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View Full Version : WHAT? Nothing 'bout the BSA admitting Gay Kids?



Nicholas Scheuer
05-27-2013, 08:17 AM
Just returned from a week on the Rhine, and am surprised I don't see a 5 or 6-page thread hashing out whether the recent move by the BSA is OK or not! The move by some BSA Councils to form another organization will be fun to watch. Maybe if the new "anti-gay" group is heavily influenced by Texas, they will take over the Dallas BSA Headquarters! Then the real BSA can move back to Brunswick, NJ, which they never should have left. I sometimes wonder whatever became of the BSA Headquarters property in Brunswick, at which I was fortunate to attend for a week of boy-level training in the 1950's.

The Bigfella
05-27-2013, 08:22 AM
I'm not sure I understand what "a week of boy-level training" entails?

hokiefan
05-27-2013, 08:27 AM
Just returned from a week on the Rhine, and am surprised I don't see a 5 or 6-page thread hashing out whether the recent move by the BSA is OK or not! The move by some BSA Councils to form another organization will be fun to watch. Maybe if the new "anti-gay" group is heavily influenced by Texas, they will take over the Dallas BSA Headquarters! Then the real BSA can move back to Brunswick, NJ, which they never should have left. I sometimes wonder whatever became of the BSA Headquarters property in Brunswick, at which I was fortunate to attend for a week of boy-level training in the 1950's.

There was some discussion in the "Rick Perry Pile On thread" down below. This Eagle Scout is quite alright with the realization that gay boys have been Boy Scouts as long as there have been Boy Scouts. I know my troop had one, and none of us perished...

Cheers,

Bobby

bogdog
05-27-2013, 08:29 AM
There are plenty of existing alternative groups for those too intolerant and religiously bigoted to stay with the BSA.

Nicholas Scheuer
05-27-2013, 08:33 AM
It was a Junior Leadership Training Course (for teens, by outstanding teens & adult Scouters); key to Lord Baden-Powell's whole idea for Boy Scouting.

George Jung
05-27-2013, 08:40 AM
That they now allow gay scouts but not openly gay leaders has, presumably, set the next battle lines.

hokiefan
05-27-2013, 08:44 AM
Just returned from a week on the Rhine, and am surprised I don't see a 5 or 6-page thread hashing out whether the recent move by the BSA is OK or not! The move by some BSA Councils to form another organization will be fun to watch. Maybe if the new "anti-gay" group is heavily influenced by Texas, they will take over the Dallas BSA Headquarters! Then the real BSA can move back to Brunswick, NJ, which they never should have left. I sometimes wonder whatever became of the BSA Headquarters property in Brunswick, at which I was fortunate to attend for a week of boy-level training in the 1950's.


It was a Junior Leadership Training Course (for teens, by outstanding teens & adult Scouters); key to Lord Baden-Powell's whole idea for Boy Scouting.

My... you're an old fart!!! That said, I've been around long enough that my OA lodge no longer exists, merged with another lodge that's no longer around. I have many flap patches from mine, I suspect one or two from the other mergee. My Dad's stuff may have one from the resultant lodge, I'll have to look and see.

Cheers,

Bobby

The Bigfella
05-27-2013, 08:48 AM
What has sexuality to do with any of it? There's gay teachers and gay students in our schools, and it isn't an issue unless there's inappropriate dealings going on. This is Dark Ages stuff... really.

George Jung
05-27-2013, 08:54 AM
It's Dark Ages Stuff that's been dragged, kicking and screaming, into the light, BF. It's a process; it'll take time.

The Bigfella
05-27-2013, 09:01 AM
Asia seems so much more civilised.

Small village... 70 or so huts... and not one Flying Fig was given....

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff112/igatenby/Beer%20Lao/360.jpg (http://s240.photobucket.com/user/igatenby/media/Beer%20Lao/360.jpg.html)

Peerie Maa
05-27-2013, 09:01 AM
That they now allow gay scouts but not openly gay leaders has, presumably, set the next battle lines.

Don't young (gay) scouts grow into (gay) scout leaders?

hokiefan
05-27-2013, 09:07 AM
Asia seems so much more civilised.

Small village... 70 or so huts... and not one Flying Fig was given....

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff112/igatenby/Beer%20Lao/360.jpg (http://s240.photobucket.com/user/igatenby/media/Beer%20Lao/360.jpg.html)

Ya know what Ian, since life is obviously so much better in Asia why don't you keep your opinions there???

The Bigfella
05-27-2013, 09:11 AM
Ya know what Ian, since life is obviously so much better in Asia why don't you keep your opinions there???

.... and now we see the sort of thinking that leads to this crap.

Bigotry and archaic thinking, like this issue, deserve to be attacked wherever they occur. Wear this sort of stuff proudly on your sleeve, do you?

hokiefan
05-27-2013, 09:21 AM
.... and now we see the sort of thinking that leads to this crap.

Bigotry and archaic thinking, like this issue, deserve to be attacked wherever they occur. Wear this sort of stuff proudly on your sleeve, do you?

You obviously don't read worth a damn. I have maintained for years that the BSA should accept gay scouts, written them several time to that affect. As an Eagle Scout I would hope my voice has a wee bit of weight. My troop had at least one gay scout, could be more. The organization has finally accepted gay scouts, I expect gay leaders will come in time. Get off your stinking high horse and read before you spout off. You only have to go to the top of this thread to show how uninformed you are about my opinion.

hokiefan
05-27-2013, 09:23 AM
As a private organization I believe the Boy Scouts should be able to set their own rules regarding who they accept as members and/or leaders. Freedom of association is guaranteed by our Constitution. Whether they decide to change their rules to allow gays not should be up to them. Do the posters here who are angry because they don't like the Boy Scouts rules believe in the First Amendment?

The Boy Scouts of America have recently decided to accept gay scouts, in part because many, many past members told them it was the right thing to do. I was one of them.

The Bigfella
05-27-2013, 09:38 AM
You obviously don't read worth a damn. I have maintained for years that the BSA should accept gay scouts, written them several time to that affect. As an Eagle Scout I would hope my voice has a wee bit of weight. My troop had at least one gay scout, could be more. The organization has finally accepted gay scouts, I expect gay leaders will come in time. Get off your stinking high horse and read before you spout off. You only have to go to the top of this thread to show how uninformed you are about my opinion.

I was commenting on your post #12.

Insular is as kind as I can be.

hokiefan
05-27-2013, 09:43 AM
Ya know what Ian, since life is obviously so much better in Asia why don't you keep your opinions there???


.... and now we see the sort of thinking that leads to this crap.

Bigotry and archaic thinking, like this issue, deserve to be attacked wherever they occur. Wear this sort of stuff proudly on your sleeve, do you?


I was commenting on your post #12.

Insular is as kind as I can be.

Don't try to be kind. Just take your arrogant crap back to Oz.

George Jung
05-27-2013, 09:45 AM
Could hook up that 'dog shock collar' in a discreet location..... one of your friends could send ya a friendly 'crispy critters' when you're about to offer an opinion....

Hey, we're just here to help!

Full Tilt
05-27-2013, 09:52 AM
I know my troop had one, and none of us perished...

___________ ______________________________ _____________________________

Just one?

The Bigfella
05-27-2013, 09:53 AM
He's sure hot under that collar... must've shorted on?

Its a simple issue... easily handled... unless you've got something bugging you from within.

George Jung
05-27-2013, 09:58 AM
Personal perspective? Change is difficult - and change in perspective, from what we've 'known' most of our lives, to an entirely different value - extremely difficult. Having someone poke ya in the ribs with a sharp stick doesn't tend to have the strong beneficial properties you might expect.

hokiefan
05-27-2013, 10:01 AM
___________ ______________________________ _____________________________

Just one?

Just one that I know of for sure. Its possible there were more, but honestly I moved away from town at 22 and haven't kept up. Its not an important issue in my life who anyone sleeps with.

Cheers,

Bobby

bogdog
05-27-2013, 10:34 AM
As a private organization I believe the Boy Scouts should be able to set their own rules regarding who they accept as members and/or leaders. Freedom of association is guaranteed by our Constitution. Whether they decide to change their rules to allow gays not should be up to them. Do the posters here who are angry because they don't like the Boy Scouts rules believe in the First Amendment?

Considering the amount of public funds the BSA solicits every year their policy is out of step. As I pointed out there are alternatives for those who want to leave that do not solicit public dollars. Our local district director frankly doesn't get what all the fuss is about and he's been a Scout for almost his entire life. My BIL is a scout leader he was thrilled except for the fact that gay adults weren't accepted, his district is embarrassed by that fact also. The fact is the Scouts made the decision to change, the real blowback is coming from those who are opposed to the change. Now if they would just get rid of that elitist OA...

John Smith
05-27-2013, 10:37 AM
As a private organization I believe the Boy Scouts should be able to set their own rules regarding who they accept as members and/or leaders. Freedom of association is guaranteed by our Constitution. Whether they decide to change their rules to allow gays not should be up to them. Do the posters here who are angry because they don't like the Boy Scouts rules believe in the First Amendment?

Is it really that simple? Is this a tax exempt organization?

hokiefan
05-27-2013, 10:41 AM
Considering the amount of public funds the BSA solicits every year their policy is out of step. As I pointed out there are alternatives for those who want to leave that do not solicit public dollars. Our local district director frankly doesn't get what all the fuss is about and he's been a Scout for almost his entire life. My BIL is a scout leader he was thrilled except for the fact that gay adults weren't accepted, his district is embarrassed by that fact also. The fact is the Scouts made the decision to change, the real blowback is coming from those who are opposed to the change. Now if they would just get rid of that elitist OA...

I'm curious what leads to this comment. I was an OA member much of my Boy Scout life, a leader there the last two. We did a lot of great work for our council, mostly building/maintaining a pretty wonderful Summer Camp facility.

Cheers,

Bobby

Reynard38
05-27-2013, 10:42 AM
A lot of troops will be looking for new quarters as many of them used church facilities for thier meetings. I've been hearing that some churches no longer wish to be associated with the BSA.

hokiefan
05-27-2013, 10:45 AM
Is it really that simple? Is this a tax exempt organization?

According to the SCOTUS, they have the right to set their membership rules. They have recently chosen to allow gay Scouts, but not gay Scout Leaders. Gay Scout Leaders will come in time.

Bobby

hokiefan
05-27-2013, 10:46 AM
A lot of troops will be looking for new quarters as many of them used church facilities for thier meetings. I've been hearing that some churches no longer wish to be associated with the BSA.

Some will unfortunately.

The Bigfella
05-27-2013, 10:51 AM
Yep... no gays in those churches eh? All those shirt-lifting priests are celibate.

Full Tilt
05-27-2013, 10:53 AM
Personal perspective? Change is difficult - and change in perspective, from what we've 'known' most of our lives, to an entirely different value - extremely difficult. Having someone poke ya in the ribs with a sharp stick doesn't tend to have the strong beneficial properties you might expect.
_____________ ____________________________ _________________________________ __________________

Times up, put down your pen and hand in your paper.

Change didn't happen.

This is the 21st century, global warming threatens to make us extinct, we don't have time for subtleties.

Ones sexuality exists as a spectrum. Not an "us or them" situation at all.

All the necessary ingredients to produce every variation of gender exists within the cells human beings are made of.

I have identical twin sisters. One is masculine, one is feminine. They are one cell, divided, into two individuals.

The characteristics of each existed together before splitting into separate, distinctly different people.

We all have the same potential my sisters had.

Let's move on.

George Jung
05-27-2013, 10:59 AM
Fulltilt, get off your soapbox/quit your pontificating. We all 'know' what you're prattling on about. Get over yourself.

bogdog
05-27-2013, 11:03 AM
I'm curious what leads to this comment. I was an OA member much of my Boy Scout life, a leader there the last two. We did a lot of great work for our council, mostly building/maintaining a pretty wonderful Summer Camp facility.

Cheers,

Bobby
I was mostly kidding, in part because I have no idea what OA is like now. When I was in Scouts OA was only for the "right kind" of Scouts. That seemed to be Scouts who had fathers with aspirations. Something my brother and I lacked, although we were both Eagle Scouts, great students(Merit Scholar semi-finalists) and civically engaged. We did have a mother who could all hike, out backpack, and out camp most men and who was Girl Scout leader for thirty years. Maybe we was blackballed. My brother and I both loved the Girl Scouts, although I ended up loving Campfire Girls better.:d

Full Tilt
05-27-2013, 11:04 AM
Fulltilt, get off your soapbox/quit your pontificating. We all 'know' what you're prattling on about. Get over yourself.
____________ _____________ __________________________________________________ _______

Tell me, what do you think I'm "prattling on about"?

bogdog
05-27-2013, 11:06 AM
How is your interest served by looking for ways to force them into something they don't want to do. You don't sound very tolerant of people you may disagree with.
They weren't forced, they chose. I'd say they are getting closer to honoring their oath and law.

hokiefan
05-27-2013, 11:14 AM
I was mostly kidding, in part because I have no idea what OA is like now. When I was in Scouts OA was only for the "right kind" of Scouts. That seemed to be Scouts who had fathers with aspirations. Something my brother and I lacked, although we were both Eagle Scouts, great students(Merit Scholar semi-finalists) and civically engaged. We did have a mother who could all hike, out backpack, and out camp most men and who was Girl Scout leader for thirty years. Maybe we was blackballed. My brother and I both loved the Girl Scouts, although I ended up loving Campfire Girls better.:d

I find this mind-boggling to be honest. I knew no Eagle Scouts, not a one, who weren't OA members. Most of us were selected by Star. To me one of the great parts of being an OA member was that I knew all of the ranking Boy Scouts in my district. When I went to summer camp, I knew someone in every troop. Being the quiet and shy kind, that was huge. I guess it may be different that I'm a small town kid, but you could be as well, I don't know.

Like you though, I have no idea what its like now. My kid chose soccer over Scouts quite a few years ago.

Cheers,

Bobby

bogdog
05-27-2013, 11:24 AM
I find this mind-boggling to be honest. I knew no Eagle Scouts, not a one, who weren't OA members. Most of us were selected by Star. To me one of the great parts of being an OA member was that I knew all of the ranking Boy Scouts in my district. When I went to summer camp, I knew someone in every troop. Being the quiet and shy kind, that was huge. I guess it may be different that I'm a small town kid, but you could be as well, I don't know.

Like you though, I have no idea what its like now. My kid chose soccer over Scouts quite a few years ago.

Cheers,

Bobby

I don't even know how scouts were selected for OA. Our troop had guys who were picked that completely surprised me and others in our troop. Can't say as I ever got a grasp on the process.

hokiefan
05-27-2013, 11:37 AM
I don't even know how scouts were selected for OA. Our troop had guys who were picked that completely surprised me and others in our troop. Can't say as I ever got a grasp on the process.

I had to look up the process, its been 39 years or so. You had to be a First Class Scout, approved by your Scoutmaster, and then elected by the troop. In my experience everyone who stuck around was eventually selected. I will say our Scoutmaster was a completely fair type of guy. I didn't always agree with him, but I could always respect him. Sorry I never got to be Kitchkinet (guide) for your ordeal.

Cheers,

Bobby

pipefitter
05-27-2013, 11:45 AM
Holy crap! Gay scouts, really??? So nobody sees an issue with kids of the typical scout age, having considerations at all to what their sexuality even is during what is certainly the most awkward of the formative years? And then wonder wtf is going on with kids these days and bouts with depression and anxiety? It's because of the f'd up crap their adults are selling them, forcing them into adult complexities at such young ages.

Can't fix our own adult social issues, so lets push it off on the kiddies and make it unanimous. Pretty damned disgusting if you ask me.

George Jung
05-27-2013, 11:51 AM
Not sure what your point is. Try again?

Full Tilt
05-27-2013, 11:52 AM
Holy crap! Gay scouts, really??? So nobody sees an issue with kids of the typical scout age, having considerations at all to what their sexuality even is during what is certainly the most awkward of the formative years? And then wonder wtf is going on with kids these days and bouts with depression and anxiety? It's because of the f'd up crap their adults are selling them, forcing them into adult complexities at such young ages.

Can't fix our own adult social issues, so lets push it off on the kiddies and make it unanimous. Pretty damned disgusting if you ask me.
_______________________ __________________________________________________

Pipefitter, get off your soap box and quit pontificating, it's all about denial ​here.

hokiefan
05-27-2013, 12:00 PM
Holy crap! Gay scouts, really??? So nobody sees an issue with kids of the typical scout age, having considerations at all to what their sexuality even is during what is certainly the most awkward of the formative years? And then wonder wtf is going on with kids these days and bouts with depression and anxiety? It's because of the f'd up crap their adults are selling them, forcing them into adult complexities at such young ages.

Can't fix our own adult social issues, so lets push it off on the kiddies and make it unanimous. Pretty damned disgusting if you ask me.

Slow down and explain that. I think I have a clue, but I'm not completely sure.

Like I've said before my troop had a gay Scout. We didn't know it at the time, I'm not sure he knew it at the time. I remember my father (an Assistant Scoutmaster) laughing that X**** "had lace on his drawers." I laughed back, said "He's going out with all the pretty girls." Dad said, "We'll see." For what its worth, my old man was right. Looking back, for the mid '70's my old man was pretty liberal for a conservative old fart.

I remember when my sister got married in '95 my buddy had full blown AIDS. No one expected him to be long for this world. With modern medicine he's now doing fine and enjoying life.

Anyway, by late Boy Scout age most of us realized girls ruled the world. These days I'm guessing the few not ruled by girls realize they may be gay. Maybe its more confusing these days, maybe not. I have no clue.

Cheers,

Bobby

Nicholas Scheuer
05-27-2013, 12:28 PM
I wonder now how this policy change might be received in my Troop of 1953. My SM was exceedingly liberal on most counts (where much of my liberal attitudes originate), yet he was a devout Roman Catholic, and our local Parish Church sponsored the Troop. The Pope is on record, and if our Pastor wished to draw a line, I'm sure neither the SM nor the Troop Committee would buck that line. Unlike many troops I've observed over the years, our Troop Committee was large and strong; strong enough to make the SM toe the line.

hokiefan
05-27-2013, 12:44 PM
I wonder now how this policy change might be received in my Troop of 1953. My SM was exceedingly liberal on most counts (where much of my liberal attitudes originate), yet he was a devout Roman Catholic, and our local Parish Church sponsored the Troop. The Pope is on record, and if our Pastor wished to draw a line, I'm sure neither the SM nor the Troop Committee would buck that line. Unlike many troops I've observed over the years, our Troop Committee was large and strong; strong enough to make the SM toe the line.

1953? Is there really much doubt?

Wouldn't have been a lot different in my mid-70's troop at the Baptist Church.

For what its worth, my Dad got his Eagle in 1945. Not that many years before. Like I said, he was pretty liberal for a conservative old fart.

BTW, I still have his faded old Eagle medal. A prized possession.

Bobby

George Jung
05-27-2013, 12:53 PM
_______________________ __________________________________________________

Pipefitter, get off your soap box and quit pontificating, it's all about denial ​here.


Must've left a mark! Just a thought - but maybe just a civil, nicely thought-out position would be useful. Strident really doesn''t help much.

pipefitter
05-27-2013, 01:08 PM
Slow down and explain that. I think I have a clue, but I'm not completely sure.

Like I've said before my troop had a gay Scout. We didn't know it at the time, I'm not sure he knew it at the time. I remember my father (an Assistant Scoutmaster) laughing that X**** "had lace on his drawers." I laughed back, said "He's going out with all the pretty girls." Dad said, "We'll see." For what its worth, my old man was right. Looking back, for the mid '70's my old man was pretty liberal for a conservative old fart.

I remember when my sister got married in '95 my buddy had full blown AIDS. No one expected him to be long for this world. With modern medicine he's now doing fine and enjoying life.

Anyway, by late Boy Scout age most of us realized girls ruled the world. These days I'm guessing the few not ruled by girls realize they may be gay. Maybe its more confusing these days, maybe not. I have no clue.

Cheers,

Bobby

The bold part is exactly my point. They should not have to know it at that time. Lifestyle choices should be left to adults. Everything else life altering is, so why not personal sexuality? Kids need not be burdened with such things. Can't drive a car until you're 16, can't drink until 21. The scout ages are varied. pre-teen on up. Why should 'all' kids be subjected to such concerns, that may not naturally have such concerns otherwise?

I have no issue with gays. Fact is, I could care less, and this is where it seems to become a problem. Their shock, attention grabbing values have worn off. Nobody really cares anymore. So they have to keep pushing their freak show to the forefront of extremes, regardless of who they inflict it upon, or what institutions they dismantle. You should have a right, or a place to not to care about such 'personal' things. Otherwise, it's just another group of tools of the trade trying to be noticed. It's pretty darned selfish.

pipefitter
05-27-2013, 01:32 PM
_______________________ __________________________________________________

Pipefitter, get off your soap box and quit pontificating, it's all about denial ​here.

How about you get off my soapbox. This says, BSA, not BSC. Just because you've lost your voice, or have abandoned your own country's social issues, in which to focus on mine, doesn't mean you have a say.

There's plenty of outlets for gay people to pursue their cause, to find themselves, and eachother. They are going to spend a heck of a lot more time as gay adults than as children, you know, when it actually matters? Let them focus on that and leave the kids organizations out of it.

This is where people who don't care otherwise, live and let live and all that, start finding the exploitive, negative sides of such issues gone too far. There is a lot of sensible and socially responsible gay people. These are not it. It's just that so many people have been brainwashed that the inclusion of homosexuality, it's victimization of the past, automatically makes it a socially acceptable cause everywhere, out of perhaps some weird, homosexual guilt, that apparently has no boundaries.

bogdog
05-27-2013, 02:04 PM
I had to look up the process, its been 39 years or so. You had to be a First Class Scout, approved by your Scoutmaster, and then elected by the troop. In my experience everyone who stuck around was eventually selected. I will say our Scoutmaster was a completely fair type of guy. I didn't always agree with him, but I could always respect him. Sorry I never got to be Kitchkinet (guide) for your ordeal.

Cheers,

Bobby

My experience was more than 39 year ago, I don't recall ever taking a vote on fellow scouts for OA, I suspect it was done by the adult leaders that's why the troop was always so surprised at who was selected. It really was an exclusive club. Our Scout master was a great guy, got along very well with my brother and I. We were both SPL a couple of times, I was troop bugler, maybe that was it? Still have a perfect totin' chip card...

George Jung
05-27-2013, 02:29 PM
Interesting perspective, Pipefitter - and good points. Only point of divergence, IMO, is - who is making this an issue in BSA? Gay activists? Or BSA leadership, by (previously) denying membership to gay scouts?

IMO, the kids have been made pawns in this whole thing. Same thing in kids' sports - adults screwing it up, when the kids just want to play.

bogdog
05-27-2013, 03:11 PM
Interesting perspective, Pipefitter - and good points. Only point of divergence, IMO, is - who is making this an issue in BSA? Gay activists? Or BSA leadership, by (previously) denying membership to gay scouts?

IMO, the kids have been made pawns in this whole thing. Same thing in kids' sports - adults screwing it up, when the kids just want to play.

Kids and adult leaders have both been victimized by the BSA policy. There have been plenty of gay adult leaders who found no problem with their local councils accepting them, and the same thing with the other scouts accepting gay kids and atheist kids, there hasn't been an issue. The ones with the issue have been at the national level. Scouting is a grassroots organization, the grassroots have spoken they don't care if a kid is gay nor do they care if a leader is gay. It wasn't gays committing the decades of abuse and hiding it from the membership, the grassroots recognize that.

There is no such thing as a stereotypical gay child they are as different and as similar as other children and those who want to learn the skills they would learn in scouts should have the opportunity. I started a backpacking/camping/climbing class in the public schools here back in the early 70s. There were kids of every gender type in those classes. They worked well together generally as a team when it was required, they respected each other, and they all enjoyed the heck out of themselves. A lot of those kids grew up still enjoying doing the things they learned in those classes as adults with their families and significant others.

L.W. Baxter
05-27-2013, 03:27 PM
I dunno, Pipes. You hang an awful lot on the notions that Scout-aged boys don't really know what they are attracted to, that homosexuality really doesn't matter to boys, and never causes anxiety or discrimination unless adult homosexual activists make it an issue.

That does not jibe with my personal experience. I knew I was attracted to women by age 6; distinctly recall seeing my first Penthouse mag and being, shall we say, excited. By age 11 or so I had all the tools to impregnate females, and in a state of nature, surely would have been actively trying by that point. Fortunately for the girls, I was raised abashed in a substantially Puritan household, and didn't make my first awkward moves until 14 or so: still Boy Scout age, eh? But from the start, I had no question that my sexual impulses were normal and accepted.

So while I had the normal range of adolescent anxieties, I was spared the deeply existential questions, those that arise from schoolyard taunts and adult approbation, i.e., Am I a faggot? The lowest of the low? An object of scorn, ridicule, and ostracism by my peers and by society at large? Am I doomed to a life of being queer?

What adult homosexual activists are saying is, those questions, rather than being irrelevant, are central to young people establishing their identities. Messages of acceptance and tolerance from the rest of us can help ease the passage for some tortured souls. And they are tortured, whether you understand their plight or not.

I'm glad you don't care about homosexuality, Pipes. But the movement to secure acceptance for homosexuals is not about you.

Bobcat
05-27-2013, 03:39 PM
I was a scout in 1970's. I also have a gay child. Kids know early on how they're wired in terms of orientation at least by the early teens. In our troop, fag was probably the most common insult and often as an accusation. Then there was the game "smear the queer." I can only imagine how the gay boys would have felt. Scouting should be for all kids.

skuthorp
05-27-2013, 04:59 PM
I was an non-believing scout, scouter, group leader and District leader for a very big part of my life. At troop level we had 'gay' scouts and scouters, but the only problems we ever had was from outside with a local man exposing himself on occasion. Never was a problem, but I am aware that in other groups it has been. It's about pederasty, not being homosexual.

nehalem
05-27-2013, 05:57 PM
For many scout troops the national BSA position is a source of embarrassment. Our troop has only scouts, parents and leaders. All adults are required to take youth safety training prior to being involved with the scouts. Our charter organization is a reconciling congregation that has sponsored the troop since the 30's.

bogdog
05-27-2013, 06:06 PM
For many scout troops the national BSA position is a source of embarrassment. Our troop has only scouts, parents and leaders. All adults are required to take youth safety training prior to being involved with the scouts. Our charter organization is a reconciling congregation that has sponsored the troop since the 30's.

Could ya translate that?

nehalem
05-27-2013, 06:19 PM
For Bogdog, Pretty much what you wrote in your post #51. We do not make a distinction. There are only scouts, leaders.and parents in our troop.

Reconciling congregations:

"As a Reconciling


Congregation, members
of this congregation have
pledged to welcome and

support all who want to

worship with us, regardless

of race, gender, class, or
sexual orientation"

nehalem
05-27-2013, 06:22 PM
You shouldn't teach your boys anything that has been accepted since the thirties. Don't allow black scouts because they come from a lower race. You should definitely inform them that Jews are dirty. Space exploration is impossible. The world is only six thousand years old. Masturbation will cause hair to grow on your palms.
I know I must have forgotten a few things so I hope others will fill in.

What? read the post....what is wrong with you?

nehalem
05-27-2013, 06:32 PM
Apology accepted.

bogdog
05-27-2013, 06:35 PM
For Bogdog, Pretty much what you wrote in your post #51. We do not make a distinction. There are only scouts, leaders.and parents in our troop.

Reconciling congregations:

"As a Reconciling


Congregation, members
of this congregation have
pledged to welcome and

support all who want to

worship with us, regardless

of race, gender, class, or
sexual orientation"
Excellent, that's nice to hear.

George Jung
05-27-2013, 07:03 PM
cartopcruiser got awful comfortable, awfully quick. Which recently banned forumite (with your current personna soon to follow, I hope) are you a re-incarnation of?

George Jung
05-27-2013, 07:12 PM
Careful when you're shaving...

skipper68
05-27-2013, 07:39 PM
You need to understand.
They have a disorder, that makes them who they are.
They are not bad, just different.

If anyone finds them an offense-they are scared they feel the same way.
Let those that are HUMAN, be happy.
All it takes.
BTW, those that are offended-go.....................................yup.
This is no more than a certain church.

Human nature is not perfect.

Humans have difficulties that are not approved of.
It is not our job to judge.

George Jung
05-27-2013, 07:45 PM
Lots of things have disappeared on this thread, and on others. Maybe the Wise Scot is whispering in a few folks ear?

AFA 'have a disorder' - that's DSM IV and earlier, I believe. Has been disproven/no longer is so classified. Unless you're talking about the bigots and the racists. That's a whole other discussion.

George Jung
05-27-2013, 07:47 PM
And became aware of that old thread - after only 30 posts. This does not compute!

skipper68
05-27-2013, 07:50 PM
Let those that are without sin-ON THAT CHURCH- cast the stone.
I bet I would throw, and be thrown upon!
Mind your own biz.
REALLY.
I love so many, and I never judge.
How can anyone here judge?
Not my job.
I love all I have in my world.
That is the best choice.

George Jung
05-27-2013, 07:53 PM
Is he a re-incarnation of FredZ? Emulating his example? I don't recall Fred being so..... wrong.

skipper68
05-27-2013, 08:00 PM
This should be a SFB thread.

Nicholas Scheuer
05-27-2013, 09:15 PM
Did everyone get smashed except for a handful of drunks babbling incoherent broadsides directed at no one in particular?

skipper68
05-27-2013, 09:20 PM
Did everyone get smashed except for a handful of drunks babbling incoherent broadsides directed at no one in particular? I represent that statement!
Wana step outside?
A bit of this will fixyaallup. ;)
I was LOL, when it blew up my computer!
Now I'm editing on the BAD one.
Ughh..
ROTFL, kicks me in the ars.

The Bigfella
05-27-2013, 09:22 PM
He was drunk, was he? I think it is a bit early here, 9:22am

AnalogKid
05-27-2013, 09:39 PM
cartopcruiser got awful comfortable, awfully quick. Which recently banned forumite (with your current personna soon to follow, I hope) are you a re-incarnation of?

Looks like you got your wish George, a search by username suggests that cartopcruiser's brief run is over. Oh, well, nevermind.

George Jung
05-27-2013, 09:44 PM
Not a loss (not sure if you read any of his 'offerings'), but a bit curious who he is. Ah well - clean up completed.

The Bigfella
05-27-2013, 09:50 PM
He had a certain flavour at times. I thought I knew, but can't be bothered going to the effort

The Bigfella
05-28-2013, 02:43 AM
Meanwhile, God has clarified his position:

http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/306955_439820389448290_1416199505_n.jpg