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Rum_Pirate
09-26-2015, 09:26 PM
While I was in West Marine - yesterday in Florida - and spotted Woodenboat magazine and had a flick through it, as I particularly want to get the issue with the obituary (if there is one) on Philip Walwyn, my late friend and builder/owner of KATE.

I was very surprised at the quality of the paper it was printed on, and this was a deciding factor in not purchasing it.

Anyone else here seen or read the magazine recently?


WoodenBoat 246, September/October 2015Table of Contents http://www.woodenboat.com/sites/default/files/application-pdf.png (http://www.woodenboat.com/sites/default/files/pdf/woodenboat246-toc.pdf)
http://www.woodenboat.com/sites/default/files/issue-covers/246-covers.jpg
FEATURES


How I Build a Boat — Finding beauty in simplicity by Willits Ansel

The Rebirth of Skuutje WR60 — The rescue of an 1840 Dutch herring boat by Tjeerdo Wieberdink and Kees Hos

Seamarks: Three Pivotal Designs by L. Francis Herreshoff — Part Three: The WHIRLWIND Debacle by Roger C. Taylor

The Case for the Gaff Vang — An important line missing on most gaff rigs by David Soule

Runabout Restoration — New life for a varnished classic: Part 1 by Paul Brackley

A Sound Boat and Simple Living — Reflections on 10 years of voyaging on a traditional wooden boat by Bruce Halabisky

Technology in the Boatshop — The state of the art by Brendan Riordan

Getting Started in Boats — A Small Outboard Motor Primer— Tear-out supplement by Jan Adkins

Cover: VIXEN reached Hawaii in 2015 to “close the circle” on a 10-year circumnavigation by author Bruce Halabisky and Tiffany Loney, who had two daughters en route. The 34′ gaff cutter designed by William and John Atkin, he writes, was ideally suited to the voyage.
Photograph by Jay Johnson.
- See more at: http://www.woodenboat.com/current-issue-woodenboat-magazine#sthash.lvN536Tf.dpuf

CWSmith
09-26-2015, 09:28 PM
You mean thin?

S.V. Airlie
09-26-2015, 09:37 PM
If there is an issue, there is probably a good reason, cost to produce would be major. A desire to keep the issues at a reasonable price in the market. It might be great to have glossy pages in every issue if you want to pay the prices charged. I don't know what the price of NG is now if it is still full of glossy pics and pics. I do suspect it's not what I paid for a subscription in 1970. $7.50 a year.

Rum_Pirate
09-26-2015, 09:37 PM
You mean thin?
The mag is of a decent thickness.

The pages were of a 'lower' quality newspaper(?) paper? It is a little difficult to describe. It was - to me - uninviting.

S.V. Airlie
09-26-2015, 09:39 PM
So, being glossy means that it's only worth reading if it is. The content/text is unimportant. Okay, have WB go back to glossy pages and everyone can be charged more for subscriptions

Ian McColgin
09-26-2015, 09:41 PM
Production values seem first class on my subscription.

Rum_Pirate
09-26-2015, 09:43 PM
If there is an issue, there is probably a good reason, cost to produce would be major. A desire to keep the issues at a reasonable price in the market. It might be great to have glossy pages in every issue if you want to pay the prices charged. I don't know what the price of NG is now if it is still full of glossy pics and pics. I do suspect it's not what I paid for a subscription in 1970. $7.50 a year.


My concern was the quality (lack thereof) of the paper it was printed on.

It is now $31.90 - $45.00 pa. and it is produced bi-monthly.

So about $5.32 - $7.50 per issue.
Mind you a lot will depend on circulation numbers.

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$31.90
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D

S.V. Airlie
09-26-2015, 09:47 PM
Ian. Two things although I can't verify. Perhaps those with subscriptions get nicer mags and those that are put at stores have lesser grade paper. Kinda makes sense. Subscriptions are guaranteed. Those dropped off, different delivery costs and selling all copies is not guaranteed. Just a thought. Is that likely or possible, don't know.

This is based on two people; one through subscription and the other at West Marine or the equiv.

Rum_Pirate
09-26-2015, 10:05 PM
I must check if there is a difference between a 'hard' paper copy subscription and a 'soft' internet down load subscription.

S.V. Airlie
09-26-2015, 10:19 PM
RP., from what I've seen with other publications, it's cheaper to subscribe on an internet.

CWSmith
09-26-2015, 10:48 PM
I was very surprised at the quality of the paper it was printed on, and this was a deciding factor in not purchasing it.


You mean thin?


The mag is of a decent thickness.

The pages were of a 'lower' quality newspaper(?) paper? It is a little difficult to describe. It was - to me - uninviting.

:) That's what I meant by "thin". The paper is thin and of low quality.

Gerarddm
09-27-2015, 09:34 AM
It's not put out by Rizzoli, after all...

bamamick
09-27-2015, 09:37 AM
I read it every month. Do you mean to tell me there are people who post in the Bilge that DON'T? I am shocked. Shocked, I tell you.

Mickey Lake

Paul Pless
09-27-2015, 09:39 AM
I read it every month. Do you mean to tell me there are people who post in the Bilge that DON'T? I am shocked. Shocked, I tell you.

Mickey Lakeforsooth

David G
09-27-2015, 09:52 AM
I read it every month. Do you mean to tell me there are people who post in the Bilge that DON'T? I am shocked. Shocked, I tell you.

Mickey Lake

Well... that would be hard to do, since it's not published every month <G> But I get your drift. I, too, subscribe.


Two comments on the OP

1. The folks at WB are interested in your feedback. In fact - they've created a special section of the Forum, abovedecks, called (sneakily enough) "WoodenBoat Magazine" where you can offer that feedback. The subtitle is (again... so sneaky, those scribish devils) "Comments, Questions, and Constructive Criticism for the Editors."

2. In light of #1 - it strikes me as strange that you choose NOT to offer that constructive criticism directly. Instead, you post on a forum that they have kindly set up for you to whine about the quality of the magazine and state that, therefore, you didn't buy it. And implying that you don't generally buy it, and don't subscribe.

Fie upon such manners.

S.V. Airlie
09-27-2015, 09:54 AM
OUCH David, that's gotta hurt!:)

bob winter
09-27-2015, 11:17 AM
I don't see anything wrong with the quality of the paper, seems the same as usual.

bobbys
09-27-2015, 11:25 AM
I live is such a small town it's never on the newsstand .

If I did see it I would steal it just to be a loyal wooden boat fan.

bamamick
09-27-2015, 11:57 AM
No, I did mean I read it every month. It takes me that long. :)

Oldad
09-27-2015, 12:49 PM
Absolutely no problem, I enjoy the content, and pay no attention to the quality of the paper.

Hwyl
09-27-2015, 10:04 PM
Anyone else here seen or read the magazine recently?

Possibly the silliest question you've ever asked. I'd venture a significant portion of us are subscribers.

callsign222
09-28-2015, 01:01 AM
WB is one of the higher quality produced magazines I buy/receive/subscribe. This is quantifiable, they survive adverse conditions far better than any other publication (coffee spills, rain, spray, bathroom floor, etc). Any thicker and one wouldn't be able to turn the page and have it stay put

Gold plated sink fixtures, much?

Tom Jackson
09-28-2015, 07:42 AM
The original post's reference to "newspaper" is a mystery—the only thing I can think is that he might be talking about the "Getting Started in Boats" pull-out section, which is on a coarser grade of paper and has perforations near the spine, because it is intended to be easily removed. The paper of that section is intended to mark "Getting Started" as distinctly different from the rest of the magazine.

I put the current issue of the magazine (No. 246) up against one randomly selected from my shelves here at the office (No. 107 of July/August 1992), and I see, if anything, slightly more gloss and perhaps a very slightly lighter weight in the inside pages of the current issue. The cover stock of No. 246 is slightly less glossy than 107, and I can't detect any difference in weight.

Over the years, WoodenBoat has been printed at a variety of printers, and occasionally there have been changes in paper stock based almost exclusively on availability and appearance. But I have to say these choices have always been within a very narrow bandwidth. Often there seems to be a wringing of hands over what I see as almost indistinguishable differences. The biggest difference I've seen in my 18 years working here has been the lower-gloss cover stock, sort of a matt finish, if you will. I've never seen any paper I wouldn't want to carry my words.

John Meachen
09-28-2015, 03:49 PM
I have noticed the change in the cover but really,as long as the quality of the content is of a high standard,it is hardly significant.

Carl Cramer
09-28-2015, 03:49 PM
FWIW, and my knowledge may not be current, but WB pays a PREMIUM for the paper that the magazine is printed on. 45#, #2 grade. Very top-notch.

And everything Tom Jackson says is true.

My two cents.

Thanks, Carl

Dryfeet
09-28-2015, 04:21 PM
It has changed over the years to a slightly less glossy and smooth paper finish. But it's still far higher quality than most newstand mags. And the content? FARRRR superior to any other boating mag and probably non-boating mag for that matter. I subscribe to both the paper and electronic versions and have virtually every copy save perhaps one or two early ones.

Not sure who Rum Pirate is, but I'd say the whole post was pretty troll-like overall. If he's a Bilge Denizen than we're in trouble cuz the water is seems to have risen above the floorboards.

Hey! Chippy! Time to overhaul the bilge pump!

J.Madison
09-28-2015, 05:08 PM
The latest issue did seem to have a lower quality for the cover material. I didn't notice the pages inside being any different though.

Yeadon
09-29-2015, 12:35 AM
And everything Tom Jackson says is true.

Hey Tom, looks like Carl wrote a signature for you.

Tom Jackson
09-29-2015, 07:33 AM
Words to live by, Tim!

Garret
09-29-2015, 07:51 AM
Gosh, "seen" WB lately? While I'm sure the subscriber rate is not 100% (as the OP proves) - I bet it's pretty high.

RP - you might want to think about what you post a bit before posting.

David G
09-29-2015, 09:02 AM
Hey Tom, looks like Carl wrote a signature for you.

He's from Astoria... I just assumed that Carl's comment went without sayin'. Just sayin'...

Rum_Pirate
10-01-2015, 10:46 AM
2. In light of #1 - it strikes me as strange that you choose NOT to offer that constructive criticism directly. Instead, you post on a forum that they have kindly set up for you to whine about the quality of the magazine and state that, therefore, you didn't buy it. And implying that you don't generally buy it, and don't subscribe.

It was an observation and an explanation as to why I didn't buy it. That in itself can be taken as constructive criticism.


. . . Not sure who Rum Pirate is, but I'd say the whole post was pretty troll-like overall. If he's a Bilge Denizen than we're in trouble cuz the water is seems to have risen above the floorboards. Does it matter who I am? The OP was made to discuss the particular issue I saw. Why would one consider that a troll?


Gosh, "seen" WB lately? While I'm sure the subscriber rate is not 100% (as the OP proves) - I bet it's pretty high.

RP - you might want to think about what you post a bit before posting.

Apologies for not being more exacting and precise. I was referring to the particular issue I saw.

I do not buy the magazine as the outlets here do not carry it (as with many other magazines I'd like to read).
I do not subscribe as it would cost US$45.00 for six issues.



http://forum.woodenboat.com/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Rum_Pirate http://forum.woodenboat.com/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png
(http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?p=4663904#post4663904)Anyone else here seen or read the magazine recently?Possibly the silliest question you've ever asked. I'd venture a significant portion of us are subscribers. Really?
So what percentage is significant?

Garret
10-01-2015, 11:17 AM
My subscription costs $32/year (6 issues). $13 to get it to St. Kitts seems cheap to me.

Michael D. Storey
10-01-2015, 12:31 PM
Well, as a collector of books, I would have to discard 80% of my collection if the quality of the paper were an issue.
I have never rejected a magazine because the paper was not up to my standards. maybe I needa get out more

Tom Lathrop
10-03-2015, 07:33 AM
I like the new cover material. Less glossy but thicker and if the inside is less glossy, I don't notice it. Many people, me included, have problems with reading on very glossy paper because of glare. Maybe that is why its called Age Related Macular Degeneration.

StevenBauer
10-03-2015, 08:17 AM
It seems like rummy missed the point of Tom's post. Were you looking at the pull out "Getting Started In Boats" section which is printed on different paper than the regular part of the magazine?