Will the "real" 5200 please stand up?

[Art Read]

I was talking to the owner of a local "industrial resins supply" outlet about some of my upcoming adheasives needs and he pulled a tube of something called "Bostik, Marine Grade, 920 Urethane Sealant" off the shelf. He said, "This IS 5200. Comes from the same supplier 3-M uses. They don't make it themselves, you know. All the commercial builders have been using this instead of 5200 for years now." Looking at the label, it "sounds" like the same stuff. And it's pretty cheap. (Compared to 5200...) They had the 3-M stuff on the shelf next to it, so I can't see why he'd just be trying to "sell" me a line. Anybody ever heard of it?

[ 03-19-2002, 01:57 PM: Message edited by: Art Read ]

[Art Read]

I was talking to the owner of a local "industrial resins supply" outlet about some of my upcoming adheasives needs and he pulled a tube of something called "Bostik, Marine Grade, 920 Urethane Sealant" off the shelf. He said, "This IS 5200. Comes from the same supplier 3-M uses. They don't make it themselves, you know. All the commercial builders have been using this instead of 5200 for years now." Looking at the label, it "sounds" like the same stuff. And it's pretty cheap. (Compared to 5200...) They had the 3-M stuff on the shelf next to it, so I can't see why he'd just be trying to "sell" me a line. Anybody ever heard of it?

[ 03-19-2002, 01:57 PM: Message edited by: Art Read ]

[Art Read]

I was talking to the owner of a local "industrial resins supply" outlet about some of my upcoming adheasives needs and he pulled a tube of something called "Bostik, Marine Grade, 920 Urethane Sealant" off the shelf. He said, "This IS 5200. Comes from the same supplier 3-M uses. They don't make it themselves, you know. All the commercial builders have been using this instead of 5200 for years now." Looking at the label, it "sounds" like the same stuff. And it's pretty cheap. (Compared to 5200...) They had the 3-M stuff on the shelf next to it, so I can't see why he'd just be trying to "sell" me a line. Anybody ever heard of it?

[ 03-19-2002, 01:57 PM: Message edited by: Art Read ]

[Donn]

Art:

I just did some quick looking, and found citations of 920 being used instead of 4200, because it can, like 5200, be used under the waterline, but has the same elastomeric qualities as 4200.

One citation was that it be used to bed a transom mount transducer, which, in fresh water, we mounted on rubber shims to offer shock absorption.

The other listings were online catalogs from building supply companies.

[Donn]

Art:

I just did some quick looking, and found citations of 920 being used instead of 4200, because it can, like 5200, be used under the waterline, but has the same elastomeric qualities as 4200.

One citation was that it be used to bed a transom mount transducer, which, in fresh water, we mounted on rubber shims to offer shock absorption.

The other listings were online catalogs from building supply companies.

[Donn]

Art:

I just did some quick looking, and found citations of 920 being used instead of 4200, because it can, like 5200, be used under the waterline, but has the same elastomeric qualities as 4200.

One citation was that it be used to bed a transom mount transducer, which, in fresh water, we mounted on rubber shims to offer shock absorption.

The other listings were online catalogs from building supply companies.

[Art Read]

Interesting. Surprised that it was compared to 4200 instead of 5200. Isn't 4200 considered the "less permanant" version of 5200? There's only a few places on my project I want the "bullet-proof" tenacity of 5200, and that's what I'd use this stuff for if I try it. I use Sika's 291 or just Dolphinite for anyplace I can concieve of EVER wanting to take apart again. If I use this stuff, I want it to (theoretically) stay there until I take BOTH pieces off. Is this the ticket?

(Custom... Do you mean they laid the juniper or cedar planking on plywood decks using this stuff, or built the hulls with the juniper/cedar and the decks out of plywood with this as a "general" adheasive? I did a quick "Google Search" on it, but mostly found general descriptions from on-line catalogs that tell me the same thing the tube itself did. Nice to get some "real world" experience. Thanks!)

[ 03-19-2002, 03:53 PM: Message edited by: Art Read ]

[Art Read]

Interesting. Surprised that it was compared to 4200 instead of 5200. Isn't 4200 considered the "less permanant" version of 5200? There's only a few places on my project I want the "bullet-proof" tenacity of 5200, and that's what I'd use this stuff for if I try it. I use Sika's 291 or just Dolphinite for anyplace I can concieve of EVER wanting to take apart again. If I use this stuff, I want it to (theoretically) stay there until I take BOTH pieces off. Is this the ticket?

(Custom... Do you mean they laid the juniper or cedar planking on plywood decks using this stuff, or built the hulls with the juniper/cedar and the decks out of plywood with this as a "general" adheasive? I did a quick "Google Search" on it, but mostly found general descriptions from on-line catalogs that tell me the same thing the tube itself did. Nice to get some "real world" experience. Thanks!)

[ 03-19-2002, 03:53 PM: Message edited by: Art Read ]

[Art Read]

Interesting. Surprised that it was compared to 4200 instead of 5200. Isn't 4200 considered the "less permanant" version of 5200? There's only a few places on my project I want the "bullet-proof" tenacity of 5200, and that's what I'd use this stuff for if I try it. I use Sika's 291 or just Dolphinite for anyplace I can concieve of EVER wanting to take apart again. If I use this stuff, I want it to (theoretically) stay there until I take BOTH pieces off. Is this the ticket?

(Custom... Do you mean they laid the juniper or cedar planking on plywood decks using this stuff, or built the hulls with the juniper/cedar and the decks out of plywood with this as a "general" adheasive? I did a quick "Google Search" on it, but mostly found general descriptions from on-line catalogs that tell me the same thing the tube itself did. Nice to get some "real world" experience. Thanks!)

[ 03-19-2002, 03:53 PM: Message edited by: Art Read ]

[N. Scheuer]

I've been happily using 3-M 5200 Urethane adhesive sealant for quite a few years, ever since learning about it in 1982. I've never had any particular problem getting anything bedded with 5200 loose, if I needed to. Sure, I have to work with it some, but after all, I never expect anything bedded with 5200 to just fall off into my hands, which is why I use it in the first place.

Are people really getting so wimpy that they find 5200 too difficult to pry off?

Yes, I've split a couple of wooden items getting them loose, but they were being discarded anyway. And I cracked a fiberglass item once, but that wasn't hard to fix.

Moby Nick

[N. Scheuer]

I've been happily using 3-M 5200 Urethane adhesive sealant for quite a few years, ever since learning about it in 1982. I've never had any particular problem getting anything bedded with 5200 loose, if I needed to. Sure, I have to work with it some, but after all, I never expect anything bedded with 5200 to just fall off into my hands, which is why I use it in the first place.

Are people really getting so wimpy that they find 5200 too difficult to pry off?

Yes, I've split a couple of wooden items getting them loose, but they were being discarded anyway. And I cracked a fiberglass item once, but that wasn't hard to fix.

Moby Nick

[N. Scheuer]

I've been happily using 3-M 5200 Urethane adhesive sealant for quite a few years, ever since learning about it in 1982. I've never had any particular problem getting anything bedded with 5200 loose, if I needed to. Sure, I have to work with it some, but after all, I never expect anything bedded with 5200 to just fall off into my hands, which is why I use it in the first place.

Are people really getting so wimpy that they find 5200 too difficult to pry off?

Yes, I've split a couple of wooden items getting them loose, but they were being discarded anyway. And I cracked a fiberglass item once, but that wasn't hard to fix.

Moby Nick

[mariner2k]

I've heard that 5200 is fairly easy to remove with heat gun. Never had to try it, but I do trust the source.
mariner

[mariner2k]

I've heard that 5200 is fairly easy to remove with heat gun. Never had to try it, but I do trust the source.
mariner

[mariner2k]

I've heard that 5200 is fairly easy to remove with heat gun. Never had to try it, but I do trust the source.
mariner

[Art Read]

It's not so much that I'm worried about ever getting this stuff, or 5200, off, it's more that I just want to know whether it really is comparable to the 5200 as far as staying together, flexibility, weathering, etc. goes. Custom's experience sounds encouraging. More an "academic" question than a big priority. I'm not using enough to care about paying a few bucks more for 3-M's product, but it IS cheaper. Just curious about using "non-brand name" products instead of mass-marketed products that are virtually the same thing? Anybody else out there ever used it?

[Art Read]

It's not so much that I'm worried about ever getting this stuff, or 5200, off, it's more that I just want to know whether it really is comparable to the 5200 as far as staying together, flexibility, weathering, etc. goes. Custom's experience sounds encouraging. More an "academic" question than a big priority. I'm not using enough to care about paying a few bucks more for 3-M's product, but it IS cheaper. Just curious about using "non-brand name" products instead of mass-marketed products that are virtually the same thing? Anybody else out there ever used it?

[Art Read]

It's not so much that I'm worried about ever getting this stuff, or 5200, off, it's more that I just want to know whether it really is comparable to the 5200 as far as staying together, flexibility, weathering, etc. goes. Custom's experience sounds encouraging. More an "academic" question than a big priority. I'm not using enough to care about paying a few bucks more for 3-M's product, but it IS cheaper. Just curious about using "non-brand name" products instead of mass-marketed products that are virtually the same thing? Anybody else out there ever used it?

[rodcross]

Art,
Bostik isn't exactly an 'off brand', we're just not used to seeing it in marine supply stores.

As for Nick. Fine. But what if those parts were held together with something more forgiving? Would you have spent so much time and effort? 5200 has its place-it is wonderful stuff. There are other compounds, however, that are less expensive and do a better job for most applications.

Hey Nick, Do they allow you to float boats on the mighty Rock?

[ 03-20-2002, 08:31 PM: Message edited by: rodcross ]

[rodcross]

Art,
Bostik isn't exactly an 'off brand', we're just not used to seeing it in marine supply stores.

As for Nick. Fine. But what if those parts were held together with something more forgiving? Would you have spent so much time and effort? 5200 has its place-it is wonderful stuff. There are other compounds, however, that are less expensive and do a better job for most applications.

Hey Nick, Do they allow you to float boats on the mighty Rock?

[ 03-20-2002, 08:31 PM: Message edited by: rodcross ]

[rodcross]

Art,
Bostik isn't exactly an 'off brand', we're just not used to seeing it in marine supply stores.

As for Nick. Fine. But what if those parts were held together with something more forgiving? Would you have spent so much time and effort? 5200 has its place-it is wonderful stuff. There are other compounds, however, that are less expensive and do a better job for most applications.

Hey Nick, Do they allow you to float boats on the mighty Rock?

[ 03-20-2002, 08:31 PM: Message edited by: rodcross ]

[N. Scheuer]

We have a LOT of boats on the ROCK RIVER, Rod. Unfortunately most of them are the too loud, too fast, too inconsiderate type.

Out Rockford Yacht Club once built a large plywood catamaram powered by eight crew pedaling portions of bycycle frames from the comparative comfort of plywood lounge chairs fixed to the deck. The chain drive is coupled to a bronze prop something like 14 inches in diameter. A ninth member of the crew steers using a wheel.

There is extra room for "relief pedelers" to hang out untill pressed into service.

This "raft" was built to compete in annual Raft Races. The races are no longer scheduled, but we're planning to launch the old catamaran as a club "Party Boat" during Rockford's annual ON THE WATERFRONT music festival in August.

About sealants; wooden boatbuilders may experience fewer problems with deck fittings; but rotten balsa cores are so common in older fiberglass boats that the use of any adhesive sealant less permanent than the best should be discouraged. (well, OK, I know y'awl will say maybe substandard sealants SHOULD be encouraged for FIBERGLASS boats, for just that reason).

Moby Nick

[N. Scheuer]

We have a LOT of boats on the ROCK RIVER, Rod. Unfortunately most of them are the too loud, too fast, too inconsiderate type.

Out Rockford Yacht Club once built a large plywood catamaram powered by eight crew pedaling portions of bycycle frames from the comparative comfort of plywood lounge chairs fixed to the deck. The chain drive is coupled to a bronze prop something like 14 inches in diameter. A ninth member of the crew steers using a wheel.

There is extra room for "relief pedelers" to hang out untill pressed into service.

This "raft" was built to compete in annual Raft Races. The races are no longer scheduled, but we're planning to launch the old catamaran as a club "Party Boat" during Rockford's annual ON THE WATERFRONT music festival in August.

About sealants; wooden boatbuilders may experience fewer problems with deck fittings; but rotten balsa cores are so common in older fiberglass boats that the use of any adhesive sealant less permanent than the best should be discouraged. (well, OK, I know y'awl will say maybe substandard sealants SHOULD be encouraged for FIBERGLASS boats, for just that reason).

Moby Nick

[N. Scheuer]

We have a LOT of boats on the ROCK RIVER, Rod. Unfortunately most of them are the too loud, too fast, too inconsiderate type.

Out Rockford Yacht Club once built a large plywood catamaram powered by eight crew pedaling portions of bycycle frames from the comparative comfort of plywood lounge chairs fixed to the deck. The chain drive is coupled to a bronze prop something like 14 inches in diameter. A ninth member of the crew steers using a wheel.

There is extra room for "relief pedelers" to hang out untill pressed into service.

This "raft" was built to compete in annual Raft Races. The races are no longer scheduled, but we're planning to launch the old catamaran as a club "Party Boat" during Rockford's annual ON THE WATERFRONT music festival in August.

About sealants; wooden boatbuilders may experience fewer problems with deck fittings; but rotten balsa cores are so common in older fiberglass boats that the use of any adhesive sealant less permanent than the best should be discouraged. (well, OK, I know y'awl will say maybe substandard sealants SHOULD be encouraged for FIBERGLASS boats, for just that reason).

Moby Nick