Mirelle' lines and sail plan. photos

[John B]

One of life's little bonus' arrived a week ago in the form of Numbers 1 to 51 of Classic Boat magazine.I happened across an advertisement and purchased them all for my own little self. Extravagent, I know. ( I'll get a collection of Woodenboat next mark my words)
Anyway, they make good reading. There's something different about the way the magazines were written a decade or so ago. Less professional, everything is fresh.
I discovered a letter from Ian Wright discussing his new boat in one issue ( sounds like it was going to be called something else at that stage)and in number 5, Lo, Mirelles lines and sail plan. How nice to see the boat we've all heard so much about.
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid15/p831562b2711090ef8b9acc5c44638c0b/fde66a74.jpg
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid15/p682f7391c2f04df80965a13cefcf720a/fde6594f.jpg

Oh.. go into the album for a better look at the lines.
http://www.imagestation.com/album/pictures.html?id=4292186127&show_all=1&start=1

[ 05-13-2003, 05:16 PM: Message edited by: John B ]

[shamus]

Nice drawings and nice detective work! Keep them coming.

[ACB]

Thank you very much indeed, John. It's lovely to see my beloved boat here, in such distinguished company. She is not quite as gorgeous as your own, but I love her dearly none the less!

I had completely forgotten that she was in CB5; I seem to remember the drawings were in an article by John Leather, who of course is "still at it" writing nice articles about forgotten designers in CB.

Now, if anyone wants to build a sister ship, I have the drawings and the table of offsets and since more than sixty years have passed I fancy they may be out of copyright....

[Thad]

Great to see, and indeed someone should go for it. I would like to see a new SEA HARMONY too, built the same year in Harding, Norfolk.

[ACB]

I should record that she was designed by William Maxwell Blake and built by Claude Whisstock for Philip Allen and the lines closely resemble those of a John Alden design - W.A Robinson's SVAAP. She has six inches less draft, three inches more beam and a counter stern in place of a transom, and is of course rigged as a gaff cutter, not as a jib headed ketch. Philip Allen pointed this out to me - SVAAP had recently gone round the world, and had made very good passages, and he wanted a boat very much like her. Blake rounded up the fore end of the ballast keel, eliminating deadwood there, because he believed that this would make her balance better under sail. This theory was also adopted by Arthur Robb, incidentally. It conforms with the metacentric shelf theory of hull balance, which she was built to.

[Alan D. Hyde]

ACB, a lovely vessel indeed, worth every bit of the effort you have expended on her behalf. A truly classic boat.

Many of the members of this forum will be familiar with W. A. Robinson, but some may not.

I can't remember the names of his books, but one that I particularly enjoyed involved quite a bit of high latitude sailing in the South Seas. They are great books, filled with many interesting details (even paint recipes, I seem to recall). I highly recommend reading them. Someone else here can doubtless do better, and perhaps add the names and publication dates of these volumes.

Alan

[ 03-01-2002, 09:53 AM: Message edited by: Alan D. Hyde ]

[ACB]

William Albert Robinson; a great, if eccentric, American. Sailed round the world in SVAAP, 1928-31 (Deep Water and Shoal, pub 1932) later sailed to the Galapagos where he almost died of appendicitis, (Voyage to Galapagos), moved to Tahiti in 1934, but moved to Ipswich, Mass. where he ran a wooden shipyard, bought the Indian coastal brig ANNAPOORYAMAL in 1938 and sailed her to Tahiti for use as a trader, built minesweepers in WW2, built his ultimate boat, the 70ft brigantine VARUA, after WW2, sailed her to Tahiti and then to the Southern Ocean in search of the "ultimate storm" (To The Great Southern Sea) and sailed her across the Pacific in connection with scientific work looking for a cure for filiarisis (Return to The Sea) The last book was published in 1972 and I remember picking it up in a bookshop and being fascinated. Don't know when he died; seem to recall a WB article about the restoration of VARUA.

SVAAP's lines are in Deep Water and Shoal; she was sailed mainly two handed and sailed very hard, often making 175 miles a day.

[ 03-01-2002, 10:21 AM: Message edited by: ACB ]

[Alan D. Hyde]

Thanks, ACB.

"To the Great Southern Sea" was the book of which I was thinking. I may own a copy; I'm not sure.

His books are well-written, never boring, and filled with fascinating detail.

Alan

P.S. Yankees, like the English, seem to not only tolerate but sometimes prize their eccentrics. This can be a good thing.

[ 03-01-2002, 11:21 AM: Message edited by: Alan D. Hyde ]

[Wild Dingo]

Thanks John!! And thanks for the link to your album too mate, theres some fine pics of your own lovely lady in there!

Have you got any photos up ACB? okay Im gonna do the search thing again I got to have a gander at her!! beautiful lines and well... say no more eh? :cool:

Take it easy
Shane

[Ian G Wright]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by John B:
[QB]I discovered a letter from Ian Wright discussing his new boat in one issue ( sounds like it was going to be called something else at that stage)[QUOTE]

I confess, Patience was once going to be Vector. I needed a boat name for the builders insurance.
Didn't like it though.

IanW.

[John B]

Vector, that's it. Re read that issue in the weekend. See, the mags all arrived , 2 boxes of them. And I flicked through them all to see what I'd missed for the instant gratification of it all .
Now I'm into the serious cover to cover stuff.

I din't realise the Svaap connection Andrew.

[John B]

That's the other thing Andrew. You don't have a seperate topmast like the dwg do you. I presume that the masthead and associated attachment points for the peak and throat etc are all higher?

[Smacksman]

My old Emma of Bosham is in one of the Classic Boat mags - can't remember which one. It was an article about cat boats by John Leather and John asked me for some pics to go with his article.

Only time my old boats ever brought money in!!

The East Coast Old Gaffers Association used to give a years subscription to Classic Boat as race prizes at the Shotley Festival. A good prize to win.

Enjoy them.

[ACB]

John, you are quite right. The sail plan shown in the drawing was taken by John Leather from the Yachting Monthly article reviewing the boat in January 1938 and shows a modification to the rig, which was indeed made in that year, after her first season, with the original pole mast shortened and a fidded topmast stepped.

This was done because Philip Allen found handling the topsail yard very awkward. However, it is the general opinion hereabouts that this separate topmast rig made her tender. Francis Manfield, the second owner, (who put her in for RORC races, incidentally!) did not bother with the topsail, as he thought the rating penalty was not worth taking, and he also thought it made her tender. The original mast rotted through at the deck, before my time, and was replaced with one to the original drawings, i.e. a pole mast, with, indeed, a slightly longer masthead in the sense that the peak halyard blocks are spread a little further along it.

For the first 14 years that I had her, I did not bother with a topsail. In the past 4 I have changed my mind, thanks to my sister giving me White Moth's topsail yard and a topsail, and I can confirm that the topsail yard (17ft) is a swine! However, I have just splashed out on a new jackyard topsail (in for a penny, in for a pound!) after looking at Ian's photo of Patience, also a pole master, and her beautiful jackyard topsail. Report will be posted in a couple of months!

I did think hard about a Dyarchy topmast i.e. lengthen the upper mast with a hollow section, bird's mouth scarphed, with a luff groove in it, but I chickened out of that when I noticed that neither of the local mast sheds could accomodate a mast of the resulting length, whilst the deadeyes and lanyards would look a bit odd with such a "late 1940's high tech" rig!.

[Norske1]

My two cents worth....."EXCELLENT MR.JOHN B!"

[John B]

I read somewhere that the Dyarchy type topsail wasn't generally regarded as a success anyway. I had an old dinghy mast , beautifully and professionally built by the looks, with a luff groove in it. It weighed 8kg from memory, 6.5 metres long. I used that for the yard and made the jackyard out of spruce ( and cedar)offcuts. Waste not etc. Since we're two handing most of the time I keep the thing on chocks on the boom so that it's inside the lazyjacks and topping lifts. 21ft. bit difficult to get off the deck or from inside. I regard it as a racing sail really. We go well enough with out it even in the light.

[John B]

I remembered this photo from last year.can you make out the topsail on it's chocks? . works well anyway.
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid28/p023a3503f54f4c511f002c3acf4f100e/fe11c55c.jpg

[ACB]

Can't do that because we have roller reefing, although Jon Wainwright does just that with Deva's topsail.

We stow ours on its yards, in a long thin canvas bag, up the port shrounds. (Starboard shrouds have ratlines, and the boathook!)

How is the dodger over your hatchway rigged?

[ 03-05-2002, 06:24 PM: Message edited by: ACB ]

[John B]

Just on stainless tube as per normal. We sail with it down as much as possible and pull it up in any inclement weather.
I tell you the most important feature though. It's sitting in a bay on a windy and wet day with the hatch open and being able to sit outside with a rum and a book.
Makes it very quiet at night with the wind blowing too.
I went to some trouble to make it disappear as much as possible when down. On "classic" days, we take it off altogether in literally 5 minutes. I certainly wouldn't do with out it now.

[John B]

I don't know whats happened to these jpegs. It's like they deteriorate. this one has gone dark.(there are people in there. me on the helm , kirsty and my daughter snuggled under the dodger)
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid16/pc1d478e086cbcecd0c026979fa3020c5/fdf32362.jpg

A nice AFA photograph from a couple of years ago. One of a set of chopper shots on a windy day. anyway , you can see that that dodger works.LOL.

[ 05-13-2003, 05:21 PM: Message edited by: John B ]

[Norske3]

worth a second look...and for new members... smile.gif

[John B]

Always a pleasure to refresh the memory. I'd even forgotten where I got those lines.
I had to update the photo URLs. I just got 'unavailable image'
Album link still works for me though.

[Norske3]

HELLO John B...album link working fine for me.

[brian.cunningham]

:cool:

[NormMessinger]

And, John B's boat is in the current issue.

[John B]

Say what? Really ?Current issue of CB? oooo. Is this at our Regatta back in feb....( looks around,numb brain suddenly becomes alert, wonders where he can get a copy...)
My Parents in law will be in the UK in about 40 hours so I'll tell em to pick one up pronto and phone with details.
Really!!
Neat. Thanks Norm!

Ps That's cool. we had a cover once back in 2000 I think. that was a thrill. I remember getting really happy about that!

[ 05-13-2003, 10:18 PM: Message edited by: John B ]

[Ged]

Thank you, Norske3. You have this new member's appreciation. smile.gif

[NormMessinger]

It is the May issue, John, Page 24, a swan among pointy winged geese. I think the editors should have featured the winner of Division Two Vintate Yachts Over 11.6 and Under 19 Meters, a bit more prominently. I'll see how it scans later today.

[John B]

It was a funny regatta in a lot of respects Norm. The boat that won the big prize completed 1 race. 1!. DNF in all the others. Another boat... I think she came 2nd in div 1, we beat every day on the water despite her 54' to our 41 ft and a history of being NZ's premier racing yacht yacht until 1938.

[John B]

I've thanked Norm offline but repeat it here. Thanks for taking the trouble to send that info to me Norm. I appreciate it.

[Wild Dingo]

Andrew?? Did you recieve me email mate?! Its with regard to Mirelle so figured here is a good spot to toss this queery! ;)

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

Shane - each time I've tried to reply, my email has bounced back!

Cheers