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Arizona Bay
08-02-2013, 10:28 AM
He's on it.


Sunday, October 04, 2009A rant about stupidity... and the coming civil war...


An article on Salon asks "Why Can't We Have Smarter Right Wingers?"


It's been my own stark plaint for a decade -- and not from any lefty reflex. Rather, as one who openly avows some libertarian and classic "conservative" views, sprinkled in a mostly-progressive goulash.


Shouldn't there be clear-headed voices, articulating the attractiveness of balanced budgets, national readiness, genuinely competitive free enterprise, and caution in international entanglements? Isn't it good to have someone in the room demanding: "Prove that something really is broken, before using the the blunt instrument of the state to fix it"?


I've long felt that the best minds of the right had useful things to contribute to a national conversation -- even if their overall habit of resistance to change proved wrongheaded, more often than right. At least, some of them had the beneficial knack of targeting and criticizing the worst liberal mistakes, and often forcing needful re-drafting.


That is, some did, way back in when decent republicans and democrats shared one aim -- to negotiate better solutions for the republic.


Does The New Right Even Have an Agenda Anymore?


Alas, today's Republican Establishment seems not only incapable but uninterested in negotiation or deliberation. It isn't just the dogmatism, or lockstep partisanship, or Koolaid fantasies spun -up by the Murdoch-Limbaugh hate machine. Heck, even though "culture war" is verifiably the worst direct treason against the United States of America since Fort Sumter, that isn't what boggles most.


It's the stupidity. The vast and nearly uniform dumbitudinousness of ignoring what has happened to conservatism, a transformation of nearly all of the salient traits of Barry Goldwater from:


* prudence to recklessness
* accountability to secrecy
* fiscal discretion to spendthrift profligacy
* consistency to hypocrisy
* civility to nastiness
* international restraint to recklessness
* efficiency to no-tomorrow wastrelness
* personal rectitude to flagrant licentiousness
* cleanliness to filthy habits
* logic to unreason


...and more, reversing:


* from respect for science to incantatory voodoo
* from an almost pedantic love of history to near total ignorance of the past
* from individual-based deliberation to lockstep party-line voting
* from belief in federalism and states' rights to excusing monolithic presidential power
* from negotiated problem-solving to strawman-based politics
* from a bookish love of statistics to justification by anecdote
* from country-first patriotism to the flagwaving kind that can instantly turn into rants about secession, the killing of civil servants and praying for the president to fail, even if that means the country going down with him.


This is not about classic left-vs-right anymore. (As if that metaphor ever held cogent meaning.) Not when every measure of national health that conservatives ought to care about -- from budget balancing to small business startups, to military readiness, to States' Rights, to the economy, to individual liberty, to control over immigration at our borders -- does vastly and demonstrably better under democrats. With nearly 100% perfection.


(Fact avoidance is even worse when you encompass ALL of history. Ask today's conservatives which force destroyed more freedom and nearly every competitive market, across 5,000 years. Which foe of liberty and enterprise did Adam Smith despise? Hint: it wasn't "socialism" or "government bureaucrats.")


No. Given their lack of any other tangible accomplishments across the last fifteen years, one must to conclude that the core agenda of Rush Limbaugh, Rupert Murdoch and their petroprince backers really is quite simple.


To find out just how far they can push "culture war" toward a repeat of 1861.

More
http://davidbrin.blogspot.com/2009/10/rant-about-stupidity-and-coming-civil.html

John of Phoenix
08-02-2013, 11:00 AM
OMG, that was written in 2009!!

They've only gotten exponentially more stupid over time and the future looks even worse.

Arizona Bay
08-02-2013, 11:20 AM
Yeah, an accurate foreshadowing.

Looks like the righteous wingers have staked out a direction and doubled down it.

wardd
08-02-2013, 12:07 PM
right wing politicians are smart enough to keep getting reelected

think of the bird, if it were to start developing more intelligence its brain would start to become heavier making flight more difficult thus exposing them to more danger and possible extinction

similarly with republican politicians if they were to become smarter their base would become suspicious of them and vote them out of office

CWSmith
08-02-2013, 12:12 PM
They get elected because of gerrymandering. Both sides are guilty and both sides are disappointing. That said, for outright lies and stupidity, I'd pick a new-age Republican every time.

wardd
08-02-2013, 12:31 PM
They get elected because of gerrymandering. Both sides are guilty and both sides are disappointing. That said, for outright lies and stupidity, I'd pick a new-age Republican every time.

the republicans had to lump their stupid base in order to keep getting elected

wardd
08-02-2013, 12:32 PM
i guess i should apologize to bird kind

hanleyclifford
08-02-2013, 12:52 PM
Good to see you lefties are having a nice day. http://fc05.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2010/034/9/3/political_kool_aid_bath_by_sketchoo.jpg

John of Phoenix
08-02-2013, 12:59 PM
Well done, clifford. I, for one, feel fully rebutted. Except for this...



Sunday, October 04, 2009A rant about stupidity... and the coming civil war...


An article on Salon asks "Why Can't We Have Smarter Right Wingers?"


It's been my own stark plaint for a decade -- and not from any lefty reflex. Rather, as one who openly avows some libertarian and classic "conservative" views, sprinkled in a mostly-progressive goulash.


Shouldn't there be clear-headed voices, articulating the attractiveness of balanced budgets, national readiness, genuinely competitive free enterprise, and caution in international entanglements? Isn't it good to have someone in the room demanding: "Prove that something really is broken, before using the the blunt instrument of the state to fix it"?


I've long felt that the best minds of the right had useful things to contribute to a national conversation -- even if their overall habit of resistance to change proved wrongheaded, more often than right. At least, some of them had the beneficial knack of targeting and criticizing the worst liberal mistakes, and often forcing needful re-drafting.


That is, some did, way back in when decent republicans and democrats shared one aim -- to negotiate better solutions for the republic.


Does The New Right Even Have an Agenda Anymore?


Alas, today's Republican Establishment seems not only incapable but uninterested in negotiation or deliberation. It isn't just the dogmatism, or lockstep partisanship, or Koolaid fantasies spun -up by the Murdoch-Limbaugh hate machine. Heck, even though "culture war" is verifiably the worst direct treason against the United States of America since Fort Sumter, that isn't what boggles most.


It's the stupidity. The vast and nearly uniform dumbitudinousness of ignoring what has happened to conservatism, a transformation of nearly all of the salient traits of Barry Goldwater from:


* prudence to recklessness
* accountability to secrecy
* fiscal discretion to spendthrift profligacy
* consistency to hypocrisy
* civility to nastiness
* international restraint to recklessness
* efficiency to no-tomorrow wastrelness
* personal rectitude to flagrant licentiousness
* cleanliness to filthy habits
* logic to unreason


...and more, reversing:


* from respect for science to incantatory voodoo
* from an almost pedantic love of history to near total ignorance of the past
* from individual-based deliberation to lockstep party-line voting
* from belief in federalism and states' rights to excusing monolithic presidential power
* from negotiated problem-solving to strawman-based politics
* from a bookish love of statistics to justification by anecdote
* from country-first patriotism to the flagwaving kind that can instantly turn into rants about secession, the killing of civil servants and praying for the president to fail, even if that means the country going down with him.


This is not about classic left-vs-right anymore. (As if that metaphor ever held cogent meaning.) Not when every measure of national health that conservatives ought to care about -- from budget balancing to small business startups, to military readiness, to States' Rights, to the economy, to individual liberty, to control over immigration at our borders -- does vastly and demonstrably better under democrats. With nearly 100% perfection.


(Fact avoidance is even worse when you encompass ALL of history. Ask today's conservatives which force destroyed more freedom and nearly every competitive market, across 5,000 years. Which foe of liberty and enterprise did Adam Smith despise? Hint: it wasn't "socialism" or "government bureaucrats.")


No. Given their lack of any other tangible accomplishments across the last fifteen years, one must to conclude that the core agenda of Rush Limbaugh, Rupert Murdoch and their petroprince backers really is quite simple.

pefjr
08-02-2013, 01:03 PM
[QUOTE=hanleyclifford;3862442]Good to see you lefties are having a nice day. [QUOTE]Just another cheerleader bon fire rally. They have about 3/4 a day to keep the J gang awake. LOL .To keep a divide in the bilge they have to keep digging the trench, and the cheerleaders work in shifts.

Osborne Russell
08-02-2013, 01:49 PM
"Prove that something really is broken, before using the the blunt instrument of the state to fix it"?

Not just that, but which level of government?

John of Phoenix
08-02-2013, 02:05 PM
"Prove that something really is broken, before using the the blunt instrument of the state to fix it"?
Not just that, but which level of government?

Grover Norquist:
I don't want to abolish government. I simply want to reduce it to the size where I can drag it into the bathroom and drown it in the bathtub.Grover wasn't specific and no one has asked for clarification. My impression has been "Drown 'em all and let God sort 'em out."

wardd
08-02-2013, 02:11 PM
can anybody tell me what the republicans have done or tried to do that is constructive since o becams prez?

hanleyclifford
08-02-2013, 02:41 PM
can anybody tell me what the republicans have done or tried to do that is constructive since o becams prez? The Republicans are keeping Obama in check. His administration will be remembered as one in which the country got relief from foolish wars and spending. Obama will get the credit from history.

wardd
08-02-2013, 02:51 PM
The Republicans are keeping Obama in check. His administration will be remembered as one in which the country got relief from foolish wars and spending. Obama will get the credit from history.

again what have proposed that is worth a dam?

pefjr
08-02-2013, 03:21 PM
The Republicans are keeping Obama in check. His administration will be remembered as one in which the country got relief from foolish wars and spending. Obama will get the credit from history.Ah.... forgot something didn't ya? More soldiers have died in the Good War than before Obama rekindled it. Course he is entitled to another Nobel PP, based on the same accomplishments that he won the first one. Would you like to compare Obama on War with Bush on War? Ain't a dime's difference. Like this little stat: Obama boosted private contractors by about 25% in both Iraq and Afghanistan. I am not sure this is a fair comparison since Bush had voodoo powers and could order up Hurricanes also. Obama has made many Afghanistan millionaires, so some are happy.

wardd
08-02-2013, 03:25 PM
Ah.... forgot something didn't ya? More soldiers have died in the Good War than before Obama rekindled it. Course he is entitled to another Nobel PP, based on the same accomplishments that he won the first one. Would you like to compare Obama on War with Bush on War? Ain't a dime's difference. Like this little stat: Obama boosted private contractors by about 25% in both Iraq and Afghanistan. I am not sure this is a fair comparison since Bush had voodoo powers and could order up Hurricanes also. Obama has made many Afghanistan millionaires, so some are happy.

not saying this is true, but wasn't that war inherited from bush/cheny?

and how would bush/cheny have fared in the same time frame?

John of Phoenix
08-02-2013, 03:26 PM
Obama boosted private contractors by about 25% in both Iraq and Afghanistan.I know better than to try this but... Got a link for that?



Or this?

Obama has made many Afghanistan millionaires, so some are happy.

Gerarddm
08-02-2013, 03:44 PM
Next election, vote against every Republican, for every office, at every level. Be patriotic.

pefjr
08-02-2013, 03:50 PM
I know better than to try this but... Got a link for that?



Or this?Ha,..... ROFL.

John of Phoenix
08-02-2013, 03:54 PM
Has anyone complimented you on your new avatar? Well chosen.

pefjr
08-02-2013, 04:10 PM
Has anyone complimented you on your new avatar? Well chosen.I think so too, of course I presume that there is the usual sarcasm in your post. If not then I apologize. I don't take this forum as serious as you boys, so just laugh along with me and Osborne's creation. I will give him the full credit.

hanleyclifford
08-02-2013, 04:25 PM
Ah.... forgot something didn't ya? More soldiers have died in the Good War than before Obama rekindled it. Course he is entitled to another Nobel PP, based on the same accomplishments that he won the first one. Would you like to compare Obama on War with Bush on War? Ain't a dime's difference. Like this little stat: Obama boosted private contractors by about 25% in both Iraq and Afghanistan. I am not sure this is a fair comparison since Bush had voodoo powers and could order up Hurricanes also. Obama has made many Afghanistan millionaires, so some are happy. What you have forgotten is that history does not always judge fairly. Remember, it's about the perception....

pefjr
08-02-2013, 04:34 PM
What you have forgotten is that history does not always judge fairly. Remember, it's about the perception....No shinola! I read a post the other day comparing JFK with Nixon. Course I considered the source. The post labeled Nixon slime, and JFK the hero,.... except for his womanizing. LOL. Nixon melted the red Chinese threat and it resulted in peace and trade with a giant Army that was at our throat. The other (JKF) knocked off Heads of State like Bowling pins, but could do no wrong by the lefties. They should enlist a ten thousand man work force and build a Pyramid in his honor.

Chip-skiff
08-02-2013, 04:38 PM
think of the bird, if it were to start developing more intelligence its brain would start to become heavier making flight more difficult thus exposing them to more danger and possible extinction

similarly with republican politicians if they were to become smarter their base would become suspicious of them and vote them out of office

And that would leave us at the mercy of global warming! :d

Osborne Russell
08-04-2013, 10:15 AM
Grover wasn't specific and no one has asked for clarification. My impression has been "Drown 'em all and let God sort 'em out."

Yeah, that guy isn't really a libertarian or a conservative. He's an aristocrat . . . Polaroid heir.

Willin'
08-04-2013, 02:06 PM
"dumbitudinousness "

It was worth reading the article just to learn that word. It is now indelibly etched into my rapidly deteriorating memory.

Jimmy W
08-04-2013, 09:59 PM
Some scientists claim that hydrogen, because it is so plentiful, is the basic building block of the universe. I dispute that. I say there is more stupidity than hydrogen, and that is the basic building block of the universe.
Frank Zappa