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Phillip Allen
01-14-2012, 10:22 PM
remember Mikes scientific vedios showing the reality of ccw cariers not 'geting' it?
I found this on youdtube RIGHT NEXT TO THE YOUTUBE COPY OF MIKES SCIENTIFIC STUDY!

there are more

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Blq_a_lqDBs&feature=related

Blowtorch
01-14-2012, 10:38 PM
Huh, look, a different opinion. Hey, I like this one Better! I'm going to say this Proves someting!

Phillip Allen
01-14-2012, 10:41 PM
Huh, look, a different opinion. Hey, I like this one Better! I'm going to say this Proves someting!

join the crowd

Paul Pless
01-14-2012, 10:44 PM
Its okay Phillip, you can admit you gotta thing for bubble headed bleach blondes. . .

Phillip Allen
01-14-2012, 10:45 PM
huh?

Paul Pless
01-14-2012, 10:48 PM
We got the bubble-headed-bleach-blonde
comes on at five
She can tell you 'bout the plane crash with a gleam in her eye
It's interesting when people die
Give us dirty laundry

...

Phillip Allen
01-14-2012, 10:58 PM
what? Mike's dirty laundry?

try not to be so vague, Paul

Paul Pless
01-14-2012, 11:02 PM
what? Mike's dirty laundry?

try not to be so vague, PaulI'm not being vague. I was struck by the bleach blonde newscaster in your video and the similarity to these old Don Henley lyrics is all.

Phillip Allen
01-14-2012, 11:09 PM
sorry... I didn't even remember the blond... I looked at several ccw vedios and wasn't interested in the news casters

I still think it interesting that Mikes scientific study was right next to vedios which contradicted it and Mike failed to 'notice'

cs
01-14-2012, 11:12 PM
sorry... I didn't even remember the blond... I looked at several ccw vedios and wasn't interested in the news casters'

Something is seriously wrong with that statement.

Chad

David G
01-14-2012, 11:15 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=46bBWBG9r2o

Phillip Allen
01-14-2012, 11:25 PM
here's one of a gun stopping a crime without shots being fired... oh, yeah... a pink gun!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tiiQQP4-Ijw&feature=related

hokiefan
01-14-2012, 11:31 PM
sorry... I didn't even remember the blond... I looked at several ccw vedios and wasn't interested in the news casters

I still think it interesting that Mikes scientific study was right next to vedios which contradicted it and Mike failed to 'notice'

Its no coincidence. Youtube pulls up other videos with similar words in the titles and descriptions. In this case probably concealed carry or something like that. There is no more meaning to it than that. It may or may not have been there when Mike found the video he posted.

Cheers,

Bobby

Waddie
01-15-2012, 12:17 AM
There's always at least two sides to every issue. Many people only see what reinforces their side.

Thanks for posting.

regards,
Waddie

McMike
01-15-2012, 08:32 AM
Oh . . . Sorry I'm late to the party Phillip. Looks like I missed the fun, Paul was telling me about the broken record you kept playin . . . killed the buzz he said . . . . maybe you oughta get that fixed or buy a new one.


Hows this guy for a winner? flippin putz . . .


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BH3UdLctd9w

Mrleft8
01-15-2012, 08:45 AM
Mrs. Brady got a job!? Mike's gotta be sooooooo disappointed!

McMike
01-15-2012, 08:58 AM
If I was armed and someone shot at me, I hope that I would have the courage to shoot back! Damn, these guys had the drop on the victim and still missed with their shots, the victim scored hits after being severely rattled, to say the least. I would like to see the "experts" from Mike's video explain why a real life crime turned out so completely different than the contrived video presented by . . . I forget . . . an alphabet network. (There aren't any differences in the alphabet networks, they are all identical so I do not see the need to differentiate one from another anyway.)

Recreate the scenario with 20 different people and let's see the results. Until that happens you have no grounds for gloating. Ohhhh, but like every other toy soldier you won't except that challenge because it poses the question; what if you're wrong?

FWIW, only one pro-gun person has tried to debate the question of whether handguns provide a net good or bad for society. He PMd me and explained his circumstances and reasons in a reasonable manner. The only response to that question I've seen from everyone else is, "it doesn't matter because the 2nd protects selfish little boys and their toys."

I'm willing to except that I'm wrong, but only grown men who don't whine and stamp their feet can convince me.

Phillip, you need to wipe the drool and foam from the corner of your mouth.

Paul Pless
01-15-2012, 09:39 AM
FWIW, only one pro-gun person has tried to debate the question of whether handguns provide a net good or bad for society. He PMd me and explained his circumstances and reasons in a reasonable manner. The only response to that question I've seen from everyone else is, "it doesn't matter because the 2nd protects selfish little boys and their toys."

There's some pretty reasonable folks with pro-gun positions that articulate quite well here I think.

ILikerust does very well. Donn doesn't post much to these types of threads, but he's a firearms instructor, pro-gun generally, but he had some very anti-NRA positions and statements that were put forth quite well following Congresswoman Gifford's attempted assassination last year. There's others, Htom. So much of this topic is just kneejerk, and for what its worth antigunners talk as much trash as the progun folks.

McMike
01-15-2012, 10:01 AM
There's some pretty reasonable folks with pro-gun positions that articulate quite well here I think.

ILikerust does very well. Donn doesn't post much to these types of threads, but he's a firearms instructor, pro-gun generally, but he had some very anti-NRA positions and statements that were put forth quite well following Congresswoman Gifford's attempted assassination last year. There's others, Htom. So much of this topic is just kneejerk, and for what its worth antigunners talk as much trash as the progun folks.

You are right, Donn has taken a very reasonable position and IMO presented an acceptable middle ground on the subject. You are also right that I did ignore these other guys in my statement, sorry.

I still stand by my opinion that entitlement has taken precedence over reason in this debate from the pro-gun crowd while at the same time the anti-gun crowd discredits itself in its own self-righteousness.


All I want to see is an objective look at the real impact of handguns in our society vs. the real benefit they provide. I acknowledge the benefit; although I don't agree it's as significant as the pro-gun crowd likes to make it out to be, I also see the bad; there can be no doubt that handguns provide a uniquely negative impact that would not exist if they were taken out of our society. The thing that frustrates me the most is, in most cases a rifle or shotgun can protect person and property just as well as a handgun, the two characteristics handguns provide uniquely, concealment and portability, are the very characteristics that allow them to be utilized so negatively, I believe we as a society should look very closely at the facts and not let the overreaching interpretation of the 2nd dictate our rational actions on the subject.

David W Pratt
01-15-2012, 10:39 AM
IIRC, the statistics bear out the notion that concealed weapon carriers do stop a lot of crime. Further, the phenomenon of Batsean mimicry would lead us to believe that the presence of Cwers, or even their possibility, helps protect the unarmed.

Phillip Allen
01-15-2012, 11:22 AM
Recreate the scenario with 20 different people and let's see the results. Until that happens you have no grounds for gloating. Ohhhh, but like every other toy soldier you won't except that challenge because it poses the question; what if you're wrong?

FWIW, only one pro-gun person has tried to debate the question of whether handguns provide a net good or bad for society. He PMd me and explained his circumstances and reasons in a reasonable manner. The only response to that question I've seen from everyone else is, "it doesn't matter because the 2nd protects selfish little boys and their toys."

I'm willing to except that I'm wrong, but only grown men who don't whine and stamp their feet can convince me.

Phillip, you need to wipe the drool and foam from the corner of your mouth.

ad hom... also called 'poisoning the well'... "Phillip drools (Mike sez), therefore all of Phillip's points/argument must be redacted"

Phillip Allen
01-15-2012, 11:32 AM
The word is "accept."

he may have meant it just the way he spelled it...

McMike
01-15-2012, 12:08 PM
The word is "accept."


I get the difference, being dyslexic, I get mixed up sometimes. Thanks for poking the retard . . . again. ;)

McMike
01-15-2012, 12:17 PM
Mike, You lose completely with your video above. No one is being threatened and he is peaceably walking a neighborhood. Were you anti gun guys lose most reasonable people is you see a threat where there is none whatsoever.

Most of us just don't live in fear like you do.


I could be wrong but I sincerely doubt his intentions are peaceful and non-threatening. My impression of his "walk" is that he's projecting his newly acquired "dominance" utilizing an extension of his manhood. Peace is apparently the last thing on his mind and a threat is exactly what he is "trying" to project. Hey, if that's the kind of thing that makes him feel like a man, more power to him, but a quick clue; it makes him look more like a scared little boy. ;)

McMike
01-15-2012, 12:36 PM
IIRC, the statistics bear out the notion that concealed weapon carriers do stop a lot of crime. Further, the phenomenon of Batsean mimicry would lead us to believe that the presence of Cwers, or even their possibility, helps protect the unarmed.

Yes they do, my point in the other thread was to ask the question; is the end result of handguns in our society a net good or net bad. If we can study the average person's utilization of their concealed weapon we would better be able to figure out if the ends justifies the means.

If I were to snap my fingers right now causing all handguns to automagiclly disappear; would we have more death and destruction or less? It's not a simple question to answer but the decision to pursue an answer is simple. I suspect the deflection on the part of many pro-gun folks here in wanting to answer this question is based on fear and not logic.

McMike
01-15-2012, 01:17 PM
It doesn't matter. Net good vs. net bad doesn't determine if something remains in society...never has and never will.


True, but it matters to me and to many others and so it remains a valid discussion.


Now you're flipping between subjects. Your video a couple of posts up depicts, and you degrade open carry. Then you flip to concealed carry. Which is it?


The video I posted above depicts the other side of the coin in terms of projecting a responsible attitude towards open carrying. That video depicts, IMO, a poor attitude towards it. My intention was not to categorize all people who open carry in that way. The fact remains that many of the people that I know carry (concealed here), project the same juvenile attitude as the guy in the video I posted as noted by the fact that I know they're carrying because they bragged about it in terms that were not unlike a child bragging about a toy.





Does that include handguns in the possession of police? I wouldn't want to see that. They'd be forced to use more dangerous firearms against criminals with knives and clubs.

Good point, I believe that for a total civilian ban on handguns to work we would have to remove all handguns from society, including from all law enforcement, not entirely practical IMO. Again, I'm well aware that all of this hypothetical and furthermore improbable.

I would however like to see a much more involved requirement for training and not just one time, I believe four times a year for carry permits should be required. Also, laws restricting the sale of handguns by private owners need to be enacted. I liked your ideas very much and think they represent a very good compromise as well as a very measured and logical approach to the issues, but sadly I think even those moderate ideas are too progressive for the many gun owners and constitutional extremists.

Phillip Allen
01-15-2012, 01:53 PM
I could be wrong but I sincerely doubt his intentions are peaceful and non-threatening. My impression of his "walk" is that he's projecting his newly acquired "dominance" utilizing an extension of his manhood. Peace is apparently the last thing on his mind and a threat is exactly what he is "trying" to project. Hey, if that's the kind of thing that makes him feel like a man, more power to him, but a quick clue; it makes him look more like a scared little boy. ;)

I agree that it looks a bit dorky... but then, lots of things look dorky... are you suggesting fashion police? (do you wear your oversized pants around your knees?)
as far as the way he is thinking according to YOUR interpretation, that's quite a trick of soothsaying I think! (a cheap way lawyers try to subliminally influence juries)

McMike
01-15-2012, 03:09 PM
http://quintessentialruminations.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/don-quixote.gif






The difference between us is I only feel the need to post it once.


Maybe, I'll take that into account.

David G
01-15-2012, 04:27 PM
I have two questions.

Preface: except for a air-pump pellet pistol I owned as a teenager... I've only owned rifles. Never a pistol - hence my ignorance.

1. The 'open carry' video: is that the right holster? It looks too small, and perhaps unsafe?

2. I'm imagining living in an open carry state, or possessing a concealed carry permit. Once I have that right, and choose to use it, I've also taken on a lot of responsibility. I can imagine scenarios where packing a piece, and shouldering the attendant responsibility, would make sense. Say I operated a cash business, and needed to make daily bank runs, for instance. Or... I've been threatened by an unstable ex-wife, for another. At the same time, I've known several people with c.c. permits. None of them had any obvious reason for taking on that level of responsibility. Questioning resulted in mostly mumbling & shuffling than coherent explanation.

Maybe someone here can offer a better rationale?

David G
01-15-2012, 05:06 PM
It looks like the "right" holster. Spring steel in the material holds the weapon snugly. It appears there is a buckle or latch for an additional strap across the receiver, which he does not have engaged.

If I had a CC and was carrying, no one would know about it unless I needed to use the gun.

Thanks.

I was hoping you might give a more detailed response on my question regarding what motivates folks to get a cc and use it - when, given my very limited experience, they don't seem to need it. Maybe one of the other knowledgeable firearms folks will chime in.

Phillip Allen
01-15-2012, 06:59 PM
It looks like the "right" holster. Spring steel in the material holds the weapon snugly. It appears there is a buckle or latch for an additional strap across the receiver, which he does not have engaged.

If I had a CC and was carrying, no one would know about it unless I needed to use the gun.

agreed (where practical)