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View Full Version : What does t5he other side offer that you can live with?



BrianY
06-25-2012, 02:43 PM
I've been thinking a lot lately about the possibility that Obama will lose the election, that the country will be ruled by Republicans and what that will mean for me. I have been trying to find something in Republican political views that appeals to me - something that I could say, "Well, although I don't agree with much of what they have to offer, I can at least feel OK with THAT" . I found some of these things when John McCaine ran and when George Bush senior (NOT Junior) was president, but now I really can't think of ANYTHING that the current crop of Republicans have to offer that fits into this category - and I'm no raving lunatic far left commie/socilist dupe. There's a Mitt Romny campaign bus parked around the corner from me and I wanted to hop on board and ask "So, what do you have for me as a non-Mitt supporter?" but the doors were locked.

Social issues? Nope. the Republican Party is pretty much 100% opposed to where I'm at on this stuff

Economic issues? Well, we do agree on the need to develop the economy. The problem is that I don't agree at all with how they propose to do it. What about regulating Wall Street and the big banks? What ever happened to that idea (and no, Democrats, you guys aren't off the hook on that one... )

Foreign policy? What foreign policy?! I guess we agree on the need to contain China...at least I assume that's what the Republicans think about that. May

Fiscal policy? I agree with the need to cut the deficit but not how they want to do it or why they want to do it. I guess we argree
that we need to secure our borders...I can get behind that idea, but I can't get behind some of the ways they propose to do it.

Environmental matters? yuh right, that's a good one....

Energy policy? Nope. There's no vision in the Republican position. Just more of the same.

Overall vision of what America should be? Nope. To me, their America looks a lot like early 19th century England only with a lot more guns and religion. No thanks.

So, I'm left feeling like there's a pretty good chance I'm going to be an alien in my own country...the old "I didn't leave my country. My country left me" bit. Canada's starting to look pretty good these days....

So, a question: Is there anything that appeals - or at least that you can feel reasonably comfortable with - in the other side's policies?

Roger Cumming
06-25-2012, 05:08 PM
The short answer is no.

BrianY
06-25-2012, 07:23 PM
The short answer is no.

And that sums up the problem with American politics quite nicely. We're witnessing the destruction of America into two divided nations-within-a-nation with both sides unwilling or unable to compromise or work together toward a common good that benefits EVERYONE.

Our nation rots from within while the pundits and politicians squabble over the scraps. I've always thought that we get the government that we deserve, that the faults of our elected representatives are OUR faults because we elect them and tolerate if not support their antics. What a sad commentary on the state of the American electorate that we should find ourselves in this stuation again. I guess Abraham Lincoln just delayed the inevitable for a few years.

Keith Wilson
06-25-2012, 07:33 PM
. . . with both sides unwilling or unable to compromise or work together toward a common good that benefits EVERYONE.http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSGXWIxW0jBvVtomrcvWTeB-nvWLsK4PNdjkFifJqMX4prfKERccA Whooooop! Whoooooop!!! False equivalence warning!! http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSGXWIxW0jBvVtomrcvWTeB-nvWLsK4PNdjkFifJqMX4prfKERccA

Only one party has moved significantly over the past 25 years. Look at the positions they actually have taken on policies. The Republicans have gotten more and more extreme, less and less willing to compromise, and more and more hostile to anyone within their ranks who tries to. Republicans who show the slightest tendency to work toward mutually-acceptable solutions lose in the primaries to Tea Party radicals. While neither side is perfect, distributing the blame equally is simply wrong. We do indeed have a problem with extremism and intransigence in American politics, but right now it is not a problem of the left.

Mrleft8
06-25-2012, 08:18 PM
I'm pretty sure that there isn't an "OTHER SIDE" for me....

wardd
06-25-2012, 08:35 PM
i'm just bewildered by those on the other side that aren't wealthy

Peter Malcolm Jardine
06-25-2012, 08:41 PM
The NDP want to raise the minimum wage here to as much as 14 dollars. I can live with that.

BrianY
06-25-2012, 08:53 PM
http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSGXWIxW0jBvVtomrcvWTeB-nvWLsK4PNdjkFifJqMX4prfKERccA Whooooop! Whoooooop!!! False equivalence warning!! http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSGXWIxW0jBvVtomrcvWTeB-nvWLsK4PNdjkFifJqMX4prfKERccA

Only one party has moved significantly over the past 25 years. Look at the positions they actually have taken on polices. The Republicans have gotten more and more extreme, less and less willing to compromise, and more and more hostile to anyone within their ranks who tries to. Republicans who show the slightest tendency to work toward mutually-acceptable solutions lose in the primaries to Tea Party radicals. While neither side is perfect, distributing the blame equally is simply wrong. We do indeed have a problem with extremism and intransigence in American politics, but right now it is not a problem of the left.

I agree, Keith. But I also want to avoid blaming one side for all of the problems and either by omission or implication absolving the other. The fact is - at least as I see it - the Democrats had their chance to make significant changes and they failed. They couldn't agree among themselves on policies and approachs and they squanderd the best chance they've had in many years. The situation is no better now - no unity of purpose or vision. Instead of uniting to fight major batlles for what they believe, they're reduced to squabbling and cat-fighting with the republicans - who ARE organized, united and have a coherent vision and are, consequently much better at this sort of petty hand to hand combat.

The one exception to this was the health care thing, but even then they failed to unite behind a truly revolutionary policy. . The dems failed to convince the public that what they were offering was good for the country and the republicans did a great job of convincing the public that it wasn't/isn't. Lack of unity, lack of ambition, lack of conviction, lack of leadership....What we got was a Ford Escort when we could have and should have had a BMW

If the Republicans are guilty of intransigence and obstructionism ( which I believe they are), the democrats are guilty of a lack of leadership, vision, drive and the ability/drive to sell their idea to the public....which is incredibly ironic since it was exactly that sort of thing that got Obama elected in the first place. In any case, both sides are failing the American public.

Cuyahoga Chuck
06-25-2012, 09:33 PM
If Willard wins it in't gonna be pretty. He has lived a Richie Rich life with very few of the hassles most of us have encountered. So I don't expect any efforts to reconstruct the middle class. The big money people that help him get the White House are going to want stuff in return and the result will be more concentration of wealth by the already wealthy. A jim-dandy reason for civil unrest.

Chip-skiff
06-25-2012, 10:09 PM
Target practice.

Mrleft8
06-26-2012, 04:56 AM
The Republicans offer the best thing going...no Obama.

That's all I need.



rofl!
What did Obama ever do to you?

bobbys
06-26-2012, 03:09 PM
I've been thinking a lot lately about the possibility that Obama will lose the election, that the country will be ruled by Republicans and what that will mean for me. I have been trying to find something in Republican political views that appeals to me - something that I could say, "Well, although I don't agree with much of what they have to offer, I can at least feel OK with THAT" . I found some of these things when John McCaine ran and when George Bush senior (NOT Junior) was president, but now I really can't think of ANYTHING that the current crop of Republicans have to offer that fits into this category - and I'm no raving lunatic far left commie/socilist dupe. There's a Mitt Romny campaign bus parked around the corner from me and I wanted to hop on board and ask "So, what do you have for me as a non-Mitt supporter?" but the doors were locked.

Social issues? Nope. the Republican Party is pretty much 100% opposed to where I'm at on this stuff

Economic issues? Well, we do agree on the need to develop the economy. The problem is that I don't agree at all with how they propose to do it. What about regulating Wall Street and the big banks? What ever happened to that idea (and no, Democrats, you guys aren't off the hook on that one... )

Foreign policy? What foreign policy?! I guess we agree on the need to contain China...at least I assume that's what the Republicans think about that. May

Fiscal policy? I agree with the need to cut the deficit but not how they want to do it or why they want to do it. I guess we argree
that we need to secure our borders...I can get behind that idea, but I can't get behind some of the ways they propose to do it.

Environmental matters? yuh right, that's a good one....

Energy policy? Nope. There's no vision in the Republican position. Just more of the same.

Overall vision of what America should be? Nope. To me, their America looks a lot like early 19th century England only with a lot more guns and religion. No thanks.

So, I'm left feeling like there's a pretty good chance I'm going to be an alien in my own country...the old "I didn't leave my country. My country left me" bit. Canada's starting to look pretty good these days....

So, a question: Is there anything that appeals - or at least that you can feel reasonably comfortable with - in the other side's policies?.

Should not your thread be called...

Heres a list of me beeching about the other side and offering nothing i can live with on the other side but now i want you to tell me what you like about my side?.

How can you Hypocritical on your first post?, That in its self is a real talent.

Nicholas Scheuer
06-26-2012, 03:12 PM
Nothing. Hey, Liberals can can play this game, too, eh?

BrianY
06-26-2012, 11:39 PM
.

Should not your thread be called...

Heres a list of me beeching about the other side and offering nothing i can live with on the other side but now i want you to tell me what you like about my side?.

How can you Hypocritical on your first post?, That in its self is a real talent.

As usual, your rabid dog bias has interfered with your reading comprehension skills. I DID NOT ask "you to tell me what you like about my side". I asked a general question to EVERYONE regardless of which side they're on if there's anything that the other side is offering that you can live with. Please get your head out of your butt and understand that in this context, the "other side" means liberals, conservatives, democrats AND republicans...whatever side happens to be opposite of your own. In your case, that would probably be the side of sanity and reason, but I leave it to you to figure out what that means.

As a life long Democrat, I used to be able to point to a few areas of agreement with Republicans. I don't think I was alone in this. I am lamenting the fact that there no longer seem to be ANY points of commonality between Democrats and Republicans. I think that this is a real shame. Obviously there are a bunch of folks out there who don't have any problem with it and who are incapable of understanding how damaging to the country this is. I guess you're one of them.

And btw - this isn't my first post as you can plainly see by the counter in the post header. Moron.

Roger Cumming
06-27-2012, 12:10 AM
My short "no" is informed by the Republicans' herd mentality in the Congress. The ACA was modeled on Republican ideas originally to counter the single payer approach. When the Republican Party decided against it all Republicans then opposed it - not a single Republican lawmaker voted for the bill. Other bills which began with Republican support were later opposed by the same Republicans who originally sponsored them, all in the name of party loyalty and fear of the Tea Party and Grover Norquist. How could any Democratic politician take seriously such irrational behavior? How could anything be accomplished? Their attitude is just like Donn's - irrational, blind hatred of Obama. In Donn's case it's a curiosity - unattractive but inconsequential but for a US Congressman it's a tragedy.

Horace
06-27-2012, 12:11 AM
As usual, your rabid dog bias has interfered with your reading comprehension skills..........................Please get your head out of your butt................. In your case, that would probably be the side of sanity and reason, but I leave it to you to figure out what that means.

As a life long Democrat.....................and who are incapable of understanding......................I guess you're one of them.........................Moron.My, my. What a charming and pleasant fellow you are. :)

bobbys
06-27-2012, 12:25 AM
My, my. What a charming and pleasant fellow you are. :).

He was NEVER interested in any dialogue and his reply shows it.

He wanted to come off as some kind of centrist and launched into a speech blasting republicans contradicting his own thread title..

Then had the brass to say he wants to see what someone else thinks of the opposite side never thinking nor caring he gave none

When i called him on it he saw a chance to get a "hot" one and got personal.

He just wanted to blast away.

Well if name calling is a measure of victory he won ..

Strange i have never called anyone as many nasty things since i have been here as he did in one post.

PeterSibley
06-27-2012, 12:34 AM
You could however show you superiority and just say what you could live with from the other side... not so hard .


.

He was NEVER interested in any dialogue and his reply shows it.

He wanted to come off as some kind of centrist and launched into a speech blasting republicans contradicting his own thread title..

Then had the brass to say he wants to see what someone else thinks of the opposite side never thinking nor caring he gave none

When i called him on it he saw a chance to get a "hot" one and got personal.

He just wanted to blast away.

Well if name calling is a measure of victory he won ..

Strange i have never called anyone as many nasty things since i have been here as he did in one post.

bobbys
06-27-2012, 12:55 AM
You could however show you superiority and just say what you could live with from the other side... not so hard ..

Its not so hard to start a thread asking what you can live with on the other side without giving a laundry list of the things your ticked off about on the other side.

But thanks for telling me , I suppose i should know you would never see the OPs hypocrisy.

perhaps the OP will still give us the things he likes on the opposite side..

Or maybe he will just double down on Moron/rabid dawg/head in butt etc

PeterSibley
06-27-2012, 01:01 AM
Bobbys , this is the Bilge.... if I had my hypocrisy glasses on I'd see it everywhere and probably go blind.

Be a good fella and get your knickers untwisted and talk about all the good things shared by Rep and Dem.


.

Its not so hard to start a thread asking what you can live with on the other side without giving a laundry list of the things your ticked off about on the other side.

But thanks for telling me , I suppose i should know you would never see the OPs hypocrisy.

perhaps the OP will still give us the things he likes on the opposite side..

Or maybe he will just double down on Moron/rabid dawg/head in butt etc

BrianY
06-27-2012, 02:16 AM
.

Its not so hard to start a thread asking what you can live with on the other side without giving a laundry list of the things your ticked off about on the other side.


Once again, my point is that there seems to be very little coming from the Republicans these days that I can agree with/feel comfortable with and THAT BOTHERS ME. Jeeezum crow, bobby. In my original post I stated that in the past I was able to find some common ground with the opposition but now I feel that there is very little if any common ground left. Again THAT BOTHERS ME. I listed several areas where I disagree to illustrate my point. I really can't understand why you or anyone else would interpret that as a political attack or being somehow unreasonably partisan. If people can't tolerate someone saying "I disagree with your politics" then they really need to grow up.

If you'd take have a second to stop your reflexive criticism of what you think I am interested in and listen to what I'm saying, you might find that yes, I AM interested in dialog. Let me put the question directly to you: Is there anything in your opposite party's politics or positions that you can accept/find reasonable/tolerable ? Or are you 100% against everything the other side stands for? If so, does that bother you at all? Do you think it's healthy for the country?

It sure as heck bothers me and no, I do not think it's healthy for the country.

Jezus H Christ, you can't even ask a simple question about politics around here any more without getting trashed. If I had said, "I think Mitt Romney and everyone that supports him are total poop heads with inbred mogoloid parents and that my side is perfect in every way", I'd expect and deserve a thorough trashing. All I did is point out the fact that I do not agree, listed a few key areas in particular where I disagree and you chose to post a response that is hostile, based on erroneous assumptions, contains a factual error and that completely fails to address the point.

And you say that I am not interested in dialog ? Pot meet kettle.

BTW- If you're still not convinced, See post #8 in which I criticized the "It's all the Republicans fault" position and also criticized my fellow Democrats. If I was only interested in trashing the Republicans, would I have written that?

Keith Wilson
06-27-2012, 07:53 AM
I would be very pleased if there were things Republicans stand for that I could support. I would be very pleased if I could sometimes vote for a Republican in good conscience. I've done it in the past; of all the folks I've voted for, probably the one with whose performance in office I was most satisfied was a Republican (Arne Carlson, Governor of MN).

However, the Republican party has for twenty years at least been getting more and more extreme, and recently less and less willing to compromise. This is not my opinion, it's a demonstrable fact. If you take the policy positions supported by Republicans, arrange them on any halfway reasonable left-right axis, and look at them over time, you find a steady rightward movement, accelerating lately. The Democrats have done nothing comparable. Now one can think this is a good thing or a bad thing, but it's not possible to honestly deny that it has happened.

We need reasonable conservatives. The left does stupid things too, and probably will again, and they sometimes need to be brought back down to earth. If the Republican party were populated by people like Chris Ross, I might be a Republican. But today's Republican party has started to support extreme, unworkable, and in some cases very, very dangerous ideas.

leikec
06-27-2012, 11:25 AM
I would be very pleased if there were things Republicans stand for that I could support. I would be very pleased if I could sometimes vote for a Republican in good conscience. I've done it in the past; of all the folks I've voted for, probably the one with whose performance in office I was most satisfied was a Republican (Arne Carlson, Governor of MN).

However, the Republican party has for twenty years at least been getting more and more extreme, and recently less and less willing to compromise. This is not my opinion, it's a demonstrable fact. If you take the policy positions supported by Republicans, arrange them on any halfway reasonable left-right axis, and look at them over time, you find a steady rightward movement, accelerating lately. The Democrats have done nothing comparable. Now one can think this is a good thing or a bad thing, but it's not possible to honestly deny that it has happened.

We need reasonable conservatives. The left does stupid things too, and probably will again, and they sometimes need to be brought back down to earth. If the Republican party were populated by people like Chris Ross, I might be a Republican. But today's Republican party has started to support extreme, unworkable, and in some cases very, very dangerous ideas.


The question is whether people like Cris Ross will remain republicans in the future, and if the party even wants them around anymore. I like and respect Cris, but I think the republican party is moving away from him at light speed....

Jeff C

2MeterTroll
06-27-2012, 03:42 PM
not so sure i have a side. But yes there are somethings i could live with; maybe not like, but live with. Fewer and fewer in any party are concerned with the issues i am even in the Green party; and of those who have a clue they all simply talk and sit in there thumbs; Except when trying to pat themselves on the back.

seems that all the parties are only concerned with lip service and none will actually do anything; bunch of toxic scumbags every one.

Rum_Pirate
06-27-2012, 03:50 PM
about the possibility that Obama will lose the election,

I suspect and am led to believe that you are not allowed to post such unsubstantiated rubbish on this forum.

I'm sure that a supporter(s) will be along shortly to crucify you*.








*Then again maybe that is reserved for me.:cool: