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Duncan Gibbs
04-27-2013, 09:49 PM
As much as I like them all (and I really do mean I like all of them) I'm not sure why some/most are still there. I think it may put off others from posting updates and place a burden on those who have a stickied thread. As well you have to scroll down an entire screen to get to the other threads, which are more active than the majority of those that have been stickied.

My feeling is that the sticky threads should be sticky when they're moving along nicely, or at significant times such as launching and sea trials. Otherwise B&R feels a bit static/stuck right now.

ETA: I think it's still Scot's call on which thread get a sticky and which ones don't, just that variety up top has to be a good thing.

Bernadette
04-27-2013, 10:52 PM
i'd like scot to keep my build thread a sticky until my yacht is launched.

Duncan Gibbs
04-28-2013, 04:23 AM
Maybe there's a way of having the sticky threads mirrored on another board where there can be more stickies than there are now, (as I think there are at least 30 worthy threads), whilst the order remains natural, as in last posted at the top in B & R itself (including the sticky threads on the new "mirrored" board. Is it possible?

Paul Pless
04-28-2013, 04:20 PM
i guess everybody must have something to complain about. . .

Duncan Gibbs
04-28-2013, 05:38 PM
I'm not complaining Paul, I'm just making a serving suggestion. It just seems odd to have stickies where nothing happens for months at a time. If my Dragon thread was stickied right now, I'd want it unstuck, as I don't feel there's enough progress to make it of much interest to anyone. I'm not wanting rain on anyone's parade, but I'm wondering what is being served by having so many stickies and if there's another way of highlighting worthy threads other than having a whole bunch that sit at the top of every B & R page.

Jim Ledger
04-28-2013, 06:47 PM
Duncan's got a point...the current Sticky system is static and boring, sort of an "everybody gets a trophy, we're all winners here" sort of thing. This arrangement actually promotes long lapses without serious progress as well as a lot of fluffy feel-good chatter among the posters.

Another more rewarding system would involve a cutthroat numerical thread grading, not just post or view count, but an actual grade based on the "Wow factor" of the actual build, something from zero to a hundred say, constantly re-evaluated in order to foster a sense of insecurity in the participants and interest in the viewers.

Might just jump-start some of those lagging builds, those Sticky-milkers...and you'se know who you are....

Jim Ledger
04-28-2013, 08:18 PM
By the way have you refueled your WOW factor lately?



No, Mike, I haven't, but then I ain't in the Sticky Club either.:D

Tell you what I would like to see...the names of who clicks on your thread, the ones who look without ever saying anything.

That'd be some entertaining.

jsjpd1
04-28-2013, 08:53 PM
Hey Jim, I looked at your thread the other day but didn't say anything. Just thought you should know. :D

Jim

Mike Vogdes
05-02-2013, 03:47 PM
I think they should all be put on a time limit. When a thread is getting a lot of traffic, then give it a stickie, when the traffic dies down, adios... I rarely look in on them, usually scan right past them.

Duncan Gibbs
05-03-2013, 07:07 AM
Ha! I was about to make the same comment Mike, just as I opened up B&R and realised that I just scrolled straight down without even looking at them.

I really don't think these perma-stickies are good for the thread starters, nor for those who might otherwise open the thread if it just came to the top 'naturally.' They are really, really good threads, but I think the value of them being stuck has been lowered considerably by the amount time they've been there.

Mrleft8
05-03-2013, 08:06 AM
I mentioned this to Scot back in February or March..... My idea is that the first 4 or 5 active threads precede the stickies so that the people that are actually arguing with each other don't have to wade through all the staid and stately threads from the anointed. ;)

Yeadon
05-03-2013, 08:33 AM
I had a sticky once.

Paul Pless
05-03-2013, 12:17 PM
I think they should all be put on a time limit. When a thread is getting a lot of traffic, then give it a stickie, when the traffic dies down, adios... I rarely look in on them, usually scan right past them.

Active threads don't really need stickies do they?

Canoeyawl
05-03-2013, 02:18 PM
I never even look at the stickies, just blow right by. Life is short.

Harbourmaster
05-03-2013, 04:17 PM
If I don't have a lot of time to poke around... i.e. most of the time, I just go to the upper left of the header and hit the "What's New" button to bring up all of the threads that are currently active... simple enough.

Duncan Gibbs
05-03-2013, 10:41 PM
I actually think the stickiness if not washed off soon enough does damage to the thread. How's that for a laundry analogy?

Paul Pless
05-04-2013, 01:22 PM
I'm gonna petition scot to make this thread and Duncan's dragon thread over in B&R a sticky.

Duncan Gibbs
05-04-2013, 05:16 PM
I'm glad you live in Hell Paul, since you really are truly evil! :D

Phil Y
05-08-2013, 04:49 PM
It looks like there's a few less stickies in B&R-or is that just my imagination? Sadly bernie has chucked her toys out of the cot.

Bernadette
05-10-2013, 06:07 AM
It looks like there's a few less stickies in B&R-or is that just my imagination? Sadly bernie has chucked her toys out of the cot.
got to love that! you guys make me smile with what you come up with at times!

Larks
05-10-2013, 08:23 AM
got to love that! you guys make me smile with what you come up with at times!

I just had the image of you leaving the room and walking down the hall way and calling back: "I heard that...."

Phil Y
05-10-2013, 04:40 PM
Stamping foot, and pouting:)

Bernadette
05-11-2013, 06:08 AM
i want to make it clear that duncan's initial comments were not the reason i decided to pull the thread (no pun intended).

its threads like 'reverse clinker' that have me confounded by how some people wish their sheer stupidity to be taken seriously!

and i am equally dismayed at the way boatbuilding practices are 'ransomed' by people that simply do not know what they are talking about.
anyhow as the song goes: its my party and i will cry if i want to!
ive never been happier actually.

Paul Pless
05-11-2013, 12:14 PM
its threads like 'reverse clinker' that have me confounded by how some people wish their sheer stupidity to be taken seriously!

I love that thread!:D

Duncan Gibbs
10-02-2013, 06:46 AM
Cripes! Look what just happened!

Larks
10-02-2013, 06:53 AM
what?

Duncan Gibbs
10-02-2013, 07:02 AM
All the B&R Stickies have been unstuck, aside from Luc's locked thread.

Peerie Maa
10-02-2013, 08:44 AM
Coming late to the party, but.

I believe that there is a lot of excellent info in these threads, which should be preserved for the benefit of future builders. Is there some way of doing that, even if it means a page or section of stikied threads?

Hwyl
10-02-2013, 08:51 AM
Maybe a section just for perma threads

chuckt
10-02-2013, 08:56 AM
Ya'll are fun

Jim Ledger
10-02-2013, 09:00 AM
Coming late to the party, but.

I believe that there is a lot of excellent info in these threads, which should be preserved for the benefit of future builders. Is there some way of doing that, even if it means a page or section of stikied threads?


That's right, Nick, they represent the best of the Forum Builds and contain information, advice and techniques found nowhere else, and in a format impossible to achieve with any other kind of media.

I had to PM Don Kurylko not long ago just to find the thread of his build, in order to review how he made the mast for his boat. There is no easy way to retrieve these valuable threads, even if you are aware of their existance. Unfortunatly, once a thread is finished it usually sinks, never to be seen again.

There ought to be some kind of permanent archive where the best threads are kept easily availavle, not just the current crop of stickies, but all the outstanding, informatinve threads.

Jim Ledger
10-02-2013, 10:03 AM
Not too seriously (so jump down my throat) - but would that include how to manipulate action figures and beer bottles? :eek: That one at least I would suggest has outlived it's "sell by" date by some margin...

I think that the singlehanded building of a large Bolger boat to high standards, with minimal tools, under often extremely averse conditions would be of interest to many in the future, as it has been in the past. The humor is just an added benefit.

I've got my polar bear hat.:D

chuckt
10-02-2013, 11:26 AM
Man. Don't mess with Duncan. :D

Hwyl
10-02-2013, 11:51 AM
When I joined the forum someone had aggregated everything on the same subject, using a title like "this horse ain't dead yet". Maybe an old timer will remember better than me.

wizbang 13
10-02-2013, 12:36 PM
I love that thread!:D
but my fave of all time .... Schooner RUS .... opposite of sticky ,
bruce

Mad Scientist
10-02-2013, 02:10 PM
but my fave of all time .... Schooner RUS .... opposite of sticky ,
bruce

+100!

So, about a year ago, I seemed to have more cash in my pocket than usual. I considered spreading it out on an old bedsheet, and recreating what might be the most notorious photo in the history of the WBF. But, it just wouldn't have been the same...

Tom

Vernon
10-02-2013, 08:21 PM
That's right, Nick, they represent the best of the Forum Builds and contain information, advice and techniques found nowhere else, and in a format impossible to achieve with any other kind of media.

I had to PM Don Kurylko not long ago just to find the thread of his build, in order to review how he made the mast for his boat. There is no easy way to retrieve these valuable threads, even if you are aware of their existance. Unfortunatly, once a thread is finished it usually sinks, never to be seen again.

There ought to be some kind of permanent archive where the best threads are kept easily availavle, not just the current crop of stickies, but all the outstanding, informatinve threads.


Often if you know a name and topic, that'll get you right there with Google. Any part of the title you remember can also get you the thread.

In this case, I searched google for "site:forum.woodenboat.com Don Kurylko mast" without the quotes. The first hit was a page of "more pictures of....." I opened that page and hit F3 for a search window and typed "mast" for the search. That took me directly to a series of picture links around June 2012 of a nice mast build. Might not be the one you were looking for, but this type of search is very quick with good results once you get used to doing it this way. Took only about 10 seconds to find the page (a page at least) just by your mention of it. Though I'm a little geeky, so it's automatic to do it this way. Was worth looking at again btw, a whole lot more time spent looking at the pictures. :)

I found my own thread with "site:forum.woodenboat.com vernon tern" - again first hit.

Give it a try, googles site search blows away the forum search.

Vern

Duncan Gibbs
10-02-2013, 08:55 PM
I don't use the VB search function at all, even to find my own long lost threads. Google wins hands down.


Man. Don't mess with Duncan. :D
Chuck knows! He only buys monel bolts now...

svaap
10-03-2013, 03:36 AM
As the writer of one of the previous "Stickies", I must admit that I am glad that it has been removed.

I was honored when the thread got the stickie, but since it has been at best at idle the last year or so, I feel it should be visible at every new posting only.

/Ole

chuckt
10-03-2013, 06:19 AM
Duncan, I suspect Scot was thinking about doing something about it and you gave him some validation or encouragement. I agree it was due for tidying up. Recent activity has always been what I look for. Most all the good threads are gonna be at the top except those awesome completed threads. A hall of fame folder would be great.

What about that Scot? A Hall of Fame?

Duncan Gibbs
10-03-2013, 06:32 AM
Particularly as we already have the Hall of Shame! (http://forum.woodenboat.com/forumdisplay.php?5-The-Bilge)

I think it's a great idea, but Pless hates the idea of any more sub-forums. He's sure to vote agin it! BTW, he said he was going to start a new build in three weeks and that was ages ago. What happened there?

Jim Ledger
10-03-2013, 07:34 AM
Often if you know a name and topic, that'll get you right there with Google. Any part of the title you remember can also get you the thread.

Thanks for the search information, Vern.

The problem I had looking for Don Kurylkos thread was that it was posted by Dave Lesser, not Don, and so didin't show up on Dons posted threads.

Searching for a particular thread assumes you know of the existence of that thread, which isn't always the case, particularly people joining the forum after the threads demise. Even long standing readers would need a prodigious memory in order to recall all the worthy build threads.

There's gold in those threads, they come alive for the reader in a way no magazine article can match. These aren't, for the most part, gold-plater builds built by "real" boatbuilders, they are built by much more accessible people working under conditions and overcoming difficulties that most of us can relate to. The photos, text, replies and responses provide an intimate look into the creation of a boat that would serve as either an inspiration or cautionary tale.

How about "The Best of the Forum", a permanent category, and to be clear, I want my thread up there, along with Lenihan, Lucky Luke, Don Kurylko, Svaap, Matt Billey, and all the others who have built fine boats and taken the time to document and share the process here.

It'll be just like a shelf with all your favorite books, you don't have to look at them often, but you know where they are.

Jim

Hwyl
10-03-2013, 08:40 AM
Thanks Mike, Jim Hillman was the guy I was trying to remember.

Peerie Maa
10-03-2013, 01:37 PM
How about "The Best of the Forum", a permanent category, and to be clear, I want my thread up there, along with Lenihan, Lucky Luke, Don Kurylko, Svaap, Matt Billey, and all the others who have built fine boats and taken the time to document and share the process here.

It'll be just like a shelf with all your favorite books, you don't have to look at them often, but you know where they are.

Jim

Don't forget Morgan Volunteer.

chuckt
10-03-2013, 04:19 PM
I like this idea.

Larks
10-03-2013, 06:23 PM
How about "The Best of the Forum", a permanent category, and to be clear, I want my thread up there, along with Lenihan, Lucky Luke, Don Kurylko, Svaap, Matt Billey, and all the others who have built fine boats and taken the time to document and share the process here.

It'll be just like a shelf with all your favorite books, you don't have to look at them often, but you know where they are.

Jim

Terrific idea! It'd be nice if it was a pathway to the thread, rather than moving it from where it is was originally posted. So a link that works the same as "New posts" or one of the drop down boxes under "Quick links":

Todays Posts
Subscribed Threads
Best Of
Open contacts popup

Duncan Gibbs
10-03-2013, 09:56 PM
I like it too! +1000!

Would it be in the form of a permanent link to the first page of the thread, or would the thread be moved to a new sub-forum? I think the former would be better and simpler.

Jim Ledger
10-04-2013, 07:25 AM
Don't forget Morgan Volunteer.




The threads I suggested were only a sampling, no offence to anyone not included in my very short list. It would be interesting to see other candidates nominated.




I like it too! +1000!

Would it be in the form of a permanent link to the first page of the thread, or would the thread be moved to a new sub-forum? I think the former would be better and simpler.



The details would have to be worked out, but how does "WBF's Greatest Hits" sound to you?:D

What the forum phenomena really needs is a next-generation software package, something with some kind of categorizing and indexing capability. Things have changed markedly since the inception of the forum. Whereas the original intent was to allow conversations between like-minded individuals, the reality has far outstripped the medium. The advent of photo heavy build threads has allowed a significant body of useful information to accumualte. The problem is accessing old material, and not being able to browse subjects of interest that are not current topics of conversation. A sub-forum of significant threads is still a stop-gap measure, but it's better than stickies.

Chip-skiff
10-06-2013, 12:35 PM
What the forum phenomena really needs is a next-generation software package, something with some kind of categorizing and indexing capability. Things have changed markedly since the inception of the forum. Whereas the original intent was to allow conversations between like-minded individuals, the reality has far outstripped the medium. The advent of photo heavy build threads has allowed a significant body of useful information to accumualte. The problem is accessing old material, and not being able to browse subjects of interest that are not current topics of conversation. A sub-forum of significant threads is still a stop-gap measure, but it's better than stickies.

I'd be happy with a simple means to archive the links to threads I intend to revisit. For my own threads, I can go to my profile and scroll down the list, of course. But for worthwhile but infrequently updated threads by others, I've not found a good means to keep track. What about the Subscribe function under Thread Tools? But I don't want to get an e-mail or notification every time someone posts on a chosen thread. A crude way to archive threads is to copy the address header (e.g. http://forum.woodenboat.com/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=3925098) and paste it in an e-mail message in my profile, which doesn't get sent: it's just a dropbox.

Any advice or ideas?

Duncan Gibbs
10-06-2013, 07:18 PM
The details would have to be worked out, but how does "WBF's Greatest Hits" sound to you?:D

Let's start with the sub-forum header: Swap "Connie's" for "Wooden Boat Forum's" and then all the song titles could be replaced with thread titles that are clickable links...

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/22/Connie's_Greatest_Hits_Album_Cover.jpg

I'm liking this idea more and more!

Larks
10-06-2013, 07:24 PM
I like it too! +1000!

Would it be in the form of a permanent link to the first page of the thread, or would the thread be moved to a new sub-forum? I think the former would be better and simpler.

Hmmm, I think I'm feeling middle child syndrome.....ignored....:rolleyes:


Terrific idea! It'd be nice if it was a pathway to the thread, rather than moving it from where it is was originally posted. So a link that works the same as "New posts" or one of the drop down boxes under "Quick links":

Todays Posts
Subscribed Threads
Best Of
Open contacts popup

essaunders
10-07-2013, 08:06 AM
I always figured the stickies were just how Scott kept track of what he was reading. I never notice as I read the forum by hitting the 'What's New' button (which is now useful once the Bilge was excluded)

Paul Pless
10-08-2013, 06:48 PM
When I joined the forum someone had aggregated everything on the same subject, using a title like "this horse ain't dead yet". Maybe an old timer will remember better than me.

there were thread indexes and threads gathering links into FAQ type threads.

Duncan Gibbs
10-09-2013, 05:33 PM
There was one of those that was a sticky for a while in B&R when I first joined up and it was pretty good, but it got unstuck. I doubt any of the links would work any more since the the URLs have changed from "www.vbwoodenboat.forum..." or some such to the one we see in our address bars today. This is perhaps one of the problems inherent in having permalinks is they ain't "perma."

Perhaps a sub-forum where the "best of" threads that have ceased to be active can be parked?

(Yeah! Yeah! I know you don't like sub-forums Mr Pless!)

Easytiger Models
10-15-2013, 09:59 AM
My two cents? Way too many stickies. I'm not going to CRY, exactly. With time, love, and tenderness, I will pull through the too many stickies issue, give me a few months. BUT...it is annoying and unsightly. I, like many pass over the stickies and don't read them. But that's half the page. Unstick them, and let the currents drive those threads where they may.

Paul Pless
10-15-2013, 10:07 AM
My two cents? Way too many stickies. I'm not going to CRY, exactly. With time, love, and tenderness, I will pull through the too many stickies issue, give me a few months. BUT...it is annoying and unsightly. I, like many pass over the stickies and don't read them. But that's half the page. Unstick them, and let the currents drive those threads where they may.
yeah its like really crazy up there in B&R with all the stickies, have you even stopped to count them???

Easytiger Models
10-15-2013, 10:11 AM
Saaaaaaaaayyyy...they are ALL GONE! Except for one about some thing in Vietnam. Now I need to start a new thread complaining about how all the stickies have gone!