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Larks
08-28-2014, 10:16 PM
.....another forum that I visit from time to time has a sort of helpfulness/like rating and thank-you option and I'd initially thought it was a bit elitist, but it made me wonder......

Often over the few years that I've been here, I've seen forumites lambasting other forumites and seen the arguments grow until someone finally cracks in frustration. And I've noticed that many of the vocal ones in those arguments live primarily in the bilge and contribute diddly squat to anything to do with Wooden Boats above decks, while others, although just as vocal, at least sing for their supper above decks - not necessarily just providing advice and opinion, but equally importantly providing encouragement, support and appreciation of those that post their works, experiences and boat related problems above decks.

So I can't help feeling just a little bit miffed when I see someone who actively contributes above decks, get shot down and banned, in a couple of sad cases eternally, by someone who spends their entire existence on this forum skulking below decks. For those who never venture into the sunlight, how would they know what value that person might be providing to the greater part of the forum when all they see is the underside of the lowest deck?

On the adverse side, we've seen a few bilge living antagonists and trolls come and go and have also seen their supporters here bleat at their going, ignoring that in many cases they've not actually ever contributed anything positive to the Wooden Boat Forum itself but have instead often introduced a new level of nastiness and mischief that the forum can well do without.

So perhaps a similar thank-you/like rating opportunity might be a good thing - ABOVE DECKS - (i.e. not in the bilge) to recognise the well considered responses, advice, encouragement and support that are the most important and valuable elements of this forum and the reason that most of us came here in the first place.

Perhaps then when the powers that be are put on the spot of smiting someone from these pages to kill a dispute, they'd (he'd) at least have the opportunity to see what the forum might be losing by that action - some forumites really are a loss to the rest of us on the forum, (who may never have any idea what went on the bilge to get them smited - smote?), for the sake of appeasing one angry and vindictive button pusher............while other smitees really are no loss to the forum.

I kinda think it'd be useful to recognise the difference and to be able acknowledge the effort that many great people here apply to their contributions ABOVE DECK.

Just a thought!!;)

jsjpd1
08-28-2014, 10:50 PM
Now you're in for it! Don't you know you're not supposed to critize the bilge in the bilge?:p

Jim

Larks
08-28-2014, 10:54 PM
Now you're in for it! Don't you know you're not supposed to critize the bilge in the bilge?:p

Jim

Livin' life on the edge Jim.;)

David G
08-28-2014, 11:32 PM
Is that the edge of the continent? The edge of the desert? The edge of dessert? The edge of sanity?

I, too, have always wondered what on earth people are doing hanging around in the Bilge section of a wooden boat forum... if they have (it seems) no interest and no contribution to make when it comes to actual wooden boats. One can certainly speculate... but it's a bit of a puzzler.

KMacDonald
08-28-2014, 11:35 PM
.....another forum that I visit from time to time has a sort of helpfulness/like rating and thank-you option and I'd initially thought it was a bit elitist, but it made me wonder......

Often over the few years that I've been here, I've seen forumites lambasting other forumites and seen the arguments grow until someone finally cracks in frustration. And I've noticed that many of the vocal ones in those arguments live primarily in the bilge and contribute diddly squat to anything to do with Wooden Boats above decks, while others, although just as vocal, at least sing for their supper above decks - not necessarily just providing advice and opinion, but equally importantly providing encouragement, support and appreciation of those that post their works, experiences and boat related problems above decks.

So I can't help feeling just a little bit miffed when I see someone who actively contributes above decks, get shot down and banned, in a couple of sad cases eternally, by someone who spends their entire existence on this forum skulking below decks. For those who never venture into the sunlight, how would they know what value that person might be providing to the greater part of the forum when all they see is the underside of the lowest deck?

On the adverse side, we've seen a few bilge living antagonists and trolls come and go and have also seen their supporters here bleat at their going, ignoring that in many cases they've not actually ever contributed anything positive to the Wooden Boat Forum itself but have instead often introduced a new level of nastiness and mischief that the forum can well do without.

So perhaps a similar thank-you/like rating opportunity might be a good thing - ABOVE DECKS - (i.e. not in the bilge) to recognise the well considered responses, advice, encouragement and support that are the most important and valuable elements of this forum and the reason that most of us came here in the first place.

Perhaps then when the powers that be are put on the spot of smiting someone from these pages to kill a dispute, they'd (he'd) at least have the opportunity to see what the forum might be losing by that action - some forumites really are a loss to the rest of us on the forum, (who may never have any idea what went on the bilge to get them smited - smote?), for the sake of appeasing one angry and vindictive button pusher............while other smitees really are no loss to the forum.

I kinda think it'd be useful to recognise the difference and to be able acknowledge the effort that many great people here apply to their contributions ABOVE DECK.

Just a thought!!;)

Let me guess, you want to make the decision who gets banned.

Larks
08-28-2014, 11:38 PM
Is that the edge of the continent? The edge of the desert? The edge of dessert? The edge of sanity?

I, too, have always wondered what on earth people are doing hanging around in the Bilge section of a wooden boat forum... if they have (it seems) no interest and no contribution to make when it comes to actual wooden boats. One can certainly speculate... but it's a bit of a puzzler.

All of the above David.:d


Let me guess, you want to make the decision who gets banned. I can not think of anything that I'd want less......(ebola perhaps :rolleyes:).

Ian McColgin
08-28-2014, 11:46 PM
There are said to be more folk in industrial nations who read WoodenBoat Magazine than there are wooden boats. There are certainly plenty of people on this forum who don't have wooden boats but like being in the woodenboat community. The thing is, while they can appreciate woodenboats, they might not, or might feel they've not, have much to say about designs or building or whatever. So they do their thing in the Bilge. Fine by me. Lotta room around here.

PeterSibley
08-29-2014, 02:47 AM
A good suggestion Greg, perhaps some way of generating Scot Credit Points for useful works above deck .

I'd give RodB quite a few for his above decks activities .

The Bigfella
08-29-2014, 03:04 AM
With one rider. There's the odd little clique, decides to play games... "get" people and so on. It ain't gunna work around here.

Larks
08-29-2014, 03:07 AM
There are said to be more folk in industrial nations who read WoodenBoat Magazine than there are wooden boats. There are certainly plenty of people on this forum who don't have wooden boats but like being in the woodenboat community. The thing is, while they can appreciate woodenboats, they might not, or might feel they've not, have much to say about designs or building or whatever. So they do their thing in the Bilge. Fine by me. Lotta room around here.

True enough Ian, but a "wow I enjoy your work", or an "I'm inspired to do something similar" or the like does go a very very very long way when someone is going to the trouble of posting their work. I'm referring though to those that never make an appearance above decks and seem to be only here for the bilge.



A good suggestion Greg, perhaps some way of generating Scot Credit Points for useful works above deck .

I'd give RodB quite a few for his above decks activities .

Likewise Peter, and I could rattle off quite a few more.

The Bigfella
08-29-2014, 03:19 AM
Greg, I'm sure there's lots of folks who don't post much above decks because there's plenty who are better qualified. That doesn't mean they aren't interested.

Take your paint thread... I was going to suggest exactly what someone else already had (buy a smaller tin of the same paint in another colour to tint the white) - but as I read down, there it was already.... so, no comment forthcoming.

I did that with the paint for my 100 year old bandsaw btw... using a couple of different colours of epoxy paint....

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff112/igatenby/iansecond/painted.jpg (http://s240.photobucket.com/user/igatenby/media/iansecond/painted.jpg.html)

changeng
08-29-2014, 04:20 AM
There are said to be more folk in industrial nations who read WoodenBoat Magazine than there are wooden boats. There are certainly plenty of people on this forum who don't have wooden boats but like being in the woodenboat community. The thing is, while they can appreciate woodenboats, they might not, or might feel they've not, have much to say about designs or building or whatever. So they do their thing in the Bilge. Fine by me. Lotta room around here.

Spot on.
I do have a small boat, it is wooden. I do drop in upstairs to look at the builds and generally like looking at wooden boats.
OTOH I know diddly squat about them . I'm sure some numpty chiming in with "nice boat well done" would make the toffs up there swoon with pleasure. Meh.

PeterSibley
08-29-2014, 04:36 AM
Spot on.
I do have a small boat, it is wooden. I do drop in upstairs to look at the builds and generally like looking at wooden boats.
OTOH I know diddly squat about them . I'm sure some numpty chiming in with "nice boat well done" would make the toffs up there swoon with pleasure. Meh.

It would ! It would be wonderful .|:)
http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?150812-JIM-an-18-foot-canoe-yawl&highlight=

There you go !

changeng
08-29-2014, 04:45 AM
There ya go back atcha ...
The fact is some of us are too modest and self effacing to post upstairs.. here you can be as dim as you like..no one cares.

PeterSibley
08-29-2014, 04:49 AM
I originally came to the forum to learn about America. Politics interests me and the motivations of the biggest kid on the block are always fascinating for the little kids .

Oh yeah, I like building things too and I like boats .

changeng
08-29-2014, 04:55 AM
I originally came to the forum to seek help with my boat and sailing skills.
Much help was given but there's nothing particularly exiting about a little 14' boat and a sometime seasonal pond sailor.
So I have little to contribute upstairs. Some people here seem to think the WBF is like a private old boys club and you have to have some huge life encompassing interest to join. Meh
The Politics is always... well not exatly interesting but one learns something sometimes.

Larks
08-29-2014, 05:05 AM
And some people are simply too self involved to show any expression of interest in what others are doing. Forums imitate life.

skuthorp
08-29-2014, 05:09 AM
I have two small wooden boats at present another wreck, plans for another. I frequent topsides and contribut if I can, which is not often as my knowledge is small compared to many here.
I enjoy the bilge mostly, have no ignore list but have those that I ignore, mostly.

Larks
08-29-2014, 05:14 AM
Greg, I'm sure there's lots of folks who don't post much above decks because there's plenty who are better qualified. That doesn't mean they aren't interested.


Agreed Ian, but I think you know what I'm getting at. Not trying to can people who don't get involved for whatever reason in any particular thread or topic, but to provide the opportunity to recognise and thank those that do actively and regularly contribute to the forum.

Many people here put a lot of thought and effort into their responses and often it's difficult to reply to every post on a thread.

I've not suggested anything like a dislike for the trolls or those that bring their own style of nastiness and mischief, they seem to get sorted out eventually by the greater forum community, the shame is the loss of those valuable contributors that they take with them.

Larks
08-29-2014, 05:16 AM
Just to reiterate: this thread is about providing a means of recognising and thanking the many selfless and helpful people who contribute to this community, not about providing a means of canning those who don't.

Mike Erkkinen
08-29-2014, 05:20 AM
Good idea Larks - and it seems like a long time since hearing about your H28 - will you be back working on it soon?

Larks
08-29-2014, 05:24 AM
Good idea Larks - and it seems like a long time since hearing about your H28 - will you be back working on it soon?

I'm hoping to Mike. At the moment I'm stuck working on the opposite side of the country and only getting home a couple of days a month. A 12 month contract extended another 12 months and now another 2 years.....but I'm working on a plan to cut that short;)

changeng
08-29-2014, 05:31 AM
And some people are simply too self involved to show any expression of interest in what others are doing. Forums imitate life.

Nonsense. Plenty of people here in the bilge probably do as I do...read..appreciate yet don't feel they are qualified to make comment without it seeming inane .. You have skills and knowledge..I don't and so prefer to appreciate quietly. If that's not to your liking.. that's just too bad. As to the original question of the OP.. maybe those that post well upstairs can contain their unpleasantness because it is in their interests to do so ..UP There. I assume you are miffed at a recent banee??
The bilge is not a place to vent your spleen. Vile posts are vile posts and good boat posts upstairs are no excuse.

Mike Erkkinen
08-29-2014, 05:33 AM
I look forward to tracking your restoration. It's nice that you're in a place with so much appreciation of LFrancis and the H28.

Larks
08-29-2014, 05:38 AM
Nonsense. Plenty of people here in the bilge probably do as I do...read..appreciate yet don't feel they are qualified to make comment without it seeming inane .. You have skills and knowledge..I don't and so prefer to appreciate quietly. If that's not to your liking.. that's just too bad. As to the original question of the OP.. maybe those that post well upstairs can contain their unpleasantness because it is in their interests to do so ..UP There. I assume you are miffed at a recent banee??
The bilge is not a place to vent your spleen. Vile posts are vile posts and good boat posts upstairs are no excuse.

No, not at all, it was a suggestion based on my gratefulness for all of the help that I have received over the years that I have been on this forum and on reflection of my disappointment of some of the valuable contributors that we have lost over the years and of the posts that often go with them . If you aren't grateful for the help that you may have received here but would rather turn this suggestion into an argument, perhaps start your own thread find someone else to argue with.

changeng
08-29-2014, 05:47 AM
So what was this about then?
"So I can't help feeling just a little bit miffed when I see someone who actively contributes above decks, get shot down and banned, in a couple of sad cases eternally, by someone who spends their entire existence on this forum skulking below decks. For those who never venture into the sunlight, how would they know what value that person might be providing to the greater part of the forum when all they see is the underside of the lowest deck? "

I have no intent to turn your suggestion into an arguement, but I feel that some of your OP is wrong footed and needs a response.
OTOH My experience of "ratings" on forums (if you mean those little green dots that apear beside a posters ID) is that they are just as prone to politics as anything else.. It just becomes a popularity contest and easily manipulated.

PeterSibley
08-29-2014, 05:55 AM
No, not at all, it was a suggestion based on my gratefulness for all of the help that I have received over the years that I have been on this forum and on reflection of my disappointment of some of the valuable contributors that we have lost over the years and of the posts that often go with them . If you aren't grateful for the help that you may have received here but would rather turn this suggestion into an argument, perhaps start your own thread find someone else to argue with.

I am equally grateful for the boatbuilding expertise offered so freely up on deck, especially relating to small plywood /epoxy craft . My JIM thread was an attempt to give back a little that I had learned and add a little bit of my own. There are some very helpful people up there .

The Bilge has also been a marvelous education not only in the subtleties of US politics but in human nature in all it's convolutions ... some I which I had not before seen demonstrated !

Larks
08-29-2014, 05:58 AM
I am equally grateful for the boatbuilding expertise offered so freely up on deck, especially relating to small plywood /epoxy craft . My JIM thread was an attempt to give back a little that I had learned and add a little bit of my own. There are some very helpful people up there .

The Bilge has also been a marvelous education not only in the subtleties of US politics but in human nature in all it's convolutions ... some I which I had not before seen demonstrated !

It has indeed Peter. Kate suggested it could be a great basis for a psych' thesis.

Jim Ledger
08-29-2014, 06:03 AM
Hey, people are hard-wired to like things like ratings because they give official sanction to precedence and pecking order.

If they also offered a get-out-of-jail-free card then what's not to like?

The best part, though, is that they make a CONTEST out of all the above-deck posts!

Now, do we all start out with zero, or will there be a pro-rated estimate given for past posts?:d




http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m193/searover1916/Quadrant59_zpsf0ed15aa.jpg (http://s104.photobucket.com/user/searover1916/media/Quadrant59_zpsf0ed15aa.jpg.html)

Ian McColgin
08-29-2014, 06:03 AM
I think 'recognition' happens. Bob Smalser could be pretty crusty on social topics but he knew his wood and was a resourse well utilized. Norm Messinger, always nature's gentleman, is remembered quite rightly at the top of every Forum page as the finest who walked or sailed among us. Recognition enough.

Jim Ledger
08-29-2014, 06:10 AM
. Recognition enough.


I dunno, Ian, you play that "Last Boat" thing right I can see some serious points accruing next to your name.

changeng
08-29-2014, 06:10 AM
Yeah.. we don't need no steenking green dots :D

Jim Ledger
08-29-2014, 06:11 AM
Yeah.. we don't need no steenking green dots :D

That might work for you.:D

changeng
08-29-2014, 06:33 AM
That might work for you.:D

:D
seriously, It's not a good idea.
The way "reputations" usually work is that one hit's "like"
then finds one has to"like" at least three other posters before one can "like" the first person you "liked" again.
It works in the converse, one can issue "unlikes"

It's really easy on a big forum to "Like" posters that havent been active for years. use your "like"s on inactive members and then "unlike" a target multiple times until there are a bunch of red dots next to their ID.

Not good.

On some forums 6 red dots will automatically ban the recipient.

Larks
08-29-2014, 06:37 AM
Just to reiterate again:


Just to reiterate: this thread is about providing a means of recognising and thanking the many selfless and helpful people who contribute to this community, not about providing a means of canning those who don't.

changeng
08-29-2014, 06:43 AM
Just to reiterate again:

Yes I get that, but read my post about how these things work.
Hard as it is to understand, there are a few malicious people post here. It wouldn't take long for some people to work out how to manipulate the forum software.
As Ian said, we know who deserves kudos.

Larks
08-29-2014, 06:48 AM
The forum that I referred to in my OP had not such negative rating opportunity, only thankyou's and positive feedback options.

PeterSibley
08-29-2014, 06:50 AM
I think it has merit but the assessment of contributions could be fraught ! There are a wide band of skills displayed up in the real forum and assessing the reliability of some could be .... difficult .

but....

On another forum I visit the soft ware allows a "thanks" tag and gives a total for every contributor. I seems a reasonable way for some kind of democratic recognition of public contributions and a community way of recognising someone who gives decent and accurate advice.

I'd exclude the Bilge from any input into those little tags. People here would need to dry their feet and toddle upstairs into the sunshine to assess what goes on in the sunlight.

Jim Ledger
08-29-2014, 06:52 AM
I think you need a more nuanced grading system, say a scale of one to a hundred.

The result would be an explosion of competitive creativity.

Chang, I'm not sure how negative red dots could be awarded for build threads.

changeng
08-29-2014, 06:54 AM
The forum that I referred to in my OP had not such negative rating opportunity, only thankyou's and positive feedback options.

Even so, you still end up over time with regular posters getting the max number of dots..deserved or not. It's meaningless.
Some of the very best here come from overseas (Not USA).. they will get fewer "dots" than Locals it's just the nature of the beast.
I think it's better we make up our own minds about the quality of posts.

Larks
08-29-2014, 06:55 AM
I think it has merit but the assessment of contributions could be fraught ! There are a wide band of skills displayed up in the real forum and assessing the reliability of some could be .... difficult .

but....

On another forum I visit the soft ware allows a "thanks" tag and gives a total for every contributor. I seems a reasonable way for some kind of democratic recognition of public contributions and a community way of recognising someone who gives decent and accurate advice.

I'd exclude the Bilge from any input into those little tags. People here would need to dry their feet and toddle upstairs into the sunshine to assess what goes on in the sunlight.

Agreed Peter, as I suggested in the OP. The forum that I'm referring to is the Woodwork Forum and it has "Thankyou for this post" or "Like this Post". No negative options.
http://www.woodworkforums.com/search.php?searchid=3789703

In fact I've never seen any forum with a negative response option to a post, as was suggested as how these things work, above.

changeng
08-29-2014, 06:59 AM
I think you need a more nuanced grading system, say a scale of one to a hundred.

The result would be an explosion of competitive creativity.

Chang, I'm not sure how negative red dots could be awarded for build threads.

This forum software has a function for positive and negative feedback. Scot in his wisdom has not switched it on.
I think it is nuanced, 3 neg get you a red dot or something. Like I said, it's easy to manipulate it. We did it for a laugh on a smallish forum once.. redded a very popular member.. we didn't know it would automatically ban the reciever.. fortunatly the admin were in on the joke :)

changeng
08-29-2014, 07:00 AM
Agreed Peter, as I suggested in the OP. The forum that I'm referring to is the Woodwork Forum and it has "Thankyou for this post" or "Like this Post". No negative options.
http://www.woodworkforums.com/search.php?searchid=3789703

In fact I've never seen any forum with a negative response option to a post, as was suggested as how these things work, above.

Different forum software.
I think it's far nicer to receive a public post of appreciation.
If you think such posts by numpties like me will be appreciated.. well I will post em from now on. I just never thought my opinion mattered.

Garret
08-29-2014, 07:05 AM
Howdy -

I see where you're going with this & agree with the concept. However, I just don't see a good way to implement it. As has been said, on a small forum like this it'd be easy to manipulate.

I've gotten some great help abovedecks & hopefully have offered a bit of help & encouragement in return. While it pains me to see some of the depths to which the bilge can sink - it's (IMO) really more about people 1) using a modicum of self-restraint & 2) remembering some manners. Yeah I know, that sounds suspiciously like reading & following the forum rules... ;)

Jim Ledger
08-29-2014, 07:17 AM
If you think such posts by numpties like me will be appreciated.. well I will post em from now on. I just never thought my opinion mattered.

Don't refer to yourself as a numpty, please.

Having been involved in several above-decks threads I can tell you that ALL responses are appreciated. There's a lot of work involved in the building, not to mention the presentation and responses. Sometimes days of labor are represented by a single post, which might go unremarked while the bilge is howling over what's the best kind of toast.

Happens all the time to lots of posters.

changeng
08-29-2014, 07:40 AM
Don't refer to yourself as a numpty, please.

Having been involved in several above-decks threads I can tell you that ALL responses are appreciated. There's a lot of work involved in the building, not to mention the presentation and responses. Sometimes days of labor are represented by a single post, which might go unremarked while the bilge is howling over what's the best kind of toast.


Happens all the time to lots of posters.

Numpty (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Numpty&defid=679444)

Scottish usage:
a) Someone who (sometimes unwittingly) by speech or action demonstrates a lack of knowledge or misconception of a particular subject or situation to the amusement of others.


Toast??? crunchy ..butter when cold

:D

S.V. Airlie
08-29-2014, 08:49 AM
Is that the edge of the continent? The edge of the desert? The edge of dessert? The edge of sanity?

I, too, have always wondered what on earth people are doing hanging around in the Bilge section of a wooden boat forum... if they have (it seems) no interest and no contribution to make when it comes to actual wooden boats. One can certainly speculate... but it's a bit of a puzzler.When I was initially working on Airlie in 2007-8, I was given sooo much flak from the formites; you should have done this, you should have done that, personal insults etc. I found the bilge to be a safer place to hang out! At least, I CAN expect the insults etc. in the bilge

Keith Wilson
08-29-2014, 09:11 AM
In the case Larks mentioned, someone who is indeed helpful and knowledgeable in the boaty parts of the forum behaved quite badly in the bilge, and wrote things that IMHO more than justified what happened. I'd say that good behavior above decks certainly does NOT excuse being a schmuck down here, and God knows we need a way to enforce some minimal standards of civilization in the Bilge. Yet it's a shame to lose someone's valuable contributions about boats because they lack self-control (sometimes even basic decency) in political arguments.

One way to handle it would be to separate what happens in the Bilge from the rest of the forum to a greater degree - i.e. bad behavior in the Bilge would only result in having one's posts deleted from the Bilge, or banning from the Bilge, not the rest of the forum. I don't know whether the forum software allows Scot to do this easily, but it seems a better solution than what happens now.

Jim Mahan
08-29-2014, 09:38 AM
One way to handle it would be to separate what happens in the Bilge from the rest of the forum to a greater degree - i.e. bad behavior in the Bilge would only result in having one's posts deleted from the Bilge, or banning from the Bilge, not the rest of the forum. I don't know whether the forum software allows Scot to do this easily, but it seems a better solution than what happens now.

I would think that that, on the surface a good idea, well-intentioned, would actually lessen the restraint of some questionable posters. If I'm safe up there no matter what I say down here, it gives me free reign to be as obnoxious as I feel like. And it might then also lead to a bannee trying out the obnoxicity upstairs, too. Otherwise, I agree with your post.

Larks
08-29-2014, 09:38 AM
In the case Larks mentioned, someone who is indeed helpful and knowledgeable in the boaty parts of the forum behaved quite badly in the bilge, and wrote things that IMHO more than justified what happened. I'd say that good behavior above decks certainly does NOT excuse being a schmuck down here, and God knows we need a way to enforce some minimal standards of civilization in the Bilge. Yet it's a shame to lose someone's valuable contributions about boats because they lack self-control (sometimes even basic decency) in political arguments.

One way to handle it would be to separate what happens in the Bilge from the rest of the forum to a greater degree - i.e. bad behavior in the Bilge would only result in having one's posts deleted from the Bilge, or banning from the Bilge, not the rest of the forum. I don't know whether the forum software allows Scot to do this easily, but it seems a better solution than what happens now.


I should clarify that I wasn't actually talking about anyone in particular Keith, but otherwise I agree with you.

bobbys
08-29-2014, 10:09 AM
I read the threads above decks.

I enjoy them.

I also go on home building forums.

there is no way I want to argue work with people I do not know on the internet.

a lot of people can write all sorts of stuff yet could not perform on a commercial job.

i think above deck there are a few bullies.

rather then spoil above decks I stay out.

Yet they make guest Appearances in the bilge to poop when feeling frisky.

I'm sure there are dozens of fine craftsman around here.

I find it pathetic some of these "heros" mocked me got actually having a journeyman shipwright card and for commercial fishing a Wooden dory..

I have nothing to prove to anyone..

I think some are unhinged.

I have the Pm full of vile obscenities.. To prove it.

Why would I argue with these people, L et them be the heros above deck.

It's all a look at our friendly gang here but I have been told by very many to never show up at gatherings.

slight threats based on thier inability to converse in a reasonable manner...

People that complain the most seem to be the worst offenders.

Its always some sort of .... O my you must have driven ole joe away and he was the god of varnish, my o my...

I cannot imagine working in a shipyard and running off the job because some guy is mean to me?

Nor can I imagine some guy waking around being the god like go to guy that can post pictures to prove it..

Some here own plastic boats they sail around the harbor in a aimless circle with the drinking flag up yet thier opinion is waited breathlessly on political matters..

Heck I get lectured by some here that brag about all thier higher education to prove how smart they are.

They are upset a actual carpenter shipwright fisherman might be on a wooden boat forum

If I spent all that time in school I would never have journeyman cards in 4trades...

No I stay out of top sides and just read it I f I was to post the bullies would need to be macho and "get" me so rather then spoil it I let them rule the kingdom..

The irony they cannot see is thier petty arguments are the ones spoiling the forum and disrespecting our hosts..

Notice the constant blame game.

Keith Wilson
08-29-2014, 10:12 AM
I should clarify that I wasn't actually talking about anyone in particular . . . Sorry, assuming too much. I thought you were referring to RonW or Rod.

SMARTINSEN
08-29-2014, 07:39 PM
In the case Larks mentioned, someone who is indeed helpful and knowledgeable in the boaty parts of the forum behaved quite badly in the bilge, and wrote things that IMHO more than justified what happened. I'd say that good behavior above decks certainly does NOT excuse being a schmuck down here, and God knows we need a way to enforce some minimal standards of civilization in the Bilge. Yet it's a shame to lose someone's valuable contributions about boats because they lack self-control (sometimes even basic decency) in political arguments.

One way to handle it would be to separate what happens in the Bilge from the rest of the forum to a greater degree - i.e. bad behavior in the Bilge would only result in having one's posts deleted from the Bilge, or banning from the Bilge, not the rest of the forum. I don't know whether the forum software allows Scot to do this easily, but it seems a better solution than what happens now.

This mirrors my thought almost exactly. The possible downfall is that could potentially allow the spread of bad behavior above decks, which stays pretty clean, and is self-policing for the most part. This could be addressed in the rules, I suppose, but that would be

The other thing, is that those who have been around for awhile and have paid any sort of attention all have a pretty good idea who are the "good guys" and who are the "bad guys" in whatever aspect of the Forum that you wish to explore. This applies above decks and equally in the Bilge. To think that the WBF administrators do not recognize this as well is absurd. Scot Bell is member #19, (or so, I did not look it up) and here since the beginning, he does not need "gold stars" appended to members' names to guide his decisions.

I do not think that this a particularly useful idea.

As an aside the thread rating tool IS a good and useful tool, use it more.

eta, "What Jim Mahan said". :)

Peter Malcolm Jardine
08-29-2014, 07:46 PM
If you look at Building and repair nowadays, almost 50% of the threads are on small plywood and epoxy boat builds. A lot of senior contributors have left. Several extremely fine boat designer/builders have been driven off by loudmouth wannabes. Powerboaters are discouraged regularly. It's just an evolutionary refinement. If the management wanted to change it, they would.

Phil Y
08-29-2014, 08:47 PM
Greg I think you make the mistake of giving the haters and spoilers too much credit for basic decency. Your suggestion I think would be like painting a big red target on the positive contributors. A lot of the trolling is just about getting attention and being on top. It's basic schoolyard bullying. Who's the bully going to bully? The teachers pet. The guy who competes for attention with all the Likes and Helpful ratings on his masthead.

PeterSibley
08-29-2014, 08:49 PM
Actually, I'm not sure I see a problem with some mechanism that generates competition to be friendly and helpful.

SMARTINSEN
08-29-2014, 09:03 PM
^What is the "mechanism"? The problem is that often competition is not very friendly. I would tend to agree more with Phil Y.