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Paul Frederiksen
02-24-2001, 10:43 AM
This should be fun! The boat is a 20 sailboat with 2370 pounds displacement. Wood with an old work boat character. I am not real excited about hanging an ugly danforth off the bow.

Here is what I was thinking. Hanging a traditional fisherman's anchor from the bow. for use in most short term applications and carrying a danforth under the floor boards for use when I really need to dig my toes in.

This leads to the next question. Where to get a traditional fisherman's anchor. I have seen one from J. M. Renieks but at 7.5 pounds it seems a bit light, and a bit expensive too.

So what think yee?

Paul Frederiksen
02-24-2001, 10:43 AM
This should be fun! The boat is a 20 sailboat with 2370 pounds displacement. Wood with an old work boat character. I am not real excited about hanging an ugly danforth off the bow.

Here is what I was thinking. Hanging a traditional fisherman's anchor from the bow. for use in most short term applications and carrying a danforth under the floor boards for use when I really need to dig my toes in.

This leads to the next question. Where to get a traditional fisherman's anchor. I have seen one from J. M. Renieks but at 7.5 pounds it seems a bit light, and a bit expensive too.

So what think yee?

Paul Frederiksen
02-24-2001, 10:43 AM
This should be fun! The boat is a 20 sailboat with 2370 pounds displacement. Wood with an old work boat character. I am not real excited about hanging an ugly danforth off the bow.

Here is what I was thinking. Hanging a traditional fisherman's anchor from the bow. for use in most short term applications and carrying a danforth under the floor boards for use when I really need to dig my toes in.

This leads to the next question. Where to get a traditional fisherman's anchor. I have seen one from J. M. Renieks but at 7.5 pounds it seems a bit light, and a bit expensive too.

So what think yee?

rbgarr
02-24-2001, 11:16 AM
Old ones come on ebay from time to time.

rbgarr
02-24-2001, 11:16 AM
Old ones come on ebay from time to time.

rbgarr
02-24-2001, 11:16 AM
Old ones come on ebay from time to time.

Bob Cleek
02-24-2001, 12:14 PM
Well, if you are really a committed purist, the only way to go is one of those bronze Herreshoff's! They are also great anchors for many applications. There are a couple of outfits that sell them. The ads are in WB. Paul Luke makes a good version. Not cheap, but beautiful and, because the flukes can be removed from the stock, they stow very compactly. The "classic" anchor with the fixed flukes you are talking about is actually really difficult to wrestly around on deck. This is why you always see them canted over the forward rail or lashed up under a bowsprit. The Herreshoff can be broken down in three pieces, while the "traditional" just folds up loose. Trying to move one around on a moving foredeck is tricky. The folded arm slides around, mashes fingers, stuff like that. The weight of the fixed flukes makes the whole thing out of balance and ackward. Since the Herreshoff breaks into three pieces, you can carry them one at a time and thus use a much heavier anchor singlehanded. Not only that, but the Herreshoff stows in the bilge neatly, keeping the weight low if you are carrying one as a big storm anchor. Just some thoughts...

Bob Cleek
02-24-2001, 12:14 PM
Well, if you are really a committed purist, the only way to go is one of those bronze Herreshoff's! They are also great anchors for many applications. There are a couple of outfits that sell them. The ads are in WB. Paul Luke makes a good version. Not cheap, but beautiful and, because the flukes can be removed from the stock, they stow very compactly. The "classic" anchor with the fixed flukes you are talking about is actually really difficult to wrestly around on deck. This is why you always see them canted over the forward rail or lashed up under a bowsprit. The Herreshoff can be broken down in three pieces, while the "traditional" just folds up loose. Trying to move one around on a moving foredeck is tricky. The folded arm slides around, mashes fingers, stuff like that. The weight of the fixed flukes makes the whole thing out of balance and ackward. Since the Herreshoff breaks into three pieces, you can carry them one at a time and thus use a much heavier anchor singlehanded. Not only that, but the Herreshoff stows in the bilge neatly, keeping the weight low if you are carrying one as a big storm anchor. Just some thoughts...

Bob Cleek
02-24-2001, 12:14 PM
Well, if you are really a committed purist, the only way to go is one of those bronze Herreshoff's! They are also great anchors for many applications. There are a couple of outfits that sell them. The ads are in WB. Paul Luke makes a good version. Not cheap, but beautiful and, because the flukes can be removed from the stock, they stow very compactly. The "classic" anchor with the fixed flukes you are talking about is actually really difficult to wrestly around on deck. This is why you always see them canted over the forward rail or lashed up under a bowsprit. The Herreshoff can be broken down in three pieces, while the "traditional" just folds up loose. Trying to move one around on a moving foredeck is tricky. The folded arm slides around, mashes fingers, stuff like that. The weight of the fixed flukes makes the whole thing out of balance and ackward. Since the Herreshoff breaks into three pieces, you can carry them one at a time and thus use a much heavier anchor singlehanded. Not only that, but the Herreshoff stows in the bilge neatly, keeping the weight low if you are carrying one as a big storm anchor. Just some thoughts...

Thad
02-24-2001, 04:12 PM
I haven't bought much of anything from Defender Industries myself, but they list both the yachtsman and Luke anchors. With your boat I would think a 13# yachtsman for everyday use and a 22# Luke in the bilge for heavier duty would be good. Lots of chain between the anchor and any rope rode helps the anchor work for you.

Thad
02-24-2001, 04:12 PM
I haven't bought much of anything from Defender Industries myself, but they list both the yachtsman and Luke anchors. With your boat I would think a 13# yachtsman for everyday use and a 22# Luke in the bilge for heavier duty would be good. Lots of chain between the anchor and any rope rode helps the anchor work for you.

Thad
02-24-2001, 04:12 PM
I haven't bought much of anything from Defender Industries myself, but they list both the yachtsman and Luke anchors. With your boat I would think a 13# yachtsman for everyday use and a 22# Luke in the bilge for heavier duty would be good. Lots of chain between the anchor and any rope rode helps the anchor work for you.

Scott Rosen
02-25-2001, 01:00 PM
Paul,

Choosing an anchor is one of the more pleasant tasks. What kind of bottoms will you be anchoring in? It makes a huge difference.

The bronze Herreshoff/fisherman's anchors are beautiful and expensive, and are very "yachty." A galvanized fisherman's anchor, like the ones at Defender, are more appropriate to a workboat. These are good in rocks and thick weeds, so-so in sand, and poor in mud--what's more, you need a heavier size for any given boat. They're awkward to stow and deploy--you could easily end up with a few gouges in your topside paint.

My boat's 30 feet, displaces about 13,000 lbs. Almost all of my anchoring is done in bottom conditions ranging from hard, compacted sand and small stone to soft, silty mud. For general work, I like the CQR. I have two, at 25lb and a 45lb. The 45 is my "storm" anchor, or the one I use in a very crowded anchorage when I can't use much scope. The 25 has held every time I've used it, even on a silty bottom in about 35 knots of wind. My guess is that a 25lb CQR would hold your boat in just about any conditions, on just about any bottom.

I also have a Fortress FX-16, which is a Danforth-type made of forged aluminum. It has the virtues of being extrememly light weight, and it can be disassembled quickly with just a pair of pliers. It holds especially well in mud and is very easy to handle because of the light weight.

Anchoring is no place to cut corners or compromise. Spend how ever much is necessary to protect your boat in any conditions you might encounter. You won't regret it. BTW, A good anchor is a once in a lifetime expense, so don't skimp.

Scott Rosen
02-25-2001, 01:00 PM
Paul,

Choosing an anchor is one of the more pleasant tasks. What kind of bottoms will you be anchoring in? It makes a huge difference.

The bronze Herreshoff/fisherman's anchors are beautiful and expensive, and are very "yachty." A galvanized fisherman's anchor, like the ones at Defender, are more appropriate to a workboat. These are good in rocks and thick weeds, so-so in sand, and poor in mud--what's more, you need a heavier size for any given boat. They're awkward to stow and deploy--you could easily end up with a few gouges in your topside paint.

My boat's 30 feet, displaces about 13,000 lbs. Almost all of my anchoring is done in bottom conditions ranging from hard, compacted sand and small stone to soft, silty mud. For general work, I like the CQR. I have two, at 25lb and a 45lb. The 45 is my "storm" anchor, or the one I use in a very crowded anchorage when I can't use much scope. The 25 has held every time I've used it, even on a silty bottom in about 35 knots of wind. My guess is that a 25lb CQR would hold your boat in just about any conditions, on just about any bottom.

I also have a Fortress FX-16, which is a Danforth-type made of forged aluminum. It has the virtues of being extrememly light weight, and it can be disassembled quickly with just a pair of pliers. It holds especially well in mud and is very easy to handle because of the light weight.

Anchoring is no place to cut corners or compromise. Spend how ever much is necessary to protect your boat in any conditions you might encounter. You won't regret it. BTW, A good anchor is a once in a lifetime expense, so don't skimp.

Scott Rosen
02-25-2001, 01:00 PM
Paul,

Choosing an anchor is one of the more pleasant tasks. What kind of bottoms will you be anchoring in? It makes a huge difference.

The bronze Herreshoff/fisherman's anchors are beautiful and expensive, and are very "yachty." A galvanized fisherman's anchor, like the ones at Defender, are more appropriate to a workboat. These are good in rocks and thick weeds, so-so in sand, and poor in mud--what's more, you need a heavier size for any given boat. They're awkward to stow and deploy--you could easily end up with a few gouges in your topside paint.

My boat's 30 feet, displaces about 13,000 lbs. Almost all of my anchoring is done in bottom conditions ranging from hard, compacted sand and small stone to soft, silty mud. For general work, I like the CQR. I have two, at 25lb and a 45lb. The 45 is my "storm" anchor, or the one I use in a very crowded anchorage when I can't use much scope. The 25 has held every time I've used it, even on a silty bottom in about 35 knots of wind. My guess is that a 25lb CQR would hold your boat in just about any conditions, on just about any bottom.

I also have a Fortress FX-16, which is a Danforth-type made of forged aluminum. It has the virtues of being extrememly light weight, and it can be disassembled quickly with just a pair of pliers. It holds especially well in mud and is very easy to handle because of the light weight.

Anchoring is no place to cut corners or compromise. Spend how ever much is necessary to protect your boat in any conditions you might encounter. You won't regret it. BTW, A good anchor is a once in a lifetime expense, so don't skimp.

Paul
02-26-2001, 07:40 AM
Hey Paul!
Those Herreshoff reproduction anchors are a thing of beauty! My wife gave me one for Christmas from Renieks and Son. The Haven only displaces about 1700 lbs (I believe thats correct). This anchor breaks down in two pieces so it stows flat. I'm considering my options on where to stow it. There is room in the aft storage compartment, but I am also considering mounting it on the forward bulkhead wall. I have read in one place, the fisherman's anchor holds well in all bottom conditions and then in another it doesn't. Like all products, it seems there is different opionions on where you read or who you ask. I like the idea of having another back up anchor similar to what Scott was describing - the Danford cast aluminum type.

Paul
02-26-2001, 07:40 AM
Hey Paul!
Those Herreshoff reproduction anchors are a thing of beauty! My wife gave me one for Christmas from Renieks and Son. The Haven only displaces about 1700 lbs (I believe thats correct). This anchor breaks down in two pieces so it stows flat. I'm considering my options on where to stow it. There is room in the aft storage compartment, but I am also considering mounting it on the forward bulkhead wall. I have read in one place, the fisherman's anchor holds well in all bottom conditions and then in another it doesn't. Like all products, it seems there is different opionions on where you read or who you ask. I like the idea of having another back up anchor similar to what Scott was describing - the Danford cast aluminum type.

Paul
02-26-2001, 07:40 AM
Hey Paul!
Those Herreshoff reproduction anchors are a thing of beauty! My wife gave me one for Christmas from Renieks and Son. The Haven only displaces about 1700 lbs (I believe thats correct). This anchor breaks down in two pieces so it stows flat. I'm considering my options on where to stow it. There is room in the aft storage compartment, but I am also considering mounting it on the forward bulkhead wall. I have read in one place, the fisherman's anchor holds well in all bottom conditions and then in another it doesn't. Like all products, it seems there is different opionions on where you read or who you ask. I like the idea of having another back up anchor similar to what Scott was describing - the Danford cast aluminum type.

Ian McColgin
02-26-2001, 09:13 AM
Workboats deserve a real working anchor. Since the classic yacht pattern is such a pain to handle, try a nice CQR or Bruce on a roller. Houses easy. Handles well.

The Danforth is nice in mud and sand but not so versitile and all but uselss in rock or grass or gravel. The Fortress we've nicknamed "The Incredible Floating Anchor" for its ability to skate near the surface in any good current. Not the hook to set on the fly as you are being blown on a lee shore.

I like the penetration of the CQR better than the Bruce but you'll find someone who will give you an arguement on that. Whatever, unless you're a brilliant engineer, stick to the brand names. i once got a cheap knock off plough anchor and found that subtle differences in shank to blade angle really make a huge difference.

G'luck.

Ian McColgin
02-26-2001, 09:13 AM
Workboats deserve a real working anchor. Since the classic yacht pattern is such a pain to handle, try a nice CQR or Bruce on a roller. Houses easy. Handles well.

The Danforth is nice in mud and sand but not so versitile and all but uselss in rock or grass or gravel. The Fortress we've nicknamed "The Incredible Floating Anchor" for its ability to skate near the surface in any good current. Not the hook to set on the fly as you are being blown on a lee shore.

I like the penetration of the CQR better than the Bruce but you'll find someone who will give you an arguement on that. Whatever, unless you're a brilliant engineer, stick to the brand names. i once got a cheap knock off plough anchor and found that subtle differences in shank to blade angle really make a huge difference.

G'luck.

Ian McColgin
02-26-2001, 09:13 AM
Workboats deserve a real working anchor. Since the classic yacht pattern is such a pain to handle, try a nice CQR or Bruce on a roller. Houses easy. Handles well.

The Danforth is nice in mud and sand but not so versitile and all but uselss in rock or grass or gravel. The Fortress we've nicknamed "The Incredible Floating Anchor" for its ability to skate near the surface in any good current. Not the hook to set on the fly as you are being blown on a lee shore.

I like the penetration of the CQR better than the Bruce but you'll find someone who will give you an arguement on that. Whatever, unless you're a brilliant engineer, stick to the brand names. i once got a cheap knock off plough anchor and found that subtle differences in shank to blade angle really make a huge difference.

G'luck.

Paul Frederiksen
02-26-2001, 09:37 AM
I saw the bronze anchor from Reneik and sons. Sure looks nice and might work for a picnic anchor (which for me is about 80% of the time). If I hung that from the bow and had a break down danforth stowed away I should be good for 99.9% of all needs. I anchor mostly in mud or rocks so everything is a compromise. The CQRs and other plow anchors are way too bulky to fit comfortably on my boat.

Paul Frederiksen
02-26-2001, 09:37 AM
I saw the bronze anchor from Reneik and sons. Sure looks nice and might work for a picnic anchor (which for me is about 80% of the time). If I hung that from the bow and had a break down danforth stowed away I should be good for 99.9% of all needs. I anchor mostly in mud or rocks so everything is a compromise. The CQRs and other plow anchors are way too bulky to fit comfortably on my boat.

Paul Frederiksen
02-26-2001, 09:37 AM
I saw the bronze anchor from Reneik and sons. Sure looks nice and might work for a picnic anchor (which for me is about 80% of the time). If I hung that from the bow and had a break down danforth stowed away I should be good for 99.9% of all needs. I anchor mostly in mud or rocks so everything is a compromise. The CQRs and other plow anchors are way too bulky to fit comfortably on my boat.

Paul
02-26-2001, 01:36 PM
My thoughts exactly Paul. Have you poured your lead keel yet?

Paul
02-26-2001, 01:36 PM
My thoughts exactly Paul. Have you poured your lead keel yet?

Paul
02-26-2001, 01:36 PM
My thoughts exactly Paul. Have you poured your lead keel yet?

Paul Frederiksen
02-26-2001, 09:45 PM
Not yet. It has been raining for weeks here so I want to wait till it dries out a bit. Things are comming together though. I was beating myself up about how to come up with a good trailer without having to mortgage the farm. By sheer luck I stumbled onto a perfect trailer with every part bolted together so everything is adjustable. $ 100 I almost kissed the guy. How is the Haven comming?

Paul Frederiksen
02-26-2001, 09:45 PM
Not yet. It has been raining for weeks here so I want to wait till it dries out a bit. Things are comming together though. I was beating myself up about how to come up with a good trailer without having to mortgage the farm. By sheer luck I stumbled onto a perfect trailer with every part bolted together so everything is adjustable. $ 100 I almost kissed the guy. How is the Haven comming?

Paul Frederiksen
02-26-2001, 09:45 PM
Not yet. It has been raining for weeks here so I want to wait till it dries out a bit. Things are comming together though. I was beating myself up about how to come up with a good trailer without having to mortgage the farm. By sheer luck I stumbled onto a perfect trailer with every part bolted together so everything is adjustable. $ 100 I almost kissed the guy. How is the Haven comming?

Paul
02-27-2001, 07:13 AM
I am going to launch her late May early June, the deciding factor will be the delivery of the sails. I will start constructing the mast and boom in a couple of weeks.
I got my copy of WB yesterday. I should have published my version of pouring a Joel White's lead ballast. I just don't understand the slow pour and the guick pour with hot lead. From my limited dealing with it, it is either liquid or solid, there is no intermediate molasses consistency. The down pipes might need to be heated up just before the pour, but if you have (in my case) 600 lbs of hot lead coming down the pipe, it ain't going to sit there long enough to solidify.

Paul
02-27-2001, 07:13 AM
I am going to launch her late May early June, the deciding factor will be the delivery of the sails. I will start constructing the mast and boom in a couple of weeks.
I got my copy of WB yesterday. I should have published my version of pouring a Joel White's lead ballast. I just don't understand the slow pour and the guick pour with hot lead. From my limited dealing with it, it is either liquid or solid, there is no intermediate molasses consistency. The down pipes might need to be heated up just before the pour, but if you have (in my case) 600 lbs of hot lead coming down the pipe, it ain't going to sit there long enough to solidify.

Paul
02-27-2001, 07:13 AM
I am going to launch her late May early June, the deciding factor will be the delivery of the sails. I will start constructing the mast and boom in a couple of weeks.
I got my copy of WB yesterday. I should have published my version of pouring a Joel White's lead ballast. I just don't understand the slow pour and the guick pour with hot lead. From my limited dealing with it, it is either liquid or solid, there is no intermediate molasses consistency. The down pipes might need to be heated up just before the pour, but if you have (in my case) 600 lbs of hot lead coming down the pipe, it ain't going to sit there long enough to solidify.

Dave Hadfield
02-28-2001, 01:03 PM
On my 40ft ketch I have a plough, a Bruce, a Danforth, and a type of folding-stock Fisherman called a Northill. Only the latter hasn't dragged at least once. It digs into the heavy weed of Georgian Bay (Lake Huron) or the hard rock shore of the Bruce Peninsula in a way that the others don't.

Mine was given to me by my grandfather. It dates from the 50's -- not much use to you.

A good modern take-apart fisherman is made in Canada, and called the Kingston Yachtsman. It's a Herreshoff, basically. My Holland Marine catalogue shows it at CAD$199 for a 25lb. (In American funds I think that's about a dollar and a half.) It stows in 3 pieces.

Looks sharp hanging off the bowsprit, and works well.

www.kingstonmarine.com (http://www.kingstonmarine.com) or do a search and find the windjammer co site (the producer).

Good Luck

Dave Hadfield
02-28-2001, 01:03 PM
On my 40ft ketch I have a plough, a Bruce, a Danforth, and a type of folding-stock Fisherman called a Northill. Only the latter hasn't dragged at least once. It digs into the heavy weed of Georgian Bay (Lake Huron) or the hard rock shore of the Bruce Peninsula in a way that the others don't.

Mine was given to me by my grandfather. It dates from the 50's -- not much use to you.

A good modern take-apart fisherman is made in Canada, and called the Kingston Yachtsman. It's a Herreshoff, basically. My Holland Marine catalogue shows it at CAD$199 for a 25lb. (In American funds I think that's about a dollar and a half.) It stows in 3 pieces.

Looks sharp hanging off the bowsprit, and works well.

www.kingstonmarine.com (http://www.kingstonmarine.com) or do a search and find the windjammer co site (the producer).

Good Luck

Dave Hadfield
02-28-2001, 01:03 PM
On my 40ft ketch I have a plough, a Bruce, a Danforth, and a type of folding-stock Fisherman called a Northill. Only the latter hasn't dragged at least once. It digs into the heavy weed of Georgian Bay (Lake Huron) or the hard rock shore of the Bruce Peninsula in a way that the others don't.

Mine was given to me by my grandfather. It dates from the 50's -- not much use to you.

A good modern take-apart fisherman is made in Canada, and called the Kingston Yachtsman. It's a Herreshoff, basically. My Holland Marine catalogue shows it at CAD$199 for a 25lb. (In American funds I think that's about a dollar and a half.) It stows in 3 pieces.

Looks sharp hanging off the bowsprit, and works well.

www.kingstonmarine.com (http://www.kingstonmarine.com) or do a search and find the windjammer co site (the producer).

Good Luck

Paul Frederiksen
03-01-2001, 09:54 PM
Thank you Dave. Your direction was helpful in finding the Yachtsman for a reasonable price from Holland Marine at www.hollandmarine.com (http://www.hollandmarine.com)

Paul Frederiksen
03-01-2001, 09:54 PM
Thank you Dave. Your direction was helpful in finding the Yachtsman for a reasonable price from Holland Marine at www.hollandmarine.com (http://www.hollandmarine.com)

Paul Frederiksen
03-01-2001, 09:54 PM
Thank you Dave. Your direction was helpful in finding the Yachtsman for a reasonable price from Holland Marine at www.hollandmarine.com (http://www.hollandmarine.com)

Paul
03-05-2001, 03:26 PM
Paul, I just received the new Defender Supply Catalog and it listed the type of anchor you are looking for.

Paul
03-05-2001, 03:26 PM
Paul, I just received the new Defender Supply Catalog and it listed the type of anchor you are looking for.

Paul
03-05-2001, 03:26 PM
Paul, I just received the new Defender Supply Catalog and it listed the type of anchor you are looking for.