Help

[Dave-H]

I am new to the forum and I am not sure if I am in the correct forum for this question. I am planning to build a wooden boat to spend some time on later in life. I am in no hurry and look forward to a long term project. I have above average carpenter skills and a fair amount of tools. I am looking at the Concordia 33 Sloop for my choice. Before I drop the 150 for the plans, what might I expect. Is all the info in the plans for building the boat.

[cs]

Dave I'm not to sure about that paticular set of plans. Before dropping that kinda smack on a set of plans I would recomend starting with something simple, say somewhere around the 14' or less range, to get a feel for building. Once you get a feel and understanding of how boats go together you can move up to bigger and bigger plans.

One of the things that worries me about someone new starting out is starting with too big of a project and than getting discourged and losing intrest. You than end up with a partially built boat in your backyard and a highly pissed off wife.

I started with a simple stich & glue 14' sharpie and I'm progressing up to my big project, a Roth Friendship sloop.

Back to your orginal question. I would say that more than likely those plans will have everything you need to build them. Do you know how to loft?

Chad

[High C]

I'll second Chad's advice. A Concordia 33 could turn out to be a several year project costing well into 6 figures. Is that the scope of project you have in mind?

[Ian McColgin]

Often not quite what you'd expect. Get Chapell's "Boatbuilding" as a start. Also Bud MacIntosh's book on how to build a wooden boat, avaiable through WB store. That will at least get you started.

Figure that if you are really fast and going for a simple finish, you'll produce 3 to 5 pounds of boat per hour of work. The Concordia is - what? - maybe eight tons. So something like 6,000 hours to do. A couple-three years if you can whack at it full time.

Which is why I start with a boat that someone else already made, but for folk of true courage, there is nothing like knowing you did it yourself.

[Dave-H]

I am looking for a boat to build over time, but I definetely don't want to get in way over my head. I have built Martha's Tender from WB a couple years back so although my experience is very limited I know how tough building is. I do have access to a gentleman who has built a very nice 29' lobster boat. The boat has steamed frames and carvel planking.

[cs]

Dave, do they offer study plans? If so get those and you can get a general idea of the scope of work.

Chad

[On Vacation]

Try rooting around some of the yards, and take a look at the scope of construction. Take several trips and take a camera, and just take pictures in bilge areas, and around the equipment. The process it and sit at home at night and look at it. If you have a video camera, use this, for study plans, too for a job of this type and magnitude.

[ 01-16-2004, 08:57 AM: Message edited by: Oyster ]

[Dave-H]

Just want to tell you that you guys are great.

[Keith Wilson]

The plans will tell you enough to build it if you already know how to build this general kind of boat. Definitely get Bud Macintosh's book "How to Build a Wooden Boat" (http://http://). It's definitely the best reference on relatively large plank-on-frame vessels I know of. GREAT illustrations, and his dry yankee sense of humor is good too.

Another good reference is Steward's "Boatbuilding Manual" (http://www.woodenboatstore.com/store/prodinfo.asp?number=300-015&variation=&aitem=2&mitem=52) Chapelle's book is encyclopedic, but it was written a long time ago and doesn't deal with some modern materials which are useful even in traditional construction. I think with the plans, those two books, and a fair amount of persistence, you'll be fine.

[ 01-16-2004, 10:12 AM: Message edited by: Keith Wilson ]

[Bruce Hooke]

I'd say that boat plans are pretty similar to house plans. All (or at least most of) the information you need to build that particular house (or boat) is generally there, as long as you know how to build houses (or boats) in general...BUT neither type of plan will tell you how -- they just show what the finished product should look like. Both types of plan will also often leave some decisions to the builder. For example, a good set of house plans will show where the light switches and other electrical fixtures should go but may not show where the wires connecting them should run or how the circuits should be split up -- that's up to the electrician. Plans for larger boats such as the one you have in mind are more likely to assume that the builder is experienced and does not need lots of details, especially if the plans were drawn before the days of widespread amateur boatbuilding.

By the way, welcome to the Forum!

One tip on getting good forum results -- as a general rule, to get the best response, the subject header for you post (in your case "help") should say a bit about what you are looking for help on.

If you are wondering how detailed the Concordia 33 Sloop plans in particular are I would try contacting the source (is it the WoodenBoat store?) and asking them.

[Wilson Fitt]

An echo for Kieth's book recommendations. With reasonable woodworking skills, those books and persistance you will produce a fine boat. Bruce is also right. I havn't seen these plans, but I expect that they will be precise about the shape of the hull and arrangement of the rig, provide general information about scantlings, and be vague about construction details and gear. The designer will have assumed that the builder is familiar with good practices and usual boatbuilding methods. That's where the books will fill in the gaps for you.

Ian's estimate of 6,000 hours is reasonable. I spent 7,500 hours building 26,000 pounds of boat using materials, finishes and gear that are probably similar to what you will want for a Concordia.

There's one hang-up that you will have to get over though. "Dropping $150" on the plans will seem like the lightest of financial feathers before you get to the end...

Go for it.

[Bruce Hooke]

Originally posted by Wilson Fitt:
..."Dropping $150" on the plans will seem like the lightest of financial feathers before you get to the end...I would venture to call that one of the truest statements ever made around here! :D

[rbgarr]

As you may know, the Concordia 33 is the design owned by Jon Wilson, founder of WB Magazine. An article was written about different interior arrangements for the design in a back issue. You can search for the article from the WB sites homepage. The Landings School in Kennebunk also used the design for training people in their yacht design class. They may have information about estimated time and materials for building one or the completeness of the plans from WB.

Here is a version for sale that was modified by Joel White for composite construction, built by Covey island Boatworks and finished out by the owner. The folks at Covey Island may be able to put you in touch with the person who commissioned the hull and you could talk to him about how much time/$ he spent on completing the hull versus what he expected/planned for, and skills involved.

As it is, the asking price is less than $2.60 per pound of boat, including labor. Materials are more expensive than that on average, so if the boat is up to snuff, it could be a good deal and you can always find plenty of work to do keeping an already nice wood boat in shape. Build a sailing peapod or Herreshoff dinghy to accompany her!

Good luck, and welcome to the Forum!

http://www.yachtworld.com/core/listing/pl_boat_full_detail.jsp?slim=quick&boat_id=1132042&units=Feet&currency=USD& access =Public&listing_id=1572&url=

[ 01-16-2004, 11:28 PM: Message edited by: rbgarr ]

[Buddy]

WOW, I'm impressed how well the forum has responded with truth ( particularly the pissed off wife), and constructive information about a project of this scope, and a really affordable alternative. All I can add is that it really comes down to the proportions of the itch you want to scratch- how much building, how much maintenance, and how much sailing? How about your wife? What will you enjoy together?