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skuthorp
06-25-2003, 05:33 AM
A man here had his hand re-attatched yesterday after cutting it off on a table saw. Home accident, not industrial. Someone here said that its the most dangerous tool in the shop.

skuthorp
06-25-2003, 05:33 AM
A man here had his hand re-attatched yesterday after cutting it off on a table saw. Home accident, not industrial. Someone here said that its the most dangerous tool in the shop.

skuthorp
06-25-2003, 05:33 AM
A man here had his hand re-attatched yesterday after cutting it off on a table saw. Home accident, not industrial. Someone here said that its the most dangerous tool in the shop.

imported_Mac
06-25-2003, 05:42 AM
I think they are all [power tools]dangerous, and I am afraid of them. At least I do have a great respect.

I ALWAYS check where my hands are before using jointer, table saw, router table and things.

And plenty of pussticks.

Good thing though that men is able to sew a hand back on again and reach a good level of functionality again with it smile.gif

imported_Mac
06-25-2003, 05:42 AM
I think they are all [power tools]dangerous, and I am afraid of them. At least I do have a great respect.

I ALWAYS check where my hands are before using jointer, table saw, router table and things.

And plenty of pussticks.

Good thing though that men is able to sew a hand back on again and reach a good level of functionality again with it smile.gif

imported_Mac
06-25-2003, 05:42 AM
I think they are all [power tools]dangerous, and I am afraid of them. At least I do have a great respect.

I ALWAYS check where my hands are before using jointer, table saw, router table and things.

And plenty of pussticks.

Good thing though that men is able to sew a hand back on again and reach a good level of functionality again with it smile.gif

Scott Rosen
06-25-2003, 07:16 AM
It seems that the most dangerous power tool is the one you fear the least. That's why band saws tend to have more accidents than any other shop tool. People get complacent, then zap.

Scott Rosen
06-25-2003, 07:16 AM
It seems that the most dangerous power tool is the one you fear the least. That's why band saws tend to have more accidents than any other shop tool. People get complacent, then zap.

Scott Rosen
06-25-2003, 07:16 AM
It seems that the most dangerous power tool is the one you fear the least. That's why band saws tend to have more accidents than any other shop tool. People get complacent, then zap.

ErikH
06-25-2003, 07:37 AM
Me, I'm terrified of them all smile.gif An old boss used to tablesaw nonchalantly, while carrying on a conversation... I could never stand to watch.

ErikH
06-25-2003, 07:37 AM
Me, I'm terrified of them all smile.gif An old boss used to tablesaw nonchalantly, while carrying on a conversation... I could never stand to watch.

ErikH
06-25-2003, 07:37 AM
Me, I'm terrified of them all smile.gif An old boss used to tablesaw nonchalantly, while carrying on a conversation... I could never stand to watch.

ishmael
06-25-2003, 07:48 AM
I think I'm the one who called the table saw the most dangerous tool in the shop, and I still feel that way. It's based on a healthy respect for all power tools. A bandsaw, as Scott says, is easy to become complacent with, but only someone half asleep will run a limb through it. The table saw, even after I'd come to understand it fairly well, gave me righteous willies whenever I was doing close work. Because it could misbehave and bite you, in a moment, even with good attention.

A few simple rules--paramount being NEVER have your hands close to the back of the blade--will keep you out of serious trouble, but I still have scars from kicks that happened in a blink. Knowing how to not lose fingers is one thing, a good one, but I don't know anyone who's worked wood for long that doesn't have a table saw story.

Respect, not fear, is the way. Fear only makes you choke, when you need your brain and coordination the most.

ishmael
06-25-2003, 07:48 AM
I think I'm the one who called the table saw the most dangerous tool in the shop, and I still feel that way. It's based on a healthy respect for all power tools. A bandsaw, as Scott says, is easy to become complacent with, but only someone half asleep will run a limb through it. The table saw, even after I'd come to understand it fairly well, gave me righteous willies whenever I was doing close work. Because it could misbehave and bite you, in a moment, even with good attention.

A few simple rules--paramount being NEVER have your hands close to the back of the blade--will keep you out of serious trouble, but I still have scars from kicks that happened in a blink. Knowing how to not lose fingers is one thing, a good one, but I don't know anyone who's worked wood for long that doesn't have a table saw story.

Respect, not fear, is the way. Fear only makes you choke, when you need your brain and coordination the most.

ishmael
06-25-2003, 07:48 AM
I think I'm the one who called the table saw the most dangerous tool in the shop, and I still feel that way. It's based on a healthy respect for all power tools. A bandsaw, as Scott says, is easy to become complacent with, but only someone half asleep will run a limb through it. The table saw, even after I'd come to understand it fairly well, gave me righteous willies whenever I was doing close work. Because it could misbehave and bite you, in a moment, even with good attention.

A few simple rules--paramount being NEVER have your hands close to the back of the blade--will keep you out of serious trouble, but I still have scars from kicks that happened in a blink. Knowing how to not lose fingers is one thing, a good one, but I don't know anyone who's worked wood for long that doesn't have a table saw story.

Respect, not fear, is the way. Fear only makes you choke, when you need your brain and coordination the most.

MikeV
06-25-2003, 08:02 AM
No such thing as reaction time at 20,000 rpm!
It's a challenge to be mentally present at all times when using power tools. I do my best but have an occassional lapse. So far I have all my fingers and two good eyes. I recently had a kick back on my table saw. I new the cut was risky but did it anyway.I was in a relatively safe position so I was fine. The Fiddlehead under construction in my shop was less fortunate. The piece thrown from the saw put a two inch hole in a plank near one of the stems(double ended). I am fortunate to get off so easily. It's hard to see what's going on if you have your head up your butt!

MikeV
06-25-2003, 08:02 AM
No such thing as reaction time at 20,000 rpm!
It's a challenge to be mentally present at all times when using power tools. I do my best but have an occassional lapse. So far I have all my fingers and two good eyes. I recently had a kick back on my table saw. I new the cut was risky but did it anyway.I was in a relatively safe position so I was fine. The Fiddlehead under construction in my shop was less fortunate. The piece thrown from the saw put a two inch hole in a plank near one of the stems(double ended). I am fortunate to get off so easily. It's hard to see what's going on if you have your head up your butt!

MikeV
06-25-2003, 08:02 AM
No such thing as reaction time at 20,000 rpm!
It's a challenge to be mentally present at all times when using power tools. I do my best but have an occassional lapse. So far I have all my fingers and two good eyes. I recently had a kick back on my table saw. I new the cut was risky but did it anyway.I was in a relatively safe position so I was fine. The Fiddlehead under construction in my shop was less fortunate. The piece thrown from the saw put a two inch hole in a plank near one of the stems(double ended). I am fortunate to get off so easily. It's hard to see what's going on if you have your head up your butt!

Mrleft8
06-25-2003, 08:43 AM
Mac
.
Member # 6492

posted 06-25-2003 05:42 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I think they are all [power tools]dangerous, and I am afraid of them. At least I do have a great respect.

I ALWAYS check where my hands are before using jointer, table saw, router table and things.

I always check where my hands are AFTER using jointer, table saw, router table.... ;)

Mrleft8
06-25-2003, 08:43 AM
Mac
.
Member # 6492

posted 06-25-2003 05:42 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I think they are all [power tools]dangerous, and I am afraid of them. At least I do have a great respect.

I ALWAYS check where my hands are before using jointer, table saw, router table and things.

I always check where my hands are AFTER using jointer, table saw, router table.... ;)

Mrleft8
06-25-2003, 08:43 AM
Mac
.
Member # 6492

posted 06-25-2003 05:42 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I think they are all [power tools]dangerous, and I am afraid of them. At least I do have a great respect.

I ALWAYS check where my hands are before using jointer, table saw, router table and things.

I always check where my hands are AFTER using jointer, table saw, router table.... ;)

imported_Mac
06-25-2003, 08:48 AM
ok...I'll rephrase myself :D

WHERE i have my hands before....

imported_Mac
06-25-2003, 08:48 AM
ok...I'll rephrase myself :D

WHERE i have my hands before....

imported_Mac
06-25-2003, 08:48 AM
ok...I'll rephrase myself :D

WHERE i have my hands before....

gary porter
06-25-2003, 12:37 PM
Tap your finger quickly on the table or estimate 1/100th of a second.....approx 23 teeth have already gone through your finger or hand. Don't be afraid,,,,,it doesn't hurt,,,well not at first anyway. Heres hoping the man recovers well and a good wakeup for the rest of us.
Gary.... :(

gary porter
06-25-2003, 12:37 PM
Tap your finger quickly on the table or estimate 1/100th of a second.....approx 23 teeth have already gone through your finger or hand. Don't be afraid,,,,,it doesn't hurt,,,well not at first anyway. Heres hoping the man recovers well and a good wakeup for the rest of us.
Gary.... :(

gary porter
06-25-2003, 12:37 PM
Tap your finger quickly on the table or estimate 1/100th of a second.....approx 23 teeth have already gone through your finger or hand. Don't be afraid,,,,,it doesn't hurt,,,well not at first anyway. Heres hoping the man recovers well and a good wakeup for the rest of us.
Gary.... :(

ishmael
06-25-2003, 01:38 PM
A well set up table saw is miraculous. Working wood into shapes, wondrous. Just take the rules, igonore them occasionally, and learn.

I never got there, but like any other tool, it's very worthy. Read some Tage Fride.

ishmael
06-25-2003, 01:38 PM
A well set up table saw is miraculous. Working wood into shapes, wondrous. Just take the rules, igonore them occasionally, and learn.

I never got there, but like any other tool, it's very worthy. Read some Tage Fride.

ishmael
06-25-2003, 01:38 PM
A well set up table saw is miraculous. Working wood into shapes, wondrous. Just take the rules, igonore them occasionally, and learn.

I never got there, but like any other tool, it's very worthy. Read some Tage Fride.

Nicholas Carey
06-25-2003, 05:55 PM
Ishmael said:
The table saw, even after I'd come to understand it fairly well, gave me righteous willies whenever I was doing close work. Because it could misbehave and bite you, in a moment, even with good attention.

A few simple rules--paramount being NEVER have your hands close to the back of the blade--will keep you out of serious trouble, but I still have scars from kicks that happened in a blink. Knowing how to not lose fingers is one thing, a good one, but I don't know anyone who's worked wood for long that doesn't have a table saw story.And MikeV said:
No such thing as reaction time at 20,000 rpm!...I do my best but have an occassional lapse. So far I have all my fingers and two good eyes. I recently had a kick back on my table saw. I new the cut was risky but did it anyway.I was in a relatively safe position so I was fine.It's important to under stand why a kickback occurs. Kickbacks don't occur from a 'risky cut', the occur due to operator error: a kickback occurs when the workpiece rotates away from the fence on the outfeed side of the sawblade.

When that happens, the teeth on the sawblade, coming up from the table, catch the workpiece and,completing the rotation of the workpiece up and over the saw blade, flinging it at high speed both away from the fence and in the direction of rotation (that would be in the general direction of the operator, assuming you're right-handed and standing to the left of the blade).

Kickback can't (never say can't, say is much less likely to) occur if the workpiece rotates away from the fence on the infeed side of the blade, as the workpiece is caught by the teeth coming down towards the table and hence is forced against the table.

Keep your workpiece against the fence and don't do freehand cuts and you won't encounter kickback.

This is why European table saws are much safer than US table saws: they are required to have a riving knife just behind the blade and aligned with the fence side of the kerf. The riving knife rises, lowers and tilts with the blade. With that riving knife in place, it is almost impossible for kickback to occur. The US style guard (anti-kickback pawls) do nothing to prevent the root cause of the problem.

Moreover, the US-style guard get in the way of doing useful work. Hence, most people wind up removing it. A Euro-style riving knife almost never gets in the way, even cutting rabbets or dadoes.

About the only cut that a riving knife would interfere with would be a plunge cut.

You can read more about kickback here (http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/pages/w00066.asp), on Fine Woodworking's web site.

But it wasn't kickback that cut that fellow hand off.

Saw-Stop

If you really care about safety, look at the Saw-Stop (http://www.sawstop.com/home.htm) system -- a system that measures blade inductance to detect if flesh comes in contact with the blade. On contact, a bolt is fired into the saw gullet, stopping the blade within 5 milliseconds and simultaneously withdrawing the blade below the table. In most instances, the user will suffer no more than minor cut.

The system is also applicable to power saws other than table saws as well (chop saws, band saws, radial arm saws, etc.)

See videos of the Saw-Stop in action here (http://www.sawstop.com/video.htm). See high-speed (1000 Frames/Second) footage of it in action here (http://64.226.112.92/images/high%20speed%20demo%20-%20AVI.avi) (1.2mb Quicktime video).

More on the Saw-Stop here (http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/pages/w00108.asp).

and write and tell saw manufacturers that you want it made available to you as a product feature. Even better, write both OSHA and the Consumer Product Safety Commission and tell them you want it made mandatory on power saws.

Alternatively, join the Saw-Stop manufacturer's petition drive (you can read the saw manufacter's whines on this page as well) at http://www.sawstop.com/We_Need_Your_Help.htm (caution: gory pathology photos here).

[ 06-25-2003, 05:56 PM: Message edited by: Nicholas Carey ]

Nicholas Carey
06-25-2003, 05:55 PM
Ishmael said:
The table saw, even after I'd come to understand it fairly well, gave me righteous willies whenever I was doing close work. Because it could misbehave and bite you, in a moment, even with good attention.

A few simple rules--paramount being NEVER have your hands close to the back of the blade--will keep you out of serious trouble, but I still have scars from kicks that happened in a blink. Knowing how to not lose fingers is one thing, a good one, but I don't know anyone who's worked wood for long that doesn't have a table saw story.And MikeV said:
No such thing as reaction time at 20,000 rpm!...I do my best but have an occassional lapse. So far I have all my fingers and two good eyes. I recently had a kick back on my table saw. I new the cut was risky but did it anyway.I was in a relatively safe position so I was fine.It's important to under stand why a kickback occurs. Kickbacks don't occur from a 'risky cut', the occur due to operator error: a kickback occurs when the workpiece rotates away from the fence on the outfeed side of the sawblade.

When that happens, the teeth on the sawblade, coming up from the table, catch the workpiece and,completing the rotation of the workpiece up and over the saw blade, flinging it at high speed both away from the fence and in the direction of rotation (that would be in the general direction of the operator, assuming you're right-handed and standing to the left of the blade).

Kickback can't (never say can't, say is much less likely to) occur if the workpiece rotates away from the fence on the infeed side of the blade, as the workpiece is caught by the teeth coming down towards the table and hence is forced against the table.

Keep your workpiece against the fence and don't do freehand cuts and you won't encounter kickback.

This is why European table saws are much safer than US table saws: they are required to have a riving knife just behind the blade and aligned with the fence side of the kerf. The riving knife rises, lowers and tilts with the blade. With that riving knife in place, it is almost impossible for kickback to occur. The US style guard (anti-kickback pawls) do nothing to prevent the root cause of the problem.

Moreover, the US-style guard get in the way of doing useful work. Hence, most people wind up removing it. A Euro-style riving knife almost never gets in the way, even cutting rabbets or dadoes.

About the only cut that a riving knife would interfere with would be a plunge cut.

You can read more about kickback here (http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/pages/w00066.asp), on Fine Woodworking's web site.

But it wasn't kickback that cut that fellow hand off.

Saw-Stop

If you really care about safety, look at the Saw-Stop (http://www.sawstop.com/home.htm) system -- a system that measures blade inductance to detect if flesh comes in contact with the blade. On contact, a bolt is fired into the saw gullet, stopping the blade within 5 milliseconds and simultaneously withdrawing the blade below the table. In most instances, the user will suffer no more than minor cut.

The system is also applicable to power saws other than table saws as well (chop saws, band saws, radial arm saws, etc.)

See videos of the Saw-Stop in action here (http://www.sawstop.com/video.htm). See high-speed (1000 Frames/Second) footage of it in action here (http://64.226.112.92/images/high%20speed%20demo%20-%20AVI.avi) (1.2mb Quicktime video).

More on the Saw-Stop here (http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/pages/w00108.asp).

and write and tell saw manufacturers that you want it made available to you as a product feature. Even better, write both OSHA and the Consumer Product Safety Commission and tell them you want it made mandatory on power saws.

Alternatively, join the Saw-Stop manufacturer's petition drive (you can read the saw manufacter's whines on this page as well) at http://www.sawstop.com/We_Need_Your_Help.htm (caution: gory pathology photos here).

[ 06-25-2003, 05:56 PM: Message edited by: Nicholas Carey ]

Nicholas Carey
06-25-2003, 05:55 PM
Ishmael said:
The table saw, even after I'd come to understand it fairly well, gave me righteous willies whenever I was doing close work. Because it could misbehave and bite you, in a moment, even with good attention.

A few simple rules--paramount being NEVER have your hands close to the back of the blade--will keep you out of serious trouble, but I still have scars from kicks that happened in a blink. Knowing how to not lose fingers is one thing, a good one, but I don't know anyone who's worked wood for long that doesn't have a table saw story.And MikeV said:
No such thing as reaction time at 20,000 rpm!...I do my best but have an occassional lapse. So far I have all my fingers and two good eyes. I recently had a kick back on my table saw. I new the cut was risky but did it anyway.I was in a relatively safe position so I was fine.It's important to under stand why a kickback occurs. Kickbacks don't occur from a 'risky cut', the occur due to operator error: a kickback occurs when the workpiece rotates away from the fence on the outfeed side of the sawblade.

When that happens, the teeth on the sawblade, coming up from the table, catch the workpiece and,completing the rotation of the workpiece up and over the saw blade, flinging it at high speed both away from the fence and in the direction of rotation (that would be in the general direction of the operator, assuming you're right-handed and standing to the left of the blade).

Kickback can't (never say can't, say is much less likely to) occur if the workpiece rotates away from the fence on the infeed side of the blade, as the workpiece is caught by the teeth coming down towards the table and hence is forced against the table.

Keep your workpiece against the fence and don't do freehand cuts and you won't encounter kickback.

This is why European table saws are much safer than US table saws: they are required to have a riving knife just behind the blade and aligned with the fence side of the kerf. The riving knife rises, lowers and tilts with the blade. With that riving knife in place, it is almost impossible for kickback to occur. The US style guard (anti-kickback pawls) do nothing to prevent the root cause of the problem.

Moreover, the US-style guard get in the way of doing useful work. Hence, most people wind up removing it. A Euro-style riving knife almost never gets in the way, even cutting rabbets or dadoes.

About the only cut that a riving knife would interfere with would be a plunge cut.

You can read more about kickback here (http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/pages/w00066.asp), on Fine Woodworking's web site.

But it wasn't kickback that cut that fellow hand off.

Saw-Stop

If you really care about safety, look at the Saw-Stop (http://www.sawstop.com/home.htm) system -- a system that measures blade inductance to detect if flesh comes in contact with the blade. On contact, a bolt is fired into the saw gullet, stopping the blade within 5 milliseconds and simultaneously withdrawing the blade below the table. In most instances, the user will suffer no more than minor cut.

The system is also applicable to power saws other than table saws as well (chop saws, band saws, radial arm saws, etc.)

See videos of the Saw-Stop in action here (http://www.sawstop.com/video.htm). See high-speed (1000 Frames/Second) footage of it in action here (http://64.226.112.92/images/high%20speed%20demo%20-%20AVI.avi) (1.2mb Quicktime video).

More on the Saw-Stop here (http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/pages/w00108.asp).

and write and tell saw manufacturers that you want it made available to you as a product feature. Even better, write both OSHA and the Consumer Product Safety Commission and tell them you want it made mandatory on power saws.

Alternatively, join the Saw-Stop manufacturer's petition drive (you can read the saw manufacter's whines on this page as well) at http://www.sawstop.com/We_Need_Your_Help.htm (caution: gory pathology photos here).

[ 06-25-2003, 05:56 PM: Message edited by: Nicholas Carey ]

MikeV
06-25-2003, 08:30 PM
"Risky Cut"=knowingly performing a cut prone to kickback. Hence the reference to head in butt!

MikeV
06-25-2003, 08:30 PM
"Risky Cut"=knowingly performing a cut prone to kickback. Hence the reference to head in butt!

MikeV
06-25-2003, 08:30 PM
"Risky Cut"=knowingly performing a cut prone to kickback. Hence the reference to head in butt!

Ed Harrow
06-25-2003, 09:15 PM
My next door neighbor when I was a kid, besides pit crewing for George and his Maserati, was incredibly gifted with his hands. Made his own band saw and table saw. First rate machinist. I remember watching him make cuts on his table saw. He'd set the blad just a scootch below the upper surface of the boar, then proceed to lay his hand atop the board and shove the board thru, his hand directly above the blade. :eek: He still has all his digits!

Ed Harrow
06-25-2003, 09:15 PM
My next door neighbor when I was a kid, besides pit crewing for George and his Maserati, was incredibly gifted with his hands. Made his own band saw and table saw. First rate machinist. I remember watching him make cuts on his table saw. He'd set the blad just a scootch below the upper surface of the boar, then proceed to lay his hand atop the board and shove the board thru, his hand directly above the blade. :eek: He still has all his digits!

Ed Harrow
06-25-2003, 09:15 PM
My next door neighbor when I was a kid, besides pit crewing for George and his Maserati, was incredibly gifted with his hands. Made his own band saw and table saw. First rate machinist. I remember watching him make cuts on his table saw. He'd set the blad just a scootch below the upper surface of the boar, then proceed to lay his hand atop the board and shove the board thru, his hand directly above the blade. :eek: He still has all his digits!

htom
06-25-2003, 11:04 PM
I'm going to go throw up now.

htom
06-25-2003, 11:04 PM
I'm going to go throw up now.

htom
06-25-2003, 11:04 PM
I'm going to go throw up now.

Wild Dingo
07-01-2003, 11:55 AM
only power tool I have a healthy fear of is a chain saw the others I have a deep abiding respect for... but the chainsaw now thats one seriass flesh eating machine if in the wrong hands!

Wild Dingo
07-01-2003, 11:55 AM
only power tool I have a healthy fear of is a chain saw the others I have a deep abiding respect for... but the chainsaw now thats one seriass flesh eating machine if in the wrong hands!

Wild Dingo
07-01-2003, 11:55 AM
only power tool I have a healthy fear of is a chain saw the others I have a deep abiding respect for... but the chainsaw now thats one seriass flesh eating machine if in the wrong hands!

Ken Hutchins
07-01-2003, 01:24 PM
My vote for worse flesh eater is the saw chain adapter for a disk grinder. :eek: That is a great roughing tool but, damm it can sure get out of control with the slightest slip up. :eek: I have one and I dress up like an OSHA poster child when using it. :rolleyes:

Ken Hutchins
07-01-2003, 01:24 PM
My vote for worse flesh eater is the saw chain adapter for a disk grinder. :eek: That is a great roughing tool but, damm it can sure get out of control with the slightest slip up. :eek: I have one and I dress up like an OSHA poster child when using it. :rolleyes:

Ken Hutchins
07-01-2003, 01:24 PM
My vote for worse flesh eater is the saw chain adapter for a disk grinder. :eek: That is a great roughing tool but, damm it can sure get out of control with the slightest slip up. :eek: I have one and I dress up like an OSHA poster child when using it. :rolleyes:

Stephen Hutchins
07-01-2003, 01:47 PM
Good news: The day is coming soon when a table saw will sense when it hits flesh and stop so fast that the cut will be less than 1/16" deep. Of course, I don't want to be the guinnea pig so I'll use a push stick, thank you. Besides for being safer, a well designed push stick can help to mill small dimensions much faster and more accuratley -If I only could learn to spell now.

Stephen Hutchins
07-01-2003, 01:47 PM
Good news: The day is coming soon when a table saw will sense when it hits flesh and stop so fast that the cut will be less than 1/16" deep. Of course, I don't want to be the guinnea pig so I'll use a push stick, thank you. Besides for being safer, a well designed push stick can help to mill small dimensions much faster and more accuratley -If I only could learn to spell now.

Stephen Hutchins
07-01-2003, 01:47 PM
Good news: The day is coming soon when a table saw will sense when it hits flesh and stop so fast that the cut will be less than 1/16" deep. Of course, I don't want to be the guinnea pig so I'll use a push stick, thank you. Besides for being safer, a well designed push stick can help to mill small dimensions much faster and more accuratley -If I only could learn to spell now.

Kermit
07-01-2003, 02:15 PM
A tablesaw was the mainstay in providing my bread and butter for years, and I have no scars. I still get an adrenaline rush whenever I light one up. I believe a large part of the problem is that few folks are willing to slow down, think about the task they are going to ask the saw to do, and then go about it in the safest way. Too many folks take shortcuts in the name of efficiency.

Think JIGS and FIXTURES. Buy 'em or make 'em, but USE 'em.

Kermit
07-01-2003, 02:15 PM
A tablesaw was the mainstay in providing my bread and butter for years, and I have no scars. I still get an adrenaline rush whenever I light one up. I believe a large part of the problem is that few folks are willing to slow down, think about the task they are going to ask the saw to do, and then go about it in the safest way. Too many folks take shortcuts in the name of efficiency.

Think JIGS and FIXTURES. Buy 'em or make 'em, but USE 'em.

Kermit
07-01-2003, 02:15 PM
A tablesaw was the mainstay in providing my bread and butter for years, and I have no scars. I still get an adrenaline rush whenever I light one up. I believe a large part of the problem is that few folks are willing to slow down, think about the task they are going to ask the saw to do, and then go about it in the safest way. Too many folks take shortcuts in the name of efficiency.

Think JIGS and FIXTURES. Buy 'em or make 'em, but USE 'em.

Ken Hall
07-03-2003, 03:42 PM
I assume all my tools, even sandpaper, hate me and will kill me at the first opportunity.

Ken Hall
07-03-2003, 03:42 PM
I assume all my tools, even sandpaper, hate me and will kill me at the first opportunity.

Ken Hall
07-03-2003, 03:42 PM
I assume all my tools, even sandpaper, hate me and will kill me at the first opportunity.

Victorious
07-10-2003, 08:17 PM
A little over two years ago....
To my recollection I had a push stick in one hand and the other hand well clear.
I have no idea how it happened from there.
I lost two fingers and half the thumb of my left hand.
I still stare at a table saw sometimes and try to figure how i could have done it.
I cannot stop wondering how i can avoid further injury without knowing where i went wrong before!

Both fingers were replanted, but the index finger did not make it and the next is alive but useless. They did not attept to replant the thumb.... I had damaged it too badly when i trod on it!
A sobering thought.......
If you do have an accident.... STAND STILL! Shout and scream if ya like, But dont dance about...

Russell Ferriday

Victorious
07-10-2003, 08:17 PM
A little over two years ago....
To my recollection I had a push stick in one hand and the other hand well clear.
I have no idea how it happened from there.
I lost two fingers and half the thumb of my left hand.
I still stare at a table saw sometimes and try to figure how i could have done it.
I cannot stop wondering how i can avoid further injury without knowing where i went wrong before!

Both fingers were replanted, but the index finger did not make it and the next is alive but useless. They did not attept to replant the thumb.... I had damaged it too badly when i trod on it!
A sobering thought.......
If you do have an accident.... STAND STILL! Shout and scream if ya like, But dont dance about...

Russell Ferriday

Victorious
07-10-2003, 08:17 PM
A little over two years ago....
To my recollection I had a push stick in one hand and the other hand well clear.
I have no idea how it happened from there.
I lost two fingers and half the thumb of my left hand.
I still stare at a table saw sometimes and try to figure how i could have done it.
I cannot stop wondering how i can avoid further injury without knowing where i went wrong before!

Both fingers were replanted, but the index finger did not make it and the next is alive but useless. They did not attept to replant the thumb.... I had damaged it too badly when i trod on it!
A sobering thought.......
If you do have an accident.... STAND STILL! Shout and scream if ya like, But dont dance about...

Russell Ferriday

fwalschots
07-11-2003, 01:14 AM
Permit me to join the topic.

Having been a furniture maker/woodworker for many years, with all of my digits attached I still have a healthy respect for my machines even though I know all of their habits.

With the table saw having that riving knife is paramount to stop the wood pinching after ripping. The wood pinching causes a lot of kickback. Mt riving knife is fractionally thicker than my saw blade and I have never had kickback of any kind after thousands of metres of sawing. Another thing is to ensure that your rip fence is not set perfectly paralell to your blade. You need a slight run off from behind the blade.

The machine I am most weary of is the 'Spindle Moulder' what with a kilo or two of steel with blades spinning around 10,000 RPM. Scary. This is one machine that can bite all too quickly.

There is an story an old cabinet maker once told me. Many years ago before safety knives etc on spindle moulders the cutting heads were square and simply held in place with bolt tension.
Well, the guys who set them up would tighten all bolts and then put their heads down below the table surface before switching on the machine. If the blades didn't fly out then it should be alright.

The point here is: most modern machinery is designed with important safety features etc. Problems and accidents occur when the operator does not concentrate (tired, distracted) or when they omit to use the saftey equipment provided.

Before I start with any machine or operation I always double check and think to myself what could go wrong and take measures to ensure that if something happened my hands are not in the way or I am not inline with the direction of the saw etc.

I aim to keep all of my digits.

fwalschots
07-11-2003, 01:14 AM
Permit me to join the topic.

Having been a furniture maker/woodworker for many years, with all of my digits attached I still have a healthy respect for my machines even though I know all of their habits.

With the table saw having that riving knife is paramount to stop the wood pinching after ripping. The wood pinching causes a lot of kickback. Mt riving knife is fractionally thicker than my saw blade and I have never had kickback of any kind after thousands of metres of sawing. Another thing is to ensure that your rip fence is not set perfectly paralell to your blade. You need a slight run off from behind the blade.

The machine I am most weary of is the 'Spindle Moulder' what with a kilo or two of steel with blades spinning around 10,000 RPM. Scary. This is one machine that can bite all too quickly.

There is an story an old cabinet maker once told me. Many years ago before safety knives etc on spindle moulders the cutting heads were square and simply held in place with bolt tension.
Well, the guys who set them up would tighten all bolts and then put their heads down below the table surface before switching on the machine. If the blades didn't fly out then it should be alright.

The point here is: most modern machinery is designed with important safety features etc. Problems and accidents occur when the operator does not concentrate (tired, distracted) or when they omit to use the saftey equipment provided.

Before I start with any machine or operation I always double check and think to myself what could go wrong and take measures to ensure that if something happened my hands are not in the way or I am not inline with the direction of the saw etc.

I aim to keep all of my digits.

fwalschots
07-11-2003, 01:14 AM
Permit me to join the topic.

Having been a furniture maker/woodworker for many years, with all of my digits attached I still have a healthy respect for my machines even though I know all of their habits.

With the table saw having that riving knife is paramount to stop the wood pinching after ripping. The wood pinching causes a lot of kickback. Mt riving knife is fractionally thicker than my saw blade and I have never had kickback of any kind after thousands of metres of sawing. Another thing is to ensure that your rip fence is not set perfectly paralell to your blade. You need a slight run off from behind the blade.

The machine I am most weary of is the 'Spindle Moulder' what with a kilo or two of steel with blades spinning around 10,000 RPM. Scary. This is one machine that can bite all too quickly.

There is an story an old cabinet maker once told me. Many years ago before safety knives etc on spindle moulders the cutting heads were square and simply held in place with bolt tension.
Well, the guys who set them up would tighten all bolts and then put their heads down below the table surface before switching on the machine. If the blades didn't fly out then it should be alright.

The point here is: most modern machinery is designed with important safety features etc. Problems and accidents occur when the operator does not concentrate (tired, distracted) or when they omit to use the saftey equipment provided.

Before I start with any machine or operation I always double check and think to myself what could go wrong and take measures to ensure that if something happened my hands are not in the way or I am not inline with the direction of the saw etc.

I aim to keep all of my digits.

imported_Mac
07-11-2003, 02:06 AM
Russel,

Very sad indeed.
I hope you don't feel offended by me asking how you are doing with Victorious.
Can you continue working on her as before the accident? How is the project going?

Mac

imported_Mac
07-11-2003, 02:06 AM
Russel,

Very sad indeed.
I hope you don't feel offended by me asking how you are doing with Victorious.
Can you continue working on her as before the accident? How is the project going?

Mac

imported_Mac
07-11-2003, 02:06 AM
Russel,

Very sad indeed.
I hope you don't feel offended by me asking how you are doing with Victorious.
Can you continue working on her as before the accident? How is the project going?

Mac

Bob Smalser
07-11-2003, 07:53 AM
One of the more poignant things Dad used to say was, "....machines can't hear you cry."

Bob Smalser
07-11-2003, 07:53 AM
One of the more poignant things Dad used to say was, "....machines can't hear you cry."

Bob Smalser
07-11-2003, 07:53 AM
One of the more poignant things Dad used to say was, "....machines can't hear you cry."

Keith G.
07-11-2003, 09:52 AM
Nasty stories. 10 years ago I worked as a butcher in a small grocery store. Since then I have done a little meatcutting on the side (moose mostly, a few deer). Anyway, every time I start the meat bandsaw I try to remind myself that this machine is specifically made to cut MUSCLE and BONE, just what my hands are made of. Sobering thought....

When I was employed as a meatcutter, I used to cut pork chops by the dozen. Sometimes I would be at the saw for 45 minutes to an hour. I remember catching the chops coming off the saw with my left hand (meat bandsaws are reversed from wood saws) while my right hand held the pork loin. Once in a while my fingers would touch the back side of the (runnig) blade. I never lost any digits, but I maintain a healthy respect for such machines.

Respect those tools, they don't care what they cut.

Keep the dust flying, and the blood contained...

Keith G.
07-11-2003, 09:52 AM
Nasty stories. 10 years ago I worked as a butcher in a small grocery store. Since then I have done a little meatcutting on the side (moose mostly, a few deer). Anyway, every time I start the meat bandsaw I try to remind myself that this machine is specifically made to cut MUSCLE and BONE, just what my hands are made of. Sobering thought....

When I was employed as a meatcutter, I used to cut pork chops by the dozen. Sometimes I would be at the saw for 45 minutes to an hour. I remember catching the chops coming off the saw with my left hand (meat bandsaws are reversed from wood saws) while my right hand held the pork loin. Once in a while my fingers would touch the back side of the (runnig) blade. I never lost any digits, but I maintain a healthy respect for such machines.

Respect those tools, they don't care what they cut.

Keep the dust flying, and the blood contained...

Keith G.
07-11-2003, 09:52 AM
Nasty stories. 10 years ago I worked as a butcher in a small grocery store. Since then I have done a little meatcutting on the side (moose mostly, a few deer). Anyway, every time I start the meat bandsaw I try to remind myself that this machine is specifically made to cut MUSCLE and BONE, just what my hands are made of. Sobering thought....

When I was employed as a meatcutter, I used to cut pork chops by the dozen. Sometimes I would be at the saw for 45 minutes to an hour. I remember catching the chops coming off the saw with my left hand (meat bandsaws are reversed from wood saws) while my right hand held the pork loin. Once in a while my fingers would touch the back side of the (runnig) blade. I never lost any digits, but I maintain a healthy respect for such machines.

Respect those tools, they don't care what they cut.

Keep the dust flying, and the blood contained...

edsr
07-11-2003, 03:27 PM
We will be reading these stories hoping that we are not the subject until some manufacturer steps up to the plate and includes that blade stopper thingy on their saws.

How many guys named "knuckles" does it take?

ANY OF YOU COMPANIES OUT THERE GOT ENOUGH CAJONES TO BUILD A BETTER SAW AND GAMBLE THAT IT WILL SELL?

Yes, I was yelling!

Haven't we have had this discussion too many times already?

How many of us in our right mind would use one of the old square headed joiners? As currently designed and built table saws are obsolete without the currently available safety feature of a blade stopper.

Nothing will change unless we make it change.

Rant over.
edsr

edsr
07-11-2003, 03:27 PM
We will be reading these stories hoping that we are not the subject until some manufacturer steps up to the plate and includes that blade stopper thingy on their saws.

How many guys named "knuckles" does it take?

ANY OF YOU COMPANIES OUT THERE GOT ENOUGH CAJONES TO BUILD A BETTER SAW AND GAMBLE THAT IT WILL SELL?

Yes, I was yelling!

Haven't we have had this discussion too many times already?

How many of us in our right mind would use one of the old square headed joiners? As currently designed and built table saws are obsolete without the currently available safety feature of a blade stopper.

Nothing will change unless we make it change.

Rant over.
edsr

edsr
07-11-2003, 03:27 PM
We will be reading these stories hoping that we are not the subject until some manufacturer steps up to the plate and includes that blade stopper thingy on their saws.

How many guys named "knuckles" does it take?

ANY OF YOU COMPANIES OUT THERE GOT ENOUGH CAJONES TO BUILD A BETTER SAW AND GAMBLE THAT IT WILL SELL?

Yes, I was yelling!

Haven't we have had this discussion too many times already?

How many of us in our right mind would use one of the old square headed joiners? As currently designed and built table saws are obsolete without the currently available safety feature of a blade stopper.

Nothing will change unless we make it change.

Rant over.
edsr

htom
07-11-2003, 03:46 PM
edsr -- they're not making them because they're afraid of the lawsuits from the people who cut off their hands on the OLD saws claiming that they thought that that particular saw had the "safe stop".

Such inventions always cause "secondary injury" as people must first learn "new ways" and then learn to learn when to use the new way and when to use the old way ... and in our culture, the award is paid by those with the deepest pockets.

htom
07-11-2003, 03:46 PM
edsr -- they're not making them because they're afraid of the lawsuits from the people who cut off their hands on the OLD saws claiming that they thought that that particular saw had the "safe stop".

Such inventions always cause "secondary injury" as people must first learn "new ways" and then learn to learn when to use the new way and when to use the old way ... and in our culture, the award is paid by those with the deepest pockets.

htom
07-11-2003, 03:46 PM
edsr -- they're not making them because they're afraid of the lawsuits from the people who cut off their hands on the OLD saws claiming that they thought that that particular saw had the "safe stop".

Such inventions always cause "secondary injury" as people must first learn "new ways" and then learn to learn when to use the new way and when to use the old way ... and in our culture, the award is paid by those with the deepest pockets.

john welsford
07-11-2003, 09:31 PM
I have just been through this subject in another forum. My dayjob sees meworking as an industrial consultant in teh woodworkingand sawmill industries, and out OSHA equivalent has just been given a lot of much sharper teeth than they used to have so I've been working in the operator safety area a lot.
Statistics from accident claims show that
the worst offender among the fixed machines in light woodworking is the Radial Arm Saw. By a long way! The next worst is the pneumatic docking saw.

But interestingly, at home, of the fixed machinery in spite of it being outnumbered about 5 to one by the table saw the humble bandsaw is the worst in terms of numbers of injuries. The nature of those ijuries is interesting as well, a fair proportion of digits detached but a significant number of instances where the hand has been passed from one side to the other across the front of the blade and guide and knuckles have contacted the blade.
This is a really nasty injury as it usually severs the extensor tendon and the nature of the cut means that another piece of tendon has to be found eleswhere in the body to make up the missing length. Ouch! Put the sliding guard down just above the workpiece EVERY TIME! If the machine has not got one, make one or at worst, sell the machine to a politician ( theyre not human and it doesnt matter what happens to them) and buy a better one.
Hand power tools? The most commone severe injury is actually electric shock! But hand held power planes are well up there.
JohnW

john welsford
07-11-2003, 09:31 PM
I have just been through this subject in another forum. My dayjob sees meworking as an industrial consultant in teh woodworkingand sawmill industries, and out OSHA equivalent has just been given a lot of much sharper teeth than they used to have so I've been working in the operator safety area a lot.
Statistics from accident claims show that
the worst offender among the fixed machines in light woodworking is the Radial Arm Saw. By a long way! The next worst is the pneumatic docking saw.

But interestingly, at home, of the fixed machinery in spite of it being outnumbered about 5 to one by the table saw the humble bandsaw is the worst in terms of numbers of injuries. The nature of those ijuries is interesting as well, a fair proportion of digits detached but a significant number of instances where the hand has been passed from one side to the other across the front of the blade and guide and knuckles have contacted the blade.
This is a really nasty injury as it usually severs the extensor tendon and the nature of the cut means that another piece of tendon has to be found eleswhere in the body to make up the missing length. Ouch! Put the sliding guard down just above the workpiece EVERY TIME! If the machine has not got one, make one or at worst, sell the machine to a politician ( theyre not human and it doesnt matter what happens to them) and buy a better one.
Hand power tools? The most commone severe injury is actually electric shock! But hand held power planes are well up there.
JohnW

john welsford
07-11-2003, 09:31 PM
I have just been through this subject in another forum. My dayjob sees meworking as an industrial consultant in teh woodworkingand sawmill industries, and out OSHA equivalent has just been given a lot of much sharper teeth than they used to have so I've been working in the operator safety area a lot.
Statistics from accident claims show that
the worst offender among the fixed machines in light woodworking is the Radial Arm Saw. By a long way! The next worst is the pneumatic docking saw.

But interestingly, at home, of the fixed machinery in spite of it being outnumbered about 5 to one by the table saw the humble bandsaw is the worst in terms of numbers of injuries. The nature of those ijuries is interesting as well, a fair proportion of digits detached but a significant number of instances where the hand has been passed from one side to the other across the front of the blade and guide and knuckles have contacted the blade.
This is a really nasty injury as it usually severs the extensor tendon and the nature of the cut means that another piece of tendon has to be found eleswhere in the body to make up the missing length. Ouch! Put the sliding guard down just above the workpiece EVERY TIME! If the machine has not got one, make one or at worst, sell the machine to a politician ( theyre not human and it doesnt matter what happens to them) and buy a better one.
Hand power tools? The most commone severe injury is actually electric shock! But hand held power planes are well up there.
JohnW

Victorious
07-13-2003, 07:08 AM
Originally posted by Mac:
Russel,

Very sad indeed.
I hope you don't feel offended by me asking how you are doing with Victorious.
Can you continue working on her as before the accident? How is the project going?

MacVictorious continues. Perhaps a little slower than before, But progress is significant.
My hand is still pretty much useless but It's amazing how much you adapt when you have sufficient motivation.
Little things are still a real pain in the butt.. Like sharpening a pencil.
I used to do this with a chisel as and when i needed to. A habit for years which worked well as when I am working I am rarely more than a few feet from a good sharp chisel. I still try to do it when i am deep in thought about some frame or floor or futtock. still, two years on, I cant get enough grip on the blasted pencil with my left hand and all i achive is to throw the pencil away.
Someone watched me do this recently and when i'd stopped swearing he sugeested i swap hands. Hmmmm... An insecurly held chisel in my left hand pointing near my good right hand..... errrrr No.
Tried a little sharpener i could keep in my pocket... I kept dropping it.
:rolleyes:
The soloution is a boat and workshop littered with pencils and the occasional half hour stint of collecting-sharpening (with big "turn handle" sharpener)-redistributing em..

Most keyless chucks in drills are beyond me. the two opposing collars are to small for the hand to grip. Bosch seem to be the only battery drills with an effective shaft Brake to enable me to grip the whole drill and thus do up or undo the chuck with my good hand. I only discovered this problem after i had bought a cheap battery drill. Fortunatly the supplier was very understanding and refunded my money on it smile.gif

Framing of Victorious is virtually complete as are deck beams engine beds and both coachroofs.
I have three good larch trees stacked cut and ready for the planking and even a couple of thousand Silly bronze screws. :D I have wasted a few weeks pondering "boil in a bag" steaming of garboards..... And how i gonna do them "Single handed" tongue.gif

Victorious
07-13-2003, 07:08 AM
Originally posted by Mac:
Russel,

Very sad indeed.
I hope you don't feel offended by me asking how you are doing with Victorious.
Can you continue working on her as before the accident? How is the project going?

MacVictorious continues. Perhaps a little slower than before, But progress is significant.
My hand is still pretty much useless but It's amazing how much you adapt when you have sufficient motivation.
Little things are still a real pain in the butt.. Like sharpening a pencil.
I used to do this with a chisel as and when i needed to. A habit for years which worked well as when I am working I am rarely more than a few feet from a good sharp chisel. I still try to do it when i am deep in thought about some frame or floor or futtock. still, two years on, I cant get enough grip on the blasted pencil with my left hand and all i achive is to throw the pencil away.
Someone watched me do this recently and when i'd stopped swearing he sugeested i swap hands. Hmmmm... An insecurly held chisel in my left hand pointing near my good right hand..... errrrr No.
Tried a little sharpener i could keep in my pocket... I kept dropping it.
:rolleyes:
The soloution is a boat and workshop littered with pencils and the occasional half hour stint of collecting-sharpening (with big "turn handle" sharpener)-redistributing em..

Most keyless chucks in drills are beyond me. the two opposing collars are to small for the hand to grip. Bosch seem to be the only battery drills with an effective shaft Brake to enable me to grip the whole drill and thus do up or undo the chuck with my good hand. I only discovered this problem after i had bought a cheap battery drill. Fortunatly the supplier was very understanding and refunded my money on it smile.gif

Framing of Victorious is virtually complete as are deck beams engine beds and both coachroofs.
I have three good larch trees stacked cut and ready for the planking and even a couple of thousand Silly bronze screws. :D I have wasted a few weeks pondering "boil in a bag" steaming of garboards..... And how i gonna do them "Single handed" tongue.gif

Victorious
07-13-2003, 07:08 AM
Originally posted by Mac:
Russel,

Very sad indeed.
I hope you don't feel offended by me asking how you are doing with Victorious.
Can you continue working on her as before the accident? How is the project going?

MacVictorious continues. Perhaps a little slower than before, But progress is significant.
My hand is still pretty much useless but It's amazing how much you adapt when you have sufficient motivation.
Little things are still a real pain in the butt.. Like sharpening a pencil.
I used to do this with a chisel as and when i needed to. A habit for years which worked well as when I am working I am rarely more than a few feet from a good sharp chisel. I still try to do it when i am deep in thought about some frame or floor or futtock. still, two years on, I cant get enough grip on the blasted pencil with my left hand and all i achive is to throw the pencil away.
Someone watched me do this recently and when i'd stopped swearing he sugeested i swap hands. Hmmmm... An insecurly held chisel in my left hand pointing near my good right hand..... errrrr No.
Tried a little sharpener i could keep in my pocket... I kept dropping it.
:rolleyes:
The soloution is a boat and workshop littered with pencils and the occasional half hour stint of collecting-sharpening (with big "turn handle" sharpener)-redistributing em..

Most keyless chucks in drills are beyond me. the two opposing collars are to small for the hand to grip. Bosch seem to be the only battery drills with an effective shaft Brake to enable me to grip the whole drill and thus do up or undo the chuck with my good hand. I only discovered this problem after i had bought a cheap battery drill. Fortunatly the supplier was very understanding and refunded my money on it smile.gif

Framing of Victorious is virtually complete as are deck beams engine beds and both coachroofs.
I have three good larch trees stacked cut and ready for the planking and even a couple of thousand Silly bronze screws. :D I have wasted a few weeks pondering "boil in a bag" steaming of garboards..... And how i gonna do them "Single handed" tongue.gif

Mrleft8
07-13-2003, 11:16 AM
Shall I tell the story of the girl working at the local deli, running the hamburger grinder while talking to her friend about the modeling contract she'd just been offered the day before....? Probably not.....

Mrleft8
07-13-2003, 11:16 AM
Shall I tell the story of the girl working at the local deli, running the hamburger grinder while talking to her friend about the modeling contract she'd just been offered the day before....? Probably not.....

Mrleft8
07-13-2003, 11:16 AM
Shall I tell the story of the girl working at the local deli, running the hamburger grinder while talking to her friend about the modeling contract she'd just been offered the day before....? Probably not.....

High C
07-13-2003, 04:21 PM
What's the concensus on the table saw blade guards that come with modern saws? Does ANYONE use them?

High C
07-13-2003, 04:21 PM
What's the concensus on the table saw blade guards that come with modern saws? Does ANYONE use them?

High C
07-13-2003, 04:21 PM
What's the concensus on the table saw blade guards that come with modern saws? Does ANYONE use them?

Mrleft8
07-13-2003, 11:02 PM
JT.... I do NOT. Even the new ones get in the way,obstruct your view, and cause you to perform gymnastics while trying to cut a board. (in my opinion)

Mrleft8
07-13-2003, 11:02 PM
JT.... I do NOT. Even the new ones get in the way,obstruct your view, and cause you to perform gymnastics while trying to cut a board. (in my opinion)

Mrleft8
07-13-2003, 11:02 PM
JT.... I do NOT. Even the new ones get in the way,obstruct your view, and cause you to perform gymnastics while trying to cut a board. (in my opinion)

imported_Mac
07-14-2003, 06:30 AM
Russel,

As I read it, you still have a great sense of humour left, and that is very (if not the most) important.

I am glad for you that you keep on working on Victorious. The satisfaction will only be bigger when she is done.

As for sharpening, I use the same big "turn handle" sharpener, but that's beceause I can't find out how to sharpen with a chisel :rolleyes:

Good luck to you!

[ 07-14-2003, 06:31 AM: Message edited by: Mac ]

imported_Mac
07-14-2003, 06:30 AM
Russel,

As I read it, you still have a great sense of humour left, and that is very (if not the most) important.

I am glad for you that you keep on working on Victorious. The satisfaction will only be bigger when she is done.

As for sharpening, I use the same big "turn handle" sharpener, but that's beceause I can't find out how to sharpen with a chisel :rolleyes:

Good luck to you!

[ 07-14-2003, 06:31 AM: Message edited by: Mac ]

imported_Mac
07-14-2003, 06:30 AM
Russel,

As I read it, you still have a great sense of humour left, and that is very (if not the most) important.

I am glad for you that you keep on working on Victorious. The satisfaction will only be bigger when she is done.

As for sharpening, I use the same big "turn handle" sharpener, but that's beceause I can't find out how to sharpen with a chisel :rolleyes:

Good luck to you!

[ 07-14-2003, 06:31 AM: Message edited by: Mac ]