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genglandoh
10-02-2013, 09:50 PM
Is Obama trying to cause a market crash?
It seems to me that Obama is trying to cause the stock market to drop in order to put pressure on the Republicans.
What a wonderful guy.

US shutdown: Barack Obama warns of default danger
The bankers are members of the Financial Services Forum, a lobby group which has, along with 250 other businesses, sent a letter to Congress urging it to raise the debt limit.
Following the meeting, Mr Obama told CNBC "it's important for them to recognise that this is going to have a profound impact on our economy and their bottom lines".
Mr Obama also said he was unwilling to negotiate "with the extremist wing of one party" as the 17 October deadline neared.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-24375591

StevenBauer
10-02-2013, 09:53 PM
No.

Rich Jones
10-02-2013, 09:56 PM
Well, of course he is! It's all part of his plan to destroy America and sell us all into Islamic slavery!

ccmanuals
10-02-2013, 10:00 PM
This is an incredibly dumb thread.

Geng, have you stopped beating your wife?

CWSmith
10-02-2013, 10:01 PM
Americans have been asking for universal health care since at least as far back as the Eisenhower administration. The response by the Republicans in the House after losing the battle and a federal election that ratified that health plan is to hold the economy hostage and then ask for what is in effect a line-item veto on the federal budget. You put those things together and conclude that Obama is trying to create a market crash? How much is 1 + 1?

Arizona Bay
10-02-2013, 10:02 PM
It's not up to O'Bama.
The House is obligated to do something, if they won't fund the Government, it stays closed.
There is nothing to negotiate.

oznabrag
10-02-2013, 10:04 PM
Well, of course he is! It's all part of his plan to destroy America and sell us all into Islamic slavery!

SSSSSSSHHHH!!

Not so loud, willya?

oznabrag
10-02-2013, 10:09 PM
Americans have been asking for universal health care since at least as far back as the Eisenhower administration. The response by the Republicans in the House after losing the battle and a federal election that ratified that health plan is to hold the economy hostage and then ask for what is in effect a line-item veto on the federal budget. You put those things together and conclude that Obama is trying to create a market crash? How much is 1 + 1?

1 + 1 = Obama is an America-hating, Kenyan-born Muslim pedophile whose evil plan includes turning us all into gay communist baby-rapers.

That's what 1 + 2 = , as well.

LeeG
10-02-2013, 10:14 PM
Is Geng a prepper?

ron ll
10-02-2013, 10:15 PM
It's not up to O'Bama.


Funny, he doesn't look Irish. :)

oznabrag
10-02-2013, 10:27 PM
Funny, he doesn't look Irish. :)

Black Irish.

In fact, there's no one as Irish as Barack O'Bama!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DerVmiZeUDw

CWSmith
10-02-2013, 10:45 PM
1 + 1 = Obama is an America-hating, Kenyan-born Muslim pedophile whose evil plan includes turning us all into gay communist baby-rapers.

That's what 1 + 2 = , as well.

Sarcasm? You can do better.

oznabrag
10-02-2013, 10:46 PM
Sarcasm? You can do better.

Perhaps, but why bother?

David G
10-02-2013, 11:21 PM
Do you even have to ask?

Waddie
10-02-2013, 11:28 PM
Obama loves the market, and surrounds himself with Wall Street types who keep the money flowing....

regards,
Waddie

genglandoh
10-03-2013, 10:13 AM
Thanks Mr President.

Obama to Wall Street: This time be worried
Wall Street needs to be genuinely worried about what is going on in Washington, President Barack Obama told CNBC in a White House interview Wednesday.
While gridlock in D.C. is nothing new, "this time I think Wall Street should be concerned," Obama said.
CNBC's John Harwood speaks with President Barack Obama on the government shutdown and stalemate in Congress.
"When you have a situation in which a faction is willing to default on U.S. obligations, then we are in trouble," Obama said.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/101081257

ljb5
10-03-2013, 10:20 AM
Thanks Mr President.

Obama to Wall Street: This time be worried
Wall Street needs to be genuinely worried about what is going on in Washington, President Barack Obama told CNBC in a White House interview Wednesday.
While gridlock in D.C. is nothing new, "this time I think Wall Street should be concerned," Obama said.

Did it ever occur to you that he might just be speaking the obvious truth!?

Would you prefer that he just blatantly lied and said everything is fine?

Arizona Bay
10-03-2013, 10:21 AM
Wrong.


“On a Monday last month, Rep. Greg Walden (http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/04/11/why-greg-walden-won-t-worry-about-a-primary.html), chairman of the National Republican Congressional Committee, met with some top GOP donors for lunch at Le Cirque on Lexington Avenue in Manhattan. The donors, a youngish collection of financial industry types and lawyers, had some questions for Walden, a mild-mannered lawmaker from eastern Oregon known for speaking his mind.Why, they asked, did the GOP seem so in the thrall of its most extremist wing? The donors, banker types who occupy the upper reaches of Wall Street’s towers, couldn’t understand why the Republican Party—their party—seemed close to threatening the nation with a government shutdown, never mind a default if the debt ceiling isn’t raised later this month.”

Some of the comments (http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/10/03/gop-donors-revolt-against-republican-led-government-shutdown.html) from some of the donors:



“’We are finding a marvelous way to grab defeat from the jaws of victory,’ said Fred Zeidman, a Houston-based businessman who was a major donor to both of George W. Bush’s presidential campaigns. ‘The way we are handling this has been a mistake from the beginning. I think we misread where the country was.’”

…”Bobbie Kilberg, a Republican fundraiser who has worked for four Republican presidents, echoed Zeidman. She has hosted fundraisers for ideological warriors such as Reps. Paul Ryan and Eric Cantor, and is hosting Arkansas Senate candidate Tom Cotton later this year, but she said she will not give to the NRCC….’When you have a small segment who dictate to the rest of the party, the result is what we have seen in the last two days,” she said. “People need to stand up and not be afraid of the Tea Party.’”

“…’I have raised a lot of money, but I am not raising any more for House candidates,’ said Munr Kazmir, a New Jersey-based businessman and major donor to George W. Bush. ‘I am angry. I am embarrassed to be a Republican sometimes, I tell you.’”

http://freakoutnation.com/2013/10/03/as-the-tea-party-gangsta-shutdown-continues-it-appears-even-the-gop-corporate-owners-are-getting-angry/

ccmanuals
10-03-2013, 10:23 AM
Thanks Mr President.

Obama to Wall Street: This time be worried
Wall Street needs to be genuinely worried about what is going on in Washington, President Barack Obama told CNBC in a White House interview Wednesday.
While gridlock in D.C. is nothing new, "this time I think Wall Street should be concerned," Obama said.
CNBC's John Harwood speaks with President Barack Obama on the government shutdown and stalemate in Congress.
"When you have a situation in which a faction is willing to default on U.S. obligations, then we are in trouble," Obama said.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/101081257

So you think a good plan is to lie to everyone about this?

John of Phoenix
10-03-2013, 10:24 AM
You need to be talking to your TP reps but in the meantime...

Rock, rock, rock the Celebration of Stupid!

Keith Wilson
10-03-2013, 10:27 AM
Jesus T. Christ! It appears someone has stolen genglandoh's brain. Saying that the shenanigans of the Republicans in the House might cause economic trouble is a bit like pointing out that dancing on the edge of a cliff might cause you to fall. If you think this would be a bad outcome, then don't dance on the edge of the goddamned cliff!!

John of Phoenix
10-03-2013, 10:35 AM
’I have raised a lot of money, but I am not raising any more for House candidates,’ said Munr Kazmir, a New Jersey-based businessman and major donor to And that's the ONLY thing that will get their attention! Nothing trumps red ideology like $$$$.

genglandoh
10-03-2013, 10:42 AM
Even the news media is starting to ask the same question.

Wall Street wonders if Obama wants a selloff
A little market crisis—not enough to crash the economy into recession but enough to stir public fear that would push Republicans to the negotiating table—could be just what settles the impasse in Washington and reopens the government, according to investing pros and market observers.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/101082066

oznabrag
10-03-2013, 10:47 AM
Even the news media is starting to ask the same question.

Wall Street wonders if Obama wants a selloff
A little market crisis—not enough to crash the economy into recession but enough to stir public fear that would push Republicans to the negotiating table—could be just what settles the impasse in Washington and reopens the government, according to investing pros and market observers.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/101082066

And what of it?

Obama didn't choose this game, but he is sure gonna win it.

When these idiots get spread out 3 mils thick and tossed in the waste bin of history, then it will all have been worth it.

They can not win this . Comprende?

ljb5
10-03-2013, 11:41 AM
If Republicans are worried that Obama might crash the economy, they'd have no choice but to rescue it... and we all know what that means -- pass a clean CR.

They could do that quite easily.

CWSmith
10-03-2013, 03:56 PM
Jesus T. Christ! It appears someone has stolen genglandoh's brain. Saying that the shenanigans of the Republicans in the House might cause economic trouble is a bit like pointing out that dancing on the edge of a cliff might cause you to fall. If you think this would be a bad outcome, then don't dance on the edge of the goddamned cliff!!

They created a monster they can no longer control. The monster demands this and their own self interest requires them to make us all dance on the cliff. We can only hope the Republican Party gets what's coming to them.

LeeG
10-03-2013, 05:04 PM
Lemmings with suicide vests


http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-politics/wp/2013/09/30/nunes-calls-fellow-house-republicans-lemmings-with-suicide-vests/

Rep. Devin Nunes (R-Calif.) had choice words for fellow House Republicans who are willing to see the government shut down over their opposition to Obamacare: "Lemmings with suicide vests," he called them.
"They have to be more than just a lemming. Because jumping to your death is not enough," he said.

PeterSibley
10-03-2013, 05:36 PM
What Obama should have said: "The Republicans hate the health care law. That's their right. They had three shots at stopping it. The first was in Congress, back when it passed. They moved heaven and earth to stop it, and they couldn't. They didn't have the votes. That was strike one. Then they said, 'Okay, we'll see you in court.' So they took the law to the Supreme Court. And they lost again. Strike two. Then, after that, they had a presidential candidate who ran against me. And he said to America, 'Forget strikes one and two. Elect me, and I'll repeal this monstrosity. And he lost. So that was strike three. Well, three strikes and you're out. You don't get to lose a political battle three times and then later come back and say, 'We're going to shut the government down if you won't change this law that we failed to stop three times.' I'd like conservative Americans to imagine what they'd have thought if Nancy Pelosi, upon becoming speaker in 2007, had threatened to shut down the government unless President Bush agreed to raise the top tax rate back up to the Clinton-era rates. Conservatives would have been outraged, and rightly so. The right response then, in that hypothetical, is the right response today: You want to change a law that passed that you don't like, go out and win some elections and overturn it. Write a new law. That's how it works. Don't threaten our economy, force hundreds of thousands of people to go without paychecks, bring the one-quarter or so of the economy that's driven by the federal government--contracts and so forth--to a standstill."

wardd
10-03-2013, 05:39 PM
Thanks Mr President.

Obama to Wall Street: This time be worried
Wall Street needs to be genuinely worried about what is going on in Washington, President Barack Obama told CNBC in a White House interview Wednesday.
While gridlock in D.C. is nothing new, "this time I think Wall Street should be concerned," Obama said.
CNBC's John Harwood speaks with President Barack Obama on the government shutdown and stalemate in Congress.
"When you have a situation in which a faction is willing to default on U.S. obligations, then we are in trouble," Obama said.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/101081257

how stupid do you think wall street is?

delecta
10-03-2013, 06:40 PM
He was just reminding those that he bailed out that they owe him one. The latest polls suggest that they haven't been successful blaming the republicans for this mess so now it is time to call in a card. If the market tanks then we better listen. The silly part is that no one takes him seriously anymore, if they ever did.

hanleyclifford
10-03-2013, 06:56 PM
Well, of course he is! It's all part of his plan to destroy America and sell us all into Islamic slavery! Are you suggesting that the Fed is Islamic?

Cuyahoga Chuck
10-03-2013, 07:08 PM
Some heavy wallstreeters like Dimon and Blankfein have already met with the president and concured with his take on the situation.
Of course you wouldn't know that because you've got your fingers in your ears and your eyes shut and are hiding under the bed.

Lew Barrett
10-03-2013, 07:11 PM
The latest polls suggest that they haven't been successful blaming the republicans for this mess so now it is time to call in a card. If the market tanks then we better listen. The silly part is that no one takes him seriously anymore, if they ever did.

Which Polls?

The latest one reported here? (http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-250_162-57605822/poll-americans-not-happy-about-shutdown-more-blame-gop/)

Perhaps you prefer the Fox News poll (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/interactive/2013/10/03/fox-news-poll-voters-support-obamacare-delay-disapprove-congress/)?

No polls have majority approval of the shut down, even those that have more disapproval of Obamacare. The Tea Party Polls do, I'd guess, but look into that Fox Poll for approval of the Tea Party by Americans at large!

And guess who receives the majority of the blame?

What direction do you expect the trends will go as this wears on?

Lew Barrett
10-03-2013, 07:14 PM
That's the main point. When it comes to the bond market: they are pretty damn smart. They
know the following:
1) our government is completely dysfunctional
2) the real definition of such terms as debt and default
3) the fact that revenue can easily covert our debt service
4) the 14th amendment

Hence, despite the rhetoric from Obama on possible default, the fact that a shutdown has occurred:

There has not been a fall in the price of treasuries, as a matter of fact they have gone up in the last 2 weeks.

The equity markets are not quite as sanguine.

Lew Barrett
10-03-2013, 07:16 PM
Are you suggesting that the Fed is Islamic?

Weak! The hanleyclifford I know (thought I knew?)is capable of better quips than this!

hanleyclifford
10-03-2013, 07:26 PM
Weak! The hanleyclifford I know (thought I knew?)is capable of better quips than this! Not a "quip", Lew; think about it a little more.

PeterSibley
10-03-2013, 07:34 PM
That's the main point. When it comes to the bond market: they are pretty damn smart. They
know the following:
1) our government is completely dysfunctional
2) the real definition of such terms as debt and default
3) the fact that revenue can easily covert our debt service
4) the 14th amendment

Hence, despite the rhetoric from Obama on possible default, the fact that a shutdown has occurred:

There has not been a fall in the price of treasuries, as a matter of fact they have gone up in the last 2 weeks.

post again , just after a default.

ccmanuals
10-03-2013, 07:47 PM
He was just reminding those that he bailed out that they owe him one. The latest polls suggest that they haven't been successful blaming the republicans for this mess so now it is time to call in a card. If the market tanks then we better listen. The silly part is that no one takes him seriously anymore, if they ever did.

Of course it wasn't Obama that bailed the banks. But don't let facts get in the way of your argument.

Lew Barrett
10-03-2013, 07:50 PM
Of course not: a shutdown has a definite negative economic impact if it lasts for long enough. But with all this democratic talk of ( bogus ) defaults, it's the bond market which speaks to the falsehood implied by the president.

Treasuries are safer in the short term, but their perceived quality....and their prices......are largely a question of how long this showdown lasts. Bets are that the US will starve everything else not to default, but in the long run, refusal to raise the limit will probably drag the bonds down with it. Reuters. (http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/09/28/us-markets-usa-bonds-shutdown-analysis-idUSBRE98R06R20130928)

You're assuming the crisis will pass sooner rather than later. I think that's a fair assumption, but it isn't the only possibility. I see this as a crisis manufactured by Republicans with the hope that it will stick to the President. The President plays to the end game and you see it as improbable, but if there is no motion, it is the predictable outcome.

The "manufacturing" is now being shifted as well, as if this were Obama's invention. A remarkable conclusion.

Chip-skiff
10-03-2013, 07:51 PM
If you invite devils into your house, then you must feed them.

--Afghan proverb

PeterSibley
10-03-2013, 10:55 PM
Let's say the financial press here is ... disturbed ! The ripples of a default would spread world wide .

ljb5
10-03-2013, 11:15 PM
I certainly will, I will post and admit I am wrong even before the actual default occurs, the spike in interest rates will tell us all when there is a true danger

If I remember correctly, the bond markets responded paradoxically to the 2011 default crisis. The assumption was that the risk or threat of default would hurt corporations. In comparison to stocks, bonds actually looked better, not worse, so yields fell as investors flocked to them - even as they were being downgraded.

No guarantee that the same pattern will play out this time, but it is interesting to note how it's possible to get the reverse of what you'd expect.

hokiefan
10-04-2013, 12:10 AM
If I remember correctly, the bond markets responded paradoxically to the 2011 default crisis. The assumption was that the risk or threat of default would hurt corporations. In comparison to stocks, bonds actually looked better, not worse, so yields fell as investors flocked to them - even as they were being downgraded.

No guarantee that the same pattern will play out this time, but it is interesting to note how it's possible to get the reverse of what you'd expect.

I have no personal interest in the bond market (other than wishing stability and sanity), but I am very interested in the stock market. I am constantly surprised by the way the market reacts to various bits of news. Stuff that I'm sure would make it happy causes a correction, and vice versa. Until of course I count on that reverse mojo, and my base logic proves correct. At least for me, predicting how the market will react to anything is a fools game. Others may get better mileage.

Cheers,

Bobby

mdh
10-04-2013, 12:45 AM
He's counting on scaring it down in order to use the 14th to take dominion over finance away from Congress.

PeterSibley
10-04-2013, 01:15 AM
As reported here.http://www.businessspectator.com.au/news/2013/10/4/usa/default-risk-catastrophic-obama

Default risk 'catastrophic': Obama





AAP
The political crisis gripping Washington could trigger a "catastrophic" US debt default the Treasury has warned as America limped into day three of a government shutdown.
Despite the looming danger to the US and world economies, there was no sign that either President Barack Obama or his Republican foes were ready to give ground.
"There's one way out of this reckless and damaging Republican shutdown. Congress has to pass a budget that funds our government with no partisan strings attached," Obama declared.
"Take a vote, stop this farce and end this shutdown right now."
At midnight on Monday the US federal government ran out of funding after Congress, divided between a Republican-led lower House and Democratic Senate, failed to pass a stop gap budget measure.
Hundreds of thousands of government workers have been sent home, federal agencies have halted all but the most critical operations, parks and monuments have closed and scientific research is on hold.
Now, another threat looms, after Republicans warned that they would not approve an increase in the federal government's debt cap without receiving concessions in the budget debate.
With the government likely to exhaust its cash reserves around October 17, the Treasury said being forced into non-payment of any of its obligations - and in particular its debt - would spark turmoil.
World financial markets would be rocked and the crisis could plunge the United States into deep recession, a Treasury report said.
"In the event that a debt limit impasse were to lead to a default, it could have a catastrophic effect on not just financial markets but also on job creation, consumer spending and economic growth," it said.
"Credit markets could freeze, the value of the dollar could plummet, US interest rates could skyrocket, the negative spillovers could reverberate around the world, and there might be a financial crisis and recession that could echo the events of 2008 or worse."
The government is operating just barely below the $US16.7 trillion ($A17.8 trillion) debt ceiling, using what it calls "extraordinary measures" since May to meet a chronic deficit of about $US60 billion a month.
Conservative Republicans want to dismantle or amend Obama's health care law as a condition for approving interim funding for the new fiscal year, which began Tuesday.
However, the president is refusing to tinker with the law, his signature health care reform widely known as "Obamacare" and there is no end to the crisis in sight.
The prospect of feuding lawmakers remaining deadlocked over whether to raise US borrowing authority has international markets and groups like the International Monetary Fund fretting.
"It is 'mission-critical' that this be resolved as soon as possible," IMF Managing Director Christine Lagarde said Thursday in a speech in Washington.

ljb5
10-04-2013, 10:27 AM
That is close to being correct.

That's the nicest thing you've ever said to me. :D


There was no default crises. Bonds are safe. But an extended shutdown will hurt the economy, so stocks go down.

The government has no choice, due to the 14th amendment, but to keep servicing debt.

I was referring to the 2011 crisis. In explaining their reasons for downgrading the US, Standard and Poor's (Standard and Poor's said) used the term "threat of default," which I think is an accurate way to describe the situation.

The threat of default is a natural and nearly inescapable consequence of refusing or resisting raising the debt ceiling. To deny that would be like saying, "Yes, I pushed him off the cliff, but it was gravity that caused him to fall!"

Gerarddm
10-04-2013, 10:30 AM
Can geng ever refrain from posting foolish threads?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Cuyahoga Chuck
10-04-2013, 11:35 AM
Can geng ever refrain from posting foolish threads?

Inquiring minds want to know.

He's hoping for a better result which always eludes him.