This deserves liberal condemnation.

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  • P.I. Stazzer-Newt
    obnoxiously persistent.
    • Jan 2005
    • 26027

    This deserves liberal condemnation.

    The Home Office are invertebrate house trainers of ministers.

    The government will be able to monitor the calls, emails, texts and website visits of everyone in the UK under new legislation set to be announced soon.


    Not even a trace of a vestigial backbone
    I'd much rather lay in my bunk all freakin day lookin at Youtube videos .
  • Andrew Craig-Bennett
    Who?
    • Aug 1999
    • 28449

    #2
    Re: This deserves liberal condemnation.

    The reaction of my children, aged 10 and 17, to this news was quite an education to me.

    They were both outraged.
    IMAGINES VEL NON FUERINT

    Comment

    • P.I. Stazzer-Newt
      obnoxiously persistent.
      • Jan 2005
      • 26027

      #3
      Re: This deserves liberal condemnation.

      Good for them.

      What are we going to do about this?
      I'd much rather lay in my bunk all freakin day lookin at Youtube videos .

      Comment

      • wardd
        Senior Member
        • Sep 2009
        • 15162

        #4
        Re: This deserves liberal condemnation.

        why do you call for liberal outrage?

        check on what the consertives are doing to net openness in this country

        Comment

        • Andrew Craig-Bennett
          Who?
          • Aug 1999
          • 28449

          #5
          Re: This deserves liberal condemnation.

          I am going to write to two people. One is my MP, but she is a new Tory and in a safe seat so she won't do anything, and the other is the Treasurer of my local Liberal Democrat party, who will at least pass it on up the line. I feel a letter to the local paper coming on as well.

          I shall not waste time venting outrage on newspaper bulletin boards, though, because only nutters read them.
          IMAGINES VEL NON FUERINT

          Comment

          • Andrew Craig-Bennett
            Who?
            • Aug 1999
            • 28449

            #6
            Re: This deserves liberal condemnation.

            Originally posted by wardd
            why do you call for liberal outrage?

            check on what the conservatives are doing to net openness in this country
            Easy; in our country the Liberals are in a coalition government with the Conservatives - not all of whom are bad, incidentally - David Davis is OK on these issues.
            IMAGINES VEL NON FUERINT

            Comment

            • Andrew Craig-Bennett
              Who?
              • Aug 1999
              • 28449

              #7
              Re: This deserves liberal condemnation.

              "liberal condemnation" = "lots of condemnation"
              IMAGINES VEL NON FUERINT

              Comment

              • Chip-skiff
                Wolves Without Borders
                • Jan 2008
                • 22820

                #8
                Re: This deserves liberal condemnation.

                The combination of this sort of monitoring data and strategic leaks to the press (cf. the Murdoch scandal) could constitute selective political blackmail. This would be a very powerful weapon in the hands of an unscrupulous government official.

                Comment

                • C. Ross
                  Senior Member
                  • May 2007
                  • 14129

                  #9
                  Re: This deserves liberal condemnation.

                  Originally posted by wardd
                  why do you call for liberal outrage?
                  Maybe because the Tories are already outraged? Perhaps you could read the article.

                  P.I.S.N. and Andrew, why does Labour keep pursuing this? Is this a Blair carryover?

                  Comment

                  • Garret
                    Hills of Vermont
                    • Apr 2005
                    • 48644

                    #10
                    Re: This deserves liberal condemnation.

                    Isn't this kind of the "Patriot Act - UK version"? I am by no means saying it's right! Outrage is exactly the right response - followed by letting all your representatives know how you feel & getting others to do the same.

                    Here in the states some attorneys are actually arguing that privacy is a thing of the past & that since so many post their lives on FaceBook, it means that no one has a right to expect any privacy. Bunch of hooey, as far as I'm concerned.
                    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

                    Comment

                    • P.I. Stazzer-Newt
                      obnoxiously persistent.
                      • Jan 2005
                      • 26027

                      #11
                      Re: This deserves liberal condemnation.

                      Labour got nuthin to do with it.

                      This is being introduced by the tories and liberal in concert.......

                      Actually it is being (re)introduced by the "Home Office" - the phrase "house trained" has a very specific meaning in Whitehall - it implies that the new minister can now be used as a reliable mouthpiece for the ideas emanating from the professionals inside the department - rather than possesing any ideas or views of his own.
                      I'd much rather lay in my bunk all freakin day lookin at Youtube videos .

                      Comment

                      • Paul Pless
                        pinko commie tree hugger
                        • Oct 2003
                        • 124894

                        #12
                        Re: This deserves liberal condemnation.

                        Originally posted by Garret
                        Isn't this kind of the "Patriot Act - UK version"?
                        You have to wonder if the U.K is just gonna buy the information from our NSA; surely we already keep close tabs on their goings on anyways.
                        Simpler is better, except when complicated looks really cool.

                        Comment

                        • C. Ross
                          Senior Member
                          • May 2007
                          • 14129

                          #13
                          Re: This deserves liberal condemnation.

                          Originally posted by P.I. Stazzer-Newt
                          Labour got nuthin to do with it.
                          It's your country, but at least the BBC article points towards Labour, so the provenance of this nasty legislation continues to puzzle this Yank.

                          Attempts by the last Labour government to take similar steps failed after huge opposition, including from the Tories.
                          The previous Labour government attempted to introduce a central government-run database of everyone's phone calls and e-mails, but eventually dropped the bid after widespread anger.

                          The then Home Secretary Jacqui Smith did pursue efforts similar to those being revisited now, but the Conservatives and Liberal Democrats continued to voice their concerns.
                          Originally posted by P.I. Stazzer-Newt
                          Actually it is being (re)introduced by the "Home Office" - the phrase "house trained" has a very specific meaning in Whitehall - it implies that the new minister can now be used as a reliable mouthpiece for the ideas emanating from the professionals inside the department - rather than possesing any ideas or views of his own.
                          So it's the bureaucracy, and these poisonous toadstools just happened to sprout first under Labour and now continues under a Conservative-Labour coalition?

                          Comment

                          • P.I. Stazzer-Newt
                            obnoxiously persistent.
                            • Jan 2005
                            • 26027

                            #14
                            Re: This deserves liberal condemnation.

                            That's my take. - except that it's a Conservative/Liberal coalition .... AKA Con-Dem-Nation.
                            I'd much rather lay in my bunk all freakin day lookin at Youtube videos .

                            Comment

                            • Andrew Craig-Bennett
                              Who?
                              • Aug 1999
                              • 28449

                              #15
                              Re: This deserves liberal condemnation.

                              Essentially, yes, that is so, Cris.

                              Jaqui Smith is a nasty piece of work, but it seems reasonable to assume that this sort of thing originates within the "security establishment".

                              Some civil servants, including senior ones in the security establishment, are very principled, see eg Eliza Manningham-Buller who as Head of MI5 was one of the people whom one might think would favour this sort of thing:



                              but others alas are not, and in particular the denizens of GCHQ seem to have trouble in resisting the urge to cast their net impossibly wide.
                              IMAGINES VEL NON FUERINT

                              Comment

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