a corporation. and b. Trump is not a particularly good CEO.

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 08:39 PM
Brian, that's not entirely accurate.

Republicans and democrats in the REPUBLICAN controlled Senate spent a year hammering out a very comprehensive and bipartisan immigration bill that addressed all aspects including border security, what to do about illegal aliens already here and a host of other issues to help solve the problem.

The Senate sent the bill to the REPUBLICAN controlled House and not only did they refuse to vote on the bill they refused to even talk about it or even send it to committee so they could talk about it.

So why do people like Daniel or Bobbys believe that somehow Trump and the republicans will solve the immigration problem? That is a real mystery.

??? yeah a real HEAD SCRATCHER... mabey because they at least acknowledge it as an issue.

For the Democrats Illegal Immigration is a winning VOTE HARVESTING tool and the more IMMIGRATION they allow the better, there is NO hope with HILLARY

Daniel Noyes
06-11-2016, 08:40 PM
A couple of problems with this being, a. The United States is not a corporation. and b. Trump is not a particularly good CEO.

It seems that Trump uses it as a metaphor... LIKE or AS ... not an exact correlation

Jim Mahan
06-11-2016, 10:17 PM
He's also no good at metaphors. There's no indication by anything he's spouted that he even knows what a metaphor is. Or a compound sentence. Or a complete sentence.

Kevin T
06-11-2016, 10:32 PM
A couple of problems with this being, a. The United States is not a corporation. and b. Trump is not a particularly good CEO.

And he is not going to be able to snap his cocked wrist forward in a cobra strike like movement and utter; "you're fired!" to Senators and Congressmen.

Paul Girouard
06-11-2016, 10:42 PM
And he is not going to be able to snap his cocked wrist forward in a cobra strike like movement and utter; "you're fired!" to Senators and Congressmen.
You're right about that , yet we keep re-electing the same people to the same office. Term limits would reduce that.

BrianW
06-11-2016, 10:51 PM
Brian, that's not entirely accurate.

Republicans and democrats in the REPUBLICAN controlled Senate spent a year hammering out a very comprehensive and bipartisan immigration bill...

The Senate sent the bill to the REPUBLICAN controlled House and not only did they refuse to vote on the bill they refused to even talk about it or even send it to committee so they could talk about it.

The failure to address immigration issues goes back at least 30 years that I'm aware of, so one incident doesn't make it a partisan issue.

S/V Laura Ellen
06-12-2016, 01:20 AM
I'll answer this one lame post. We are talking about illegal immigration which has led to 1/4 of the population of Mexico invading this nation in recent times. The USA allows more than one million legal immigrants to come into the US every year. These are two distinctly different issues. Get it?
In just 4 recent times Mexico will be empty and there will therefore be no reason for a fence.

oznabrag
06-12-2016, 02:05 AM
We should simply annex Mexico.

Problem solved!

Kevin T
06-12-2016, 05:28 AM
You're right about that , yet we keep re-electing the same people to the same office. Term limits would reduce that.

I'm all for that (term limits) but then we're faced with some structural problems. If every four years, or 6 or 8 years we turn over a large portion of our legislative bodies at the state and federal level we are then faced with the reality of having a bunch of angry individuals attempting to build coalitions with people they don't know and lots of important stuff never gets done.

How much can get done if the people running things are unaware of the required processes to enact laws, heck it could take these newbies several months just to find the keys to the bathroom.