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View Full Version : The battle for Aleppo



hanleyclifford
07-27-2012, 09:28 PM
...is about to begin. This could get really ugly.

Phillip Allen
07-27-2012, 09:29 PM
I only know a little about it... wat's up?

hanleyclifford
07-27-2012, 09:30 PM
http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=7416398n&tag=showDoorFlexGridRight;flexGridModule The story

ccmanuals
07-27-2012, 09:37 PM
This is going to get very ugly. Refugees are fleeing into Turkey and the rebels are digging in.

hanleyclifford
07-27-2012, 09:38 PM
Now here we have a test case for the wardd hypothesis which would have us believe that an armed citizenry has no chance against the federal government. Butter up the popcorn, and let's see what happens.

Phillip Allen
07-27-2012, 09:41 PM
sorry... I looked at Aleppo and read Arpaio

wardd
07-27-2012, 09:42 PM
Now here we have a test case for the wardd hypothesis which would have us believe that an armed citizenry has no chance against the federal government. Butter up the popcorn, and let's see what happens.

i dare say they are better equipped than the average gun nut in this country

how many machine guns and rpg's do you have?

ccmanuals
07-27-2012, 09:44 PM
Now here we have a test case for the wardd hypothesis which would have us believe that an armed citizenry has no chance against the federal government. Butter up the popcorn, and let's see what happens.

That was already proven in Libya but there are too many factors involved to over simplify this into people vs. gov't.

purri
07-27-2012, 09:44 PM
The Turks may be a bit nonplussed which side to take as there are a few Kurds around the area.

hanleyclifford
07-27-2012, 09:45 PM
i dare say they are better equipped than the average gun nut in this country

how many machine guns and rpg's do you have? They're equipped about the same as the Aurora whacko.

wardd
07-27-2012, 09:45 PM
the outcome of this war will depend on the loyalty of assad's military and defections to the rebel side and the support the rebels get from outside

Phillip Allen
07-27-2012, 09:45 PM
i dare say they are better equipped than the average gun nut in this country

how many machine guns and rpg's do you have?

backing down already?

wardd
07-27-2012, 09:45 PM
They're equipped about the same as the Aurora whacko.

even you must know better than that

Phillip Allen
07-27-2012, 09:46 PM
They're equipped about the same as the Aurora whacko.

without the bullet proof stuff

Phillip Allen
07-27-2012, 09:48 PM
even you must know better than that

I don't know if they have RPG's or not... but if they do, I think I know how they got them :)

hanleyclifford
07-27-2012, 09:51 PM
the outcome of this war will depend on the loyalty of assad's military and defections to the rebel side and the support the rebels get from outside But this specific battle is about to be joined and that is the subject here. BTW, wardd, if you are a combat veteran you know that it isn't the automatic character of the weapons that makes the difference. In fact, I used to order my men to stay on semi except the machinegunners.

Phillip Allen
07-27-2012, 09:53 PM
But this specific battle is about to be joined and that is the subject here. BTW, wardd, if you are a combat veteran you know that it isn't the automatic character of the weapons that makes the difference. In fact, I used to order my men to stay on semi except the machinegunners.

I was a sailor but long ago I figured that a 20 round mag on full auto is really a 7 shooter... one shot at the target and two over his head for each shot

wardd
07-27-2012, 09:53 PM
But this specific battle is about to be joined and that is the subject here. BTW, wardd, if you are a combat veteran you know that it isn't the automatic character of the weapons that makes the difference. In fact, I used to order my men to stay on semi except the machinegunners.

did you ever think to leave the machine guns behind or your grenade launchers?

and how about artillery support?

Phillip Allen
07-27-2012, 09:55 PM
did you ever think to leave the machine guns behind or your grenade launchers?

and how about artillery support?


making them all machineguns. wardd you say the craziest things. In fact, it’s almost all you ever say

Phillip Allen
07-27-2012, 09:56 PM
did you ever think to leave the machine guns behind or your grenade launchers?

and how about artillery support?

do the rebels have artillary support?

hanleyclifford
07-27-2012, 09:58 PM
Good stuff on the Google: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/middle-east-live/2012/jul/27/syria-us-fears-aleppo-massacre-live?newsfeed=true Wardd, I always want my machine guns on patrol and the grenade launchers. Artillery support is ok on offense but IMO useless for defense.

Phillip Allen
07-27-2012, 10:02 PM
it occurs to me that if the rebels whip the dickens out of the feds with nothing but pocket pistols, wardd will simply deny it and believe himself... one of the things you can't fix

wardd
07-27-2012, 10:08 PM
do the rebels have artillary support?



In a matter of months, Syria's rebels have transformed themselves from ragtag village defense forces into an armed movement capable of attacking the country's two largest cities, Aleppo and Damascus. They have also punctured the image of invincibility projected by Syrian army tanks and armored personnel carriers, as proven by the twisted wreckage of armored vehicles that now litter some roads.But the fighters still find themselves vastly out-gunned when facing government air power.And yet, even that advantage may be shrinking.

Fighters proudly opened garage doors to reveal trucks mounted with an enormous 120 millimeter mortar and a anti-aircraft gun.The weapons have seen action."I've fired this gun about 2,000 times," said Jamal Awar, a bus driver-turned-rebel. He said that, during his mandatory military service, he specialized in firing the seated, double-barreled, anti-aircraft gun. Awar said that expertise helped him shoot down a helicopter during a battle in the nearby town of Azaz several weeks ago.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/26/world/meast/syria-weapons/index.html

hanleyclifford
07-27-2012, 10:15 PM
it occurs to me that if the rebels whip the dickens out of the feds with nothing but pocket pistols, wardd will simply deny it and believe himself... one of the things you can't fix Alright, I think we all have our theories on this; now we just sit tight and see if the rebels really do have the big stuff and if they are able to bring it to bear.

wardd
07-27-2012, 10:17 PM
Alright, I think we all have our theories on this; now we just sit tight and see if the rebels really do have the big stuff and if they are able to bring it to bear.

i didn't say they have the big stuff, just that they were more heavily equipped than you have let on

hanleyclifford
07-27-2012, 10:19 PM
i didn't say they have the big stuff, just that they were more heavily equipped than you have let on OK, fair enough. Now we have to wait and see how it develops.

PeterSibley
07-27-2012, 10:19 PM
I don't know if they have RPG's or not... but if they do, I think I know how they got them :)

Anything is for sale if you have the dollar or euroes

PeterSibley
07-27-2012, 10:21 PM
There is the fact that Assad is a member of a 10% faction, a smallish Shia sect while the 80% majority are Sunni.

Edit:: you can't type in s h i t e into this forum software !! We have Sunni software!

hanleyclifford
07-27-2012, 10:22 PM
Anything is for sale if you have the dollar or euroes With a Russian presence in the country the stuff is bound to be everywhere.

wardd
07-27-2012, 10:22 PM
if they aquit themselves well they gain credibility for future outside support

Glen Longino
07-27-2012, 10:24 PM
I only know a little about it... wat's up?

Anybody want an instant profile of Phillip Allen?
Scroll down the page and watch Phillip go from "don't know my arse from a hole in the ground" to nine(9) posts of know-it-all BS!:DLMAO:D
Hey, I ain't making this up!:D

Phillip Allen
07-27-2012, 10:24 PM
if they aquit themselves well they gain credibility for future outside support

gracious, he IS backing off

hanleyclifford
07-27-2012, 10:26 PM
if they aquit themselves well they gain credibility for future outside support It worked for the 300 Spartans!

Glen Longino
07-27-2012, 10:27 PM
Make that ten(10) posts of "wat's up" BS!:DLMAO

hanleyclifford
07-27-2012, 10:27 PM
Anybody want an instant profile of Phillip Allen?
Scroll down the page and watch Phillip go from "don't know my arse from a hole in the ground" to nine(9) posts of know-it-all BS!:DLMAO:D
Hey, I ain't making this up!:D Glen, isn't it a little past your leash time?

Glen Longino
07-27-2012, 10:30 PM
r
Glen, isn't it a little past your leash time?

Nope!
And if you try to leash me I'll bite your hand off, then your cojones, then I'll eat all your progeny!:D:D

hanleyclifford
07-27-2012, 10:33 PM
r

Nope!
And if you try to leash me I'll bite your hand off, then your cojones, then I'll eat all your progeny!:D:D Silly me; it must be the time zone difference.

wardd
07-27-2012, 10:33 PM
gracious, he IS backing off

what are you babbling on about?

Glen Longino
07-27-2012, 10:42 PM
Silly me; it must be the time zone difference.

Of course, that must be it!:DLMAO

hanleyclifford
07-27-2012, 10:46 PM
Of course, that must be it!:DLMAO Glen, I'll bet there is still time for you to get into Aleppo. Get the feds laughing and then do your thing.

Glen Longino
07-27-2012, 11:02 PM
[QUOTE=hanleyclifford;3484445]Glen, I'll bet there is still time for you to get into Aleppo. Get the feds laughing and then do your thing.[/QUOTE

You go first.
I got your back!:D

purri
07-28-2012, 12:48 AM
The rebels have been brewing up quite a few light and medium tanks of late. Sorta a "blackhawk down" scenario.

Good news videos online.

BrianW
07-28-2012, 01:06 AM
the outcome of this war will depend on the loyalty of assad's military and defections to the rebel side and the support the rebels get from outside

Which is exactly how it would go down in the USA.

Glen Longino
07-28-2012, 01:10 AM
Which is exactly how it would go down in the USA.

What?
Is that you, Tylerdurden?
Good lord!

WX
07-28-2012, 01:49 AM
What's going down in Syria is not in my opinion something to make jokes about. AS for US citizens taking on the government, do you really want to unleash a civil war and all it entails?

PeterSibley
07-28-2012, 02:05 AM
There would be nothing left, desolation.

purri
07-28-2012, 02:58 AM
Well Calipornia would secede fo' sho'.

What's going down in Syria is not in my opinion something to make jokes about. AS for US citizens taking on the government, do you really want to unleash a civil war and all it entails?

LeeG
07-28-2012, 08:20 AM
Which is exactly how it would go down in the USA.

Ok, the National Guard will be your enemy, and,and the Coast Guard will still rescue boaters and intercede dope runners, and,and your neighbors who support the Guard and gov't will be your enemy so you'll have to kill them and, and

LeeG
07-28-2012, 08:25 AM
What's going down in Syria is not in my opinion something to make jokes about. AS for US citizens taking on the government, do you really want to unleash a civil war and all it entails?

"butter up the popcorn and see what happens"- Hanleyclifford

Apparently it's entertainment and opportunity to score 2nd Amendment talking points.

hanleyclifford
07-28-2012, 08:31 AM
Run out of money and run out of petrol? Could defeat the feds before the rebels do it.http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503543_162-57481626-503543/u.s-officials-assad-regime-running-low-on-money/?tag=cbsnewsMainColumnArea

LeeG
07-28-2012, 08:45 AM
Rebels and Feds, you're talking about Syria or writing a script?

hanleyclifford
07-28-2012, 09:01 AM
"butter up the popcorn and see what happens"- Hanleyclifford

Apparently it's entertainment and opportunity to score 2nd Amendment talking points. Yes, indeed. This situation puts the lefties into a conundrum. Instinctively and ideologically they want the rebels to prevail against the conservative, oppressive bogeyman but they cannot stand the notion that an armed citizenry had anything to do with securing their freedom. Eat your popcorn, Lee.

Chris Woodward
07-28-2012, 09:47 AM
Now here we have a test case for the wardd hypothesis which would have us believe that an armed citizenry has no chance against the federal government. Butter up the popcorn, and let's see what happens.


A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State...


We must, indeed, all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately. Attributed to Richard Penn
They have a common cause and purpose. Here, we go it alone, ever the rugged individualist. We don't much like each other, or trust each other enough to die for one another.

hanleyclifford
07-28-2012, 11:05 AM
This report suggests the rebels are using very light weapons and homemade bombs and actually pushing the government troops back a little. http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162-57481343/u.n.-showdown-in-aleppo-imminent/?tag=cbsnewsMainColumnArea

Phillip Allen
07-28-2012, 11:20 AM
What's going down in Syria is not in my opinion something to make jokes about. AS for US citizens taking on the government, do you really want to unleash a civil war and all it entails?

of course not... not any more than I want to need an eprib or even a life vest

Phillip Allen
07-28-2012, 11:21 AM
Well Calipornia would secede fo' sho'.

the already have. did you know that if you drive to California that you must pass a border check point?

Gerarddm
07-28-2012, 11:35 AM
Kinda surprised the opposition hasn't used any Stingers or similar.

They need a couple of mechanized Syrian Army units to defect ​en masse.

Canoeyawl
07-28-2012, 11:36 AM
the already have. did you know that if you drive to California that you must pass a border check point?

Only if you are a friggin vegetable...

Phillip Allen
07-28-2012, 11:38 AM
Attributed to Richard Penn
They have a common cause and purpose. Here, we go it alone, ever the rugged individualist. We don't much like each other, or trust each other enough to die for one another.

that depends on whether they are perceived to occupy the same vertual fox-hole as we do

Phillip Allen
07-28-2012, 11:41 AM
Only if you are a friggin vegetable...

the check point exixts... it takes one phone call to change the watermellon to a gun or a ..........typewriter

Canoeyawl
07-28-2012, 11:44 AM
The check point exists in every state Phillip.
There are laws about transporting all kinds of things, and permits required. You don't get out much I guess.

hanleyclifford
07-28-2012, 11:48 AM
The check point exists in every state Phillip.
There are laws about transporting all kinds of things, and permits required. You don't get out much I guess. Baloney, I've never seen one here in Massachusetts (except during the New Hampshire liquor border scuffle). I do get out some.

wardd
07-28-2012, 11:55 AM
What's going down in Syria is not in my opinion something to make jokes about. AS for US citizens taking on the government, do you really want to unleash a civil war and all it entails?

a civil war means you have the backing of at least a good fraction of the population

if any pea ant group thinks they could take on the gov they'd have every finger for miles pointing them out

mao wasn't completely wrong about everything

Canoeyawl
07-28-2012, 12:22 PM
I've never seen one here in Massachusetts (except during the New Hampshire liquor border scuffle).

Imagine that, Must have been that "phone call" that Phillip spoke of.

wardd
07-28-2012, 12:28 PM
Imagine that, Must have been that "phone call" that Phillip spoke of.

phill speaks of a lot of stuff

BrianW
07-28-2012, 01:37 PM
a civil war means you have the backing of at least a good fraction of the population

if any pea ant group thinks they could take on the gov they'd have every finger for miles pointing them out

mao wasn't completely wrong about everything

So... it's never happened before, or elsewhere, because Mao had it right.

Okay.

wardd
07-28-2012, 01:42 PM
So... it's never happened before, or elsewhere, because Mao had it right.

Okay.

has it happened here lately, oh say since 1860?

how did the last one turn out?

BrianW
07-28-2012, 01:47 PM
So it has happened.

Screw Mao.

WX
07-28-2012, 06:13 PM
Okay so you have your revolution and overthrow the government...then what happens?
Just curious.

McMike
07-28-2012, 07:04 PM
The differences between Syrian and the US Military are light-years apart. You have failed in your comparison before the outcome has been decided.

BrianW
07-28-2012, 07:23 PM
Okay so you have your revolution and overthrow the government...then what happens?
Just curious.

I'm not looking for a revolution.

Do you have a quote from someone who is?

What's interesting, is some folks saying it can't be done, yet it has been done before, and is being done right now.

Phillip Allen
07-28-2012, 08:00 PM
I'm not looking for a revolution.

Do you have a quote from someone who is?

What's interesting, is some folks saying it can't be done, yet it has been done before, and is being done right now.


LALALALALALALA... 'they' kaint HEAR you!

hanleyclifford
07-29-2012, 02:13 PM
It is possible that the rebel attempt to hold the city against a strong counterattack could be premature, a tactical error; only time will tell.http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162-57481887/syrian-troops-shell-aleppo-neighborhoods/?tag=cbsnewsLeadStoriesAreaMain

PeterSibley
07-29-2012, 06:08 PM
I'm not looking for a revolution.

Do you have a quote from someone who is?

What's interesting, is some folks saying it can't be done, yet it has been done before, and is being done right now.

Confusing !

hanleyclifford
07-29-2012, 08:42 PM
A confusing picture after Sunday action. http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/07/29/us-syria-crisis-idUSBRE8610SH20120729

PeterSibley
07-30-2012, 07:17 AM
It looks as if the "guns will make you free crowd" are going to see what happens when the army takes on civilians .:(

hanleyclifford
07-30-2012, 07:51 AM
It looks as if the "guns will make you free crowd" are going to see what happens when the army takes on civilians .:( It doesn't always go the way we want it to the first time around (we lost at Bunker Hill) but an armed citizenry has a better chance of freeing itself from the tyrant's yoke than one that is not. I wish the best for the rebels of Syria, but their future has to be in their hands.

Canoeyawl
07-30-2012, 09:53 AM
I wish the best for the rebels of Syria, but their future has to be in their hands.

And why is this different than Israel?

wardd
07-30-2012, 11:41 AM
It doesn't always go the way we want it to the first time around (we lost at Bunker Hill) but an armed citizenry has a better chance of freeing itself from the tyrant's yoke than one that is not. I wish the best for the rebels of Syria, but their future has to be in their hands.

in case you haven't noticed it's a different world than it was then

even then we could not have won without the help of france, the rebels in syria will win if they do because of support from without

show me any self styled militia group in this country that could prove more than an annoyance and be soon rounded up?

hanleyclifford
07-30-2012, 01:16 PM
in case you haven't noticed it's a different world than it was then

even then we could not have won without the help of france, the rebels in syria will win if they do because of support from without

show me any self styled militia group in this country that could prove more than an annoyance and be soon rounded up? History is a process, wardd, not an event. We lost the Boston Massacre. We lost on Lexington Green. We lost at Bunker Hill. But if we had not begun the process, do you think France would have come along and "given" us independence? Sometimes events are not recognized as significant until well after the fact. How many times did French dragoons slaughter the Juaristas? But would the US following the Civil War have made the noises necessary if the Mexicans had not begun the process?

Phillip Allen
07-30-2012, 02:16 PM
History is a process, wardd, not an event. We lost the Boston Massacre. We lost on Lexington Green. We lost at Bunker Hill. But if we had not begun the process, do you think France would have come along and "given" us independence? Sometimes events are not recognized as significant until well after the fact. How many times did French dragoons slaughter the Juaristas? But would the US following the Civil War have made the noises necessary if the Mexicans had not begun the process?

the yankees lost the first battle of the Civil war... does wardd think that should have been the end of it?

wardd
07-30-2012, 02:22 PM
all i'm saying is a bunch of idiots with guns are not going to start a successful civil war in this country

they will just wind up strapped to a table

you guys have read the turner diaries too many times

Kaa
07-30-2012, 02:24 PM
Wardd thinks the population is powerless against a government.

Sounds to me like an excellent reason to keep government small and not too cocky... :-D

Kaa

Phillip Allen
07-30-2012, 02:27 PM
wardd cannot be educated on this... he has everything invested in the idea of an all powerful and benign government

wardd
07-30-2012, 02:27 PM
Wardd thinks the population is powerless against a government.

Sounds to me like an excellent reason to keep government small and not too cocky... :-D

Kaa

no kaa, we can vote

that is until the republicans take that away

wardd
07-30-2012, 02:29 PM
name the last civil uprising that succeeded

the whiskey rebellion, the civil war, ruby ridge, karesh?

Kaa
07-30-2012, 02:32 PM
no kaa, we can vote

that is until the republicans take that away

No what?

And once the evil evil republicans revert back to their true alien lizard shapes and take away your right to vote, whatcha gonna do? :-D

Kaa

Phillip Allen
07-30-2012, 02:32 PM
neither ruby ridge nor karesh were civil uprisings... I'll have to check of the whisky thing seeing as how 'rebellion' is nothing more thana word of convience

Kaa
07-30-2012, 02:33 PM
name the last civil uprising that succeeded

You never heard of Eastern Europe, I take it?

But if you want the *last* one, I guess that would be Libya.

Kaa

wardd
07-30-2012, 02:37 PM
neither ruby ridge nor karesh were civil uprisings... I'll have to check of the whisky thing seeing as how 'rebellion' is nothing more thana word of convience

they were fomented by the type of idiot that thinks that once the rebellion is started it will be joined by all the whitepower lunatics

what was timothy mcveighs motive?

you should check out sites that if this is possible are more to the idiot right than you are

Phillip Allen
07-30-2012, 03:25 PM
they were fomented by the type of idiot that thinks that once the rebellion is started it will be joined by all the whitepower lunatics

what was timothy mcveighs motive?

you should check out sites that if this is possible are more to the idiot right than you are

wardd, you don't impress me as being very smart...

hokiefan
07-30-2012, 03:25 PM
Baloney, I've never seen one here in Massachusetts (except during the New Hampshire liquor border scuffle). I do get out some.

There is one on I-95 just south of the Georgia/Florida boarder. Checking produce. I would assume they are also on the other interstate entrances to Florida but I haven't checked them out personally.

Cheers,

Bobby

wardd
07-30-2012, 04:37 PM
wardd, you don't impress me as being very smart...

you don't impress me as being very smart if you think you and a bunch of other foolish people can go out in the streets with your guns and bring down the government

you have no idea what an army is how or how it functions or what doctrine is and why it's necessary

LeeG
07-30-2012, 05:46 PM
you don't impress me as being very smart if you think you and a bunch of other foolish people can go out in the streets with your guns and bring down the government

you have no idea what an army is how or how it functions or what doctrine is and why it's necessary

Firearm ownership isn't for bringing down the gov't. They're more of a totem to facilitate reenactment fantasies. "we'll be the rebels and,and..."

wardd
07-30-2012, 06:34 PM
Firearm ownership isn't for bringing down the gov't. They're more of a totem to facilitate reenactment fantasies. "we'll be the rebels and,and..."

you mean like that republican nazi reenactor?

hanleyclifford
07-30-2012, 07:07 PM
If we could take a little rest from our gun rant, here is the latest from Aleppo. http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/07/30/syrian-regime-claims-gains-in-aleppo-rebels-deny/?test=latestnews

LeeG
07-31-2012, 07:20 AM
Something I haven't heard discussed is the military skill jihadists developed fighting in Iraq. Hanley's idealized Syria with "rebels" and "Feds" leaves out AlQaeda like groups improving the "rebels" capabilities. The neocon wet dream of smashing through Iraq on the way to Syria and Iran seems to have put more people on the battlefield than just contracted military.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/jul/30/al-qaida-rebels-battle-syria

SMARTINSEN
07-31-2012, 07:47 AM
it occurs to me that if the rebels whip the dickens out of the feds with nothing but pocket pistols, wardd will simply deny it and believe himself... one of the things you can't fix


If we could take a little rest from our gun rant, here is the latest from Aleppo. http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/07/30/syrian-regime-claims-gains-in-aleppo-rebels-deny/?test=latestnews

That would be nice, though the photo on your link puts the kibosh to Phillip's silly notion. The Saudis, Qatar, (as well as the CIA I am quite sure) are providing materiel support to the rebels.

hanleyclifford
07-31-2012, 07:56 AM
That would be nice, though the photo on your link puts the kibosh to Phillip's silly notion. The Saudis, Qatar, (as well as the CIA I am quite sure) are providing materiel support to the rebels. Unquestionably many players are going to get on board one side or the other.

hanleyclifford
07-31-2012, 08:02 AM
This would seem to support SMARTENSEN's comments above. http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503543_162-57483181-503543/source-assad-could-fund-6-more-months-of-war/?tag=stack