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Osborne Russell
08-07-2013, 02:39 PM
Both the visiting Senators urged Egypt’s provisional government to free detained members of the Brotherhood, including Mr. Morsy, before initiating talks with the group. “In democracy, you sit down and talk to each other,” counselled Mr. Graham. “It is impossible to talk to somebody who is in jail.”

Egypt’s interim government has slammed visiting Senator John McCain for threatening to cut off U.S. aid to Cairo, and signalled it would prefer a home-grown solution to its standoff with the rival Muslim Brotherhood rather than depend on foreign intervention.

http://www.thehindu.com/news/international/world/diplomacy-to-end-egypt-crisis-fails/article4999316.ece

What Would Reds Say (WWRS) if the Prez were Rep and the Senators on a frolic were Dem?

John of Phoenix
08-07-2013, 03:46 PM
When I read about McCain traveling to the Middle East, I can't help but wonder what Sarah would be doing in the White House while President Johnnie was out stirring the pot.

S.V. Airlie
08-07-2013, 05:27 PM
What Would Reds Say (WWRS) if the Prez were Rep and the Senators on a frolic were Dem?The guy was elected by a majority of the people in 2009/10. Who elected the provisional Gov. I didn't see an election or hear of one. What authority does the provisional Gov have to negotiate for the country and the US? Power sweep! That's it. To heck with democracy.

hanleyclifford
08-07-2013, 07:24 PM
What are you worried about? There was no coup...Obama said so!

wardd
08-07-2013, 07:49 PM
what about that coup against king george ?

C. Ross
08-07-2013, 09:32 PM
We did this one a couple years ago.

http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?122440-Independent-international-policy

It got silly.

Osborne Russell
08-07-2013, 11:43 PM
We did this one a couple years ago.

http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?122440-Independent-international-policy

It got silly.

So it is OK to pal around with terrorists?


In an interview Thursday with radio host Glenn Beck, the Minnesota Republican asserted that Rep. Keith Ellison, D-Minn., has a long record of being associated with the Muslim Brotherhood.

Ellison said in a subsequent interview Thursday night with CNN's Anderson Cooper that he has no ties to the Brotherhood, a fundamentalist Islamic movement that recently came to power in Egypt and that some say maintains ties to the Palestinian terrorist group Hamas.

Bachmann offered no evidence of ties between Ellison and the Muslim Brotherhood during the Beck interview. Bachmann's spokesman, Dan Kotman, cited a 2009 Fox News report that Ellison had a trip paid for by the Muslim American Society, a group described by an expert quoted in that report as "the de facto arm of the Muslim Brotherhood in the U.S."

"The influence today of the Muslim Brotherhood at the highest levels, from the White House, to the Pentagon, to the FBI, even to our United States military, truly is breathless and people have to know about it," Bachmann said.


http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/story/2012-07-20/bachmann-brotherhood-comments/56370300/1

C. Ross
08-08-2013, 06:20 AM
So it is OK to pal around with terrorists?

In Holder v. Humanitarian Law Project, the Supreme Court in 2010 tested this.

The Court upheld a portion of the Patriot Act that bars "material support to terrorist groups" including advice on things like political organizing. (Which people including President Jimmy Carter wanted to be legal.)


[Solicitor General Elena] Kagan said US citizens are free to meet with and even join any terrorist organization. They are free to discuss issues with such groups. But she added, “The discussion must stop when you get to the point of giving valuable advice.”

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice/2010/0223/Supreme-Court-Peace-activists-challenge-US-antiterror-law

Would you consider a discussion with Senator Graham "valuable advice"?

I think "pal around with" is closer "discuss issues with" which Kagan claimed was legal than "offer material support". Then again, I don't think you're a real pal unless you're willing to lend your tools or help turn over a boat. QED.

C. Ross
08-08-2013, 06:23 AM
This quote deserves its own post. Thank you Osborne.


"The influence today of the Muslim Brotherhood at the highest levels, from the White House, to the Pentagon, to the FBI, even to our United States military, truly is breathless and people have to know about it," Bachmann said.

Truly breathless indeed. She'll not be missed.

hokiefan
08-08-2013, 06:30 AM
This quote deserves its own post. Thank you Osborne.



Truly breathless indeed. She'll not be missed.

I am curious Chris. What dynamics allow someone with Michelle Bachmann's gobsmacking... well... mannerisms (for lack of a better word) get elected in the first place? As someone who grew up voting Republican, I don't think even my naive 20 year old self could have managed to vote for her. What am I missing?

Cheers,

Bobby

C. Ross
08-08-2013, 07:05 AM
Bobby, danged if I know.

Actually, I don't think voters in her district are nearly as extreme or unaware as Ms. Bachmann. All I can figure is that she is a pitch perfect cultural fit for her district. Looks, dress, voice, demeanor. She whistles all the dog whistles without even knowing it. Simple answers and snappy slogans are IN nowadays doncha know?

Minnesota also has a taste for boring politicians leavened by a few wingnuts. Stassen, Ventura, Bachmann, and Franken all tap the same vein.

Keith Wilson
08-08-2013, 07:30 AM
Stassen, Ventura, Bachmann, and Franken all tap the same vein.Eh? Perhaps, but in very different ways. Harold Stassen was a mainline moderate politician, and only got nutty when he kept running for president over and over and over and over. Ventura had a - um - colorful personality, but governed very moderately, although he got very weird later. Franken was a pretty outrageous comedian, but left all that behind and has been a decent if unremarkable center-left senator. Bachmann, OTOH has a large enough supply of madness to export it; she could keep the entire continent of Africa well-stocked with crazy all by herself.

wardd
08-08-2013, 09:07 AM
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB82/handshake300.jpg

John Smith
08-08-2013, 09:23 AM
It all looks like a mess to me, and I'm not sure to what extent, if any, we should involve ourselves in it.

Osborne Russell
08-08-2013, 04:09 PM
In Holder v. Humanitarian Law Project, the Supreme Court in 2010 tested this.

The Court upheld a portion of the Patriot Act that bars "material support to terrorist groups" including advice on things like political organizing. (Which people including President Jimmy Carter wanted to be legal.)



http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice/2010/0223/Supreme-Court-Peace-activists-challenge-US-antiterror-law

Would you consider a discussion with Senator Graham "valuable advice"?

I think "pal around with" is closer "discuss issues with" which Kagan claimed was legal than "offer material support". Then again, I don't think you're a real pal unless you're willing to lend your tools or help turn over a boat. QED.

The Constitution? Supreme Court? Laws? Interpretation? We're talking about the Tea Party, man. Someone qualified to be President explaining why her opponent isn't. By that standard, McCain and Graham are palsy walsy huggy kissy with the Mooslim Brotherhood.



In October 2008, after the McCain campaign announced that it would step up attacks on the Democratic presidential candidate, Sarah Palin delivered speeches saying that Obama was "palling around with terrorists." For support, Palin cited a New York Times article that had actually concluded that Obama and Ayers were not close. The article stated that other "publications, including The Washington Post, Time magazine, The Chicago Sun-Times, The New Yorker and The New Republic, have said that their reporting doesn't support the idea that Obama and Ayers had a close relationship." CNN has independently deemed Palin's allegations false, saying: "There is no indication that Ayers and Obama are now 'palling around,' or that they have had an ongoing relationship in the past three years. Also, there is nothing to suggest that Ayers is now involved in terrorist activity or that other Obama associates are."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Ayers_presidential_election_controversy

The points you raise are certainly important policy matters. Wake me when the nation pulls its head out -- we'll give it a shampoo and a cup of coffee and go back to taking care of business like citizens.

Osborne Russell
08-08-2013, 04:10 PM
This quote deserves its own post. Thank you Osborne.

You're welcome !