shortening a turnbuckle?

[wharfrat]

I recently purchased a 22 foot sailboat and I’m having trouble retuning the mast. I took down the mast for repairs and didn’t think to take readings before I dropped the mast, so I can’t comment on how it was tuned previously.

According to my research there should be a reading of about 40 to 41 using my Loose gauge on the for and aft stays, with a rake of about 10 inches. The stainless steel turnbuckles has a closed body of 3 ½” and a max. close of 5 5/8” with 1/4” dia. pin holes. and 5/16" threads. The stays are 5/32” dia.

The problem is with the forward turnbuckle lengthened out so only 1/2” of threads are holding, I can get a reading of 40. But the aft turnbuckle is shortened to the max. and I still only get a reading of 38 and with these settings I get only about a 4” rake.

On the forward turnbuckle I intend to put a 1 3/8” ‘Eye Jaw Toggle’ since that few threads bearing don't seem safe to me. This should allow me to gain more rake and maintain suggested tention.
However I can’t find a supplier with a shorter turnbuckle with 5/16” threads for the aft stay.

Here is my question. Can I simply cut about 3/8” off each end of the body on the aft turnbuckles as well as the same amount off the threaded eye ends? The body is threaded right through so I don’t see any structural compromise and the end result should allow me to gain the required 40 as well as the required rake.

Thanks to all and any who reply your thoughts are greatly appreciated

[Thaddeus J. Van Gilder]

hmmm, shortening turnbuckles...

It's an idea....one could do that...I wouldn't, but I suppose one could. :rolleyes:

[Lulworth]

In my experience when the shrouds get too long it means that the foot of the mast is sinking. If keel mounted, this could be serious but maybe not. My patented close-my-eyes-and-ignore-the-problem solution is to put a block in the mast step to raise the mast. Voila, the shouds will temporarily fit.
Good luck,

David

[Jamie Hascall]

I guess the question I would ask is if you know how the boat sailed before you took the mast down and whether you liked that or not. The fact that the specs say 10" of rake doesn't necessarily mean that that is the best for this individual boat. If something has changed in the relationships of the shrouds then there may be a reason they do not meet the expectations but if nothing has changed I'd be loath to make permanent alterations before you sail her as is and figure out that the changes were not advisable. You may find that she develops a hell of a weather helm with that much rake. Why don't you put her together as she exists and decide how far to tune the rig after sailing for a while.

Good luck,
Jamie

[James R]

I once worked for CS Yachts. Yea I know they built bleach bottle boats but it paid the bills.

Anyway, when racing, some of the owners would crank up the backstay for all it was worth. On some of the boats equipped with hydraulic backstays the tabbing on the bulkhead just forward of the head would separate from the deck. At the risk of stating the obvious, tightening up the backstay pulls up on the ends of the boat while pushing down at the mast step.

So, my advice is to check for any structural damage first to make sure it's not the boat itself that is flexing too much. If you determine that you really do need to shorten the turnbuckle, don't. Shorten the stay instead.

[TomRobb]

Godzilla stay tension is for mono-maniacal racers.
Do you really want to subject your boat to the stress?

[Ian McColgin]

Both here and at the Brion Toss site the advice has been to sail first. It is not at all obvious that the stay should be shortened.

The Loos guage is a nice way to get quick repeatablity. even a pluck and twang guy like myself likes them if you've a whole bunch of boats in need of repeatable tuning.

But there is still no subsitute for tuning your way to it being right.

A couple of hints - the boat's trim has more impact on weather v lee helm than the mast rake. It is entirely possible that the previous owner really needed rake in the mast that the designer did not have in mind because he had a big crew, shifting underwater CR aft, or maybe he never filled the forward water tank or many other things.

Unless I know for a fact that the design calls for noticable rake - as with a friend's ketch - I start with the mast pretty much straight up and down and take her for a spin.

The bane of my life has been boat yards that use fingernail polish to mark turnbuckle settings. So they put it back just the way she'd been in the fall and say that you're all set.

A wooden boat moves a bit. Don't know about you, but I use a couple different notches on my belt depending on the day, the meal and the cut of the pants. Ought to allow that much choise to your true love as well.

G'luck.

[Ross Faneuf]

In any case, I wouldn't make changes by taking a hacksaw to the turnbuckles. Get new stays made up instead - it won't be terribly expensive in a 22' boat. And, depending on age, it might be a good idea anyway.

This only if you have checked everything other people have mentioned - structural changes/damage, don't really need it, etc.