Trailerable Downeast Style Powerboats

[South Shore Boatworks]

I am currently working with a Maine boatbuilder in developing a 25'x8'6" lobster style boat with inboard power and a draft of 2'6". The construction will be either strip or coldmolded. I welcome any input on this idea. I am also looking for a patient customer for the first boat to be built.

[N. Scheuer]

I enjoyed studying Lobster boats and Yachts up colse for the first time last summer. I am kkeenly interested in the factors which seperate those that kick up a large wake from those which make hardy any wake, at any speed. Of course displacement/length and distribution of that make a difference.

Watching them manuever with just the big single wheel is very interesting.

If I had a Lobster yacht, I'd like to keep the exhaust stack forward of the windscreen, with the muffler fixed horizontal on the roof, just to keep the boat from looking too "highly finished". Gayle would probably want me to figure out a way to insulate the stack as it passes through the cuddy, like maybe a square wooden sheath with Shaker pegs all'round.

I'd keep the after deck open and use multiple folding chairs instead of built-in benches.

How'bout using the trap hauling wheel as an anchor winch?

Moby Nick

[RonW]

I have the plans for glen-l's eagle, a 22 x 8 lobster boat that I am going to stretch to 24 feet. I plan on putting a 90 horse 25 inch shaft four stroke honda on the transom. Going to build in traditional strip planked. Going to layout frames this winter and get rolling in the spring. So what do you want to talk about? Check out the eagle here.
http://www.glen-l.com/designs/workboat/eagle.html

[SteveFaehnle]

Look at Arch Davis' 26 foot "Jack Tar".

[South Shore Boatworks]

Although the "Jack Tar" has a good following, It is not legally trailerable without special permits. The beam exceeds 8'6". The boat that I am developing will be trailerable. If you are a boater in Southern New England, you notice the lack of slip and mooring availability, as well as the high costs. There are some excellent launching ramps. This is why I am moving forward with the concept of a legally trailerable downeast style boat with inboard power.

[Captain Pre-Capsize]

SSB:

As a new member to the forum you may not be aware that our host frowns on business transactions from company to customer. It isn't something that bothers me but there is a line that can be crossed that is inappropriate. You may not yet have crossed it but be careful. If you DO cross it you could forever be sent from the Wooden Boat Forum over to the Fiberglass Forum and none of us want that! ;)

[Tonyr]

About wakes on this type of boat, when you are going less than displacement speed - I believe it is partly a function of speed, and partly one of whether the run ends with an immersed transom or not.

Like Ron, I am building the Glen-L Eagle, stretched to 24 ft. The hull is now finished outside, and will be turned over in the spring when I have enough structure inside to make that a safe action.

I have raised the run the last four feet by 2.5", and have also flattened it (i.e. the transom is practically flat, no deadrise). I am using white cedar, and building it light where-ever I can. Between the alterations I have made, the light wood, and the extra buoyancy with the extra length, I expect the transom to just kiss the water at rest. That should result in good fuel efficiency and very small wake at five knots or so, but still give me the ability to semi-plane at between 10 and 15 knots when I put the power on. The wake at these speeds will probably be more than with the flat run as designed by Glen-L, but I am more interested in slow speed efficiency and low wake, than in high speed performance. I also expect the boat to have a more nose-up attitude at speed than with the original design.

Given that it will be mid summer before I can reasonably hope to launch (unfinished, of course, but the grandchildren are coming, and they have expectations!), I can't yet prove that my ideas are sensible, but I will certainly get an adequate boat out of the building effort. My priorities are low wake at low speed, and fuel efficiency. Different priorities would lead to different decisions.

Tony.

[RonW]

Hey TonyR. I have been wondering how your progress has been.I spent 2004 playing with the 18 foot boat I built in 2003. But am going to get started on a stretched version of the eagle in 2005, if nothing stupid happens.

So give us a report. What size strips did you go with?
What glue did you use between the strips?
What nails did you use to fasten the strips together with?
Did you leave the strips square, and bevel as needed going around the chime? Or did you cove and bead the strips?
How much time did you have in actually stripping the hull? Do you like the method?

Sounds like you are wanting more of the old time launch rather then a planning hull, kinda like the richard pulsifer lobster boats.
http://www.pulsiferhampton.com/

[Tonyr]

Ron, I have placed a series of annotated photos of the project so far on www.imagestation.com/album/?id=2133480086. (http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=2133480086.)

I think most of your questions will be answered there. And, yes, I am indeed building more of a launch, than anything else, if in the shape of a lobster boat. Our local water is semi-sheltered, if pretty extensive, and we don't like speed, wash and noise, being ex-sailboaters.

Tony.

[ 12-25-2004, 09:10 PM: Message edited by: Tonyr ]

[Figment]

Originally posted by South Shore Boatworks:
If you are a boater in Southern New England, you notice the lack of slip and mooring availability, as well as the high costs. There are some excellent launching ramps. This is why I am moving forward with the concept of a legally trailerable downeast style boat with inboard power.I am a boater in southern new england. I do notice the high costs of mooring/dockage. However, I think you may be overreaching.

A 25'x8.5' boat, particularly inboard powered, is simply too cumbersome to ramp-launch every time you want to use it. True, Bayliner and Sea Ray and others of that ilk sell lots of 25'ers on trailers to people who don't know better, but I notice that the owners will tolerate this for only about a year or maybe two before biting the bullet and getting slip at a marina. (or, the boat sits in the driveway except for 4th of july and labor day weekends).

Your target market probably doesn't fall into the category of "people who don't know any better".

I think that the threshold of reasonable trailerability is probably somewhere around 22', all-up weight 4000lb.... roughly the size of the above-referenced Glen-L Eagle.

[RonW]

I think Figment hit the nail on the head, and just about right on as to the tolerable length and weight of a so called trailerable boat.I see people all the time-more then one would think- pulling big 26 & 28 foot glass boats with big diesel trucks, and they labor trying to get it in and out at the ramps. In fact they actually have to pick and choose their ramps to have turning room.On the other end of the scale at
www.nexusmarine.com (http://www.nexusmarine.com)
They took a trailerable lobsterboat and lenghtened it to 29ft. and put a outboard in a well. Pretty neat idea and would probably make a nice boat on the water, But getting it there and back may be one royal pain, so it sits, except on holidays.

http://www.nexusmarine.com/images/29%27Salty/Salty%2029B_colored_700.gif

[South Shore Boatworks]

Guys. Thanks for your input. Having trailered large boats in the past, I know that there can be difficulties as you have described. I will think it over.

[bainbridgeisland]

Originally posted by Figment:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by South Shore Boatworks:
[qb]...I think that the threshold of reasonable trailerability is probably somewhere around 22', all-up weight 4000lb.... roughly the size of the above-referenced Glen-L Eagle.I think you are pretty close. However, if you can hold the weight down, added length makes getting the boat on and off a trailer easier. The boat performs better too.

Well designed and built timber powerboats can be built to about 27' long, 7.5' wide and 3,000 lightship displacement. Performance would be outstanding. Launching such a boat would be easier than a 22' boat of the same displacement. The total length of the trailer and boat would still be reasonable too.

I guess I am trying to say the weight is more important than the length for easy tralering.

[N. Scheuer]

If a 25-ft X 8.5-ft boat is too cumbersome to launch at a ramp, the problem must be with that particular boat, or it's designer.

A Bolger Blackbird (discussed on a nearby thread, with 50-hp outboard power shoild be emminently trailerable.

My 28-ft Shearwater Yawl, also a Bolger design, built by Edey & Duff, is a snap to launch and retrieve, singlehanded, if necessary (done it many times).

The secret is weight, or lack thereof. The boat displaces about 2700-lbs, yet has 1000-lbs of lead ballast in her utterly flat bottom. On her trailer the rig weighs a bit less than 4000-lbs.

My V-8 Silverado can tow it with ease to an water in or around the Continental US from Illinois.

So what is the Shearwater's secret? Airex PVC-foam-core construction, which does not have a lot of bell and whistles included in the package which add undue weight.

Yes, inboard power is usually heavier. So do without inboard power!

Moby Nick

[Phil Joseph]

Re: Lobster style boats,
Just for comparison, you might check out the trailable 28 foot boat built by Mike Kiefer, of Great Lakes Boatbuilding Company, last year. I have been on the boat and it is a beauty. Simple and capable. I don't think Mike will build another one, but he has an extremely practical sense of what works. Many pictures on his web site. (Greatwoodboats.com)

[RonW]

Trailerable.
I was wondering what everyone thought as to what size is still pleasant enough to be considered trailerable. The 29 footer that I posted above is only 3200lbs. In comparison, looking at a fiberglass bayliner at 27 ft. x 8ft.6in. beam, it weighs in at 6,000 lbs. almost twice the weight. Plus these big glass boats all seem to have extremely high sides and a tendency to be top heavy, making for a more awkward situation.
It looks like this is another situation where wood boats have a big advantage over heavier glass boats. So you can push the length a little as long as the weight is reasonable.

[Figment]

I think that "trailerable" is a rather loose term. In my mind, there are three general categories of trailerability.

#1: "trailerable" means that they can winter the boat in their driveway or backyard and save on some offseason costs. For these folks, it's ok to spend an entire morning engaged in the launch or recovery evolution.

#2: "trailerable" means that, though the boat is generally moored afloat within a half hour of home, they can hitch the vessel to the Metallic Pea Green Family Truckster and bring it to whatever vacation destination has been drawn from the hat that year. For these folks, it's ok to spend an hour or two to complete the launch or recovery evolution.

#3: "trailerable" means that every time they want to use the boat (at least once a week, weather permitting, right?) they hitch it up and head to the ramp. For these folks, the launch and recovery evolution (from the time they arrive at the ramp lot to the time they are actually afloat with a drink in hand, or vice-versa) can't take any more than 20 minutes, or it's just taking up too much of the afternoon.

I speak as a former category 3 trailerboater who owned a boat that needed 40 minutes to setup for launch. It wears on you.

[Figment]

The reason I guessed at the 22' length limit is that when you get longer than that, your launch window becomes restricted by tide. This is particularly true with a powerboat, which generally balances with the wheels quite far aft.
If you get too long, you can run out of ramp before she floats, and a lot of ramps (around here, anyway) have a big ol' trailer-eating dropoff at the end.

An inboard powered boat would by necessity sit higher on the trailer and require even more ramp to float.