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Shang
06-21-2012, 09:34 AM
Romney's 1/3 ownership of the dancing horse gave rise to a $77,000.00 Tax Deduction.
Mitt’s deduction is about two and a half times the annual median wage in the U.S.: $26,364,
http://i1131.photobucket.com/albums/m551/keepemhonest2/RomneyTaxDedonDancingHorse.jpg

Gerarddm
06-21-2012, 10:03 AM
Can't blame them for taking a legal deduction. The fault is in the system itself.

BTW, does Mitt feel pain? I did not know that.

Durnik
06-21-2012, 11:08 AM
Can't blame them for taking a legal deduction. The fault is in the system itself....

This is one of those 'facts' that needs some 'splainin.. The 'system' was set up by people like Romney to work in their favor, to the dis-advantage of the common worker.

Legal is not necessarily Right.

I expound on this point as it is all too easy to forget that the foxes are guarding the hen house.

enjoy
bobby

Kaa
06-21-2012, 11:17 AM
Romney's 1/3 ownership of the dancing horse gave rise to a $77,000.00 Tax Deduction.

So, um, he lost money. I don't see your point -- do you want to disallow losses as tax deductions?

Or are you simply trying to whip up some class warfare demagoguery?

Kaa

ccmanuals
06-21-2012, 11:48 AM
Jon Stewart,

"How in the world do you, Mitt Romney, justify making more in one day than the median American family makes in a year -- while paying the same tax rate as the guy who scans shoes at the airport?"

Stewart also brought up a related point: that in 2007, Romney's Bain Capital was one of the companies who lobbied against a bill that would have made private equity owners pay a 35% tax rate (instead of %15, which is still higher than what Romney pays now). And yet, on the campaign trail, Romney has called the 47% of americans who pay no income tax because they are underemployed or otherwise disabled, "unfair."

"Poor people have sh*tty lobbyists," Stewart lamented.

Shang
06-21-2012, 11:57 AM
So, um, he lost money. I don't see your point -- do you want to disallow losses as tax deductions?

Or are you simply trying to whip up some class warfare demagoguery?

Kaa

Perhaps you haven't heard, Kaa, economic times are tough for a huge number of people. Mr. Romney wears Mom jeans and a blue work shirt, and contends that he understands the problems of the poor, and that he will solve the situation when he is elected (although he won't say how until after the election).
Somehow it is difficult to believe Mitt's perspective when he piddles money on a dancing horsey and elevators for his cars in his several mansions.

Durnik
06-21-2012, 11:59 AM
So, um, he lost money. I don't see your point -- do you want to disallow losses as tax deductions?

Or are you simply trying to whip up some class warfare demagoguery?

Kaa

Lord, no! We don't want any "class warfare demagoguery"! The wealthy have a Gawd Given Right (enshrined right there in The Constitution) to create a governing/tax structure which benefits themselves to the exclusion of the common person!

No Siree (or Mamee, as the case may be..), we be good ni__as & work some more for masta & missus - who must struggle with the horrible stress of finding suitable & sufficient deductions for more wealth (taken from workers) then they'll ever need!

enjoy
bobby

Kaa
06-21-2012, 12:02 PM
Perhaps you haven't heard, Kaa, economic times are tough for a huge number of people. Mr. Romney wears Mom jeans and a blue work shirt, and contends that he understands the problems of the poor, and that he will solve the situation when he is elected (although he won't say how until after the election).

So what else is new -- he's a politician. You don't expect your politicians to be honest and straightforward -- do you? Americans don't elect those.

Kaa

bobbys
06-21-2012, 12:04 PM
So, um, he lost money. I don't see your point -- do you want to disallow losses as tax deductions?

Or are you simply trying to whip up some class warfare demagoguery?

Kaa.

Their going after the Richie Rich angle..

This is after the going after Sarah because she did not have enough money.

Get it?

Kaa
06-21-2012, 12:11 PM
Lord, no! We don't want any "class warfare demagoguery"! The wealthy have a Gawd Given Right (enshrined right there in The Constitution) to create a governing/tax structure which benefits themselves to the exclusion of the common person!

No Siree (or Mamee, as the case may be..), we be good ni__as & work some more for masta & missus - who must struggle with the horrible stress of finding suitable & sufficient deductions for more wealth (taken from workers) then they'll ever need!

enjoy
bobby

I seem to recall historically successul attempts to strip the rich of their ill-acquired wealth and distribute it to common people. A real workers paradise it was! Worked out very well :-D

Kaa

Cuyahoga Chuck
06-21-2012, 12:13 PM
BTW, does Mitt feel pain? .

Well, you can buy a lot of remediation from pain when you have as much as $250 million salted away in overseas accounts.
But it should be remembered that Willard is a penny-ante piker when you compare his wealth to those that send him $10 million checks from their petty cash accounts.

ccmanuals
06-21-2012, 12:14 PM
.

Their going after the Richie Rich angle..

This is after the going after Sarah because she did not have enough money.

Get it?


Sarah, really? Bobby's...... life just hasn't been the same for you since that fateful day when she winked at you through the tube. :)

Cuyahoga Chuck
06-21-2012, 12:18 PM
I seem to recall historically successul attempts to strip the rich of their ill-acquired wealth and distribute it to common people. A real workers paradise it was! Worked out very well :-D

Kaa

We really don't know what you can recall or why you are so vague. With some specifics we can test the veracity of what you think you can recall. Have no fear. Your keyboard won't go up in smoke if you blow us a much more detailed epistle.

Kevin T
06-21-2012, 12:20 PM
Were doomed when one half of the electorate asks for a little balance.

And the other half, who really are part of the 99%, automatically equates that balance with erecting onion domes in DC:rolleyes:

Kaa
06-21-2012, 12:28 PM
Were doomed when one half of the electorate asks for a little balance.

And the other half, who really are part of the 99%, automatically equates that balance with erecting onion domes in DC:rolleyes:

Onion domes came up in response to #7 :-)

And about half US households do not pay any income taxes (as in, have no federal tax liability even if they fill out their 1040s). Is that the half which wants "a little balance"?

Kaa

Cuyahoga Chuck
06-21-2012, 12:33 PM
So, um, he lost money. I don't see your point -- do you want to disallow losses as tax deductions?

Or are you simply trying to whip up some class warfare demagoguery?

Kaa

I don't know what a "dancing horse' does that merits a deduction but I do know the wealthy have access to tax lawyers that are very inventive and produce contrived enterprises just to get a tax break.

Kaa
06-21-2012, 12:40 PM
I don't know what a "dancing horse' does that merits a deduction but I do know the wealthy have access to tax lawyers that are very inventive and produce contrived enterprises just to get a tax break.

Surely you do -- it's right there in the picture of the tax document -- the word "LOSS". A dancing horse loses Mitt Romney money :-D

The solution to tax lawyers and contrived enterprises is to have a simple tax system. Any of the politicians you prefer ever did anything serious to simplify the tax code?

Kaa

Cuyahoga Chuck
06-21-2012, 12:41 PM
Onion domes came up in response to #7 :-)

And about half US households do not pay any income taxes (as in, have no federal tax liability even if they fill out their 1040s). Is that the half which wants "a little balance"?

Kaa

I don't know for certain what they want. It might be three meals a day and a roof to huddle under.
Of course we could utilize the method common in the old Ottoman Empire. The tax collector went from hovel to hovel with a group of skilled torturers to make certain everyone payed. Those that payed to avoid torture might then die of starvation but that was of no concern of the sultan.

ccmanuals
06-21-2012, 12:41 PM
Onion domes came up in response to #7 :-)

And about half US households do not pay any income taxes (as in, have no federal tax liability even if they fill out their 1040s). Is that the half which wants "a little balance"?

Kaa

Yep, those people living in poverty and seniors living on SS need to get off their asses and pull themselves up by their boot straps. Freeloaders, all of them.

Cuyahoga Chuck
06-21-2012, 12:48 PM
Surely you do -- it's right there in the picture of the tax document -- the word "LOSS". A dancing horse loses Mitt Romney money :-D

The solution to tax lawyers and contrived enterprises is to have a simple tax system. Any of the politicians you prefer ever did anything serious to simplify the tax code?

Kaa

If I go to Google and punch in "dancing horse" I want something more pictorial than word "loss".

Get serious. Right now if the Democrats proposed life everlasting for everyone the Republicans would vote against it.

Kaa
06-21-2012, 12:54 PM
If I go to Google and punch in "dancing horse" I want something more pictorial than word "loss".

I am sure you'll get it :-) Go ahead, try it :-D

Kaa

wardd
06-21-2012, 12:55 PM
how do you lose money on a pet?

Kaa
06-21-2012, 12:56 PM
I don't know for certain what they want. It might be three meals a day and a roof to huddle under.

Half the households in the United States.

Are you really going to tell me that half the households in the US lack three meals a day and a roof to huddle under?

Kaa

wardd
06-21-2012, 01:07 PM
Joseph Stiglitz: The Rich Have Become Experts At Advancing Their Cause



Joseph Stiglitz says the rich have got America right where they want it.




The Nobel Prize-winning economist writes in Salon that the super-rich have never been better at advancing their cause -- that being the obtainment of a larger slice of the pie.




“What is different today," he writes, "is that the 1 percent now has more knowledge about how to shape preferences and beliefs in ways that enable the wealthy to better advance their cause, and more tools and more resources to do so."




He has two friends in Jacob Hacker and Paul Pierson, two political scientists that argue in their book “Winner-Take-All Politics" that corporate America and the wealthy people that run it have twisted Washington to their advantage since the late 1970s. You know, Citizens United, etc. Stiglitz also argues that the richest Americans have successfully obscured how much inequality has truly risen, citing a study that found most people think the wealthiest fifth of society holds 60 percent of the nation’s wealth, when that percentage lies closer to something around 85 percent.




Yet there's evidence that income inequality has actually become something of a mainstream issue in recent years. A January survey by the Pew Research Center, for example, found that more than half the country saw signs of "strong conflicts" between the rich and poor. The percentage had risen 50 percent from just a few years prior.




What's certain is that America's rich have been the biggest beneficiaries of the U.S. economy since the 1970s, with the nation's richest one percent watching their incomes rise an average of 275 percent between 1979 and 2007 -- gains that significantly outperform any other income bracket.




Look at CEO pay rates for a specific example of this process. Even as the wages of everyday workers fell 2 percent last year, CEO pay grew by 15 percent, The Guardian reports.




http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/18/joseph-stiglitz-the-rich-_n_1606116.html

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/18/joseph-stiglitz-the-rich-_n_1606116.html

MiddleAgesMan
06-21-2012, 01:17 PM
Romney's 1/3 ownership of the dancing horse gave rise to a $77,000.00 Tax Deduction.
Mitt’s deduction is about two and a half times the annual median wage in the U.S.: $26,364,
http://i1131.photobucket.com/albums/m551/keepemhonest2/RomneyTaxDedonDancingHorse.jpg

I won't comment on the substance of your post Mr. Shang but I will have to call you out on the title, Vote for Mitt, he feels your pain.

How can you justify this suggestion/command?

I had you pegged as a moderate liberal-leaning academic, now I just don't know what to think.... ;)




























Touche!

MiddleAgesMan
06-21-2012, 01:21 PM
.... are you simply trying to whip up some class warfare demagoguery?

Kaa

Pure, unadulterated (and smelly) Kaa Kaa.

Kaa
06-21-2012, 02:13 PM
Pure, unadulterated (and smelly) Kaa Kaa.

I prefer to be pure and unadulterated :-P

Smelly -- I don't know, have you seen Donn's post? What does Shang's post smell like to you? :-D

Kaa

Gerarddm
06-21-2012, 05:04 PM
This is one of those 'facts' that needs some 'splainin.. The 'system' was set up by people like Romney to work in their favor, to the dis-advantage of the common worker.

Legal is not necessarily Right.

I expound on this point as it is all too easy to forget that the foxes are guarding the hen house.




Indeed.

Durnik
06-21-2012, 05:06 PM
Onion domes came up in response to #7 :-)

And about half US households do not pay any income taxes (as in, have no federal tax liability even if they fill out their 1040s). Is that the half which wants "a little balance"?

Kaa

Essentially, admitting that half of U.S. households have inadequate income to incur a tax debt is the same as admitting the system is biased to keeping half of its citizens at or below the poverty level. Just to put this in some sort of perspective, the 'poverty level' is the (minimum) amount of income needed to simply survive. Are there actually people who are all right with this?

Now, from experience, I can tell you that it is hard work to survive when you know not where your daily bread is coming from.. Much harder than, say, Mitt & Ann suffering over onerous tax forms.. when _all_ of their wealth is from others..

Also from experience I can say that driving thru the rural south one can see many homes with campers in the back yards. Campers with lights on at night.. Torn tarps (attempting to) cover leaks.. people in The Wealthiest Country In The World (proud, are ya?) just trying to find shelter.

Mitt feels their pain.. in a pigs eye, he does..

And everything you may believe you 'know', both pro & con, about successful (or no) 'workers paradises' was filtered thru an indoctrinational system which was designed to produce one line of thought.. That may be worth keeping in, well, mind.


This, BTW,


The solution to tax lawyers and contrived enterprises is to have a simple tax system.

might well fall under the category of 'a belief' - esp if by 'simple', you mean 'flat'. As I know not your meaning, I leave it hanging.

enjoy
bobby

Shang
06-21-2012, 08:09 PM
I won't comment on the substance of your post Mr. Shang but I will have to call you out on the title, Vote for Mitt, he feels your pain.

How can you justify this suggestion/command?

I had you pegged as a moderate liberal-leaning academic, now I just don't know what to think.... ;)




























Touche!

Well played, MiddleAgesMan! You caught the sarcasm exactly.

Mister Kaa doesn't seem to grasp the plight of more than half of our citizens who will live under the poverty level at some time during their lives...

...while the two percent or so of multimillionaires squat on their rumps and "create jobs."

How can any intelligent person vote Republican?

ccmanuals
06-21-2012, 08:11 PM
Approximately 15% of Americans are below the poverty line.

That's so impersonal. Let's just say 46.2 million people.

Durnik
06-21-2012, 09:03 PM
That's so impersonal. Let's just say 46.2 million people.

That's all?? _Only_ 46,200,000 people?? Just (roughly) the combined populations of Michigan, Georgia, North Carolina, New Jersey & Virginia.. Well, the heck with them. Let them starve - Mitt needs a new horsey!

Damn, feels weird channeling a conservative.. ;-)

enjoy
bobby

Shang
06-21-2012, 09:16 PM
That's all?? _Only_ 46,200,000 people?? Just (roughly) the combined populations of Michigan, Georgia, North Carolina, New Jersey & Virginia.. Well, the heck with them. Let them starve - Mitt needs a new horsey!

Damn, feels weird channeling a conservative.. ;-)

enjoy
bobby

Not at all, bobby, you're do'ning fine.

Durnik
06-21-2012, 09:46 PM
^ Please note that none of what follows Shang's post loses any significance based or not on Shang's statement. But, hey, conservatives will avoid an issue any way they can, eh? To satisfy your carnal cravings, yes, Mitt's deduction for his play horsey was less than Shang originally posted.. but the facts of ridiculous taxation still exist.. Mitt still has waaaay too much of other peoples money.. & waaay too many people (in The Wealthiest Nation In The World) are still dirt poor & struggling to simply stay alive.

BTW, 46,200,000 is also (roughly) the combined populations of

Wyoming, Vermont, N. Dakota, Alaska (Yah, Sarah! Go bobbys! ;-)), S. Dakota, Delaware, Montana, Rhode Island, New Hampshire, Maine, Hawaii, Idaho, Nebraska, West Virginia, New Mexico, Nevada, Utah, Kansas, Arkansas, Mississippi, Iowa, Connecticut, Oklahoma & Oregon (Hey bobbys, you're right up there with Sarah! ;-)) - as of July 2011..

But hey, let's not quibble about a few poor losers.. This is getting easier, Shang. I's a gettin' nervous.. Think I might go 'hole hog & just stop thinking..





Ooo,






Ok, I'm back - that was weird! Let's not do _that_ again! ;-)

enjoy
bobby

ChaseKenyon
06-21-2012, 09:58 PM
Go bobby!!!!!!!

I have so much to do that I have had to limit myself to no more than 1.5 serious thread rebuts per day averaged by month.

Keith Wilson
06-21-2012, 10:01 PM
Or are you simply trying to whip up some class warfare demagoguery?Oh, yes. the way things are going, we could use some more good old-fashioned class warfare. "Class warfare" is what they call it when the rest of us try to defend ourselves.

http://assets.motherjones.com/politics/2011/inequality-p25_averagehouseholdincom.png



http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2011/09/04/opinion/04reich-graphic/04reich-graphic-popup.jpg

hokiefan
06-21-2012, 10:11 PM
I'm certain Shang did not intend to mislead with this post, but the fact is, the Romneys were only able to deduct $50 from this year's taxable income.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v54/donnwest/misc/2012-06-21_140044.jpg

The rest will carry over to future returns, if, and only if, they are able to make some income on the horse.

I'm no Mitt Romney fan, but has anyone read this post by Donn? Mitt may have gotten a 70K deduction at one point on the form. But only $50 was allowable at the end. I'm thinking no one read it myself.

Cheers,

Bobby

Durnik
06-21-2012, 10:25 PM
Damn, Keith, those charts are scary.. & so many people just don't get it. To (mis) quote Jon Stewart, the Koch Bros have good propaganda people - the best our money can buy! ;-)

enjoy
bobby

Durnik
06-21-2012, 10:30 PM
I'm no Mitt Romney fan, but has anyone read this post by Donn? Mitt may have gotten a 70K deduction at one point on the form. But only $50 was allowable at the end. I'm thinking no one read it myself.

Cheers,

Bobby


I suspect we read it, Bobby - I know I did. Still, see this post (http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?149425-Vote-for-Mitt-he-feels-your-pain&p=3449785#post3449785) for my comment..

thanks for bringing it up, tho.

enjoy
bobby (lower case.. ;-))

hokiefan
06-21-2012, 10:38 PM
I suspect we read it, Bobby - I know I did. Still, see this post (http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?149425-Vote-for-Mitt-he-feels-your-pain&p=3449785#post3449785) for my comment..

thanks for bringing it up, tho.

enjoy
bobby (lower case.. ;-))

I have no problem with frying Mitt, its just more effective with facts. :D

Cheers,

Bobby

Keith Wilson
06-21-2012, 10:46 PM
I have no problem with frying Mitt, its just more effective with facts.Indeed. $21,700,000 income in 2010, 13.9% total federal tax rate. Check your next paycheck and see how much tax you're paying. Include all federal taxes.

Durnik
06-21-2012, 10:48 PM
I have no problem with frying Mitt, its just more effective with facts. :D

I agree! I'm also more concerned with 'frying' the conservative attack machine, of which Mitt is just a Lt.. & Cheney was a Major.. Ok, Mitt might have made Captain.. but he's no where near as evil as Darth Cheney! ;-)

enjoy
bobby

Durnik
06-21-2012, 10:57 PM
Indeed. $21,700,000 income in 2010, 13.9% total federal tax rate. Check your next paycheck and see how much tax you're paying. Include all federal taxes.

One way to look at it is he paid $3,000,000 in taxes.. A perhaps more realistic way to look at it is he had $18,700,000 to spend..

Hmmm.. he really _is_ in touch with the average American.. who has (& worked for) a median income of $41,000...

sarcasm tags apply.. ;-)

enjoy
bobby

ETA: that's 41k _before_ taxes.. but let's not worry 'bout the poor..

Keith Wilson
06-22-2012, 07:51 AM
And about half US households do not pay any income taxes (as in, have no federal tax liability even if they fill out their 1040s).The first part is true. The second part is certainly not. Social Security tax and Medicare tax is withheld from all wages, (capped at just over $100K). This regressive tax is very significant for most people, but is nothing at all to the very rich. The total rate is 15.3%, greater than Mr. Romney pays on his entire $20-plus million of income It's as large a share of federal revenue as income tax.


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/fa/Share_of_Federal_Revenue_from_Different_Tax_Source s_%28Individual%2C_Payroll%2C_and_Corporate%29_195 0_-_2010.gif


Source (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Insurance_Contributions_Act_tax).

Todd D
06-22-2012, 09:16 AM
Hey, don't forget that Mitt is a job creator. Just consider the jobs he will create when he installs a horse elevator in the horse barn :D

Kaa
06-22-2012, 10:12 AM
Essentially, admitting that half of U.S. households have inadequate income to incur a tax debt is the same as admitting the system is biased to keeping half of its citizens at or below the poverty level.

ROFL... There is a minimum taxable income, make anything below that and you don't pay any taxes. Let's imagine that this minimum got raised. Less people will pay any taxes. By your logic, this would push more people into poverty :-D


Just to put this in some sort of perspective, the 'poverty level' is the (minimum) amount of income needed to simply survive.

No, it's not.

First, because if it were true people under the poverty level would not survive and they obviously do.

Second, because I have lived under the poverty level and, to your discomfort, I'm still alive.

Third, because the poverty statistics generally do NOT include federal and state assistance.

Fourth, because all of this ignores the gray economy which is flourishing among the poor.

Kaa

Kaa
06-22-2012, 10:14 AM
Oh, yes. the way things are going, we could use some more good old-fashioned class warfare.

Really?

Kaa

Kaa
06-22-2012, 10:16 AM
Indeed. $21,700,000 income in 2010, 13.9% total federal tax rate. Check your next paycheck and see how much tax you're paying. Include all federal taxes.

Why, Keith, if you want to tax capital gains at the same rate as straight income, just say so out loud. No need to be shy.

Any guess as to what the economic consequences will be? :-D

Kaa

Durnik
06-22-2012, 10:45 AM
http://forum.woodenboat.com/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Durnik http://forum.woodenboat.com/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?p=3449481#post3449481)

Essentially, admitting that half of U.S. households have inadequate income to incur a tax debt is the same as admitting the system is biased to keeping half of its citizens at or below the poverty level.


ROFL... There is a minimum taxable income, make anything below that and you don't pay any taxes. Let's imagine that this minimum got raised. Less people will pay any taxes. By your logic, this would push more people into poverty :-D

Incorrect - as Keith pointed out, all workers pay the highly regressive FICA on even their meager income. But happy I am to have made you fall to the floor in glee.. ;-)




http://forum.woodenboat.com/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Durnik http://forum.woodenboat.com/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?p=3449481#post3449481)
Just to put this in some sort of perspective, the 'poverty level' is the (minimum) amount of income needed to simply survive.

No, it's not.

First, because if it were true people under the poverty level would not survive and they obviously do.

Second, because I have lived under the poverty level and, to your discomfort, I'm still alive.

Third, because the poverty statistics generally do NOT include federal and state assistance.

Fourth, because all of this ignores the gray economy which is flourishing among the poor.

Kaa

First, simply surviving is not an answer. One could be locked in a room, 'feed' by I.V. & 'survive'. One could be enslaved to work 16 hours a day with minimal meals and no recreation or entertainment & 'survive'. Survival is _not_ an adequate answer.

Second, I have lived most of my life _far_ below the poverty level, & to your discomfort, am both alive & aware of the injustice to many. ;-)

Third, the fact that so much assistance is necessary in The Wealthiest Nation In The World is a very powerful indicator that Something Is Very Wrong.. NTM, conservatives of all stripes are fighting tooth_and_nail to remove the afore mentioned assistance.. Just sayin'.. ;-)

Fourth, the grey economy exists as a way for the poor to attempt to have _some_, however minimal, life worth living. Again, its existence further points to an overall problem.

enjoy - your fantasies of benevolence & wealth
bobby

bobbys
06-22-2012, 11:03 AM
Sarah, really? Bobby's...... life just hasn't been the same for you since that fateful day when she winked at you through the tube. :).

Well yes that is true.:d

bobbys
06-22-2012, 11:06 AM
Nor does Marco Rubio have enough. He nearly had a foreclosure, dontcha know. For a candidate to be a good President, he has to be exactly like me...lest he be "out of touch"..

Somehow i can never get the "right" amount of money one should have if one is a Conservative.

To much your a Richie rich.

Not enough your a Trailer park NASCAR redneck.

bobbys
06-22-2012, 11:08 AM
I won't comment on the substance of your post Mr. Shang but I will have to call you out on the title, Vote for Mitt, he feels your pain.

How can you justify this suggestion/command?

I had you pegged as a moderate liberal-leaning academic, now I just don't know what to think.... ;)




























Touche!.

Uncanny how a liberal can make a Character Judgment from a Tax return.

I better go easy on the Deprecation if ST Peter is going to review my returns.

bobbys
06-22-2012, 11:09 AM
I'm certain Shang did not intend to mislead with this post, but the fact is, the Romneys were only able to deduct $50 from this year's taxable income.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v54/donnwest/misc/2012-06-21_140044.jpg

The rest will carry over to future returns, if, and only if, they are able to make some income on the horse..

Perhaps Shang will post his returns so i can see if he feels anyone's Pain

Shang
06-22-2012, 11:18 AM
Please notice Shang completely ignores the fact his opening post is a outright lie, and not a single fact-checking liberal hypocrite calls him on it.

Anything for attention, eh Shang?

Oh?
Well, what if I re-titled the thread to something more appropriate?
How about:
Mitt says, "Let them eat cake*!"

(*In the original version of this post I didn't say "cake."
I named a certain horsey byproduct...
...but I looked over my shoulder and saw Scot writing names on his clipboard...)

Shang
06-22-2012, 11:26 AM
.

Perhaps Shang will post his returns so i can see if he feels anyone's Pain

Pain is relative, but on a percentage basis I pay half again more than does Mitt.

Kaa
06-22-2012, 11:29 AM
The post would remain an outright lie.

Everything is allowed in advancing the holy goal of saving the American people from the monster that is Mitt Romney!

No tactic is too low to counter the malignant influence of these untermenschen:


How can any intelligent person vote Republican?

Kaa

Shang
06-22-2012, 11:34 AM
Everything is allowed in advancing the holy goal of saving the American people from the monster that is Mitt Romney!

No tactic is too low to counter the malignant influence of these untermenschen:

Kaa

Come toward the light, Kaa, you're catching on! Come toward the light!

Kaa
06-22-2012, 11:35 AM
Come toward the light, Kaa, you're catching on! Come toward the light!

It burns! IT BURNSSSSSS!!!

:-D

Kaa

Cuyahoga Chuck
06-22-2012, 11:51 AM
Everything is allowed in advancing the holy goal of saving the American people from the monster that is Mitt Romney!

No tactic is too low to counter the malignant influence of these untermenschen:



Kaa

How dramatic! Try this.
What we MUST be saved from is dominance from the oligarchy and the oligachs are IN LOVE with Willard M. They were also IN LOVE with George W. But even tho' that stretch turned out badly the oligarchs want to go to the same place again because they profited while Rome burned.
Be advised your salvation rests on whether you follow your brains or follow your guts. If the upper 20% increase their holdings beyond the 83% of national wealth they now hold there may be trouble.

switters
06-22-2012, 11:57 AM
Mom jeans?

Basically we shouldn't vote for Mitt because he has a dancing horse and wears mom jeans. How about wanting to get rid of a few environmental regulations, or banking regulations, or the fact that he will continue on with the same craptacular foreign policy of Bush and Obama? Cant we just not vote for him because of those reasons?

Shang
06-22-2012, 12:07 PM
It burns! IT BURNSSSSSS!!!

:-D

Kaa

LOL!

ccmanuals
06-22-2012, 02:21 PM
Durnik used a percentage, so I used a percentage to correct his erroneous claim. You want raw numbers, tell Durnik.

Testy today. :)

Keith Wilson
06-22-2012, 06:06 PM
Why, Keith, if you want to tax capital gains at the same rate as straight income, just say so out loud. No need to be shy.That's not what I said, although one can make a reasonable argument in favor of it. That would be a subject for another thread.

However, Mr Romney, who AFAIK did not work a single paid hour last year and has over $20,000,000 in income, pays a lower percentage in federal taxes than almost everyone who gets a paycheck. He paid 13.9%. Even if one pays no income tax, FICA is 15.8%.

I think we already are in a class war whether we want it or not, although a great deal of effort has gone into obscuring the fact. Any guesses as to who's winning?


http://www.cbpp.org/images/cms//6-25-10inc-f1.jpg

John Smith
06-22-2012, 06:08 PM
Can't blame them for taking a legal deduction. The fault is in the system itself.

BTW, does Mitt feel pain? I did not know that.

He pays some illegals to feel your pain for him

The fray over this horse thing is not that he took a legal business deduction, but that he lied as to the purpose of the horse: it was said to be medical to help the wife with her MS.

John Smith
06-22-2012, 06:21 PM
I seem to recall historically successul attempts to strip the rich of their ill-acquired wealth and distribute it to common people. A real workers paradise it was! Worked out very well :-D

Kaa

This is the problem: the extremities of thought. Tax rates on the upper incomes are at historical lows, and we, the nation who put men on the moon, now have to hitch a ride with the Russians (or rather pay for it) to get a man to the space station. While Republicans are blocking any tax increases and funding is getting cut so teachers et al are losing their jobs, and we can't fund infrastructure repair, causing brownouts all over NYC yesterday, I wonder if we could have built our infrastructure with today's tax rates.

Romny likes to fire people. He's said so. I'm sure there are times when firing someone is necessary, but I can't imagine "liking" doing so.

We keep hearing, "A rising tide lifts all boats." For our economy to work,we must view the middle class as the tide. Spending money in the pockets of the middle class means masses of customers for all businesses, and the money trickles up through the free market.

How many businesses could function today without running water, electricity, roads and highways, dredged harbors/airports and those other parts of the physical infrastructure. Then there's the patent laws and the enforcement mechanisms provided by the government to protect the ideas that people build businesses from. Similarly, copyrights and name registration.

Every business dealing in this country, individual or organization/business is a contract, and everyone entering a contract depends on that contract being honored and it is the government they turn to when they feel it has not been honored.

A quality government, one that makes for a nation who puts men on the moon, is like quality in every other walk of life: we must be prepared to pay more for higher quality. If we keep cutting taxes and services, it hurts all aspects of business and our economy. Those 500,000 fewer public employees we have now amount to half a million fewer customers for private businesses.

Romney view success through the eyes of a successful career of a guy who plays with other people's money. He has, apparently, little or no concern about those who lose their job and fall into the safety net. He's said he's not concerned with them.

John Smith
06-22-2012, 06:28 PM
Were doomed when one half of the electorate asks for a little balance.

And the other half, who really are part of the 99%, automatically equates that balance with erecting onion domes in DC:rolleyes:

We are doomed, but that's due to a lot of planed disemmination of misinformation. One poster asked me a month ago what tax rates I would suggest. I responded I'd look at the rates in affect at the times this country was at its best and use those rates. Near as I can recall, he did not respond.

I believe the upper rates were 70% when we put the man on the moon. When Eisenhower built the interstates, they were 90%.

To my mind, an honest person would look around and admit today's tax rates don't work. An honest man would also take cognizance that we've been outsourcing jobs for decades; long before NAFTA. If a nation outsources jobs for 50 years, it ought not be a surprise to not have many jobs left.

It would also be interesting to see what the actual impact on the economy increases in the minimum wage as had. Think I'll see if I can find something about that now.

2MeterTroll
06-22-2012, 06:31 PM
JS I dont understand arguing or explaining politics to Kaa, He has no stake in the race or results, doesn't live in the US and basically poopoos anything he has not himself said.
Personally he's a waste of time like Several others here providing sometimes a lead for other places to explore.

John Smith
06-22-2012, 06:45 PM
We are doomed, but that's due to a lot of planed disemmination of misinformation. One poster asked me a month ago what tax rates I would suggest. I responded I'd look at the rates in affect at the times this country was at its best and use those rates. Near as I can recall, he did not respond.

I believe the upper rates were 70% when we put the man on the moon. When Eisenhower built the interstates, they were 90%.

To my mind, an honest person would look around and admit today's tax rates don't work. An honest man would also take cognizance that we've been outsourcing jobs for decades; long before NAFTA. If a nation outsources jobs for 50 years, it ought not be a surprise to not have many jobs left.

It would also be interesting to see what the actual impact on the economy increases in the minimum wage as had. Think I'll see if I can find something about that now.

This seems to be the best analysis of raising the minimum wage. Reading this and several others, I come to the opinion it works if all employers raise the wages they pay. It does cost them more in wages, which is deductible, but it saves them money in other ways and if everyone in the community gets a pay raise, every business gets more customers.

Durnik
06-22-2012, 07:49 PM
Durnik used a percentage, so I used a percentage to correct his erroneous claim. You want raw numbers, tell Durnik.

Hmm, your reading seems.. selective. I was replying to this post ..


http://forum.woodenboat.com/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Kaa http://forum.woodenboat.com/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?p=3449277#post3449277)

Onion domes came up in response to #7 :-)

And about half US households do not pay any income taxes (as in, have no federal tax liability even if they fill out their 1040s). Is that the half which wants "a little balance"?

Kaa



where Kaa used the "about half US households do not pay any income taxes" - which I admittedly carried over to 'below poverty level'. The number was incorrect for 'at or below poverty', but try to keep the _complete_ story straight. An "if, then supposition" != "a claim"..

The cumulative state totals, however, _were_ a statement.

enjoy
bobby

wardd
06-23-2012, 12:25 AM
I await your learned reply, John Smith.

why not a multi million yacht, one of them would help with a lot of things i have

ccmanuals
06-23-2012, 08:10 AM
My two dachshunds are very therapeutic to me. Guess I can now claim them as a medical deduction.

wardd
06-23-2012, 08:15 AM
My two dachshunds are very therapeutic to me. Guess I can now claim them as a medical deduction.

do you lose money on them?

ccmanuals
06-23-2012, 08:26 AM
do you lose money on them?

your kidding right? the vet bills and special food I have to buy are brutal. :)

wardd
06-23-2012, 09:00 AM
your kidding right? the vet bills and special food I have to buy are brutal. :)

what i figured