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Nanoose
09-22-2012, 08:44 PM
Iceland turns it's economy around AND convicts the bankers!

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/09/21/1134915/-Cenk-Iceland-Arresting-Bankers-WORKS-Economy-Growing-Faster-Than-EU-Now

Garret
09-22-2012, 08:54 PM
Nah - that makes too much sense & would be fair.

hanleyclifford
09-22-2012, 08:57 PM
I like it! But it will take some work here; our banksters have actually set themselves up as a fourth branch of government.

hanleyclifford
09-22-2012, 09:55 PM
Hmm...the lefties don't want to talk about this...could it be that their boy is also wrapped up in the problem?

Durnik
09-22-2012, 10:16 PM
Hmm...the lefties don't want to talk about this...could it be that their boy is also wrapped up in the problem?

What, Garret's not a lefty?? He gave the correct answer - none more needed.

ETA: It seems Garret just may be a right (http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?153255-I-m-too-busy-at-the-moment-Try-again-later%21&p=3541259#post3541259)y.. ;-)

ETA yet again ;-): apparently he is 'correct'.. and that is _not_ right.. or something like that.. ;-)

enjoy
bobby

McMike
09-22-2012, 10:27 PM
Hmm...the lefties don't want to talk about this...could it be that their boy is also wrapped up in the problem?

What's there to talk about, "the people" aren't outraged enough, maybe we're just a nation of cowards. Yeah, that's it.

hanleyclifford
09-22-2012, 10:29 PM
What's there to talk about, "the people" aren't outraged enough, maybe we're just a nation of cowards. Yeah, that's it. No, it's about mental complacency
and the fear of change.

Durnik
09-22-2012, 10:41 PM
"fear of change"

"cowards"

Yes.. you agree.

enjoy
bobby

Garret
09-22-2012, 10:41 PM
What, Garret's not a lefty?? He gave the correct answer - none more needed.

ETA: It seems Garret just may be a right (http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?153255-I-m-too-busy-at-the-moment-Try-again-later%21&p=3541259#post3541259)y.. ;-)

enjoy
bobby

Hey - I corrected that!

HC knows I'm more left than right. I also voted for the senator that brought this to light (so I get to take tremendous credit;)). Bernie has been trying to build the outrage on this, but he seems to be the only one who gives a rat's in DC.

I am surprised at the media's lack of interest. I thought this was big news back when it came out.

hanleyclifford
09-22-2012, 10:46 PM
The media don't like the idea of the people finding out just exactly how the bankster thing works.

Durnik
09-22-2012, 10:49 PM
>so I get to take tremendous credit;)

Ah, is that with the bankers? ;-)

& yes to congress doesn't give a rat's a__, they are in bed with those bankers! As for the media.. who 'owns' they? ;-)

enjoy
bobby

McMike
09-22-2012, 10:53 PM
No, it's about mental complacency
and the fear of change.

Or you could just call it laziness and cowardous. Make any excuse you want, I'm not buying it. This country is failing because the people are failing; they let the government and wealthy talk for them, put words in their mouths. We've devolved to a nation of scared peasants willing to believe anything that will deflect blame onto anyone but ourselves . . . And yes, the Republicians are much better at running scared than the rest, but all are guilty.

Garret
09-22-2012, 11:01 PM
>so I get to take tremendous credit;)

Ah, is that with the bankers? ;-)


Trust me, there isn't a banker in the US (or anywhere in the world) that knows who I am. Maybe a teller or two.......:p

Durnik
09-22-2012, 11:06 PM
^ if they ever make it upstairs, you're "in like flynn' ;-)

hanleyclifford
09-22-2012, 11:14 PM
After the crash people might just start looking at Ron Paul/Bernie Sanders in 2016....

McMike
09-22-2012, 11:33 PM
After the crash people might just start looking at Ron Paul/Bernie Sanders in 2016....

What crash you scared sad man? There you go again peddling fear.

skuthorp
09-23-2012, 02:40 AM
Quote McMike: "We've devolved to a nation of scared peasants willing to believe anything that will deflect blame onto anyone but ourselves."

Something I have thought but would not be so presumptuous to post on a US forum. The majority here much the same, as a certain forumite used to say, sheeple. Thanks Mike.

hanleyclifford
09-23-2012, 07:18 AM
What crash you scared sad man? There you go again peddling fear. If you're not afraid, you don't understand what is going on.

WX
09-23-2012, 07:33 AM
Hmm...the lefties don't want to talk about this...could it be that their boy is also wrapped up in the problem?
What a strange comment, it's the Right that would want to protect the bankers. I would be quite happy to see a lot more of them looking out though a set of bars.

Garret
09-23-2012, 07:48 AM
If you're not afraid, you don't understand what is going on.

Was a bumper sticker that was on quite a few cars in VT a few years ago: If you're not afraid, you're not paying attention.

Garret
09-23-2012, 07:50 AM
After the crash people might just start looking at Ron Paul/Bernie Sanders in 2016....

I just can't see that combo (either way). They may share some ideals - but they are just too far apart to be able to come together enough to be on the same ticket. Talk about a schizophrenic campaign! ;)

hanleyclifford
09-23-2012, 07:55 AM
I just can't see that combo (either way). They may share some ideals - but they are just too far apart to be able to come together enough to be on the same ticket. Talk about a schizophrenic campaign! ;) After the crash we are all going to see how that fat cats have played us all with this left/right, liberal/conservative sort of crap. The politicians will get it too if they want to lead the populist rebuilding.

Garret
09-23-2012, 09:29 AM
After the crash we are all going to see how that fat cats have played us all with this left/right, liberal/conservative sort of crap. The politicians will get it too if they want to lead the populist rebuilding.

Not sure I can completely agree with that. Oh, there's no doubt that many play the masses with it, but there are also very real differences in how people think our society should be governed. One of the more obvious ones being the folks who believe business should be allowed to operate unfettered & those who believe that they need to be regulated to control excesses. I purposely did not describe either as left or right, but currently one could say those are views of the right & left.

Of course our issues are more complex than right/left, conservative/liberal. Not only are there other positions, but there are plenty of shadings between them all. Our current system (& I don't just mean the gov't here) promotes right/left, lib/consv, black/white thinking. The sound bite media perpetuates that further & people are largely well trained to see decisions as binary. Gonna have to be a major shakeup to change that inertia!

McMike
09-23-2012, 09:34 AM
If you're not afraid, you don't understand what is going on.

Here's what I do understand:

The economy is cyclical.

The people are the economy but yet they don't understand their collective power.

This "period" we find ourselves in currently is ridiculous there are folks making poo loads of money on its volatility and to your point; they are the ones driving the bus. You are simply buying into their propaganda of impending doom continuing to tow the line, propagating the up and down, allowing them to further work the system. Back to my statement; we are a nation of cowards who hides behind or religion and our guns thinking they make us safe while the powers that be continue to fleece us leaving just enough to keep us warm and content but not enough to have any spare time to look behind the curtain and see that they are keeping the wool for themselves. Maybe it's because they think we aren't smart enough or mature enough or deserving enough . . . maybe they're right.

WE ARE A LAND OF COWARDS if the people who caused this economic crisis are left unchallenged. Everyone I talk to believes the Republican propaganda and blames Obama, they blame social programs, they blame the poor . . . they are wrong.

There is plenty to go around, it doesn't have to be socialism but it MUST be fairer. Profits are and have been allowed to be too high without the American worker seeing any of the gain for themselves when it is them who drives industry, commerce, and the economy at large. That IS the truth. If the average American was keeping pace with the relative growth of income the wealthy have enjoyed over the past 30 years then maybe college would be affordable, maybe healthcare would be affordable, maybe work would be satisfying and freeing instead of confining and soul crushing, leading to addiction, depression, and crime.

Keep making excuses, keep buying into the lie, keep pointing the finger at all the wrong reasons . . . Keep being a part of the problem and not the solution.

Phillip Allen
09-23-2012, 10:23 AM
Hmm...the lefties don't want to talk about this...could it be that their boy is also wrapped up in the problem?

ever notice how common it is for someone to accuse others of what he is guilty of? :)

Phillip Allen
09-23-2012, 10:26 AM
What, Garret's not a lefty?? He gave the correct answer - none more needed.

ETA: It seems Garret just may be a right (http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?153255-I-m-too-busy-at-the-moment-Try-again-later%21&p=3541259#post3541259)y.. ;-)

ETA yet again ;-): apparently he is 'correct'.. and that is _not_ right.. or something like that.. ;-)

enjoy
bobby

that doesn't fit the pattern around here... the 'correct' answer is often repeated in a shill voice and repeated often (unless attention to the thread is not desired)

Gerarddm
09-23-2012, 10:28 AM
Write in Bernie Sanders for president, says I.

One of the faults of the DoJ is in fact failure to go after the big banks. After all those Matt Taiibi articles you'd think somebody in the West Wing would have taken notice.

wardd
09-23-2012, 10:48 AM
ever notice how common it is for someone to accuse others of what he is guilty of? :)

especially from the right

Garret
09-23-2012, 11:06 AM
Hey folks -

I'd posit that this is NOT a right/left issue - though maybe DC wants to make it one. Is there anyone here who is not disgusted with what the banks & Fed have gotten away with? Is so, please explain why you're OK with the status quo - I'd be interested to hear.

IMO, this is one area where everyone could come together & agree on what should happen. Of course there will be differences - but how about trying to find common ground instead of name-calling & searching for areas of disagreement?

John Smith
09-23-2012, 11:15 AM
I NEVER UNDERSTOOD how the problem was bad mortgages, the taxpayers paid the banks the value of the bad mortgages, but the banks still owned the mortgages and homes got foreclosed on by the banks. TARP should have paid off the mortgages and the government should then have owned them and negotiated with the homeowners for lower rates.

THEN the bankers who made the bad decisions, some of which had to be illegal, needed to go to jail. As I recall the problem created by ending Glass/Steagull wasn't that it actually changed the regulations, but screwed up what regulators had authority to regulate what bank.

The only people who go to jail in this country are the poor and middle class. There are very few exceptions.

Phillip Allen
09-23-2012, 11:47 AM
Hey folks -

I'd posit that this is NOT a right/left issue - though maybe DC wants to make it one. Is there anyone here who is not disgusted with what the banks & Fed have gotten away with? Is so, please explain why you're OK with the status quo - I'd be interested to hear.

IMO, this is one area where everyone could come together & agree on what should happen. Of course there will be differences - but how about trying to find common ground instead of name-calling & searching for areas of disagreement?

I suspect getting access to the congressmen's and senators' tax returns might answer a lot of questions in this area

Durnik
09-23-2012, 11:48 AM
Hey folks -

I'd posit that this is NOT a right/left issue - though maybe DC wants to make it one. Is there anyone here who is not disgusted with what the banks & Fed have gotten away with? Is so, please explain why you're OK with the status quo - I'd be interested to hear.

IMO, this is one area where everyone could come together & agree on what should happen. Of course there will be differences - but how about trying to find common ground instead of name-calling & searching for areas of disagreement?

Bingo! The reality is that _people_, not _pols_ , on the right _and_ the left, are disgusted with what is happening. Believe me - I live with pinko commies (the _real deal! ;-)).. as well as redneck righties.. _Both groups are angry. Now, how can we 'hold the pols feet to the fire'? Or, as Garret asks, if you are ok with the situation - truly ok, as in support the bankers, not simply the idea of preventing a collapse - why?

enjoy
bobby

Garret
09-23-2012, 11:49 AM
I suspect getting access to the congressmen's and senators' tax returns might answer a lot of questions in this area

Both VT Senators & our lone Congressman release their returns.

John Smith
09-23-2012, 11:51 AM
Both VT Senators & our lone Congressman release their returns.

It's my impression releasing multiple years of tax returns is standard procedure.

Phillip Allen
09-23-2012, 11:56 AM
Both VT Senators & our lone Congressman release their returns.

I don't believe such things are common...

Phillip Allen
09-23-2012, 11:57 AM
Both VT Senators & our lone Congressman release their returns.

are you aware that insider trading by congress and the senate are legal?

Phillip Allen
09-23-2012, 12:03 PM
here's an article on the subject

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/bill-to-ban-insider-trading-in-congress-is-suddenly-popular/2011/11/30/gIQAn193DO_story.html

Garret
09-23-2012, 12:04 PM
are you aware that insider trading by congress and the senate are legal?

It's my understanding that it has been ended. http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/23/us/politics/insider-trading-ban-for-lawmakers-clears-congress.html

Gerarddm
09-23-2012, 12:07 PM
are you aware that insider trading by congress and the senate are legal?

Indeed so, and a plague on Congress. And they wonder why they have single digit approval ratings.

Phillip Allen
09-23-2012, 12:10 PM
Indeed so, and a plague on Congress. And they wonder why they have single digit approval ratings.

I believe that Tip O'Niel made quite a bit on the military stuff his state got shunted from other states in the name of cutting down on military spending... I mention this to point out how long this has been the norm

hanleyclifford
09-23-2012, 12:16 PM
Once again we get sidetracked on a side issue.

Phillip Allen
09-23-2012, 12:38 PM
Once again we get sidetracked on a side issue.

it was not my intention to distract but rather to tie the web together... we have the foxes guarding our hen house

skuthorp
09-23-2012, 12:43 PM
it was not my intention to distract but rather to tie the web together... we have the foxes guarding our hen house
Not much 'guarding' going on, more like raiding.
Banking here is much more regulated but not without it's faults. Only our regulations prevented our banks going down the same sh*t hole as yours.

Garret
09-23-2012, 12:43 PM
we have the foxes guarding our hen house

True 'dat.

hanleyclifford
09-23-2012, 12:50 PM
Not much 'guarding' going on, more like raiding.
Banking here is much more regulated but not without it's faults. Only our regulations prevented our banks going down the same sh*t hole as yours. Do you mean to suggest that your country has popular control over central, banking?